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Saturness
08-01-2012, 13:45
Hi everyone! I hope you are doing well! :)

I have been reading some books and a few times different authors mention that this or that planets, or that specific combination of planets, is the "signature" os an Astrologer in someone's map.

Donna Cunningham, for instance, mentions that one of the indicators of talent/potential to be an astrologer is to have both Uranus and Neptune must be strong in a prominent position (like close to the angles, I suppose). However, I am not sure because these planets are slow and 'social'... wouldn't their influence create a generation of astrologers?

Another book I read (sorry I cannot remember which - I should have kept notes!) related Astrology to Mercury, and not to Uranus. But it seems most of "modern" books really consider Uranus the "planet of the Astrologer", although they do not agree on how Uranus must be placed/aspected in order to show this particular potential.

So I'd like to ask people here, out of curiosity... what would you consider the "astrologer signature" in a natal chart? Or such things doesn't exist, in your view?

Thank you for sharing your ideas! :)

dadsnook2000
08-01-2012, 15:38
I have Moon at the IC trine Uranus in the 11th, and Sun conjoining Neptune in the 4th. Perhaps you could look up astrologers on Astrodatabank, do a search for Uranus aspects. Dave

Minderwiz
08-01-2012, 21:19
Most modern writers assign Astrology to Uranus.

Quoting Stephen Arroyo, who I very much respect, Uranus symbolises attunement to truth, originality, inventiveness, directed experimentation, respect for freedom, as its 'good' qualities ( he uses the word positive) and wilfulness, restless impatience, constant need for excitement, purposeless change, rebellion and extremism as the 'bad (negative) qualities.

Now to me many of those words describe the state of Astrology in the 21st century. For many Astrology is 'individualistic' - it's whatever you say it is and if you don't like something you change it because you are free to do so. You can invent new methods, even new planets (now literally'uranian'). Moreover this is the 'Dawning of the Age of Aquarius' and of course Astrology is New Age and therefore ruled by Uranus.

With such a multiplicity of methods things are confusing (Neptune) and so too is what is an Astrologer - someone who practses Astrology - but as that can be something you just made up, anyone can be an Astrologer. At a more serious level, there is a real question. Does the person have to have an Astrology qualification - if so which of the many on offer? Is Rob Hand an Astrologer, because he's self taught and only began a formal qualification late in lfe (and not one of the 'professional ones). So exactly who do you search for that signature?

Traditionally Mercury is the planet associated with Astrology and it's also linked to the ninth house - dreams and prophesy clearly mediated by the messenger of the gods. It is also linked to Aquarius but not the quirky individualistic sign of Uranus but the disciplined, inquiring, seeker of knowledge of Saturn. Its a humane sign and brings humanity to discipline, To paraphrase Lilly, astological judgement is science tempered by Art

Our view of Astrology has changedn- it used to be a msinstream subject, taught in universities and the required knowledge of physicians for diagnosis and prescription. Now it is the fringe activity of oddballs and requires 'health warnings on any TV programme that discusses it.

So what signature are we looking for - Uranus and Neptune? Mercury and Saturn? House placements? Aspects? I suppose the individualistic answer is go for what is personally satisfying. I still hanker for Astrology as a noble science so for me its Mercury and Saturn - but then I might be an individualistic oddball, making it really Uranus :-)


For the record I have Uranus on the cusp of the eleventh House - hopes and aspirations - trining Sun and Moon.

For balance I have Saturn on the Ascendant in exact square with Mercury in the fourth and exact opposition to Moon on the Descendant. For Dave, an angular T Square in Fixed signs. I know which one
I'd point to :)

Edited to add:


Both Dave and I have an eleventh house Uranus trining an angular Moon - signature found, problem solved :) :)

Saturness
09-01-2012, 03:35
I have Moon at the IC trine Uranus in the 11th, and Sun conjoining Neptune in the 4th. Perhaps you could look up astrologers on Astrodatabank, do a search for Uranus aspects. Dave

That would be a very interesting research indeed! The "Uranus Effect", maybe? LOL!


Now to me many of those words describe the state of Astrology in the 21st century. For many Astrology is 'individualistic' - it's whatever you say it is and if you don't like something you change it because you are free to do so. You can invent new methods, even new planets (now literally'uranian'). Moreover this is the 'Dawning of the Age of Aquarius' and of course Astrology is New Age and therefore ruled by Uranus.

With such a multiplicity of methods things are confusing (Neptune) and so too is what is an Astrologer - someone who practses Astrology - but as that can be something you just made up, anyone can be an Astrologer. At a more serious level, there is a real question. Does the person have to have an Astrology qualification - if so which of the many on offer? Is Rob Hand an Astrologer, because he's self taught and only began a formal qualification late in lfe (and not one of the 'professional ones). So exactly who do you search for that signature?

