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Callanish
12-04-2010, 10:44
My knowledge in the intuitive arts is probably weakest in Astrology so please forgive my lack of it here.

I've taken a personal interest in the numerological connection between Tarot, Astrology and Numerology.

It occurred to me recently that the numbering of the star signs and their traits is very like numerology.

So for the first 9 star signs:

1st Aries - needs to be independent and first at everything. Needs to be the leader.
2nd Taurus - Happy to take 2nd place to keep the peace. Diplomatic.
3rd Gemini - Creative
4th Cancer - patient and hard working
5th Leo - Loves freedom, travel and is adaptable.
6th Virgo - Responsible and family centric.
7th Libra - Spiritual, studious
8th Scorpio - Power and control
9th Sagittarius - Selfless humanitarian, philosopher

Any opinions on these traits being accurate, from a numerology point of view?

This would imply that the last 3 signs are:

10th (1) Capricorn - like Aries
11th (11/2) Aquarius - like Taurus but more intuitive(11)
12th (3) Pisces - like Gemini

It's these last 3 that concern me, what am I not seeing here or can anyone add more insight to this observation?

I'm writing this with 12 hour jet lag at 2am in the morning so not thinking as clearly as maybe I should be submitting a new thread!

Seoras

dadsnook2000
12-04-2010, 12:01
First, it is my opinion that the three systems are each unique and generally very different from each other in their concepts and their application. They do have so commonality related to the cultures they have in common, however, each of the three systems were born in vastly different time periods and based on prevailing knowledge of those periods.

Second, I believe that some of your astrological sign meanings might be wrong in terms of how most astrologers view them.
** Gemini doesn't necessarily indulge in creativity, more in curiousity.
** Leo isn't seen as adaptable, but quite fixed and self-driven.
** Virgo may or may not be responsible and family centric, but is often found to be self-centered and detail oriented.
** Libra is known for being social, pleasant, indecisive.
** One might make the case that Sag is into travel, social gatherings and honesty as they see it.
** Capricorn is not muck like Aries
** Aquarius is said to be humanitarian-inclined.
** Pisces is not very like Gemini, being more sensitive (Gemini is often too much in a rush to even know what sensitivity means).

Third, once one gets into astrology, one finds that signs are not used the way they are in the popular press.

Fourth, I have found that numbers are associated with different emphasis in Astrology and in Numerology. A few examples:
** TWO in Astrology is associated with the opposition aspect, partners and enemies. In Numerology, pairing and associations.
** FOUR in Astrology is associated with squares; strife, struggle, being driven to achieve. Numerology; stability, solidarity.

One has to go much deeper and approach these systems differently to find similarities or commonalities that are useful to cross-apply. Just some thoughts. But, there are many views on this and I trust that others on the list will come up with differing views. Dave

Callanish
12-04-2010, 12:34
First, it is my opinion that the three systems are each unique and generally very different from each other in their concepts and their application. They do have so commonality related to the cultures they have in common, however, each of the three systems were born in vastly different time periods and based on prevailing knowledge of those periods.

Am I trying to do an Einstein with the intuitive arts in looking for a "unifying theory"...? :-)
Intuitively, I feel there is a great deal of unity between tarot, astrology & numerology.
Even if I'm wrong in the hypothesis the exploration of it develops my knowledge of each of the 3 arts considerably.



Fourth, I have found that numbers are associated with different emphasis in Astrology and in Numerology. A few examples:
** TWO in Astrology is associated with the opposition aspect, partners and enemies. In Numerology, pairing and associations.
** FOUR in Astrology is associated with squares; strife, struggle, being driven to achieve. Numerology; stability, solidarity.

My understanding of 4 in Numerology matches your association of 4 in Astrology.
In Numerology a 4 period (day, month, year, cycle, etc) can indicate "strife, struggle, being driven to achieve".

2 in Numerology deals with balancing relationships, diplomacy and finding the middle ground.
So again I'd say there is a strong link to the Astrological association.

Thanks for the input Dave!

Seoras

Minderwiz
13-04-2010, 05:04
I think the situation is quite a bit 'messier' than either you or Dave suggest. When you say 'Astrology', 'Numerology' and 'Tarot' which variants and epochs are you talking about? Astrology today is almost unrecognisably different from what it was 300 years ago, let alone 3,000 years ago, or 30,000 years ago (and we have evidence of Astrology from 'cave man' times.

Astrology, certainly has a history dating back into prehistoric times, before the advent of writing, or possibly before the advent of developed languages. However, like Tarot and Numerology it is not a constant. Hellenistic Astrology is different from either Babylonian or Egyptian Astrology but was influenced by them and in turn has influenced Vedic and Arabic Astrological practices. They in turn influenced medieval Astrology and I'm sure that the developers of Kabbalah were aware of Astrology and in turn influenced medieval Astrology.

The sign meanings that are used in modern Astrology are primarily the invention of the Theosophist Alan Leo, in the late nineteenth and early twentieth century and have been taken on by the followers of C G Jung, who in turn have done much to 'appropriate' both Astrology and Tarot.

So yes you will find many parallels in all three mantic arts, either contemporaneously,or between different time periods, because philosophical, religious and spiritual knowledge are not competely independent or self contained.

That being said, a 'unified theory' is a chimera. Astrology now is so fractured that there is no chance of it being unified, let alone married to Tarot and Numerology. If I were a deeply religious person, I'd say that all of them show different aspects of the glory of God. As a self doubting believer, I'd say that what we have is a number of loosely related attempts to make sense of, and understand, the spiritual nature of mankind and the true reality of the Cosmos.

Perhaps we should simply glory in all three, and be glad that the cold materialism of modern science has not yet become omnipotent.

Wild West Barbie
30-04-2010, 22:33
Hi Callanish
I find it more helpful to link the Astrological planets to Tarot Card numbers rather than signs. My system is the following:
The Sun & Mercury 1 essence, ego
Moon 2 duality
Venus 3 creativity, form
Earth 4 stability, structure
Mars 5 trouble, energy
Jupiter 6 benevolence, expansion
Saturn 7 responsibility, patience
Uranus 8 independence, freedom
Neptune 9 spirituality
Pluto 10 power
It works for me!
Wild West Barbie