"School For Beginners"

[LadyZelda]

"The 4 Pillars of Our School For Beginners"


:) "Laying Good Foundations" - "No Question Is Irrelevant Or Silly" - "Feel Free To Share What You Sense" - "The Door Remains Open To All Who Wants To Learn" :)


Welcome everyone!:D

If you have just found this thread, I want to let you know that "the School's door" remains opened to anyone who wants to join even if we have already started:) You can always catch up with us by going to our first post....;)

Our Text Books are: "The Iris Treppner's Course" and "Le Petit Lenormand by Colette Silvestre" without locking ourselves into either of them.

Note: The Treppner's Course & "Le Petit Lenormand by Colette Silvestre" are not a requirement to participate in the School. During our classes anyone who has neither the course or the french book will be able to learn from our posts.

Once we study our first card I will open the "Cards' Meaning & Combination" thread and once we study our first layout I will open the "Lenormand Layouts" thread.

April 7th & 8th is our 1st day of class. You can drop by anytime during these 2 days;)

For our 1st Class we will study about:

1- The basics of divination:

Preparing a new deck of cards, preparing our space and oneself for reading the Oracle; sharpening our clairvoyance to get the most out of our readings...

2- Using the cards:

Shuffling, drawing, dealing...

3- Grouping the cards:

Communication - Object - Thematic - People - Positive - Negative - Mixed

This is a flexible schedule, we do not have to rush anything so if we cannot cover all the steps, we will finish up during our next class.

See you tomorrow! :D

[Eyebright]

Sounds good, can't wait to get started now :D

[MoiraKarin]

Sounds good sweetheart. Lots of success with enrolling this, and lots of succes and fun for all anticipating studens as well:)

[janie144]

Looking forward to it :)

[metatron3]

*sits en class with her deck. First row of course*

[LadyZelda]

Good Morning/Afternoon Everyone!:D



I lingered too long at the breakfast table...got myself late!

Thanks you all for being enthusiastic about our School For Beginners! :) Like most of you who enrolled, I've been drawn to the Lenormand Oracle, but been frustrated by not being as much "one" with it like I wanted to...So, now let's put down the veil and get in tune with this exquisite and mysterious deck!;)

1) Divination:

Those of you who own the Treppner's Course read about all the preparation for reading the Oracle.

I've done similar things since I read the Tarot and I believe this applies to the Oracle as well.

a) Preparing a new deck:

I'm gonna tell you exactly what I do, "but" this is not "the" way...You are free to do the same but you can also, adapt "my" way to your liking and beliefs, or do it completely differently. What I think is important and that is visibly the opinion of many professional readers, is to prepare your deck. The way you do it is up to you.

I don't know about you all but here is what I do (please share your own ways):

After I buy a deck (the same is true if you got a brand new deck or a used one), I first cleanse it from all energy that it gathered from the people who handled it before me. I light up either a Cedar or White Sage incense, place it in an incense holder, take the deck in my hands and kind of "fan" it. Then, I pass it through the smoke (making sure I don't touch the stick...as I want to smudge the cards not to burn them ;) ) and while doing that I say:

"Be gone Darkness and welcome Light" 3 times
"I banish any negative, evil energy from this deck and any energy that came from the people who handled it before me and bless it with divine Love and Light"
"Be gone Darkness and welcome Light. This deck is now cleansed and purified from any negative, evil energy and the energy that came from the people who handled it before me"

Next step, consecrate the deck: (again this is just "my" way that is imprinted with "my" spiritual beliefs...please share your own ways)

"I consecrate this deck of cards to be used as an instrument of pure, true and positive communications with the realm of Light. Only my spirit guide, the Goddess and God, and my higher self [here you can place whichever you believe in. It can even be just your higher self, or the spirit of the Oracle, or the Gypsy Spirit....] can use this oracle to communicate truth to me.
No other spirit beings, forces, and nothing at all from the power of darkness shall bring any input, or interfere in any way. Any form of evil, negativity is absolutely ordered to back off and remain away from any communication done through these cards.
I bless this deck and surround it with divine Love and Light; it is now “off limit” and Sacred.
Every reading done with this Sacred Oracle shall bring revelation, prophecy, guidance, knowledge, wisdom, to help me rise to higher level of spirituality. No reading shall ever be subject any “negative, evil disturbances or statics” and shall be clear from any input that comes from the carnal mind. So mote it be."

- For what the Iris Treppner calls “Neutralizing the cards”:

When you buy a new deck, all the cards are in order and of course we need to give them a good shuffling so that we don’t end up with cards following each other unless it is “meant to be”.

Here is what I do:

I spread my cards on my cloth and gently swirl them around get some from the bottom and put them on the top, etc…
Then I shuffle them the regular way.
Then, I deal them in 3 piles (I did that for all my Lenormand oracle decks because it’s only 36 cards. For the Tarot I will go with 5 piles). And shuffle again.
I do that until it “feels” right. Then I look over every card to make sure to have them right side up. Then I shuffle them the regular way one last time. At that point I estimate my deck ready.
Then, I place my deck in a “cleansed consecrated box or pouch” and leave a smooth crystal quartz with them as this crystal will soak any energy left on the cards and get them neutral in between readings.

Making our space ready:

If you don’t have one, it might be a good idea to get a “reading cloth” or make one (I made mine;) ). It is better to protect your deck as you place the cards on a soft fabric (I chose 100% silk but any soft and smooth fabric can do the trick too!), it is also good because you are placing your cards on a “neutral” energy area (tables gather energy from what we do on them) and it help concentration as the background of your spread will be a solid inspiring color (I favor “purple” it is proven to be a color that trigger intuition and that is we need to read the Oracle; but black and dark blue are very good too. It is better to avoid yellow, orange any flashy color that could distract you. And in my opinion it is better to avoid patterns completely).

If you buy or make a reading cloth, cleanse it and consecrate it just as you did your cards and keep it in a pouch or box. I do also smudge it from time to time to keep it neutral (as energy is released when reading the Oracle)

Before a reading, choose a room where you won’t be disturbed, cleanse it with incense the same way you cleansed your deck. Spread you reading clothe, and take your deck. You can if you want and sense you need to, smudge your deck before starting your spread.
Snuff the Cedar or White Sage incense that are used for cleansing and light up inspirational incense, those that trigger your intuition: Meditative incense (it is a blend I buy already made and they don’t say what it is made of), patchouli, rosemary, lemongrass, etc…

You can also light up a candle, I don’t but some do. You can put some soft music, meditative music, music for relaxation, music for yoga or nature sounds music… I do so from time to time when I see the need. It helps you unwind and reach the state of clairvoyance also called the “Alpha state”. If you choose to put music on; do so, very softly as you don’t want it to be distractive.



Ok, now I'm gonna let you discuss on that part....;)

[janie144]

Ok for the first part I had difficulty choosing the deck I wanted to study with, I really wanted to use my Mystical Lenormand it was the first Lenormand deck I owned and was the only one for a little while, I still love it. However I decided to help with the process of learning Lenormand it would be better to use one that has the corresponding playing card inserts so I have opted for Melissa's Postmark Lenormand, no cluttered or layered images, just clear simple pictures with the corresponding playing card at the top of the card along with the title, a good choice for learning I think.

Preparing a deck, ok I have to admit I have never ever done this with any deck new or old, Lenormand or Tarot, but hey in for a penny in for a pound so I am willing to give this a go. I do have some incence but I also have a white sage smudge stick and I have heard a lot about how they are great for cleansing and removing any and all negitive energies, so that is what I think I will use.

Personal space is a little harder to do in my mad, very busy house, too many people too many pets etc etc, I am going to have to work a bit harder on that one, however to help I have found myself a nice little box which I have filled with some bits and bobs, I have never owned a spread cloth so today I found an old scrap of material, a lovely soft faux suede sort of material and frayed all the edges ( they say neccesity is the mother of creation :)) and in the box it went, along with my cards and a couple of crystals so now I can just pick up and move to whichever room is quieter at any time :D


My spread cloth

[alyna]

Hi everyone

so we are here at the class. Its really convenient with the time being 2 whole days as 1 day.

About divination, I have a strong belief that no matter what tool we use, be it meditation, scrying, oracle decks or tarot decks, the answer is all lying within you. I like the Lenormand deck a lot mainly because it talks to me like a friend. There seems to be no end to learning it. Everyday I find a new way to read the cards and everyday there is a new combination emerging. Its like a real friend talking, the little friend in your head, talking through your cards.

About neutralizing, cleansing etc, I seriously have never paid much attention, except occasionally putting them with sea salt and putting them in the right order (1-36) after every few readings (5-8). This does the trick for me. Some days are good days, when I can feel an urge to read them, so I offer some free readings too on the forums or to friends, but some how its not everyday.

I forgot to mention I have a Blue Owl with playing cards inserts and I'm looking for mystical one. Will get it soon. I've been religiously taking help from Treppner's course and I find it very extensive.

