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dadsnook2000
27-01-2004, 23:07
This thread will offer my thoughts on trying to identify my life's purpose based on the outline given in the thread YOUR LIFE'S PURPOSE. Briefly, I had outlined a process that 1) looked at the parent's struggle and manner of living and achieving their goals, 2) looking at how I blended their life's purposes and took from it to define my own purpose and goals, and 3) how the astrological chart reflects and/or clarifies this.

My parent's approached and transitioned into adulthood during the period of the Great Depression. This economic environment affected almost everyone in the US and in many other areas in so many critical ways. To a large degree, the depression became a key factor in those generation's life purposes, forming a backdrop which sharpened their character and their faults and made it more difficult to achieve goals.

MY FATHER was abandoned by his parents when he was about 8 or 9 years of age. He completed grade school but went to work before reaching his teen years. Like many others he worked at many different jobs in order to just survive. He met and married my mother who came from a middle-class family -- an extended family that managed to support each other. Most were able to have work through those lean years. My thoughts seem to focus on the fact that my father valued that supportive family concept greatly (not having had it himself). He worked very hard and for many long hours each week to have his own home and car and to provide for four children. He tried every form of work, started and ran several small businesses. He died when I was 18 from being poisoned by a metal-cutting process that he was developing for the business that he was running.

His life purpose appears to have been to develop and value a supportive family life that he was denied as a child and to make every creative effort through work and community activity to provide for that family. He would literally try anything to succeed.

MY MOTHER had traditional working class values and was always very supportive of my father. I think the women of those times were given to letting the man set the direction of their lives. She was very patient, worked hard at home helping him to actually build houses, garden, and teach us children how to read. I was able to read adult level books and magazines before reaching first grade in school. Looking back, she appeared to be highly supportive, quietly encouraging, and very self-sacrificing -- traits that I'm sure many of us will abscribe to their own mothers.

Her life purpose appears to have been to be the supportive partner during the early years and then the complete provider for the family in the latter years following my father's death. She was very enterprising in terms of using her resources, running several small businesses of her own. I remember her best in terms of always being quietly supportive, very encouraging, and always promulgating the values that my father had practiced.
It appeared that she was the 2nd phase of a marriage that had a single common goal of raising a family based on effort, persistance and support.

I'll look at my life's purpose and the astrological chart in another posting. Dave.

dadsnook2000
28-01-2004, 02:39
I will attempt to articulate a "self-view" relative to the theme of this thread. What did I take from my parents in terms of my life's attitudes and manner of shaping my life?

Father's key themes -- hard work, strong focus on the task at hand, socially outgoing and involved, dedicated to providing for his family. A question I've always had -- did an early death, which abandoned the family, so to speak, reflect his own history (being abandoned as a child) and pose a challenge to the rest of us to take up his attitudes and drive to follow his example in life?

Mother's key themes -- initially a supportive helpmate, a focus on learning and teaching, setting a quite example. Later, being the strong provider (after my father's death), holding the family together.

My life's themes and probable purpose -- as a combination of some or many of one/both parent's values and efforts. I will present my chart and comment on it's patterns in another post.

1) Both a variety of experiences (work, careers, interests) and a strong sense of creativity have marked my life. My parents did a number of things to survive -- I seem to have chosen to deliberately try to do a number of things (23 work fields/career areas, with only the last few representing more than one job in that field). Each work area has often involved graphical or design creativity although I have worked as an artist only twice.

2) I have had a strong family life having raised with my wife three children, later having a young lady come to live with us and finish high school and nurses training before leaving to get married, and most recently having adopted three grandchildren (15, 12 and 10 now) when they were young. So, the caring and support for the family remains a constant value.

So, I have taken the above paths into my own life -- perhaps they are very common to many. What have I adopted that seems not to be part of my parent's demonstrated values.

3) I have come to develop my own spiritual values and beliefs relative to the afterlife and world's purpose. While my parents did not attend church or exhibit strong religous practices they did support a local church and send us to weekly services.

4) I am probably more self-centered and not quite as outgoing, socially, as my father was. I have his focus but I apply it to both hobbies, graphical work and interest areas -- my wife says I am too strongly focused and that I don't give her or the kids enough time. I'm a Boy Scout leader, go on camping and hiking trips with them, help them with homework -- all that stuff, so I think her views are just the usuall man-woman differences in style and sensitivity. I do make sure that I have some time for myself each day -- I'll miss sleep just to pursue my interests and have time to explore things.

My next posting will layout my chart and look at how it may reflect both my parent's values and life's purposes as well as my own life style and purposes.

