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JennyM
29-08-2008, 21:44
I met someone online who is claiming to be a professional astrologer.

I don't know anything about astrology.

She asked me for my birthdate and place. Instead of giving that to her I found a site online, put in my birthdate and place...and gave her that information. I did NOT put in my birthtime and I chose 12 noon as the site recommended if someone doesn't know the time of birth.

So, this "chart" I got (and then gave to her) contained different things like...my venus is in cancer etc.

Now, she's claiming to know...from that information...that my 4th house is in Scorpio.

However, I've been reading online that one needs the time of birth to be able to figure out houses.

sapienza
29-08-2008, 22:07
I would say that because you chose 12 noon when you entered your details and then gave her the chart with the birth time as 12 noon, she is probably assuming that your birth time in 12 noon and going by that. You do need a time to work out houses, but the chart you gave her has a time of birth, being 12 noon. Can I ask, is there any reason you didn't want to put in your correct time of birth? If you don't want her to know the time of your birth then just say you don't know, rather than giving an incorrect time. Otherwise you're both going to end up very confused.

Best wishes.

JennyM
29-08-2008, 22:23
No..no reason. I just wasn't sure of the time.

What I'm saying is...what I gave here mentioned nothing of "houses". So, how did she determine that?

How does one determine the fourth house?

As you can see, I'm a bit suspicious of her.

This is what I used:

http://www.alabe.com/freechart/

If you do it, you'll see the amount of information given.

Moonmystic
29-08-2008, 23:03
I'm a little confused about what you are asking, however; Astrology is all about signs, planets and houses. The information she asked you for allows her to determine the houses in your personal chart and what planets are in them. Some people study astrology for their entire life, so the questions you are asking are bigger than a forum response. You need to do a bit of studying.

I think with some basic understanding of how astrology works, you'll be less suspicious of her. We tend to fear what we don't understand.

Here is a good link to a basic astrology lesson. If you'll spend an hour or two reading through it, you'll understand better how this person knew the information she gave you.

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/learn-astrology/astrology-lessons.php

JennyM
29-08-2008, 23:05
"The information she asked you for allows her to determine the houses in your personal chart"

Ok..that's what I wanted to know. Thank you.

franniee
29-08-2008, 23:17
When you gave her the chart with the time 12noon it set up the houses according to the incorrect time. You can't set up a chart without a time... so by putting 12 down that was the time.

Venus in cancer or the moon in taurus is set by your birthdate, but the rising sign and houses are based upon the time and place - that sets the chart up. It is important that it be accurate. It is very significant to know if venus is in cancer in your first house or the moon is on your descendent! or whatever.

Astrology is an exact science and needs precise information. If you do not trust her then go to someone else but they will ask the same question - date time place of birth - some people even want the minutes and seconds of the time of birth. :)

Moonmystic
30-08-2008, 00:04
You are very welcome. Pay attention to what Franniee just told you though. If you really want to see your very own chart, your astrologer needs to know your "exact" moment of birth so she can tell you what planets where visible in the sky at the moment you were born. You can't know your rising sign without knowing the moment you were born (what sign was on the horizon when you were born).

Have fun! Take the first step to learn a bit about it and you may begin a fascinating journey that goes with you throughout your entire lifetime.

JennyM
30-08-2008, 02:25
Just to be clear...

I did NOT tell her 12:00 PM. I just gave her the information the website gave me when I entered 12:00 PM.

So, did she figure out 12 noon from that?

I'm suspicious because she said that she reads cards...but I got the impression that she was "cutting and pasting" from a book.

Minderwiz
30-08-2008, 03:11
If you gave her the correct place and the correct date and the correct planetary positions for 12 noon taken from the website (even if you did not tell her what time was used) it is quite easy to work out the time, especially if the website gave you the positions to the nearest second. Indeed you only need to have given the correct placements of the Sun and Moon for this to be done.

If you take today (29th August 2008)as an example, at 00:00 GMT the Moon was at 12 Leo 25 mins 20 secs. At 00:00 tomorrow the Moon is at 26 Leo 21 mins 49 secs, so today the Moon will travel 13 degrees, 56 mins and 28 secs, simple maths will give it's position at any moment of the day, and, alternatively, given it's position (at any time today), simple maths will give the time.