True, all that you say. I suppose that Uranus is indeed the perfect planet for 21st Century Astrology, whereas Saturn and Mercury would make good planets for the Traditional Astrology. Astrology has become a hostage of the "whatever I think is right is right" that has been dominating every 'new age' art out there. There's no longer need to any study, or need to temper art with knowledge - if it feels right than it's right.

It'd be great if such thing worked for math exams. God knows I have tried, by my teachers disagreed. :P

I was not really asking for a universal symbol for Astrology... I was focusing a bit on the vocational side. What planets and aspects in a chart could show that someone has the potential to be become a very good astrologer? Like Gauquelin shows that a rising or culminating was present in the charts of many sport champions, I wondered if a similar signature could exist for Astrologers.


Traditionally Mercury is the planet associated with Astrology and it's also linked to the ninth house - dreams and prophesy clearly mediated by the messenger of the gods. It is also linked to Aquarius but not the quirky individualistic sign of Uranus but the disciplined, inquiring, seeker of knowledge of Saturn. Its a humane sign and brings humanity to discipline, To paraphrase Lilly, astological judgement is science tempered by Art

Saturn is so badly seen by some astrologers that it is no wonder they would rather be associated with quirky-creative-Uranus than serious-Saturn. :P

So, Mercury in the 9th House or Aquarius (or both) would be a good "sign" for interest and possibly skills in Astrology, in your view? Or not quite?


Our view of Astrology has changedn- it used to be a msinstream subject, taught in universities and the required knowledge of physicians for diagnosis and prescription. Now it is the fringe activity of oddballs and requires 'health warnings on any TV programme that discusses it.

That is true -- and sad. Very sad.


For the record I have Uranus on the cusp of the eleventh House - hopes and aspirations - trining Sun and Moon.

For balance I have Saturn on the Ascendant in exact square with Mercury in the fourth and exact opposition to Moon on the Descendant. For Dave, an angular T Square in Fixed signs. I know which one I'd point to :)

Both Dave and I have an eleventh house Uranus training an angular Moon - signature found, problem solved :) :)

Wow, lol! Maybe I'll look at other Astrologer's charts and see if they have this also! So, a rising close-to-culminating Uranus trining an angular Moon.

In fact, Marion D. March and Joan McEvans say in their book that Uranus trining Moon indeed represents an interest in occultism, spirituality and... astrology. "Entrepreneur, scientific and intuitive"... which I think are very proper qualities for anyone who wishes to venture seriously in Astrology.

So yes, I suppose I can start my statistic studies now. I just need to check my own chart and see if I have the "Gauquelin Signature" in my chart. :P

Minderwiz
09-01-2012, 05:35
In fact, Marion D. March and Joan McEvans say in their book that Uranus trining Moon indeed represents an interest in occultism, spirituality and... astrology. "Entrepreneur, scientific and intuitive"... which I think are very proper qualities for anyone who wishes to venture seriously in Astrology.



Well they do believe that planets suddenly appear when we have need for them and that signs change their meanings and grow more like other planets, independent of human intervention so Uranus would seem a good choice for them :)

BigLuna
10-01-2012, 03:08
Here's what I've observed with people who have a strong Uranus. They love astrology, astronomy or science fiction, sometimes two or all three. I can't recall meeting a Uranian (as opposed to an Aquarian) who didn't adore at least one of the three.

Saturness
10-01-2012, 04:10
Here's what I've observed with people who have a strong Uranus. They love astrology, astronomy or science fiction, sometimes two or all three. I can't recall meeting a Uranian (as opposed to an Aquarian) who didn't adore at least one of the three.

Thanks, Big Luna! :)

I am not sure if I am Uranian but I sure as hell love astrology, astronomy and science fiction, LOL! :laugh: If I were more intelligent I'd have tried to become an astronomer, as I have loved the subject since childhood. :)

I must say I do not know what makes an Uranus strong, Astrology-wise. Because I am sure this same planet could apply to scientists who are skeptical about Astrology - so I suppose a certain aspect or placement would have to influence Uranus for it to show an interest in Astrology specifically. Maybe aspects to Neptune and Mercury or placements like the 9th House.

I found this quote in an Astrology website, and it's interesting:

Uranus in aspect to the Mid-Heaven can make a good TECHNICAL astrologer. Neptune makes a good READER of charts. Mercury trine Uranus also seems to occur in the charts of astrologers. The late Charles Emerson told me that all of the charts of astrologers that he had seen (and he saw quite a few) had the hypothetical trans-Neptunian "planet" Haydes in some aspect to the Mid-Heaven (he counted the minor aspects here).