When I read the cards, I switch between methods of shuffling and which card I pull off, its mainly because I feel like doing it. I'm just trying to find a method that works for me and for that I have to explore different methods first. This is why I'm open to new meanings, new spreads, new methods of cleansing, shuffling, cutting, everything. I try them all and still get very accurate readings no matter what I do. I've had some very very accurate readings when I did not even know how to read the cards. If it worked for me then, it will now too.

The only thing that effects my readings the most is my nervousness . When I'm nervous my readings will never make sense , however when I'm mentally and physically relaxed, I will do wonders and the answers will come in a motion picture like thing in front of my eyes. I recommend meditating with the cards. You will learn what the card means to YOU.

This is me so far. Thank you

[LadyZelda]

Janie, I agree that to do the learning a deck with the cartomancy shown is easier. So far I own 4 Lenormand Oracle Decks (I've got few more I desire to get but I will have to wait that my finances permit...: the astrological, the art nouveau, Les vieux jours and Isabell's dream). Right now I chose the Carta Mundy it has the cartomancy too!
You've got yourself a good cloth thanks for sharing a pic :)

Alyna I know what you mean about feeling that the Oracle is a dear friend! I feel the same too and desire to know the oracle better, there is something about it that I can't explain and that draw me to it so much.

Yes, agree with you regarding meditating on each card! This is very important to know the Oracle through and through...and get the most out of each card. I was planning on starting that as soon as we start to study the cards. And yes, for me too I believe it is good to find out about diverse ways and then follow the one or maybe even a mix that really click with me. I think we all have our very own, special relationship with the Oracle, you know what I mean...so I believe our way with the Oracle has to be tailored exactly for us, fitting like a glove...

Being relax is primordial for me if I want to be able to do any divination and I found that preparing my space, lightening the incense, doing a breathing session really help and like you say when I'm well relaxed everything flows and it is like watching a movie...:D

[LadyZelda]

Many professionals advice to prepare and "isolate" (I call that going into my "bubble") ourselves before any form of divination. Here is the way I do it:

-Preparing oneself to consult the Oracle:

Before I shuffle the cards or anything else here is what I do to put myself in “Alpha” mode:

I sit straight, feet well-grounded on the floor. I do a little session of breathing. I close my eyes and breath in raising my arms, joining my hands (just each palm against the other, no finger crossing) on top of my head then I breath out letting my arms go wide open down, then gather my hands in front of my chest in “Namaste” pose…if you ever done Yoga, what I do is really a type of Yoga breathing, with a sitting mountain pose. I breathe like that 7 times with my eyes closed.

Then, I surround myself with light; I place myself like "in a bubble", where it is just me and the Oracle. To materialize that I say:

Be gone Darkness and welcome Light! I allow only guidance and energies that are harmless, pure & true. All evil, negative energies or entities must leave now! Divine Wisdom within me, Light above me, Earth beneath me, the Light of Love surrounds me…I am protected from all that is not Love and my Sacred Oracle is kept in the boundaries of its consecration. So mote it be.

Then I ask for wisdom, enlightenment to be given to me through the Oracle. :)

- Shuffling, drawing, dealing, for a spread:

At that point I shuffle just the regular way to shuffle cards unless I sense the need to give my cards a good swirl on my reading cloth. I usually cut but sometimes I don't. I either fan my cards on my cloth to draw with my left hand or I just deal.

If I draw: I shuffle concentrating on my question or just asking for wisdom. Then what I like to do first is to raise the energy by rubbing my hands together, eyes closed, than I open my hands a bit, and feel the energy rising between my hands. Rub some more and separate my hands wider, etc...Until it feels right. You can really feel the energy between your hands and in the heart of your hands. If you ever practice Qi Gong this is one of the exercises you do...If you never done that you can try just for the feeling, for an experimental experience ;) Of course, you don't have to do it before a reading if it is not like you to do so.

Anyhow, like I was saying I raise the energy, and when I feel I'm ready, still with my eyes closed, I let my left hand hover the cards and I will draw a card when I sense the pulling of the energy. I do that like that because I always feel like if I would not draw the right card if I was looking at them and make my pick...

If I choose to "deal" the cards (which always worked very well for me), I shuffle, and while shuffling I concentrate on the question, or ask for wisdom. And I ask to shuffle until the cards are in place to give me the message and before I cut, I ask that I will cut right where the wisdom lies.

After I draw or deal, I proceed with the layout. With my cards always face down. Then I turn them right side up. Look at them for a moment (I do follow Iris Treppner with that step), and then I close my eyes for the "vision". I don't try to "force" any picture to appear; I just remain relaxed and wait for the "movie" to start ;) I keep a voice recorder on pause ready for me to use as soon as I see a picture. At that point my eyes remain closed and I just describe what I see. I found out that this works out better for me than to write down what I see. I feel that writing down kind of breaks the flow of the vision as I have to open my eyes and write...
I have gotten great results since I have started to do that. It gives me additional clues about the message of the Oracle.

Well I will now turn the table to you! If you are still up and available as it must be evening for you in Europe! For me I still have quite some time but I have now to prepare diner!


Hope to see you soon!:D

[Empath111]

Just popping in to say I'm slow and just found the thread. Lol. However, I am glad I'm here. Intrigued and very thankful:)

[metatron3]

I'm much like janie : It never occurred to me to cleanse a deck nor have a sacred space : should it be a clothe or a place at home.
Mostly because taking more than 10 minutes at home without being disturbed isn't possible ;)
It is a really busy house when someone is always needing something and asking someone else where it is ... if not asking simply "what are you doin' ?" in a lovely tone. Full of love, but love do take all your time ;)

Still ! For this first day of class I took my only deck ( LoS French Cartomancy ) and will follow me all week. I do like the idea of seeing cards like friends ... and I like to know my friends. ( do I sound like a stalker ? )

For some unknown reason I was drawn to Lenormand. Probably because I am the kind who likes practical answers more than often and Tarot give me more direction to follow, not : "you'll get a letter, won't be fun" which sometimes, is what I'm looking for and all the deep informations you can get from those 36 cards.

Anyway ! This class is starting right in time since I've started meditation a week ago so I'm getting a bit used it and it does help me to center. A new concept for me ;)

Hehehe : totally newbie ^_^

[LadyZelda]

Pity! I missed your visit Empath and Metatron! I don't have much time left but I would like to add a bit more....

I'm gonna ask our moderators if they could make a sticky out of our "School For Beginners" like they offered us. That would probably help everyone find our classroom ;)

Metatron you are not the only one with finding it difficult to retire on your own, Janie mentioned it too...This is not easy to advice on, but I will say maybe to use the quieter room in your house, if need be your bedroom. Try to bring a portable table unless you have a vanity table in your bedroom, otherwise only the floor will be left which for some people is not too comfortable. At all cost I would not use the bed, but this is my opinion. The idea of a "sacred place" is really a room because you need to be one with the Oracle. You can't be focused and all ears if there is noise, family members talking etc...Sometimes, the best is to work out a certain time when others are busy doing their own things. And also just frankly asking to "please do not disturb me until I get out of this room, I need a little time on my own". It has always worked for me...but every household is different. For sure, I would lose my "visions" if someone would suddenly come up and start to talk...It happened once and it broke the flow. Also, I have learned to silence my phone for the time I'm reading the Oracle or Tarot. I estimate that it is OK, as it is not like I'm shutting myself for a whole day...But again; it depends on everyone's life, what work for me might not work for you. The reading cloth is really just for the cards, to keep the energy neutral, not to have interferences, but in itself will not bring the focus needed if you have a people chatting around you.
Meditation is a great + and will help a lot!:)

Tomorrow, I will post about the 3rd part of our first lesson: "The Grouping Of The Cards". I was hoping to do so tonight so you all who live in Europe would have had that to munch on while I'm still sleeping ;) but we watched Indiana Jones tonight and now it is a bit too late...

So I bid you good night! :D and hope to see you tomorrow!

[MoiraKarin]

Divination: I personally see definition through tarot or oracle deck such as specific as the lenormand deck as communication with your ‘ higher self’ or higher consciousness. I think such a communication succeeds or fail as depending on what energy we all align ourselves with. Cards are just ways as to bring forth energy from higher source. Cards is energy in form just as any other object is. It is not the form which matters but what meaning we give to the presented form in the way we gave it meaning. Consistency with focus to the meaning you give to the card sequence is important…

I am convinced that it does not matter whether these these specific symbols, are printed on plastic cards, pixel images from computer programs or painted on gold, or curved in stone
If you bring down all the means you give it form, every chosen form originate from the same source of energy(light , higher divine intelligent light)
This is the way I perceive it, anyway. I just seem them as ways of bringing images into existence through our subconscious connected with our higher consciousness.