No doubt she will have double checked by repeating this process for Sun, Mercury and Venus (almost certainly using a computer). Once she has established that the positions are those at 12 noon she can automatically read the house positions from her computer.

The small thing that concerns me, is that having realised the time of the chart was 12 noon, that she didn't ask you whether this was a genuinely accurate time or simply an estimate. I'd certainly do that for any birth quoted as an exact hour - and quoted times of 12 noon or dawn are frequently evidence that the day is right but the client has no idea at all of the time.

I do agree with one of the comments above, It is far better to be up front and say that you don't know what the time was, or given an estimate based on parents or other relatives recollections, than give a misleading time.

Bernice
30-08-2008, 03:11
If you gave her your birthdate (day, month, year) and your location at birth (Lat. & Long), and you led her to believe that the Time was 12 noon. She would draw up a chart according to that information.

I don't understand why you entered your birth-data into an online astro-site instead of giving to her direct. If the astro-site was set-up & calculated for a 12 noon birth-time and you gave her those details, then she would do a chart for the data as given.

You could instead, get a freeware astrological program, enter your birth-data details and it would display your chart. Then you could compare that chart with any other charts you may have been given.

Bee :)

P.S. Jenny, your 4th House can't be in Scorpio.

Bernice
30-08-2008, 03:20
Hello Minderwiz,

I agree, simple math for the Suns' postion will give the approx. time of day.

Was this Astrologer asking for payment, or doing Jenny a favour?

Bee

JennyM
30-08-2008, 03:26
P.S. Jenny, your 4th House can't be in Scorpio.

See, I know NADA about astrology :)

She said this:

"It is Scorpio in the 4th house"

Ok, I think my question has been answered. She could have taken the information I gave her and figured out the houses.

She was doing this for free.

Minderwiz
30-08-2008, 03:27
Just as a PS to my post above,

You do not need to be a professional to work out what she did - any amateur who knows the basics of casting a chart can do it.

If you did what you did because you were suspicious in the first place, then it would have been better to say that you did not know your time of birth accurately and ask her to rectify your birth chart from events in your life. If she was a professional she would be able to do that, or at least give you a very good reason why she could, or would not.

JennyM
30-08-2008, 03:34
Just as a PS to my post above,

You do not need to be a professional to work out what she did - any amateur who knows the basics of casting a chart can do it.



And I'm sure there is software out there that can do this very easily, no?

She offered to do it for another woman and that woman went to another site and got a circular chart with the information on it. She told her, "No, I can't use the circular chart". I wondered about that. Does that make sense?

She told us that she charges people good money to do this. However, why would that circular chart with the cryptic writing on it :) be of no use to her?

Minderwiz
30-08-2008, 03:49
Yes there are tons of freebie software that allow that to be done


On your other point, I can only think of two reasons.

The first is (like me) she likes to work from her own software and therefore she prefers the usual data entry format of date, time, place. This is a personal reason, rather than anything enlse, but it's similar to a Tarot reader preferring to use their own deck of cards. That being said, a professional should be able to cope with a circular chart produced by some other software, textbooks are full of them!

The second reason would be that she uses square charts, There are two possibilities here, she might use Vedic (Indian Astrology) or she might be heavily rooted in Traditional Astrology (even more than me :) ), as square charts were the norm up to the eighteenth centry.

Now as the Vedics use the sidereal zodiac and not the traditional Western Tropical Zodiac, I very much doubt that this would be the case, as she would need to correct the information you gave her for the diffrence in Zodiacs as all the placements would be 'wrong'.

I also very much doubt that she is a died in the wool Traditional Astrologer, so the 'own software' seems to be the best bet.

Bernice
30-08-2008, 03:57
Why on earth couldn't she just get your birth-data details direct from you, then just enter them into her software (am assuming she uses software) and tweak it for a rectified birth-time via events in your life?
Why use a ready-calculated chart.... from somewhere else !!!

...And why would you not want her to know your birth-time in first place. :confused:

Bee

JennyM
30-08-2008, 04:00
Why on earth couldn't she just get your birth-data details direct from you, then just enter them into her software (am assuming she uses software) and tweak it for a rectified birth-time via events in your life?
Why use a ready-calculated chart.... from somewhere else !!!

