Is my timing correct for trying to read with historical decks?

I am seven months old in the world of Tarot. I started of with the RWS deck and I think that I am progressing decently day by day. Anyways, recently I was gifted with two decks – the Golden Tarot and the Tarot de Marseilles. I knew that these are decks with a history and have been around from a long long time, probably more than RWS (not sure though). I recently attempted reading with the Tarot de Marseilles (TdM) and I realized that the pips of this deck has no imagery akin to the RWS, so invariably I always used to sub-consciously compare any pip of the TdM with the RWS corresponding card while reading. The key words might be the same, but I know this is not the proper way to read any deck.

The imagery of the TdM and the Golden Tarot is not the way as it is with RWS. Not that I have anything against these two decks, but as a newbie I have become more accustomed to RWS. Is it OK for me to venture into trying to read with these two historical decks or should I stick to RWS till maybe I get a bit more experience and then venture into reading with these? Can the same approach of reading for RWS be applied to the Golden Tarot and TdM??

Which Golden Tarot do you mean? I'm thinking of Kat Black's Golden Tarot and that one certainly is RWS based.

As for reading with a TdM.. Why not join the TdM reading circle to get some practice in? I've recently returned to reading with a Tarot de Marseilles myself and I have to say that I'm finding the Minors very expressive and the readings to be flowing...
I think with the TdM a bit of knowledge of numerology helps and a lot of people read these decks by linking the Minors to their numerically equivalent Major...

Take a look at the threads in the TdM forum for some tips - I don't think that many TdM readers would use RWS meanings with historical decks since those decks pre-date RWS by hundreds of years and it's very liberating to actually read the pips without having a picture of someone elses interpretation imposed on them.

Many people actually start reading with TdMs or historical decks so I don't think you need to have been reading for any length of time to use them. It may even help if you don't have much experience with other systems as you're then not tempted to impose one system on another.

Here's a link to the TdM forum: http://www.tarotforum.net/forumdisplay.php?f=38

If it were me, I'd have just confused myself terribly if I had started with another system just a few months after starting with RWS. Everyone is different, of course, so it might work quite well for you. All you can do is give it a try and see what happens.

For me, part of the beauty of historical decks is that the sparseness of the imagery allows me to use whatever system (or lack thereof) that I like.

I read with RWS, Thoth, and lots of others before I got into pip decks, and so now I certainly apply the pre-existing concepts I have of each card (though based on modern ideas) to older decks, simply because I'm accustomed to reading in a particular way, and it works for me, and because I love historical reproduction decks.
But as with most decks, I've found that the cards take on their own nuances after working with them for awhile, despite whatever prior idea I had about a card's meaning.

When I first started reading cards, I read intuitively, looking for story and emotion from the visual imagery, and didn't pay much attention to what each card was 'supposed' to be about. In that way, jumping back and forth between decks wasn't a problem.
I actually found I gained a new perspective about a card in one deck by comparing it to the same one from another pack.
Later on, I focused in on one deck at a time, and found that useful, too.

I think anyone can read historical decks, they're not necessarily more difficult, they just might need a little experimentation with different methods of reading.
Also, you might find that there's more there, visually, than you first thought. I would invite you to really spend some time -looking- at the pips.

Sulis said:

Which Golden Tarot do you mean? I'm thinking of Kat Black's Golden Tarot and that one certainly is RWS based.

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Sorry I just forgot to mention that..its the Liz Dean Golden Tarot

Sulis said:

As for reading with a TdM.. Why not join the TdM reading circle to get some practice in? I've recently returned to reading with a Tarot de Marseilles myself and I have to say that I'm finding the Minors very expressive and the readings to be flowing...
I think with the TdM a bit of knowledge of numerology helps and a lot of people read these decks by linking the Minors to their numerically equivalent Major...

Take a look at the threads in the TdM forum for some tips - I don't think that many TdM readers would use RWS meanings with historical decks since those decks pre-date RWS by hundreds of years and it's very liberating to actually read the pips without having a picture of someone elses interpretation imposed on them.