I am now currently working with the Novobrisk,- hedewitch and the mystical lenormand .
I would love to get my hands on the Melissa lenormand or the magischer Lenormand

I do not pay much attention to card cleansing although I do have
incense I have a sort of white table cloth as well . I have a ‘token’ which I like to see as a presentation of presence of higher source.
A art deco colour stained glass owl. This owl is really awesome. . I try to prepare myself the best way possible. Maintaining a fresh cleansed spirit who is calm, ready to focus and to be as non-judge mental as I can be . I really want to learn the cards to speak to me. I tried to be ‘open minded ‘ all the way for all possible options.

I like to be able to focus with as less distraction possible.

I like to be comfortable during reading, taking care of myself, the best way possible. I prefere reading in the evening night or early mornings

[LaLaBella]

Divination-My attitude about divination is based on being raised by a woman who has spent her entire life thinking that she is a "Mystic" (her term, not mine) and never quite getting there. Anyway, I think that everyone has one or a laundry list of spiritual gifts and for some of us, divination is one of the gifts. Lenormand is one of the ways that I hope to access that gift if I possess it.

Neutralizing/Cleansing-I've never given this any thought. I suppose I should have but there you have it. I do look at all the cards. Kind of like a getting to know you thing but anything involving crystals, candles or incense hasn't happened.

Preparing to Read-First of all, there's only 2 places in the house where I can get the privacy to work with the cards. The first is the laundry room and the other is the weight room in the basement. I usually use the weight room and even then, I still get interrupted unless no one is home. This is rare. I learned early in my childhood how to put a barrier between me and the outside world. Then it's just a matter of centering myself which is more of a challenge. I need an off-switch for my brain.
I have a cloth to read on but I think that I need something bigger. Also a notebook to write the reading on. I also deal the cards face down and turn over what I'm reading as I'm reading it because otherwise it becomes information overload.

This is it for now.
Lady Zelda, why is reading on the bed bad? Just curious.

[LadyZelda]

Divination-
Lady Zelda, why is reading on the bed bad? Just curious.

It is all about energy being released. It is I will say like a concept of Feng Shui where certain place must remain in a certain way. When you read cards energies will be produce (at least according to my belief), if you read on your bed these energies will spread and remain on your bed (unless you go into cleansing your bed). These energies might be very positive because the reading was all about wonderful news, but it can be also not so good and some negative energy will be the results, even if we are able to "swallow" accept the bad news, in my opinion it still create some negative energies because it was not pleasant and it is but "human" to react to something unpleasant to some extent. Your bed is supposed to be as a peaceful place as possible. Your night is supposed to give you the rest you need to face another day. You don't want any negative energy that could disturb your sleep in any ways. So I never read cards on my bed, I know others don't either. Some say "it's bad luck, it brings bad stuff in your life", I don't know about that, it is part of the folklore built upon superstitions...But, I also abide by a simple rule "better be safe than sorry". Knowing that some nights are not so peaceful, I have to say that I am among those who believe in placing an amethyst cluster on my bed and live it there few hours when I sense the need of a good cleansing. Amethyst is a gemstone that is a true gift from the Goddess and the God. It absorbs negative energies, fear, worries like a sponge and does restore the "balance"....At least this is what I believe and practice.

If you have more questions always feel free to ask :D

MoiraKarin, I love the idea of an "owl" deco and yeah, that must be such a site to behold!

Thank you all for sharing your views and ways... :) It is very interesting ;)

[LadyZelda]

GROUPING Of CARDS BY SIMILARITY - Summary of Colette Sylvestre method:

1- News – changes – movement
The Rider
The Ship
The Birds
The Storks
The Letter

2- Feelings of happiness - tenderness – harmony:
The Star
The Flowers
The Garden
The Lily

3- Luck – fate – opportunities:
The Clover
The Key

4 – Friendship – Love – harmonious relationships
The Dog
The Heart
The Ring
The Sun

5- Strength – Stability – Safety – Success
The Bear
The Tower
The Sun
The Anchor

6- Protection – Peace – Calm
The House
The Tree
The Book

7- Imagination – fame – intuition
The Moon
The Fish

8- Temporary problems – Road blocks – Doubts
The Clouds
The Mountain
The Path

9- Treason – Manipulation – theft
The Snake
The Fox
The Mice

10- Separation – Ends – Conflicts – Sorrows
The Coffin
The Scythe
The Whip
The Cross

CLASSIFICATION OF CARDS (Summary of Iris Treppner’s method)

1- Communication:

The Rider
The Whip
The Birds
The Letter

2- People cards:

Most used:
The Lord
The Lady
The Child
The Rider
The Snake
The Bear
The Dog
The Lily

The court cards found in the cartomancy insert like “the King of hearts/The house” card. Among them the most predominant are:

The Queen of Clubs/The Snake
The Jack of Clubs/The Child
The King of Spades/The Lily
(see Treppner’s Course for details about each card – if you don’t have it ask me)

3- Object Cards relate to material things:

The Rider
The Ship
The House
The Flowers
The Bear
The Tower
The Fish
The Anchor

Thematic Cards relate to archetypes like “house = family”

The Clover
The Tree
The Clouds
The Snake
The Coffin
The Scythe
The Whip
The Birds
The Child
The Fox
The Stars
The Storks
The Dog
The Garden
The Mountain (also an object card)
The Paths
The Mice
The Heart
The Ring (also an object card)
The Book (also an object card)
The Letter
The Lily
The Sun
The Moon
The Key
The Cross

4- Positive – Negative – Mixed cards

a) Positve:

The Rider
The Clover
The Ship
The House
The Flowers
The Child
The Bear
The Stars
The Storks
The Dog
The Tower
The Garden
The Paths
The Heart
The Ring
The Book
The Letter
The Lord
The Lady
The Lily
The Sun
The Moon
The Key
The Fish
The Anchor

b) Negative cards:

The Clouds
The Coffin
The Scythe
The Fox
The Mountain
The Mice
The Cross

c) Mixed positive/negative cards:

The Tree
The Snake
The Whip
The Birds

My views on certain cards:

a) Among the “Positive cards” that at times can have some negativity

-The tower: For example it can talk about isolation, depression, being “locked up” being trapped, waiting room that can create stress

-The Bear: Can be a powerful opponent not easily dealt with

-The Moon: unrealistic fears, unstability

b) Among the “Negative cards” that depending of their position or point of view can have some positivity:

- The Clouds: if you are on the white side of the clouds it means for me that things are either clearing up or it won’t be much trouble, just little annoyances

- The Coffin: sometimes an end is a blessing and also the end can be seen as a new beginning

- The Scythe: if the sharp edge point away then things are not so bad. Also as I have a working farm, I cannot help but see the “harvest” side of the Scythe…which is when “the party begins!”

- The Fox: Well for me fox can be also considered as wise, they know how to turn the tables around to win, they know how to get what they need, they are practical and sometimes in life you better be like the fox and be witty enough to find ways (they don’t have to be crooked ones) to fix your situation or you won’t survive.

- Mountain: if it is behind you, that mean you have overcome and can move on

- Cross: Can be going into deeper level of spirituality

Iris Treppner give another interesting list:

1- The 2 Negative cards that neutralize the negative cards next to them:

-The Mice & The Scythe (Sharp edge toward next card):

Destroy the effect of: The Scythe, The Mice, The Coffin, the Clouds, the Mountain, the Cross, the Fox

2- Two negative cards:

Except for the Mice and Scythe, negative cards following each other reinforce the negativity.

3- Negative cards will “spoil” positive cards:

The beneficial effect of any positive card will be destroyed by a negative card. For instance, in my opinion if the Flowers are followed by the Coffin, that means the end of happiness or even a funeral


I will end this post there and let you share your views. Also just in case I’m unable to come back later on I would like to talk about our next class.

-Do you want us to study 2 or more cards and discuss about them during our next class?
-Do you want that beside the study of 2 or more cards, we start learning about 1 layout?

I will open today the “Cards' Meaning & Combination" thread and post the “Grouping of the cards” list to keep as a reference. Once we discuss the meaning of cards I will add them as we go. :D

[MoiraKarin]

the moon relate to positive feelings for me as well most of the time, but could sometimes 'flip coins'and turn into' fearsome'

[Caristia]

Sorry I'm late for class - I've spent the entire weekend trying to catch up with my work (including an all-nighter on Friday night). :(

First of all, I only have one Lenormand deck - a Piatnik - and I understand that the clouds are reversed. I hope that isn't a problem.

I've never paid much attention to cleansing though I have to admit that my Lenormand has something very special about it. I don't know if it's "energy" or what. I got it from Mr. Somerville. The deck seems like it had been lovingly handled but there's also a touch of something else - wistfulness? I bought it during the last few days before he closed up shop, so maybe that explains it.

I'm also one of those who is having trouble finding a place to do the readings. Only 2 rooms are inhabitable at the moment, so I can either use the kitchen table and get disturbed or use the bed, which apparently isn't ideal either.