If anyone has questions, critiques or observations they are invited to ask. It is probably quite hard, early in this process, to really dig out and assess the really core issues relating to one's life purpose. As we proceed I may come back to these issues. I suspect that the review of my chart will stimulate a lot of thought as astrology is a familiar tool for me to use and a way to unlock a lot of detail. Lets hope for that. Dave.

Minderwiz
28-01-2004, 05:44
Dave,

This is really fascinating I look forward to your next post in the series. It will be interesting to look at the techniques and use them to reflect on our own lives.

dadsnook2000
28-01-2004, 13:44
I'll start to review portions of my natal chart and relate them to the earlier observations. The following natal chart positions are noted:

MC at 5 Pisces
ASC at 0 Cancer
Sun at 21 Virgo, 4th h.
Moon at 3 Virgo, at IC

Mercury at 15 Libra, 5th h.
Venus at 12 Libra, 5th h.
Mars at 21 Leo, 3rd h.
Jupiter at 16 Sag, 6th h.

Saturn at 17 Pisces, 10th h.
Uranus at 8 Taurus, 11th h.
Neptune at 16 Virgo, 4th h.
Pluto at 29 Cancer, 1st/2nd h.

I would like to note first the Saturn opposition to Sun/Neptune from the 10th to the 4th -- the parental axis. These square the 6th house Jupiter. This powerful T-square brings together structure and persistance (Saturn) with vision, dreams and identity (Neptune, Sun) with confidence and an ability to grasp opportunity (Jupiter).

This T-square pattern has permitted me to grasp a concept or idea (Neptune) and give it structure and form (Saturn) -- a pattern I call "bridge building between the dream and the possible." The Sun lets me identify with a concept. Jupiter gives the drive to express the idea, to work for it.

This pattern supports the strong work ethic. Since it is aligned along the 4th-10th house axis it can be easily associated with the parents values. Neptune rules the 10th from the 4th. Saturn in the 10th has long been seen as a strong indicator of the "distant father" -- my dad was always working hard and long, and died while I was a teen-ager.

This is only one pattern that can be associated with my life's purpose as it has been expressed up to this point (I am now retired, sort of, so I've had some time to establish some criteria that are obvious even to me. I'll look at other patterns in the next post. Dave.

M-Press
28-01-2004, 17:18
Dave...this is so...
well, I'll say fascinating too, becasue I'm left speechless ...

I have a small question regarding how you came to adopt your grandchildren.
Was it after and event? a necessity? or because you had something better to offer to them?
Was it your choice, or it was something "put" on you under the circumstances, although it seems you took in on more than willingly?

Hope I'm not too probing...

dadsnook2000
28-01-2004, 22:14
The oldest boy, now 15+, was left with us right after his birth. The other two came to us 5 years later at the ages of 2 1/2 and 8 months (a boy and a baby girl) following a sort of mental breakdown and abusive event by their mother. They stayed with us and after another 5 years we adopted them.

It was our view that kids not only need a home but they also should have their family remain intact. This was not something we would have casually done at this point in our lives as I'll be 75 when the youngest graduates from high school (grade 12).

One of the things I'll be looking for in my chart, as part of this thread's theme, is to see where family and children are so strongly indicated -- if that is a valid issue to seek out. Dave.

dadsnook2000
29-01-2004, 03:11
The Moon carries a lot of symbolism among which is the mother, emotional ties, habits based on early environment and nurturing, basic needs, automatic responses and reactions, feelings, etc.

In my chart the Moon is opposite the MC (and by definition, along the parental axis), is in Virgo, trines Uranus, sextiles the ASC angle, and is semi-square the Mars/Jupiter midpoint.

With Saturn appearing to represent the "distant father, Moon at the IC has to represent the mother. My mother spent much of her time with me (my next sibling was not born until I was 5) as we lived often in a rural area and my dad worked the evening shift in manufacturing. I was taught to read at age 3 and 4, was proficient at coloring and making pictures at a level typical of kids in middle school, and helped with yard work and gardening to the extent that my age and size permitted.

The Moon in Virgo at the IC would signify practical and detailed work, mental pursuits being emphasized, and developing an appreciation for detail and thought and hands-on application.

Moon trine Uranus (Taurus, 11th) could suggest then, and very definitely now, an interest in whatever struck me as unique and having/developing friendship with those who are individualistic.
This aspect also increases the curiosity factor common to many Virgos -- although there are factors in the chart that also contribute to that.