Many people actually start reading with TdMs or historical decks so I don't think you need to have been reading for any length of time to use them. It may even help if you don't have much experience with other systems as you're then not tempted to impose one system on another.

Here's a link to the TdM forum: http://www.tarotforum.net/forumdisplay.php?f=38

Click to expand...

Thanks for the link...I have actually been going through the particular forum that you pointed out.. Its definitely way different from the RWS, something which you have mentioned as well..! Going through the stuff there had me confused and hence this thread. Though I think I might as well give it a try for some days...Not pretty confident about joining the reading circle now unless I gain the confidence I think I have with the RWS..Nevertheless thank you for your kind words of encouragement (initially when I got a mail saying Sulis has commented on your thread, I was a bit worried if I had posted in the correct forum, and if I got a mod note for it )

Rasa said:

I think anyone can read historical decks, they're not necessarily more difficult, they just might need a little experimentation with different methods of reading.
Also, you might find that there's more there, visually, than you first thought. I would invite you to really spend some time -looking- at the pips.

Click to expand...

While just like Grizabella pointed out, yes I am very much confused as I switch from RWS to a historical deck, but then I think I will actually give it a good shot before deciding whether to continue or not.

Your post especially this..

.............When I first started reading cards, I read intuitively, looking for story and emotion from the visual imagery, and didn't pay much attention to what each card was 'supposed' to be about. In that way, jumping back and forth between decks wasn't a problem.
I actually found I gained a new perspective about a card in one deck by comparing it to the same one from another pack.
Later on, I focused in on one deck at a time, and found that useful, too.

Click to expand...

has given me a blueprint about how to go on.. I guess I will try to incorporate it in my readings as I go along with learning from the forum link Sulis mentioned... Thank you for your kind words

pacificwaters said:

I am seven months old in the world of Tarot. I started of with the RWS deck and I think that I am progressing decently day by day. Anyways, recently I was gifted with two decks – the Golden Tarot and the Tarot de Marseilles. I knew that these are decks with a history and have been around from a long long time, probably more than RWS (not sure though). I recently attempted reading with the Tarot de Marseilles (TdM) and I realized that the pips of this deck has no imagery akin to the RWS, so invariably I always used to sub-consciously compare any pip of the TdM with the RWS corresponding card while reading. The key words might be the same, but I know this is not the proper way to read any deck.

The imagery of the TdM and the Golden Tarot is not the way as it is with RWS. Not that I have anything against these two decks, but as a newbie I have become more accustomed to RWS. Is it OK for me to venture into trying to read with these two historical decks or should I stick to RWS till maybe I get a bit more experience and then venture into reading with these? Can the same approach of reading for RWS be applied to the Golden Tarot and TdM??

Click to expand...

There are no rules to Tarot. No one can tell you when it is alright for you to do something or not. You have to feel that inside you.

But the one thing I can tell you is to not to afraid to experiment. If you feel called to try something feel free to. As long as you have a sincere desire to learn, a passion even, you will learn. A lot can be learnt by trial and error. We learn from everything we do. Mistakes teach us what does not work for use personally (and this is a very important life lesson as this varies from person to person). What does nto work well for us teaches us who we do not want to be as readers.

Someitmes learning what does not work for us and who we don;t want to be as readers teaches us as much and more on our paths to learning and learning what does work for us.

Follow your feelings and do what feels right and calls you you. I don't believe you can do it wrong. As long as you want to learn you will. And each thing you learn will make you a better reader.

The absolute worst that could happen (and this is not bad at all) is that you will find you are in over your head and not ready yet. Then put the deck away and try later. No biggie, But then again , you might find that you are and learn lots from it.

You either are ready or you're not. No one else can tell you that, only you can know it,. And you will find out for sure if you feel ready to try.