At least I have a nice place to lay out the cards - a beautiful velvet Sulis reading cloth.

Last night I tried the "finding your inner centre" exercise and promptly fell asleep!

Tonight I will try the breathing exercise while looking at the Rider card. Is anybody else going through the whole deck like that one card at a time as Iris suggests?

[lord_ewin]

I've never paid much attention to cleansing though I have to admit that my Lenormand has something very special about it. I don't know if it's "energy" or what. I got it from Mr. Somerville. The deck seems like it had been lovingly handled but there's also a touch of something else - wistfulness? I bought it during the last few days before he closed up shop, so maybe that explains it.

I'm also one of those who is having trouble finding a place to do the readings. Only 2 rooms are inhabitable at the moment, so I can either use the kitchen table and get disturbed or use the bed, which apparently isn't ideal either.

At least I have a nice place to lay out the cards - a beautiful velvet Sulis reading cloth.



I don't bother cleansing the cards, and don't believe it matters much where or how you draw the cards so long as you have enough room and some quiet to concentrate. I have done readings on my bed, first thing in the morning, and the only places I don't recommend are outdoors unless the wind is calm. So don't worry about where... :)


CLEANSING / CONSECRATING:

Any hoky poky is just added fluff for show in my opinion, and doesn't really help me with my card readings. If it helps you, keep at it, but we hardly have to go through burning insence and throwing holy water over our cards and burrying them beneath an oak tree in a special box on the full moon to get cards ready for readings. You rip the plastic off the deck, fondly look at all the cards, clear your mind and tell them what you want done and what your question is and go at it. It has never failed in my 12 years of reading Lenormand, and my 25 years with the Tarot.

On the occasion that the reading seems wonky, the fault is usually mine because I'm preoccupied or can't seem to concentrate, not because the cards aren't tuned in. You're the card reader. Either you are tuned in, or you are not... The pieces of paper in your hands don't need anything more than a firm hand and a clear and inspired mind.


LE

PS, yes, I do recommend meditating on each card as Iris Treppner suggests. Keep your note book close by and mark down any thoughts. I'd even ask myself 4 questions, what this card represents in love, what it represents in work, etc... It gets you thinking about future meanings. :)

[Empath111]

Divination-I do ask for assistance from my higher power to help me be able to read the messages clearly and for it to come from that divine source. To enhance this I sometimes use certain crystals. I calm myself and meditate/ground to get get a good "base" and then can sense easier if my crown chakra is more open...I might not always think of it as my crown chakra, but coming from the top as from above. I do know when I have prepared well because I sense a tingling there when shuffling.

Neutralizing/Cleansing-I've never really done this either although it intrigues me hearing about it here. Especially with a new deck. I have smudged, but never my deck.
Preparing to Read-I have a room in my home that I have to treat patients and to use for my own meditation/grounding purposes. Because the technique I learned is very "energy based" - sometimes emotions get released and I have absorbed them in the past. So I do have to ground/center and protect prior. I have smudged the area with white sage at times when I can sense it is needed..based on negativity brought in or released. My room is set up with crystals on the window sills, plants, water fountain - relaxing music if needed. I don't use a silk cloth or anything..just my computer desk. Maybe need to re-think that. Love the ideas here..will try some out!

[LadyZelda]

Sorry I'm late for class - I've spent the entire weekend trying to catch up with my work (including an all-nighter on Friday night). :(

First of all, I only have one Lenormand deck - a Piatnik - and I understand that the clouds are reversed. I hope that isn't a problem.

No, it won't be because you look at it in "your" reading and the appropriate card will be on either side it "has" to be to give you the message.

I've never paid much attention to cleansing though I have to admit that my Lenormand has something very special about it. I don't know if it's "energy" or what. I got it from Mr. Somerville. The deck seems like it had been lovingly handled but there's also a touch of something else - wistfulness? I bought it during the last few days before he closed up shop, so maybe that explains it.

It is well acknowledged that "energies" of different kinds are all around us. Humans, animals, crystals, etc... release energy, we are energy beings...The very concept of Feng Shui is that to keep the balance, the harmony necessary in one's life, one has to let the energy flows and get rid of any negative energy. When you are worried you are releasing a different energy than when you are overjoyed...The energies that were in the shop when as it was closing were the owner's feelings about closing his shop, the faithful customers' feelings about the closing of "their" store...All these energies were deposited on everything in that store. Some people who would get a hand down deck from someone who was a very good fortune teller desire to keep "the energy" left by the previous owner as a "+", feeling it is going to enhance their own readings. Still, after a day of reading they will cleanse the deck by smudging it to remove the energies of all the readings that were done but will make sure not to say "and the energy that belongs to those who handled that deck before me" as they want to keep the energy of that fortune teller...
When I'm done using the Oracle I put it away in its box with a crystal quartz on the top of it to soak up all the energies released by the readings, so that I will get my Oracle back to a "neutral" state. This is "my" way and the way of many professional readers, but you have to see how it resonates with you. In the end it will have to be according to what "you" believe is "the" way.

I'm also one of those who are having trouble finding a place to do the readings. Only 2 rooms are inhabitable at the moment, so I can either use the kitchen table and get disturbed or use the bed, which apparently isn't ideal either.

If your bedroom is the only place where you won't be disturbed, if you don't have a portable table, if you are uncomfortable on the floor, and the only possible place is your bed. Then, I would smudge the room to cleanse the energies, I would place an amethyst cluster on the bed, lay out my reading cloth and when I'm done reading I would cleanse the bed by smudging it (just going all around it, and extending your arm above with the incense) and leave the amethyst cluster for as long as you can, and smudge the room to get everything back to neutral. After that I would cleanse my amethyst cluster because it acts like a sponge and therefore would be filled with all the energies it gathered. The amethyst can be cleanse by pouring some salted water (1 cup of water with 1 tsp of natural sea salt) and by saying the "cleansing" words. Then, it would be good to go for another day. (there is no need to cleanse in between session during the same day unless you feel strong about doing so. Cleansing would be after you are done for the day to get your bedroom and your bed back to their neutral state and worldly use).

But, I have to stress out that all I have said is what "I" would do if I was in your shoes. If that doesn't bear witness with your spirit, then by all means do according to what "you" sense has to be done. :)



Is anybody else going through the whole deck like that one card at a time as Iris suggests?

I'm going to meditate probably upon at least 2 cards per week depending of the time I have. I think it is a good thing to do so, because for our next class we will start studding the meaning of each card. Thus, it would be better if everyone meditate on at least 1 card to participate during class ;)

[LadyZelda]

Divination-I do ask for assistance from my higher power to help me be able to read the messages clearly and for it to come from that divine source. To enhance this I sometimes use certain crystals. I calm myself and meditate/ground to get get a good "base" and then can sense easier if my crown chakra is more open...I might not always think of it as my crown chakra, but coming from the top as from above. I do know when I have prepared well because I sense a tingling there when shuffling.

The same goes for me :) good preparation makes a difference...

Neutralizing/Cleansing-I've never really done this either although it intrigues me hearing about it here. Especially with a new deck. I have smudged, but never my deck.
Preparing to Read-I have a room in my home that I have to treat patients and to use for my own meditation/grounding purposes. Because the technique I learned is very "energy based" - sometimes emotions get released and I have absorbed them in the past. So I do have to ground/center and protect prior. I have smudged the area with white sage at times when I can sense it is needed..based on negativity brought in or released. My room is set up with crystals on the window sills, plants, water fountain - relaxing music if needed. I don't use a silk cloth or anything..just my computer desk. Maybe need to re-think that. Love the ideas here..will try some out!

Sounds like a great room! I don't have the possibility right now but I'm looking forward to have a water fountain ;) Thanks for sharing! :D

[LadyZelda]

CLEANSING / CONSECRATING:

Any hoky poky is just added fluff for show in my opinion, and doesn't really help me with my card readings. If it helps you, keep at it, but we hardly have to go through burning insence and throwing holy water over our cards and burrying them beneath an oak tree in a special box on the full moon to get cards ready for readings.

Thanks for sharing your way :) I have to disagree about the way you describe "the cleansing/consecrating" For all of us who are doing that it is not "hoky poky is just added fluff for show". I am reading on my own and I don't have to impress anyone. Professionals who do that, don't either because the customer doesn't see any of the cleansing/consecrating. The only thing they will see is a room well set up, but again it has nothing to do with putting on a "show". Everyone who follow that path truly believes that energies must be dealt with, that crystals are a gift to help us with that and many other things as a matter of fact, as well as the effect of incense, and candles. Did you ever notice how a certain smell can change the way you feel or bring peacefulness? The same is true with music. All that are proven facts that some disregard and some receive, but they are facts nonetheless. Life is not just about "matter" that you can touch, yes, the cards are paper and ink and paint, but beside that it is an Oracle...their special use set them apart from a deck that you would use just for playing poker....and the energy that will flow makes the difference...;)
Still you have to follow your path and everyone of us has to follow their own....