Moon sextiles the ASC at 0 Cancer, significant because Moon rules Cancer (are you noting this Minderwiz, I'm using rulerships here). The most significant exhibition of this aspect, to me, is a very sensitive and emotional nature. I go to pieces at funerals and avoid chick-flicks and heart-breaker TV shows. My wife would say that I'm not sensitive at all but that may be another story.

Moon contacts the Mars/Jupiter mid-point (via a semi-square). For those who know of and use mid-point theory in the astrological work, this is significant. Mars is in Leo in the 3rd, Jupiter is in Sag in the 6th. Mars has always been a creative agent, Jupiter has always led me to work where I could be creative. These two planets are also in trine and work easily together. Later I may expore how the Mars-Mercury yod to Saturn triggers writing projects if that is relevant.

SO, LETS PUT ALL OF THIS TOGETHER.

Moon/Mother emphasizes strong home/family experiences and values.

Moon/ASC increases sensitivity and acceptance of that training and environment. Curiosity and attraction to friends that involve excitement and curiosity is a natural function (due to trine).

Moon = Mars/Jupiter supports the Virgo influence to try, to create/build and provides an outlet for communicating, applying ideas and skills within a project or work place.

TO SUMMARIZE: It seems the parental work ethic, tendancy to get things done -- has been adopted by me. Their strong sense of family cohesiveness and support has also carried over to me.

They do not strike me, in rememberance, of being as curious or explorative in many ways as I am. That might be a generational and social thing (as the world is very different now from their world). They were more conservative across the board it seems.

SUGGESTIONS FOR OTHERS: The Moon should be considered relative to the parents and early home experiences. It may indicate what you took from your parents AS WELL AS WHERE YOU MAY APPLY THOSE LESSONS IN ANOTHER AREA OF YOUR LIFE. In my chart the Moon is in the same place where I received those lessons so I've just mirrored that early training right back into the same area of life. Look for Moon aspects to planets ruling the parental axis signs or Moon rulership over one of the signs at the MC or IC. Good luck. Dave.

dadsnook2000
29-01-2004, 08:53
For those interested, I've posted my chart data on Astro.com. You need to have a contact and password to access this data -- the directions for obtaining them have been posted on the root thread -- Your Life's Purpose. I cannot give them to you.

Note that the given birth time is for Eastern Daylight Time (04:00) and the resultant ASC should be zero Cancer. I'm not sure that Astro.com asked for or recorded that data correctly as they show an incorrect Gemini Ascendant. Dave.

M-Press
29-01-2004, 09:31
hi Dave!

Thanks for doing such a wonderful job presenting all this to us. It's quite amazing really, your findings... although I must say that my own aspect-mathics are just not as advanced, so I have some problems looking at your chart by-myself and seeing all that.

I really don't know whether you wish for any comments here, or what kind of discussion?

The family issue sure looks big (Sun in the 4th, Asc in Cancer), and i wonder how it is shown in your chart that you'll become a double-father. I find this issue more unique than hard word for example, that might be more common. On the other hand I understand that maybe in one's chart all this weighs the same, and it's only "us" that put names to it? I think you would think so...;)

Also where do you see the many job changes/variety? i definitely understand the Venus in Libra regarding the graphic/artistic work-you must have superb taste and aesthetic sense. Is the change of jobs a part of your path to find the "right way"? Is that your Saturn in the 10th?
Is it there to make sure all your efforts go to the familia?
I don't know whether this is connected or not, but your username "dadsnook" spells DAD to me, so maybe this is the first perception of yourself? (Chiron and Part of fortune in the 1st? am I bubbling?)

I would love to participate in the excersise as well (of course), but i would like to see at least one more example of how this is done. But I've been thinking about it since...
Thank you for the experience...

dadsnook2000
31-01-2004, 00:07
Following an examination of the Moon THE NEXT COMPONENT TO EXAMINE is the parental/home axis.

1) The rulers of the 4th and 10th house and their placement in the chart and aspect patterns.

2) The planes aligned along the 4th-10th house axis and their aspect patterns.

The last thing we will look at, in another posting, is the Sun.

4th AND 10th HOUSE RULERS:
Neptune and Mercury rule this axis. Neptune rules the MC and is located in the 4th house. Neptune is involved in a T-square with Saturn (in the 10th) and Jupiter (in the 6th), and has a separating conjunction with the Sun. Mercury is in the Libra 5th and conjuncts Venus.

PLANETS ALONG THE AXIS:
Saturn is in the 10th opposing Neptune and Sun in the 4th. Moon is at the IC but seperate from the Saturn-Neptune/Sun-Jupiter aspect pattern.