For whatever it's worth. I do not like the TdeM for just the reason you stated , the unillustrated pips. I get most of my meaning from the card images, so the deck does not call to me, even the illustrated cards are too plain for my tastes. I doubt I will ever use one for that reason. But again, we are all different and we have to know ourselves insde as readers. The best way to know who we are as individuals and as readers, to me, is to experiment and see what works for us, and learn from what doesn't.

There are lessons in everythign that can help us improve, if we try and then look for them.

Babs

Thanks a lot for your advice Babs. Your well spelt out post did give me a bit of adrenaline boost, especially the one that I feel drains out when I see the unillustrated pips...

Just as you said - Either I can or I cant...So better try before saying I cant...!!

I have started doing my daily draws with these decks just to see if I can acquaint well with them... I THINK I am doing ok...but its still a big challenge nevertheless... Thanks for your advice and kind words

Reading with a TdM shouldn't be either easier or more difficult than reading with and RWS, just very different. Remember that these are the "original" tarot decks, created at a time when there were no LWBs, no rules to follow, and especially, no RWS scenes to "pollute" your thinking.

I like what SunChariot said, about there being no rules in Tarot, no one to slap your wrist should you do something wrong. There are, however, "rules" to the Golden Dawn who fundamentally changed the way we see Tarot today with attributions, illustrated or stylized pips and more (I know there were those things before the RWS and Thoth, but I'm speaking generally). The TdM, however, came far before all that, and people used them all the same.

Personally I can't wait to get a TdM deck and try to "clean" my head of everything I learned over the years of study. Alas, that will have to wait a while, since money isn't too plentiful right now. But I do encourage you to try, I think there is nothing really better than a Marseilles to sharpen the intuitive wits upon. As much as I love the RWS, those images are kind of like crutches, from a certain point of view.

It is perfectly alright to apply any meanings you wish to the Marseille, including those of the Rider-Waite (which derive from the Golden Dawn system). Of course, Trumps 8 (Justice) and 11 (Strength) of the Marseille were interchanged by the Golden Dawn in order to make them compatible with certain Kabbalistic correspondences to the Hebrew letters assigned to the inter-sephirotic paths on the Tree of Life. Moreover, the Golden Dawn interpretations of the Minors (which were very influential in the design of the images of the RWS Minors) are based on a system of astrological (decanate) correspondences, which is totally unrelated historically to the Marseille. In my opinion, the Marseille works better without the additional Golden Dawn baggage with which the RWS is burdened, not that the latter is without merit. I would suggest looking into the various methods for reading the pips which are intrinsic to the Marseille. You are bound to find a method with which you feel comfortable.

pacificwaters said:

Thanks a lot for your advice Babs. Your well spelt out post did give me a bit of adrenaline boost, especially the one that I feel drains out when I see the unillustrated pips...

Just as you said - Either I can or I cant...So better try before saying I cant...!!

I have started doing my daily draws with these decks just to see if I can acquaint well with them... I THINK I am doing ok...but its still a big challenge nevertheless... Thanks for your advice and kind words

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You're welcome!

I think people spend too much time worrying about the right or wrong way to learn sometimes. If you want to learn, any path will take you there, anything you try will teach you.

Well, yes, LOL Better try before saying you can't. We are all different inside. No one else can tell you what can or cannot do. And even if you did find something too hard, you can come back to it when you are ready later on and no harm done. But you can't know if you are ready unless you try. No one else can tell you what will work best for you. Only you can know that. And you know that by trying all kinds of things and seeing what works best for you. What works best for each of us is not the same thing.

It's supposed to be a challenge . It you took on something that was totally easy and you could did it with your eyes closed, then that thing would have nothing to teach you. You are doing this to learn. And in order to learn we have to face things that we don't understand fully and work on that. If you understood it well enough now that there was no challenge, then there would be no need to do it in the first place.

But by taking it on, you now have some fascinating things to learn and you are off on an adventure that can open so many fascinating doors. That is a good part of the joy and fun of learning Tarot. You never know what you may learn along the way.

Babs