I'd even ask myself 4 questions, what this card represents in love, what it represents in work, etc... It gets you thinking about future meanings. :)

Real good idea! :D

[Empath111]

The same goes for me :) good preparation makes a difference...



Sounds like a great room! I don't have the possibility right now but I'm looking forward to have a water fountain ;) Thanks for sharing! :D

I am very lucky- it's mainly for business reasons, but it serves multi purposes:) Very lucky. It is a calm room even before the grounding "stuff" I added. I really want more plants:) That's my next goal.

[MoiraKarin]

Thanks for sharing your way :) I have to disagree about the way you describe "the cleansing/consecrating" For all of us who are doing that it is not "hoky poky is just added fluff for show". I am reading on my own and I don't have to impress anyone. Professionals who do that, don't either because the customer doesn't see any of the cleansing/consecrating. The only thing they will see is a room well set up, but again it has nothing to do with putting on a "show". Everyone who follow that path truly believes that energies must be dealt with, that crystals are a gift to help us with that and many other things as a matter of fact, as well as the effect of incense, and candles. Did you ever notice how a certain smell can change the way you feel or bring peacefulness? The same is true with music. All that are proven facts that some disregard and some receive, but they are facts nonetheless. Life is not just about "matter" that you can touch, yes, the cards are paper and ink and paint, but beside that it is an Oracle...their special use set them apart from a deck that you would use just for playing poker....and the energy that will flow makes the difference...;)
Still you have to follow your path and everyone of us has to follow their own....



Real good idea! :D
I really agree here with LE
Smells object rituals will set in the inmagintion instead of your higher conscieceness to pass on messages just as well as music, or other distractions.
we want here to be connected to divine not to inmagination.
I never use incense for reading other then i think it will be good to use it to neutralize energies. However i think this should be done long before the reading.
Just a clear calm focused mind just as well as the place to where you do the readings, are important
It is important to get the messages clear from your higher consciousness instead of your inmagination to set in and tell it's story

[Empath111]

PS, yes, I do recommend meditating on each card as Iris Treppner suggests. Keep your note book close by and mark down any thoughts. I'd even ask myself 4 questions, what this card represents in love, what it represents in work, etc... It gets you thinking about future meanings. :)

I like this idea too

[lord_ewin]

Thanks for sharing your way :) I have to disagree about the way you describe "the cleansing/consecrating" For all of us who are doing that it is not "hoky poky is just added fluff for show". I am reading on my own and I don't have to impress anyone. Professionals who do that, don't either because the customer doesn't see any of the cleansing/consecrating. The only thing they will see is a room well set up, but again it has nothing to do with putting on a "show". Everyone who follow that path truly believes that energies must be dealt with, that crystals are a gift to help us with that and many other things as a matter of fact, as well as the effect of incense, and candles. Did you ever notice how a certain smell can change the way you feel or bring peacefulness? The same is true with music. All that are proven facts that some disregard and some receive, but they are facts nonetheless. Life is not just about "matter" that you can touch, yes, the cards are paper and ink and paint, but beside that it is an Oracle...their special use set them apart from a deck that you would use just for playing poker....and the energy that will flow makes the difference...;)



My point was, if the crystals, the incense, the incantations works for you, do it, but it is hardly something that must be done for success in card reading, tarot, or Lenormand.

It's like a football player tussling the mascot's hair for luck. It won't help him win the game, but if it makes him less nervous and lets him concentrate on things, terrific, but some of us do manage to get right to the point without it.



LE

[Empath111]

My point was, if the crystals, the incense, the incantations works for you, do it, but it is hardly something that must be done for success in card reading, tarot, or Lenormand.

It's like a football player tussling the mascot's hair for luck. It won't help him win the game, but if it makes him less nervous and lets him concentrate on things, terrific, but some of us do manage to get right to the point without it.



LE
I was going to comment on this in the like.
I'm a PT who learned a technique that was more energy-based than traditional physical therapy. I had no idea why I was getting flighty and would go home exhausted. It was the weirdest thing I ever felt. My supervisor never taught me about "grounding " (which i had no idea what the heck it meant) because she thought I was the most grounded person she ever met. So other staff members were taught it I guess upon hire. Well, I'm not grounded. LOL I'm the opposite. So I learned the hard way searching around for help. Things that generally "bring the outdoors in" can help as well as meditation etc. Now, my boss was VERY grounded and didn't need to spend time between patients in quiet for 2 mins doing some deep breaths etc. Then again, she couldn't sense I was ungrounded - which most grounded people can't feel.

This also reminds me of my son dad who was a pitcher and could just focus and block everything else out - he's a grounded guy and it just came natural. My son..he can't block stuff out - lots of pressure on a pitcher....and he's more like me. But they both can throw great - great athletes. But you have to be able to block out stuff and focus in that position. So since he's started taking his time between pitches and taking a few deep breaths he has improved a lot. Plus he does some imagery and calming before the game at home if he is going to pitch. Prior to that he was struggling big time. So it does depend on the person, IMO.

I think of rustling someone's hair as superstitious versus grounding. Valid grounding techniques help for people who need it. Massage therapists are taught it etc. Again, not everyone needs it to the same degree.

[LadyZelda]

My point was, if the crystals, the incense, the incantations works for you, do it, but it is hardly something that must be done for success in card reading, tarot, or Lenormand.

It's like a football player tussling the mascot's hair for luck. It won't help him win the game, but if it makes him less nervous and lets him concentrate on things, terrific, but some of us do manage to get right to the point without it.

LE

I understood your point, but visibly I didn't express mine very well, sorry about that ;)

I and all others like me, do not do what we do "like a football player tussling the mascot's hair for luck" etc..., it is not to help ourselves to concentrate on the reading, or to be able to get the message of the Oracle either. Just like you "we can get right to the point" :) What I have been trying to explain is that it is about the reality of "energy management". It has nothing to do with hocus pocus and imagination.:D

[lord_ewin]

I understood your point, but visibly I didn't express mine very well, sorry about that ;)

I and all others like me, do not do what we do "like a football player tussling the mascot's hair for luck" etc..., it is not to help ourselves to concentrate on the reading, or to be able to get the message of the Oracle either. Just like you "we can get right to the point" :) What I have been trying to explain is that it is about the reality of "energy management". It has nothing to do with hocus pocus and imagination.:D

I think we'll never agree on that point, no point in insisting. On with the show. :)

[214red]

I understood your point, but visibly I didn't express mine very well, sorry about that ;)

I and all others like me, do not do what we do "like a football player tussling the mascot's hair for luck" etc..., it is not to help ourselves to concentrate on the reading, or to be able to get the message of the Oracle either. Just like you "we can get right to the point" :) What I have been trying to explain is that it is about the reality of "energy management". It has nothing to do with hocus pocus and imagination.:D

energy management really has nothing to do with cards, its to do with your energetic selves, the card from that point of view are an extention of that.

anways, people have different methods for reading, they dont have to manage their energy to read. if they dont manage their energy they are likely to feel it someways, but does it affect their readings? i dont think it does, it just might be that they personally get the effects, perhaps headaches, or tiredness...

I dont think its needed for reading, if your linking to spirits during this yes, but your guides , no.

interesting thread, good luck

[DownUnderNZer]

What is meant by "Energy Management"? Is it the atmosphere (negative/postive vibes of a room/people)... or the individual..as in the "reader".

I do have to agree with a few others on here that there is no need for "energy management' when it comes to reading cards, oracles, boards or the Lenormand etc. However, the reader does have to be focused, respectful and unbiased as possible so that when s/he reads they are giving the best insight/information/message as s/he can.

I can read my Lenormand eating a sandwhich in front of the tv or drinking a hot milo or coffee whilst playing with my pc, but I do make sure to be as FOCUSED as possible. I dont need crystals, incense sticks, incitations, or managing energy to work with them at ALL.

With MEDIUMSHIP I would be different about it as I do think that is working with energy of sorts and there are things that should be considered and not taken lightly. I would be doing protection prayers, connecting to guides and cleasing rituals etc etc etc.

However, with any form of reading as long as there is respect, an awareness, responsibilty as well as good ethics that is what matters when it comes down to reading for sitters. :)

[Empath111]

Sorry if OT: Just a quick question. I have one Lenormand Deck: Mystical Lenormand. Is this one that people generally use here? Any particular one you like better? I like this one so far, but a newbie to Lenormand.

[lord_ewin]

Sorry if OT: Just a quick question. I have one Lenormand Deck: Mystical Lenormand. Is this one that people generally use here? Any particular one you like better? I like this one so far, but a newbie to Lenormand.

Hi Empath; Yes, a bit off topic, but to answer your question I don't think there is a predominant deck. People seem to be using a little of everything from Carta Mundi to the Limited Editions Collector Decks. Given the cards all have the same major symbols, the deck you have should work just fine in this learning setting.

