Tarot In The Southern 'emisphere.

After reading with interest several threads about Astrology in the 'down under' Which also includes by definition New Zealand and South Africa and several countries of the Americas....I wondered in my wee brain...

How come a game and laterly a divination device born in the Northern Hemisphere can have relevance to colonised lands and their people?
I personally have thrown off the shackles of Northern domination in my approach to myth and legend, and have adopted the Polynesian astrology of the first Nation (Maori). The seasons are different, as is the land-the culture for my country at least is a melting pot. I have retained the culture of celtic peoples in attitude to Education, Justice and Food production and preparation. Most of the Archetypal cards (if you consider Tarot is archetypal) have no relevance; I doubt that anyone could name an Empress from history or consider the Virtue of Temperance in any coherent way.(that is, I admit a massive overstatement)

It all reminds me a bit of Freemasonry. The numbers of Masons is declining at a rapid rate in the antipodes. Since all information became available and the mystery gone mostly- the decline of membership has accelerated. I have noticed this has happened with Tarot history on this forum. We rapidly cycle through fads and our attention is short....Playstation has declined as has X Box. Cards that are pap to the polulace are everywhere...and they are about nature and show our lands down here and our animals. Greeting cards are culturally sensitive now..no longer Santa in the snow with red Robbins chirping and sleigh bells ringing.

Now in times of Finacial duress, Fortune telling has always increased historically. Not this time apparently! Home cooking and baking is the fad the helps people through. Whatever the dernier cri is..it is not Tarot down under it seems to me. Even blogging is dying along with twitter and facebook.
Does tarot have relevance still for us here in the New lands?
What is your experience?

~Rosanne

Rosanne said:

How come a game and laterly a divination device born in the Northern Hemisphere can have relevance to colonised lands and their people?

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Er, because it;'s not about the position of stars in the sky like astrology, but about being human, and being human happens to humans no matter where the equator is?

<grin> And there are colonised lands in both hemispheres.

As I understanding, the concept of archetypes is that they transcend nationality, country of origin, and certainly hemisphere.

So there aren't many Empresses in the real world today. "Empress" is a label. She's not an actual Empress, she's a symbol of fertility etc (not wanting to start a card-meanings debate LOL).

The symbolism and archetypal meanings allow people of all cultures to identify with the cards and read them because we all experience loss, partnership, decision making, new beginnings and so forth. Every single card is archetypal. If you don't see this, then no wonder you question their relevance.

Home cooking is definately a happening thing these days, as are cooking shows on TV etc. But I question whether there is any great meaning to any perceived decline in playstation/xbox - have they really declined? I hadn't noticed, and if they have it's only because they've been replaced by higher technology. Facebook etc are so new, sociologically speaking, that they are still finding their niche. Basically, new things come and people get all excited, and then the novelty wears off. If they have relevance to enough people they are maintained in whatever form suits the current time, such as tarot cards being released in a gazillion different themes.

I'm Australian. And I read Tarot cards. And I have a different understanding of them to some people, and a similar understanding to others. Culture may have some effect on this personal understanding. However, individual understandings don't dictate the overall relevance of Tarot.

So no, I don't think that our location, cultural background or social history effects the general relevance of Tarot or the relevance of the archetypal meanings of the cards.

Society will always cycle through waxing and waning interests, have different amounts of disposable income, and choose to spend it on different things at different times. Is there room for many people to make a living as a Tarot reader in Australia? No idea. I know there are only about a dozen people who seriously make a living as a writer in Australia, and that doesn't make the writing of all the others and less relevant, nor does it make writing in general any less relevant. (I realise this wasn't a point in the original post, but I thought it... er... relevant...)

Would my opinions and choices be different if I wasn't a seventh-generation Australian, 100% daughter of convicts and early settlers? I daresay they would. But I'd still experience love, guilt, sorrow, joy and pessimism. Just as the cards represent.

Nisaba said:

...and being human happens to humans no matter where the equator is?

