View Full Version : The Two Towers
Little Baron
28-12-2003, 18:40
I was just wondering today, whether anybody knows of any reasons why the towers in the Moon card seem to have also been put into the background of Death? I am imagining that these are the one and same. Any ideas? Does anybody know of any other cards that have parts of each other within them?
Best wishes
Yaboot
TemperanceAngel
28-12-2003, 19:17
The two towers is a recurring theme in RWS, the pillars in High Priestess and Chariot, the two figures of the Lovers, that is just to name a couple. I feel too lazy to look at my deck, so these are the first ones that come to mind.
The towers represent passive/aggressive, yin/yang, masculine/feminine to name but a few.
I am sure there will be plenty more ideas to this thread :)
XTAX
Little Baron
28-12-2003, 19:27
Thanks Temperance Angel. I just wondered, since the these two depictions of the towers are almost identical, if it was some kind of look into the future of the fools journey through the major cards. It's a strange feeling looking at it. It is like you are looking at the setting of the moon from a different angle or from the top of a hill. There is always the possibility that we could be viewing it from behind, as apose to the side we are used to seeing it from as the Moon card.
Yaboot
Yes the bridge is the same bridge in the 5 of Cups and the 4 of Wands.www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20292
Also I always think that the window in the 5 of Coins and the 4 of Swords are different windows but in the same building. To me it says find the way in and you will find rest.
The 2 of wands looks like he is standing on top of the building in the background of the Chariot card, you can even see water behind the Chariot. So that puts the Chariot on the other side of the lake in the 2 of wands. I also think that the same bridge that is in the 5 of Cups and 4 of Wands is also in the 2 of Wands.
To me the towers in the Moon card and the towers in the Death card mean that there will be a time in all of our lives when the illusion of this world will be lifted, and we will see all things as they truly are.
Interesting question.
I am using the RW, Original Rider Waite and the Universal RW to see these things.
Little Baron
28-12-2003, 20:01
I can see what you mean; especially like the idea that the buildings in the chariot background is the one that the man stands on in the 2 of Wands. The trees surrounding the buildings seem to tie in and so too is the top of the wall pattern.
Thanks lark. I found that really interesting. Maybe it is just me but I got a bit confused with this one -" also think that the same bridge that is in the 5 of Coins and 4 of Swords is also in the 2 of Wands". I can't see any bridges in these cards.
Best wishes
Yaboot
I'm so sorry I ment the 5 of cups and the 4 of wands.
I fixed it with an edit.
There's a little bridge in the two of wands. Right above the little red topped house next to the wand on the right.
I have three Rider Waite decks spread all over my table what a mess but a happy mess.
This has got me thinking. You could probably make a map of the Rider Waite deck. Like the Hundred Acre Wood in Winnie The Pooh.
USGames could include it in every box of tarot cards and I would be rich, rich beyond my wildest dreams.!!!!!!!!
I'd better go eat something I'm getting delirious.
Little Baron
28-12-2003, 20:22
That would be great! I remember that Hundred Acre Wood Map; thats brought back some memories; think I still have it somewhere.
Found one bit about the towers on this website - 1st point.
http://www.tarotpassages.com/old_moonstruck/oneill/18.htm
Look forward to hearing more.
Yaboot
Jewel-ry
29-12-2003, 03:01
Yaboot001
Never noticed the towers in the Death card before. How interesting. I agree, it definately looks like you are looking at the view from a different angle. Also in Death, the Sun is between the towers, whereas obviously its the Moon in XVIII. I have to go to work now but will ponder this today. Interesting observation.
J :)
Just thought I would add also, is there a common theme with the 6 of swords & the 8 of cups?It looks like the same card only different in the Rider Waite Tarot.
Little Baron
29-12-2003, 13:09
I have been looking at this deck for so many years and its so mad how a detail like that completely passes me by. They are very alike, arn't they? Cheers Ros. I will have to look for simularities and differences on this one.
Best wishes
Yaboot
Yaboot001
Don't forget to look at the Fool & the Star also. lol
I read your post & looked up & these 2 cards were sitting on my dest. I never noticed them before. Samething, they are different but the same!Wasn't going to send this but I thought oh what the heck.
Have fun,
ros
Jewel-ry
29-12-2003, 14:37
Hi Yaboot001,
Had another thought about the Moon and the Death card towers. Towers can represent our defenses and both the Death and the Moon can represent letting go (dealing with our demons in the case of the Moon). Perhaps that is another way of interpreting them on both cards?
J :)
I was just about to ask about these towers when I notcied this thread. So heres what I've thought of so far.
In Wicca for certain rituals, like the Esbat of the full moon, the altar is set up in the west and the west is referred to as the Moon Gate. This assocation probably stems from materials Wicca absorbed from european magical lodges like the Order of the Golden Dawn. The sun sets between the two towers thus placing them in the west. I have always disagreed iwth readers who interpreted the sun as beig either setting or rising thus making the Death card entirely about transformation and rebirth. To me the sun is specifically setting and will return after the night has reigned.
FourLeafClover
30-12-2003, 01:48
My (admittedly uneducated) guess is that they represent a gateway. That would make sense on both Death and The Moon. I tend to see the little lobstery critter as wanting to get beyond those pillars, with the obvious impediment of two high-strung dogs in his way.
Death as a gateway is an ooolllddd notion.
O.K.
What if the Moon represents a night journey & the Death is a day journey. Moon being that we can pick our illusions.The truth in the sunlight is not alway true in the darklight. That true is true , the light just changes how we view it. So the in the Moon we should take the middle path just because it is a path & mabee grounding through the night. The pillars are both white so when we get through the moonlight, & let go of the issues in the Death card we get to the pillars, both white, so mabee they both mean that it is a spiritual matter or good things will be there for our finding in the end of our day travels or night travels of our mind.Mabee the pillars take us to the next level of understanding when we get through them.Don't know where this came from , just an idea.
P.S.
Mabee the pillars mean that there is new light on the other side no matter what card they are in.
Originally posted by ros
P.S.
Mabee the pillars mean that there is new light on the other side no matter what card they are in.
Definitely a very positive approach. I still think of it as a long dark night of the soul.
Anyone think of any Tolkien references when considering the Towers?