Hope that helps...!

LE

[Empath111]

Hi Empath; Yes, a bit off topic, but to answer your question I don't think there is a predominant deck. People seem to be using a little of everything from Carta Mundi to the Limited Editions Collector Decks. Given the cards all have the same major symbols, the deck you have should work just fine in this learning setting.

Hope that helps...!

LE
Thank you! :D Helps a lot.

[lord_ewin]

Re: Energy Management - I'm not saying it's not useful. To some it might be of high value, and to others, less so. Myself, I use meditation techniques (that on a good day is almost instant and on an off day takes a while) to slip into my "hightened" mind over matter state.

I use it mainly when shuffling the cards to get a good visual of the question I am asking, and shutting out everything else. It's quickly abandoned for the interpretation part of the process. My mind looks at a series and just gives me a story:

Like the mice, nice little furry creatures, eating away at a piece of cheese, next to the house, suddenly making a nest in the walls, infesting my pantry, ruining and chewing on cables, and general uncleaness.

For my clients, I will use the feeling of violation and paranoia that that imagery brought on, and usually wxpand a bit more about things for them.

My point is that everyone is different, and so we can't preach one method over another. There isn't "one" right way. My method might put other people off, meanwhile yours might be a right fit, and vice versa. I think the sharing of ideas and methods is particularly useful in one's journey to reading fortunes, and leads to a mish-mash of experience that influences a neophant's own style.

All in all, I think this a good discussion to have just so that people can honestly ponder what they are more comfortable with. Good on you for leading the discussion, Lady Zelda.

LE

[Empath111]

Re: Energy Management - I'm not saying it's not useful. To some it might be of high value, and to others, less so. Myself, I use meditation techniques (that on a good day is almost instant and on an off day takes a while) to slip into my "hightened" mind over matter state.


LE

That's along the lines of what I wanted to write. It cuts down on the "mind chatter" for me and seems to help me "listen to my gut" better. I only read for others online, so it's easy for me to do before and in-between reads. I seem to get better feedback when I take the time to do it.

Is this needed for all? I don't believe so. But it is a good tool for me.

[MoiraKarin]

That's along the lines of what I wanted to write. It cuts down on the "mind chatter" for me and seems to help me "listen to my gut" better. I only read for others online, so it's easy for me to do before and in-between reads. I seem to get better feedback when I take the time to do it.

Is this needed for all? I don't believe so. But it is a good tool for me.

I do believe it is needed for all. Muscic, scent, colors, dominant placed objects etc, influences the incoming of news from higher source. It colors the interpretation you will give to readings.
Everbody knows the power of scent. Animals do. Everbody knows the power of sound or music. etc. These are not opinions but facts that the influence the way you percieve things!!
These are rigidly proven facts,and thus influeces your perception of what ever comes in and create 'trash' as they say in remote viewing. If you want accurancy you need to leave the ego related 'stuff' out. And 'Yes' inmagination will 'set in' by music, scent,smell, taste, toutch and even thinking too long, dominant object(s)
But then again if you are absolutely convinced that it will work to do all the rituals, then maybe it even will, but this is just because you are convinced, it will

[LadyZelda]

I didn’t expect this first class to turn out that way with the subject of Divination, so far I had known no other basics then those I shared….I’ve got to say that I am astonished to find out that most people on AT do not acknowledge the reality of energy, and energy linked to divination cards. I know many people who see things the same way I do and I have read many articles of people I don’t know on the Net who visibly see things that way too…so, I had assumed that this was a general belief in the Esoteric circle….well, I see that I had the wrong picture, AT visibly gathers many who do not see things like that…

For those of you who have a certain concept of energy, do have it also in a different way…For me and those like me, we believe in using energy management when we buy a brand new deck, to get it to a neutral state, meaning free of any energy from anyone who handled it because we believe that energy is carried by all beings and also carried unto objects that these beings have touched.
This is why a Medium can “get info” about someone by just having access to something that belonged to that person. This is why people use Feng Shui, because energies are also lingering in rooms. That is why some people will organize and decorate their home the Feng Shui way…We use incense before a reading because we believe that this room we are in needs to be “cleaned up” from the energies that are lingering in, and that could influence the reading. Just like one cleans regularly his/her house on the material level, some clean their houses also on the “immaterial” level. And I’m among them…

I am also surprise that none of you believes that there is a lot of energy going on when practicing divination, even with cards (for instance the reader and/or querent releases positive or negative energies while reacting to the message of the Oracle or Tarot, etc… )
Therefore, that energy will linger on the cards as well as in the room and need to be dealt with. That is why; many professional readers will cleanse their deck after a day of reading or even for some of them during their day in between clients. They want their deck to go back to a neutral state. They believe and I do too, that otherwise the energy gathered in the cards will alter the next reading session…

I have to admit that I’m really baffled while reading your posts, this is really a “first” for me, never heard that before from Tarot readers, Medium, Reiki Masters, etc…This is quite intriguing while confirming a truth that I go by “we are not all on the same page, so must all agree to disagree and follow our own path”

Anyhow, Bright Blessings to you all and happy study…:D

[214red]

remember that your reality, or truth, is just that, its yours. there is no universal truths, everything will always be subjective.

So therefore its worth remembering that what works for you, isnt what will work for everyone.

Energy management as a phrase for example, seems like it means different things to you, and then to me. we seem to agree on the idea that everything has energy, but not how to manage it, this is likely because we do different disciplines.

techinically its the psychic part that gets information from an object, the mediumship is related to the concept that some energy has a consciousness (i.e. Loved ones, guides). mediumship is about being a channel or a conduit, you can only do that when something is interating with you, and the energy from an object cant do that, you can read the impression of the energy and therefore the persons energy, its only when you start interacting with an entity does it become mediumship

I understand your trying to help people, but your at risk of alienating people by insisting on energy management, rather then allowing people to have their own opinions.

[lord_ewin]

That's the whole point of 'Aeclectic' in Aeclectic Tarot, various ideologies working around the table in learning. IE: Leave our preconceived ideas at the door and open our mind to different ways of thinking. We aren't looking for Reiki Masters or Medium Masters to teach how things ought to be according to REiki Master So-So or Medium Expert Za-Za. They have to leave their titles behind and accept that this is a learning group and that their ways don't jive with everyone. Simple fact.

"Their way" is not the only way, and it's important for people to know of all ways to make informed choices, and expand on their practices. Your way is actually valuable, just not what everyone wants to learn, or everyone practices. Some of us are more practical and scientific, while others are more Wiccan and Spiritual. It does not take away from their success at reading cards. Period.

What matters are results and repeat customers, not the stuff you do in the backround to get it all working for you.

Now getting back on topic, if you managed to underline some actual problems that you might have had before you started the energy work, I think we'd all be interested, and it might clue us 'more experienced readers' into it's actual usefulness or just confirm what we already know from experience that we haven't needed it in 10-20 years, and aren't likely to adopt it. We are still open to hearing and discussing it with an open mind, and it will also help the newer people in getting the information they need to decide and adopt their own pathes.

Good work so far, btw! :)

LE

[LadyZelda]

I understand your trying to help people, but your at risk of alienating people by insisting on energy management, rather then allowing people to have their own opinions.

Sorry to see that you have not understood a word I said. Visibly, you pick and choose what I say and get it out of contect...

You should re-read my last statement and I will make it easy for you by copy/paste it

"..confirming a truth that I go by “we are not all on the same page, so must all agree to disagree and follow our own path”"

This ends this discussion as of for me, this has nothing to do with the school for beginners. If you want to learn about the Lenormand Oracle you are more than welcome, but if you want debates please start your own thread.

[lord_ewin]

Red is actually a very experienced and respected member of our learning circle. I'd really like it if you didn't belittle her (and others) just because they don't agree or see things differently. Her views are valuable, and more so since we know her.

[LadyZelda]

Red is actually a very experienced and respected member of our learning circle. I'd really like it if you didn't belittle her (and others) just because they don't agree or see things differently. Her views are valuable, and more so since we know her.


Here it is again:

… confirming a truth that I go by “we are not all on the same page, so must all agree to disagree and follow our own path”

[lord_ewin]

Now getting back on topic, if you managed to underline some actual problems that you might have had before you started the energy work, I think we'd all be interested, and it might clue us 'more experienced readers' into it's actual usefulness or just confirm what we already know from experience that we haven't needed it in 10-20 years, and aren't likely to adopt it. We are still open to hearing and discussing it with an open mind, and it will also help the newer people in getting the information they need to decide and adopt their own pathes.

Good work so far, btw! :)

LE

Alright, moving on. Did you have any experiences of how things were for you before you took energy management?