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How right you are! We have archetypal planets too Groups of Stars have an archetype (zodiac) but single stars don't. I like single stars-without going on a tangent- Emperor as Regulus for example.

Northern places of course at one time or another were colonised but way before us newbies (exception the Australian Aborigine). It is interesting we have shrugged off much- but a resolute few have kept Tarot.


Thanks for your views Allison70! I have had Tarot in my life for over 30 years- and this is the first time I have seen a measurable decline. This is taking into calculation- once not so long ago there was not the web. We have greater access to information, but seem to have a shorter attention span.
There are many people who do not consider Tarot archetypal at all- but that is another thread maybe. In fact try and get into a debate with a pyschiatrist about archetype Then there is the Historic versus Esoteric debate. So true as you say.....Culture may have some effect on this personal understanding... For me it does anyway- and Imagine for American Native tribes it would too- henc the different decks available.
Whatever it is interesting to hear other's views.

~Rosanne

Can I ask what you mean by a measurable decline?
What changes are you seeing?

I guess I just have a rather different world view to you, Rosanne. Not that I'm trying to change yours, there's room for us both But to me, it's not a matter of a few clinging to Tarot as they spread to the new countries. Which to me is what it sounds like you are saying. I didn't inherit tarot from my family, it was simply something I had heard of and decided to investigate. So, from your point of view, I guess I am a rarity? One flying in the face of a general trend of less people taking up an interest in Tarot?

(As to debating with a psychiatrist - ha! No thanks! LOL. I don't have the energy to take on what the Myers-Briggs ladies took on and won.)

Interesting thoughts and very thought provoking.........

I must admit over the last several years there has been some changes, some cyclic changes within all aspects inregards to Divination.........

for me personally what I have seen is maybe a decline in what people purchase in Tarot decks... not the variety they once did but a few selected tried and trusted decks.......Gilded tarot, RWS (different versions), Connolly tarot, The Quest tarot, Thoth and maybe a few of the others...but not as many....

for me I have seen alot of clients purchase Oracle decks by Doreen Virtue and Toni salerno with a few others selected to work with......

then I must admit when we have our psychic and healing fairs there are 4-6 of us that read tarot and we are all busy during the few hrs we are there....and more wishing to book xtra sessions........where I live we have a huge numbers of readers and we are all busy when we want to be.......when we draw the people who need us to us.......


I have felt in these last few months that tarot has certainly increased not just for those of us that seem a wee bit out there but also to include those that seem mainstream....(personal opinion...)
That is in the HB area......
Vesta

What an interesting post!

I agree with Nisaba, i think human being are human beings everywhere. Besides, the cultures around the world have mixed so much sometimes (my country is a ultimate culture mixer) that even in a distant tribe a guy with a crown might be recognized as someone 'important', even if he's not called "emperor".

Here, Tarot is known, but the Gypsy Cards (known elsewhere as Petit Jeu Lenormand) are still the most used. Only in the last decade that we began to have different tarot deck (because until the 90s, we didn't import anything, let alone tarot decks and books!), tarot books translated and all. And so tarot hasn't had the time to grow roots yet. It's not ignored, just hasn't reached a greater population yet.

We have many people how don't have money. They can pick between a R$10 (the price of a Petit Jeu Lenormand) and a R$50,00 (the price of decently printed tarot deck), which one do you think they are going to choose? And many people learn to read the PJ Lenormand at home, with their grandmas.

Historically, we were colonized by the Portuguese, the Spanish and in a few places, the French. Then we also received Italian, German, Japanese, Jewish, Polish etc. immigrants. Plenty of europeans. So it's strange that Tarot didn't come with them...maybe the Tarot de Marseille did, but even so, it did not become very popular. But the Lenormand oracle did! How weird

Anyways. At least here, where i live, i do not see a decrease. I daresay i see an increase, albeit a slow one. But that doesn't apply to the whole southern hemisphere.