View Full Version : Chart Reading: Step #7, Martha Stewart -- The outer planets

01-11-2003, 23:14

In this thread we will examine the outer planets, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto within Martha Stewart's chart. We can choose to look at these three planets in either or both of two ways:

As generational signposts, these planets indicate major social or cultural cycles that we are born into. Uranus; the strctures and forces for change that can impact our lives. Neptune; the beliefs, fashions, cultural ideals that shape the overal social structure. Pluto; the areas and types of institutional changes that overwhelm individuals.

As personal crises and awarenesses, these planets indicate how we interact with the larger, seemingly external forces that intrude into our lives.

So, we are born into a pattern formed by these three planets and then we live our lives within the seed-changes that they seem to put into motion. Their effects linger and develop. We cope. Good luck with your thoughts on these planets. Dave.

isthmus nekoi
02-11-2003, 07:55
Thanks for starting up the next thread, Dave. Minderwiz should be back in time to weigh in on this one.

Both Uran and Neptune seem to be in uneasy signs...

Speedy unpredictable Uranus seems confined by slow and stable Taurus. Boundary disolving, illusionist Neptune seems to counter Virgo's attention to detail and analytic nature. Of course, the contradictions don't necessarily need to manifest negatively, esp since these are generational planets.

Uran/Saturn trine Neptune. These are interesting contacts for Saturn, I think. Saturn here isn't predictable w/Uran. Unexpected turns in relationships (perhaps burdening ones), and a degree of idealsim (Neptune square moon, Venus placement) may undermine Saturn somewhat.

As for Pluto conj sun, again this may speak to difficulties in relationships, a theme that has arisen before.

02-11-2003, 13:03
In a previous thread and posting I had noted that Saturn/Taurus conjunct Uranus/Gemini had some specific meaning. Mythology has Saturn castrating Uranus -- symbolizing the blockage of any possible change. As a result, the Furies were born. Terrible things happen when change is blocked up. The conjunction in Martha's chart is in the 7th house. Sign-wise, Saturn is in stable Taurus while Uranus is in changable Gemini. Saturn is the faster planet and will catch up and conjoin with Uranus in Gemini -- change will occur.

That having been said, let's focus on Uranus. The Saturn-Uranus cycle usher in world-wide social change. Structures/governments were torn down, new powers arose, a new world order emerged. Uranus/Gemini changed the world through the air via planes and communication.

Uranus trines Neptune; ideals and beliefs changed -- religion became a focal point, communism made its supreme push for dominance. Nationalism became a means for changing old ways.

A half year later, as Saturn and Uranus retrograded away from the Taurus/Gemini cusp, Mars entered Gemini. In May of 1942 both Saturn and Uranus crossed into Gemini behind the fast moving Mars. Agression marked the beginning of this important cycle.

Martha was born into this turmoil and was influenced by the many pressures upon the family and country. There were tensions in the houshold. This is highlighted, for Martha, by the inconjunct between Saturn and Moon; father and mother symbols. As she moved into and through adulthood we would expect Martha to shape her enviornment such that this tension with others would be lessened. Obviously she has chosen a profession where harmony -- not tension -- is the focus. Colors and the pleasant household are her stage.

With Mars becoming part of the world-cycle that emerged at and following her birth time, a driving force has to be part of her basic nature -- yet, it probably has to remain hidden, be channeled into plans and visions were it will be more in harmony with corporate workings and less in effect in personal infighting. I had made a remark that she is like an iron fist in a velvet glove. I think this is quite true.

Now, we can look at transits here. As Martha became embroiled in a stock scandal Uranus was in Aquarius, the sign ruling her 4th angle. Her foundation was rocked by falling stock and an investigation by the SEC into likely "insider trading." Here is a case where, possibly, the ruling sign substitutes for a structural change (Uranus conjunct Saturn) aspect. What does everyone think about this? Transiting Saturn was, of course, in Gemini during this period -- completing its second cyclic return to its natal position.

This is the manner in which I would look at each of the outer planets in both a world-cyclic view and a personal view. Dave.

03-11-2003, 04:01

Thanks for reminding me of the mythical link between Saturn and Uranus - a close(ish) conjunction here could therefore be quite symbolic.

The trio of Saturn / Uranus (both in Taurus) and Neptune presents a rather intriguing set of opposites - Uranus / Neptune is the world turned upside down for an idea or a dream or a hope. Yet Saturn is fear and restraint and control. Can Martha change the world yet retain control of what she has set in progress?

Neptune is in the eleventh House, traditionally linked with friends, associations and at a mundane level the government - at a stretch we might make it encompass society as such, so Martha's revolutionary change (Uranus) might be directed at ideas, hopes and dreams for society (Neptune in the eleventh) - this could be political aspirations, but it might well be based on other ways of 'altering' or benefiting society - are her products aimed at social improvement? in one sense they are and with Virgo on the cusp of the eleventh this may be through the rather small, boring, ritual, routine tasks that societies carry out. By improving the quality of those or saving time on them social life is improved. Neptune has some very close majopr aspects to Sun, Moon, Mercury, Saturn and Uranus, its also conjunct her North Node and in opposition to her Part of Fortune.