Source: Astrology Weekly (http://www.astrologyweekly.com/)

What do you think?

kalliope
10-01-2012, 05:33
Hmm. Both the modern and traditional signatures mentioned here are interesting! I "grew up" with the idea of Uranus ruling astrology, but now that I've been learning traditional methods, I appreciate the Saturn & 9th house connections. Since we're compiling our own chart signatures, I'll toss mine out there, too:

Uranus:
--wide conjunction with AC (9 degrees)
--in 12th house by Placidus
--in 1st house by Whole Signs
--opposite Moon in 6th (aspect by degree, but not by sign)
--trine Jupiter

Saturn:
--in 9th, but peregrine and in detriment
--trine Mercury (in 1st)
--square Moon (in 6th), which rules my 9th house and trines MC
--trine Jupiter
--rules 3rd and 4th

Aquarius on the IC

Mercury:
--in 1st
--conjunct strong Mars (1 degree)
--trine Saturn in the 9th
--square MC

Neptune:
--trine MC (8 degrees)
--conjunct Venus (almost exact) in the 2nd
--conjunct Sun (in second via whole signs, across 1st/2nd in Placidus), which rules MC

I'm obviously not a professional astrologer, but I secretly have wanted to be one since my college years, and have had an almost lifelong interest in astrology (learned to set up my chart in elementary school).

So I guess I'm another vote for Uranus-Moon, Neptune-Sun, Neptune-MC, Mercury-Saturn, and 9th house contacts. But while I have a lot of these contacts, it seems like none of these planets are in very good shape with regard to dignity. Uranus rising seems like the best bet (although if you take it to be in the 12th, it's weak, but could symbolize that I do tend to study astrology "in secret"). Strength-wise, I'm a Mars/Jupiter girl. Guess that means I probably won't make my living this way! :(

As an aside, I like to think that my 9th house Saturn is why in the end I've come around to studying the traditional "conservative" methods of astrology. I suppose that according to those same methods, though, it just means an interest in astrology, period, since the traditional kind was the only kind there was! But echoing what Minderwiz said about Mercury-Saturn and wanting astrology to be a noble science, I definitely identify with that. Especially because in personality I'm more of an analytical, scientific person (with mystical yearnings!) vs. a quirky psychic, mystic dreamer. :D

-Nicole

BigLuna
10-01-2012, 10:07
I am not sure if I am Uranian but I sure as hell love astrology, astronomy and science fiction, LOL! :laugh: If I were more intelligent I'd have tried to become an astronomer, as I have loved the subject since childhood. :)



That sounds Uranian to me! Someone who is "Uranian" has Uranus highlighted several times in their chart. It could be the chart ruler, on the MC, in strong aspect to the Sun (esp. conjunct), moon or ascendant, aspecting lots of planets in the chart, and so on.

Aquarians aren't necessarily weird; but Uranians definitely are.

Saturness
10-01-2012, 22:27
That sounds Uranian to me! Someone who is "Uranian" has Uranus highlighted several times in their chart. It could be the chart ruler, on the MC, in strong aspect to the Sun (esp. conjunct), moon or ascendant, aspecting lots of planets in the chart, and so on.

I have Uranus conjunct ASC by 2 and Saturn by 4 in the First House, trining the Moon (that is Peregrine in Aries and in the 5th House) and in semi-sextile with a rather weak Mercury. I don't know if that has any importance, considering that Uranus is such a social planet and its aspects tend to last for a while (specially with other slow planets). :P But I I do have some 'uranian' interests (which does NOT mean I am good at any of them).

I'm obviously not a professional astrologer, but I secretly have wanted to be one since my college years, and have had an almost lifelong interest in astrology (learned to set up my chart in elementary school).

So I guess I'm another vote for Uranus-Moon, Neptune-Sun, Neptune-MC, Mercury-Saturn, and 9th house contacts. But while I have a lot of these contacts, it seems like none of these planets are in very good shape with regard to dignity. Uranus rising seems like the best bet (although if you take it to be in the 12th, it's weak, but could symbolize that I do tend to study astrology "in secret"). Strength-wise, I'm a Mars/Jupiter girl. Guess that means I probably won't make my living this way! :(

As an aside, I like to think that my 9th house Saturn is why in the end I've come around to studying the traditional "conservative" methods of astrology. I suppose that according to those same methods, though, it just means an interest in astrology, period, since the traditional kind was the only kind there was! But echoing what Minderwiz said about Mercury-Saturn and wanting astrology to be a noble science, I definitely identify with that. Especially because in personality I'm more of an analytical, scientific person (with mystical yearnings!) vs. a quirky psychic, mystic dreamer. :D

Hi Kalliope, thank you for sharing your info! It's nice to see what the students and astrologers here have in common, and good to have examples to study!