[Empath111]

I hope we can move past preparing for readings. We are all different and bring different things to the table. Which it is a good thing we are all different :) I hope we can move on at this point and let Lady Zelda do her thing. I'm happy she offered to teach. Maybe a separate energy thread could be created to continue the debate. Just a thought. Then we could get to learning the cards:D. L

[MoiraKarin]

I didn’t expect this first class to turn out that way with the subject of Divination, so far I had known no other basics then those I shared….I’ve got to say that I am astonished to find out that most people on AT do not acknowledge the reality of energy, and energy linked to divination cards. I know many people who see things the same way I do and I have read many articles of people I don’t know on the Net who visibly see things that way too…so, I had assumed that this was a general belief in the Esoteric circle….well, I see that I had the wrong picture, AT visibly gathers many who do not see things like that…

For those of you who have a certain concept of energy, do have it also in a different way…For me and those like me, we believe in using energy management when we buy a brand new deck, to get it to a neutral state, meaning free of any energy from anyone who handled it because we believe that energy is carried by all beings and also carried unto objects that these beings have touched.
This is why a Medium can “get info” about someone by just having access to something that belonged to that person. This is why people use Feng Shui, because energies are also lingering in rooms. That is why some people will organize and decorate their home the Feng Shui way…We use incense before a reading because we believe that this room we are in needs to be “cleaned up” from the energies that are lingering in, and that could influence the reading. Just like one cleans regularly his/her house on the material level, some clean their houses also on the “immaterial” level. And I’m among them…

I am also surprise that none of you believes that there is a lot of energy going on when practicing divination, even with cards (for instance the reader and/or querent releases positive or negative energies while reacting to the message of the Oracle or Tarot, etc… )
Therefore, that energy will linger on the cards as well as in the room and need to be dealt with. That is why; many professional readers will cleanse their deck after a day of reading or even for some of them during their day in between clients. They want their deck to go back to a neutral state. They believe and I do too, that otherwise the energy gathered in the cards will alter the next reading session…

I have to admit that I’m really baffled while reading your posts, this is really a “first” for me, never heard that before from Tarot readers, Medium, Reiki Masters, etc…This is quite intriguing while confirming a truth that I go by “we are not all on the same page, so must all agree to disagree and follow our own path”

Anyhow, Bright Blessings to you all and happy study…:D

To be clear for me ..I do not think cleansing cards using incense or thinks like that is useless what i am saying is , i believe it will be a good thing to let readings be seperate from these rituals .

[lord_ewin]

I hope we can move past preparing for readings. We are all different and bring different things to the table. Which it is a good thing we are all different :) I hope we can move on at this point and let Lady Zelda do her thing. I'm happy she offered to teach. Maybe a separate energy thread could be created to continue the debate. Just a thought. Then we could get to learning the cards:D. L

Or we could do that. :D. Given that Lady Zelda wants to lead the study group, I was giving her a chance to finish, but I'm sure the cards was the main driving idea behind this thread's purpose. :)

[Wendywu]

To be clear for me ..I do not think cleansing cards using incense or thinks like that is useless what i am saying is , i believe it will be a good thing to let readings be seperate from these rituals .

Good point.

I fear this group is at risk of getting bogged down before it starts ...

Not everyone works in the same way; it seems this is accepted by all. The group is, I think, intended to help newcomers to Lenormand learn how to read the cards. And that is all. Not how to work with energy (if anyone wants to learn this, that is great but please keep it separate to a Lenormand teaching thread).

So - given the basic idea that you guys want to learn how to read Lenormand (and will each go about the preparation in his/her own way) - is it time for you to move over to a thread where the signed up participants can be listed, and a start on the actual learning made?

If so, it will also be time for Aulruna and I to think about a beginner's index.

[LadyZelda]

Good point.

I fear this group is at risk of getting bogged down before it starts ...

Not everyone works in the same way; it seems this is accepted by all. The group is, I think, intended to help newcomers to Lenormand learn how to read the cards. And that is all. Not how to work with energy (if anyone wants to learn this, that is great but please keep it separate to a Lenormand teaching thread).

So - given the basic idea that you guys want to learn how to read Lenormand (and will each go about the preparation in his/her own way) - is it time for you to move over to a thread where the signed up participants can be listed, and a start on the actual learning made?

If so, it will also be time for Aulruna and I to think about a beginner's index.

Totally agree with that, my plans were not to start a "debate" thread but a "School for Beginners" where we can learn the cards and this has remained my goal. We had moved on to the grouping of the cards (page 2) upon which we were supposed to discuss...
Next week-end we were supposed to learn about at least 1 card or more depending on everyone's free time.

And this is what I answered when Caristia asked :

Is anybody else going through the whole deck like that one card at a time as Iris suggests?

I'm going to meditate probably upon at least 2 cards per week depending of the time I have. I think it is a good thing to do so, because for our next class we will start studding the meaning of each card. Thus, it would be better if everyone meditate on at least 1 card to participate during class ;)

So please, let's move on :)

[lord_ewin]

LadyZelda, I love the way you seem need to have the last word. I sometimes wonder if your ego will interfere with the studying... Honestly, if your method is so much better than Iris Treppner's, you should be teaching... Oh wait... I see where you're going with this now. :P

[LadyZelda]

I am moving the Classroom to new thread. The learning of each card will begin this coming week-end and it will be solely on the cards meaning first individually then in combination with the other cards, we will cover diverse layouts as well.

Please Note:

There will not be any info given on ways to prepare for reading the oracle, energy work, etc...(Please, do keep any discussions of the sort on this old thread.)

Therefore, to learn the meaning of the cards and their combinations and diverse layouts please go to our classroom and find out all details by following this link:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?p=3116808#post3116808

Thank you :D

[Ronia]

LE, you surprise me. Doesn't it remind you of something? :D Especially, given the attitude towards the previous learning circles and now towards this one. Ask your cards! :D

[Priestess]

Ridiculous carry on, when someone is only trying to help beginners understand the meanings of Lenormand. Why do some people always have to pick on or attack something? No one said you were to be forced to do anything. Take what you want from the kindness, effort and time someone's giving to help beginners, leave out the bits you don't like or disagree with!

Well said Ronia!!

[LaLaBella]

I didn’t expect this first class to turn out that way with the subject of Divination, so far I had known no other basics then those I shared….I’ve got to say that I am astonished to find out that most people on AT do not acknowledge the reality of energy, and energy linked to divination cards. I know many people who see things the same way I do and I have read many articles of people I don’t know on the Net who visibly see things that way too…so, I had assumed that this was a general belief in the Esoteric circle….well, I see that I had the wrong picture, AT visibly gathers many who do not see things like that…

For those of you who have a certain concept of energy, do have it also in a different way…For me and those like me, we believe in using energy management when we buy a brand new deck, to get it to a neutral state, meaning free of any energy from anyone who handled it because we believe that energy is carried by all beings and also carried unto objects that these beings have touched.
This is why a Medium can “get info” about someone by just having access to something that belonged to that person. This is why people use Feng Shui, because energies are also lingering in rooms. That is why some people will organize and decorate their home the Feng Shui way…We use incense before a reading because we believe that this room we are in needs to be “cleaned up” from the energies that are lingering in, and that could influence the reading. Just like one cleans regularly his/her house on the material level, some clean their houses also on the “immaterial” level. And I’m among them…

I am also surprise that none of you believes that there is a lot of energy going on when practicing divination, even with cards (for instance the reader and/or querent releases positive or negative energies while reacting to the message of the Oracle or Tarot, etc… )
Therefore, that energy will linger on the cards as well as in the room and need to be dealt with. That is why; many professional readers will cleanse their deck after a day of reading or even for some of them during their day in between clients. They want their deck to go back to a neutral state. They believe and I do too, that otherwise the energy gathered in the cards will alter the next reading session…

I have to admit that I’m really baffled while reading your posts, this is really a “first” for me, never heard that before from Tarot readers, Medium, Reiki Masters, etc…This is quite intriguing while confirming a truth that I go by “we are not all on the same page, so must all agree to disagree and follow our own path”

Anyhow, Bright Blessings to you all and happy study…:D

Thanks to my mother and her suboptimal skillset, I have experienced firsthand what damage these energies can do if you are not properly trained. I'm also able to absorb the emotional energies of the people I'm emotionally involved with as well as project my own out. That's why I had to learn how to throw up a shield for lack of a better term during my childhood.

I do believe in a higher being but due to the environment I was raised in, I am considerably more cautious than the average bear as far as meddling with energies are concerned.

For this reason, I have to put myself into that emotionally neutral state before I read. You know, toss up the ol shield. Otherwise, the reading looks like a hot mess that makes zero sense.

Anyway, this whole topic has gotten interesting. I find learning the point-of-view of others who are doing this and doing it differently and the whys of it facinating.

[halil]

deleted

[Wendywu]

I think we can all agree from now on that we all have different ways of reading.

The learning threads will continue with discussions of card meanings with no further reference to energies or rituals, which all readers are free to choose and adopt for themselves.

If you wish to start a thread discussing energies involved in readings then please feel free to do so in the appropriate forum.