Lee Lehman has an interesting chapter in her 'Classical Astrology for Modern Living' based on both Dane Rudhyar and Ptolemy in relation to the nodes. The North Node is a symbolic point of 'intake' the beginning of a new system - with the Neptune at this point Martha may have a dream or idea which is just ready to be born, something that she can take to the world. If this theory holds then we have perhaps the birth of her business idea, in Virgo a relatively business-like sign.

03-11-2003, 04:28
A friend once remarked that "Saturn is the illusion of reality" and "Neptune is the reality of illusion." The trine in Martha's chart between these two is interesting in this light. Martha is trying to build stable relationships or to control relationships -- perhaps the same thing in her mind. She is also, through her business, trying to build a real world "buy in" to her dreams, creation and style for family living and family environment. She wants to make the Martha Stewart view the public's view.

Having the trine, she assumes that this will be so. Her whole personality is geared to providing what everyone obviously wants -- as she sees it.

These are the kinds of thoughts and responses I'm trying to get from the list. I suspect that too many people having an interest and some level of skill and experience in astrology tend to gloss over the outer planets, believing that they have little "personal" meaning in the chart's interpretation. IMHO, nothing could be further from the truth. Every chart symbol is an option, and it has been my observation that most people sooner or later exercise every symbolic option they have. Dave.

03-11-2003, 06:42
Yes I agree with your point about the outerplanets in a birth chart. I don't really bother too much with signs as far as they are concerned, unless I think a generational perspective is added - as you did in your opening post.

However the House positions are important, as are the relationships to the seven visible planets and to the important points such as the angles, nodes and Fortuna. As you say, a lot more can be gathered from them by looking at their relationship to the chart.

05-11-2003, 05:51
We don't seem to have commented particularly on Pluto.

As we have noted before it's in a rather wide conjunction with the Sun. Using traditional language it's combust - accidentally debilitated. Now the idea of combust derives from the fact that planets that near the Sun cannot be seen and therefore are weakened (because they do not easily receive or reflect light).

However the three outer planets cannot be seen anyway (without a telescope) so Pluto might not be as debilitated as, say, Venus combust. Moreover Pluto represents the hidden and a planet combust is literally hidden. One might argue that behind the smiling, generous Leo Sun there is a hidden powerful wish to accumulate wealth (she is literally a plutocrat), and/or for self transformation through higher education, travel or philosophy/religion or personal self-development and growth. (Pluto being in the ninth House).

Pluto is also in close conjunction to Chiron. Now I don't usually use Chiron but I 'switched' it on in my Astrology prog because of the 8th of November thread - so I see a conjunction that I didn't notice before with Chiron switched off.

Pluto/Chiron conjunctions occur rather rarely - following the 1941 the next conjunction was in December 1999.

Now I've seen Pluto described as the unleashing of power and Chiron described as the opening of doors. So this conjunction gives Martha a means of releasing and directing her hidden powers.

As Dave said earlier, in the opening post, She was born at an important generational turning point - August 1941 saw both the high water mark of Nazi power and the beginning of the turning of tide with the Atlantic Charter, signed by Churchill and Roosevelt, even before the US entered the War. The conjunction brought both the darkest and most evil side of humanity but also the process of healing that would remove the evil.

The conjunction occurs in Martha's ninth house again emphasising the role of self expansion and growth as part of the healing process from her childhood but also the process which might well give her a need to wield power in order to prevent that (personal) situation ever occuring again.

05-11-2003, 11:58
If we were to look at Mercury-Pluto-Sun as a containment figure, we would look for Martha to "Build on ideas, focusing on them as a means of achieving her identity." She is apparently a visionary, a concept person.

Martha's Pluto is in a 1/7th aspect to Neptune; a spirit in upheaval, dreams of intensity, focus upon power through persuasian. This is a tough one to define in terms of bringing it down to a personal level -- assuming that can easily be done. I think it's a sort of inner-feeling-thing, something that influences but does not outwardly or directly express itself.

Pluto does square the ASC in addition to the loose conjunctions with Sun and Mercury. It is likely that Pluto associates better with Mercury than with the Sun. The Sun is "higher" in this chart and can out-power Pluto; the Sun integrates while Pluto only intensifies. Pluto can better focus and intensify Mercury's qualities of mind and perception. Mercury inconjuncts the Moon, forcing Moon to adjust its emotional qualities so as to react to Mercury's cues rather than physical/emotional triggers. Pluto will act where it can act most forcefully. So, it fits well with the mind and supresses the emotions. Martha seems to personify this set of qualities. Just some thoughts. Dave.