As I stated above when answering BigLuna, I too have a Uranus/Moon connection, but nothing in the 9th House. Like you, my Uranus is also trining my Jupiter (as well as my Moon), but Jupiter is not particularly strong in my chart. Mars and Saturn are - I should change my name to Miss Malefic, lol!

The MC area of my chart is a desert (actually, my whole chart is pretty much a desert), so professionally I don't know what it'd indicate. The MC is in Virgo, which would make Mercury and important indication of a career. I work in publishing house (a very Mercurial field), but traditionally Mercury also rules Astrology which could be an indication. However, my Mercury is very weak overall (in the 12 House, in Scorpio, combust and making few aspects).

It's hard to analyze our own charts I think, but it's nice to compare what we have as an exercise. Donna Cunningham mentioned Neptune as being relevant, but so far (taking into account the answers to this thread) it seems that a Uranus in aspect with the Moon is more common, specially if one or both planets are strong.

I feel like printing a bunch of charts of different astrologers and seeing if Uranus/Saturn/Moon and 11th/9th House placement have any relevance. :) Just for curiosity's sake.

kalliope
15-01-2012, 06:44
. . . I too have a Uranus/Moon connection, but nothing in the 9th House. Like you, my Uranus is also trining my Jupiter (as well as my Moon), but Jupiter is not particularly strong in my chart. Mars and Saturn are - I should change my name to Miss Malefic, lol!

I've been meaning to respond here again. Your "Miss Malefic" comment has been making me laugh this week when I've remembered it. I think it's a great name, and you should make her your internet alter-ego! :laugh:

I have Uranus conjunct ASC by 2 and Saturn by 4 in the First House, trining the Moon (that is Peregrine in Aries and in the 5th House) and in semi-sextile with a rather weak Mercury. I don't know if that has any importance, considering that Uranus is such a social planet and its aspects tend to last for a while (specially with other slow planets). :P But I I do have some 'uranian' interests (which does NOT mean I am good at any of them).
. . .

The MC area of my chart is a desert (actually, my whole chart is pretty much a desert), so professionally I don't know what it'd indicate. The MC is in Virgo, which would make Mercury and important indication of a career. I work in publishing house (a very Mercurial field), but traditionally Mercury also rules Astrology which could be an indication. However, my Mercury is very weak overall (in the 12 House, in Scorpio, combust and making few aspects).

It's hard to analyze our own charts I think, but it's nice to compare what we have as an exercise. Donna Cunningham mentioned Neptune as being relevant, but so far (taking into account the answers to this thread) it seems that a Uranus in aspect with the Moon is more common, specially if one or both planets are strong.

I feel like printing a bunch of charts of different astrologers and seeing if Uranus/Saturn/Moon and 11th/9th House placement have any relevance. :) Just for curiosity's sake.

I certainly seems that on this forum at least, there are some similarities. Your astrologer's chart research project sounds kind of fun and interesting. You should do it! I'd even volunteer to help you comb through AstroDatabank. :) (Although -- I wonder if anyone has already done this? Does anyone know?)

Barleywine
07-02-2012, 08:49
Interesting topic. This quote I came across on the blog of a Jyotish astrologer seems to support Minderwiz:

"To be an astrologer, an individual should have Mercury (talking and calculations), Ketu (the Enlightener) and Jupiter (for tradition and divinity) of good strength. Also the 5th, 8th and 9th house should be strong."

Most of the modern Western authors I've read equate a prominent Uranus (or Aquarius) to astrological proclivities, and a similar prominence of Neptune (or Pisces) to psychics or mediums.

Personally (although I'm only a dedicated hobbyist and not a professional), I have none of the salubrious aspects to Uranus or Neptune that some here have cited. I do have Neptune precisely on the 11th House cusp, but it's widely square both Sun and Moon (apex of a Cardinal T-Square). Uranus sits exactly on the 8th House cusp, but the only aspect it makes that isn't cross-sign is an opposition to Jupiter. (And being at the counter-antiscion of the Moon would not seem to dignify it.) It is, however, the "planet of oriental appearance" (it rises immediately ahead of the Sun), for what that's worth.

On the other side of the picture, neither Mercury (combust the Sun, opposite the Moon, retrograde and peregrine) nor Saturn (in traditional detriment in the 9th House) is particularly strong and neither would seem to be an astrological "signature" either. Perhaps Jupiter in Sagittarius in the 1st House trine Saturn might suffice, but it is retrograde as well. Maybe I should have been a professional technical writer instead . . . oh, wait, I was . . . :)