Thankyou

Wendywu
Co-Moderator

[Ronia]

Priestess, I have myself translated, without any expectations for anyone to read my way, and posted two threads full of meaings and combos. I have also learned a great deal from the readers on the board without participating in any schools. I have no intention to participate in any these days either. I think you got me wrong. I prefer other ways of being taught. :D

[lord_ewin]

Sorry folks, my comments from this morning might have been more on the spot than proper reflection would have allowed. I have been more than encouraging and supportive with the "class setting" that LadyZeldy is trying to setup, what I find disconcerting is her attitude towards members that have been doing the learning circles for several years now.

Like it or not, she is a beginner in Lenormand, she has had her account since January, has posted slightly above 100 posts and already she is correcting people on how to read the cards that some of us have been using for several years.

Don't get me wrong, I find her drive excellent, and all the more power to her if she wants to lead a circle (I don't have the time, otherwise I would have kept at it), but I'm not happy when I see her dismissing very good advice from cartomancers that have more experience than her with Lenormand.

Hopefully, that issue has been skirted, I haven't seen a retort and she's ignored my ill-humoured jibe from this morning, so perhaps we can concentrate on the task at hand, the cards.. And I will definately look into the school myself to comment here and there.

Sorry everyone,

LE

[Carla]

I have read through this entire thread at last, and I did get quite uncomfortable during bits of it. I hope the Lenormand school will stick strictly to card meanings and combining and leave out all peripheral business having to do with personal rituals or beliefs. I look forward to learning the card meanings and combinations in a sort of 'group' setting.

[Priestess]

I hope all who participate enjoy it. LZ did say it was for beginners and if that includes her then I think it's a good thing. They will all learn together and have their own opinions I'm sure. So probably best to let beginners get on with it and leave them to it. Let them do it their way, and if any of us more experienced can help, she can always ask us if neccessary, without anyone underminding her. We all had to start somewhere. Good Luck LZ.

Ronia, I did understand your comment loud and clear.

ETA. I did see your meanings and combos Ronia, very well done and thank you. I enjoyed reading through them as I did the ones posted before by someone who did the treppner course a long time ago (sorry I can't remember their name at the moment) as you know Ronia, I love and enjoy everything to do with Lenormand as I know you do, and have done for a long time now.

[Priestess]

I couldn't agree more Carla, I felt the same myself. I hate to see this, when someone is only trying to get people from the forum to join in with them and do their best. Live and let live!

[daphne]

Priestess, I have myself translated, without any expectations for anyone to read my way, and posted two threads full of meaings and combos. I have also learned a great deal from the readers on the board without participating in any schools. I have no intention to participate in any these days either. I think you got me wrong. I prefer other ways of being taught. :D

Rania, can you please give the links to the 2 threads with the meanings and combos?
I would be very interested to read them.
Thank you!

[celticnoodle]

Okay. well now, I just also found this thread, for the first two classes, and I decided I should read through this one before carrying on, with the next class, which I think is going to be tomorrow and Sunday. I hope to be able to join in sometime during those two days as well, though weekends are rough sometimes, as the hubby is home, and we often are running around town taking care of things.

however, I've been meaning to and wanting to jump into learning the Lenormand for a long time now and I happened across this thread this morning and was thrilled, because I am a total newbie with Lenormand. I have quite a few decks of them, and love them all. I chose one to work with right now, for this, which is the Mystical Lenormand. I cannot wait really to get started, and plan to do my best tomorrow to print out that other thread you did, where you broke it all down into categories for us. THANK YOU!!!! Now, why didn't I think of that myself? :confused: no idea! but it is most greatly appreciated, as I know it took time for you to do it. :thumbsup:

I do not have the 2 books you mentioned, but see it is not a requirement anyway, but who knows, after going through this, i may just decide the are not to be without. But, for now, plan to just follow along with you as I can.

since you did ask us to share our way to prepare our decks--I will tell you that I do not do anything at all. I see them solely as a tool, much like a construction worker may view his hammer. this is me, and I have no problem with anyone who has special steps to getting their deck "ready". I do actually enjoy hearing how others 'prepare' if the do - their decks. But, for me, the only preparation is just to look at the cards, and decide if I like these cards or now. If I do, I keep them and use them. If I do not, I probably would not keep them or use them! that's pretty much the extent of my preparation. However, I DO like to shuffle cards completely and fully! I LOVE to ripple the cards into a shuffle and am often doing so with one deck or another, before or after a reading and even when I just am sitting watching tv. :D

I do also like to put them into order. this is just a thing with me. I will put them into order, and then shuffle them again to mix them up. no specific reason, really--save that I like to do this! I also do not like reading cloths. they get in my way. I prefer to just put the cards down on the surface where I plan to do my reading. I do not wrap them up afterwards and this may even make you gasp, but I also tend to just keep them rubber banded up when I go to put them away. Yes, I do have special bags for them, sometimes they are used, and often they are not. this is me, and how I am. I have no problem with others doing differently and I'm most likely am not going to change my way. it works for me.

I never smudge or even light a candle for a reading or anything. I just grab the cards, shuffle well and concentrate. I may say a silent prayer to my guides for guidance, but that is pretty much it. Sometimes I may set crystals around too, but again--it just depends on how I feel at the time.

I may say a quick prayer, close my eyes and take a few deep breaths. but agian, it really depends. sometimes I just pick up the deck and go!

[celticnoodle]

Well, so far I've made it to post #10 and I am liking all I'm reading so far. I guess I do more then I even think about, honestly, as I do sometimes like to take a card and meditate with it. I don't do this all the time, but sometimes I just feel the need to do so. Especially if it is a card that I just don't seem to 'get'.

I also like to sit/stand with my feet firmly on the floor before starting and sometimes will clsoe my eyes and take a few deep breaths to clear my head and myself. :P I will ask the question for the cards and shuffle while concentrating on the question. so, I guess I do prepare myself somewhat for readings. I often will also ask my guides to help me with a reading and invite the guides of my client to come and help me as well.

I always turn the cards over the same way--holding the deck in my left hand, and using the right to turn it over, like I'm turning a page in a book. I lay the cards down left to right. Generally, I do not read with spreads. I like free form and often am comfortable with 3 cards at a time. I do sometimes use spreads however.

and now it is movie time here in the household, so I'll finish reading through this and try to catch up by Monday with where everyone else is in the next thread. looking so forward to this. I will be 'playing' with and getting to know my deck while our movie is playing however. :D

[Ronia]

Rania, can you please give the links to the 2 threads with the meanings and combos?
I would be very interested to read them.
Thank you!

They are in the Lenormand Resources sticky thread on first page.

French ones: http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=162640
Russian ones: http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=174105

We have tons of free info on the forum here but I don't know why it's never added to the stickies. We have to do it ourselves. You may also want to check the original Treppner thread which, I believe, was led by a lady very experienced in the Treppner reading style. Hopefully someone will add the link.

[Aulruna]

Just a quick info - the free resources thread was set up by a forum member and then made a sticky by the administrative team because of its usefulness. It is not a thread that belongs to any official entity - EVERYONE on this forum is encouraged to add to it, it's a living resource.

So, please feel free to add links and reference threads to your heart's delight!

[lord_ewin]

Just a quick info - the free resources thread was set up by a forum member and then made a sticky by the administrative team because of its usefulness. It is not a thread that belongs to any official entity - EVERYONE on this forum is encouraged to add to it, it's a living resource.

So, please feel free to add links and reference threads to your heart's delight!

As that may be, it would be useful of the Moderators kept it clean, or kept updating the table of contents...

[daphne]

They are in the Lenormand Resources sticky thread on first page.

French ones: http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=162640
Russian ones: http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=174105

We have tons of free info on the forum here but I don't know why it's never added to the stickies. We have to do it ourselves. You may also want to check the original Treppner thread which, I believe, was led by a lady very experienced in the Treppner reading style. Hopefully someone will add the link.

Thank you, Ronia!
I did not know there is so much info on reading Lenormand here. I wish those precious threads on card meaning and reading "how to" would be discovered again and made sticky. I really struggle with grand tableau, I don`t know where to start, how to proceed, for me it`s like a monster layout.

[Ronia]

There is nothing scary about the GT except your own attitude. Keep in mind that some of us had never heard about linear spreads, daily draws or similar and learned the GT from the very beginning. I'd suggest you to join the GT monthly thread, keep exploring your GT as combos (try to link two or three cards together), don't try to see the big picture immediately and I'm sure things will work out. There are really tons of info on the forum, I just don't have the time to dig all the threads now but I promise to try in the next few days. You can also look back. You can also join the "GT on a particular area" thread which I started to practice learning a GT on love/relationships only. It's easier because you'll focus on 3-4 cards mainly and at the same time will learn combos and how they play in real life. I find this forgotten very often - not learning pages of meanings matters but how they play in reality! And this comes with reading and observing your readings. :)