...And why would you not want her to know your birth-time in first place. :confused:

Bee

I had a good reason for not wanting to reveal too much information. So, I did it that way.

Bernice
30-08-2008, 04:11
I had a good reason for not wanting to reveal too much information. So, I did it that way.If you were suspicious of her you shouldn't have given any details at all. Politely refused the offer.

If you want an accurate (or near as poss.) natal horoscope it has to be drawn up for your TIME of birth. The reason is because 4mins of our clock-time is approx. equal to ONE whole degree of star-time. So If you want to know where your Moon is (and the other faster moving planets), if you give a birth-time that is, say, 30mins 'wrong', then the Moon will be in a different postion altogether (7 + degrees)!

Get yourself some free astro-software. Do your chart in it. Then ask someone who you do trust, to explain it to you.

Bee

JennyM
30-08-2008, 06:21
Can you recommend some free software?

Minderwiz
30-08-2008, 06:59
probably the best package is Halloran Software's Astrology For Windows V2.3

http://www.halloran.com/astwin23.htm

Although to get the best out of it you will need to register at $26.50 but this is so far better than any other low cost program it is a real steal. In effect you get the calculation and graphics side of AstrolDeluxe Report Writer at a fraction of the cost of the main program. If you ever want to upgrade then you get most of your money back.

There are a load of freeware programs but I'm not sure if they run well (or at all) on Vista and some of them don't even run on XP.

An alternative is Astrolog

http://www.astrolog.org/astrolog.htm

Totally free but not in the same league as Astrology for Windows. Now there may be some new stuff, as its sometime since I actually used a free program (Astrology for Windows)

franniee
30-08-2008, 07:09
or just go to astro.com and plug it in and then print out your chart. You can also get some brief explanations about certain aspects for free from them....they basically copied and pasted the Robert Hand book but it is good! You can get transits as well.

You can also google aspects and houses etc and try and piece together your chart and it's significant points.... Astrology is complex. It is 3 dimensional and in that is tricky to envision in all. Not something you can learn quickly.

But you can get an idea.....

I recommend going to a professional at least once to get an idea of what is going on in our chart. I went to a wonderful one in '96 or so - she is famous now but back then she was on the rise so she was still doing personal readings. I have gone to a few of them - she was the best! She knew her stuff and she also knew how to predict. She had a lot of love and light in her and that colored her readings. :heart: The one I went to most recently was in a dark place and that colored his predictions....also there is something to be said of chemistry - she and I had it together and he and I did not. :)

Minderwiz
30-08-2008, 08:05
franniee makes some very good points. Certainly if all you want to do is explore your own chart, then frannie's suggestion is cheapest and will give you least probs.

Astrology is not easy to learn and a problem with the freebies is that they have no interpretational modules. You have to use books/internet/here(?) etc to piece together an interpretation.

So if you are going to use the freeware/shareware you will also need to invest in some books (see the resources thread) if you are going to progress much.

Bernice
30-08-2008, 08:41
For a choice of free astro software - with reviews go to, freeware.esoterica, just enter it into a Yahoo or Google search engine.

Bee

Abrac
30-08-2008, 15:20
I've got a couple of programs on CD-ROM that come with astrology books. One is The Only Astrology Book You'll Ever Need by Joanna Martine Woolfolk and the other is Mapping Your Birthchart by Stephanie Jean Clement. They both produce the exact same chart, but the one by Clement has more commentary on the CD itself. The Woolfolk one only gives you the chart and then you have to refer to the book. The book itself is quite interesting in it's own right in my opinion. It's been in print for quite awhile and only the newer versions have the software, the older ones didn't have it.

Using this software has been a real eye-opener for me. There is so much more to a person's chart than just the Sun sign. I found out that my ascendant is Taurus which fits me a whole lot more than my Sun sign which is Aries. I've read that the ancients placed a lot more importance on the ascendant than we do today.

Bernice
30-08-2008, 22:22
There is so much more to a person's chart than just the Sun sign....ROFL....! This really tickles me. :)

I'm not being nasty - this sentence has just caught me unexpectedly - still chuckling....

Of course astrology isn't just about a Sun sign...lol

Bee :)