Looking at these patterns with the benefit of being able to look back at my life up to this point I can see the following significant expressions of these alignments:

Saturn-Neptune is my "bridge builder" between dreams and reality. Whatever the mind conceives, the mind can direct and bring into reality. Consider that Saturn has a yod pattern with Mercury and Mars, as well as its opposition to Neptune. Mars, Venus and Neptune are the "creative" planets when combined, and with the addition of Mercury, this grouping probably accounts for a high level of creativity.

The keywords: harmony and balance (Venus), logic and perception (Mercury), drive and creative force (Mars) and dreams and vision (Neptune) can all lead to an appreciation of the creative dynamic. Whenever natal/progressed Mars is transited I start a writing project. Whenever Mercury/Venus is activated I do something that creates or builds something.

Saturn seems to lend a hand by providing a framework -- for example, when I write I start by drawing a margin line down the LH side of the paper, put my pencil or pen to the paper and let the words just flow automatically. With a computer I do a similar thing in that I set margins, font and type size, then just let it go. I noted early in this series that I had not done any preparation, that I was just going to jump in. Its how I do it.

In my chart the planets along the axis and ther rulers of that axis are all tied together aspectually and by location. I any of your charts these elements may be quite seperate so perhaps I should lay out a suggestion or two.

FIRST, look at the 4th-10th rulers; their location by house (and sign, perhaps) will show the life's lessons that your parents may have most impressed upon you. In my case, Jupiter in the 6th suggests rewards from a work ethic.

SECOND, look at the planets along the axis who may not be rulers of those signs. Their aspect patterns will show how you energize and put into place certain early-life lessons.

THIRD, since we tend to always rely on what comes most easy to us, look at those aspect patterns and think about how they may have expressed themselves when you were a child, then a teen- ager, then a young adult, then a more mature adult. Have they evolved or changed? How did your parent's values end up being partially expressed in your life? What did you take, what did you add of your own?

Is all of this helping you grow satisfactorily? This last question may more properly be answered by looking at the Sun and it's role in your chart. That will be the last thing we look at in the next posting.

If any of you have questions or comments, feel free to ask or post. Dave.

dadsnook2000
31-01-2004, 04:52
The sun in your chart is the core of "you." It is also an integrating factor. Whatever it brings together is what you tend to adopt and express most forcefully.

In my chart the Sun is part of the Saturn-Neptune-Jupiter aspect pattern. Saturn, opposing the Sun and hence an important balancing-challenging factor, gives form to the Mars-Venus/Mercury pattern.

I have adopted the work ethic from my parents and utilize most strongly my own creative dynamic.

Note that the Moon is along the parental axis but is not linked in any highly significant way to the Sun's aspectual patterns. The Moon is linked to my ASC or personality expression. Two things might be considered relative to the Moon; 1) Moon rules Cancer and 2) the ASC and MC angles are in water signs. From this, I could suggest that I am a feeling type person and that my Mom played a strong role in childhood but less of a relationship role in adulthood.

The Sun expresses itself in strong Virgo and 4th house ways. The Moon function is still highly influential, of course, in terms of reacting to details (dirt on the floor, a cereal flake left on the counter after the kids have breakfast, etc.). Both Sun and Moon contribute to me getting temporarily lost in details before jumping back to the big picture.

So, in summary, look in your chart to see how your Sun is associated with the rulers of the 4-10 axis and with the planets that are along that axis. The Sun is how you activate and see your Life's Purpose. That purpose is both made up of your parent's Life's Purposes (to some lessor or greater degree) and your own individualistic goals.

Again, if you have any questions, just ask. If you want to jump in and post all or part of your own self-examination feel free to do so. The rest of us can help you to degree you wish. Dave.

Moongold
31-01-2004, 10:18
Dave ~

I want to acknowledge that I'm reading this and, like M-Press, finding it very moving.

You are inviting us to join you on a sensitive and different journey and it may take some time for people to respond. This morning I spent some time describing my parent's lives in the framework you used and learned quite a lot by the simplicity of the task. As in your situation, their lives were charactised by hard work, commitment and financial and emotional struggle. Both of them faced much grief and loss in their immediate families and through WW II, and thinking abut how this affected them both as young people and into adult life has been quite moving.

Recognition of the economic and social struggle and how they dealt with this is relatively easy but I think some of their own own life purpose may have been to deal with grief and loss caused by family dynamics and massive losses incurred in WW II. This is a little more challenging and a cause for major reflection.

You have very sophisticated astrological understanding as well, and my attempts may be a little more rudimentary though I expect to learn quite a bit. :).

Thank you once more.

Moongold

dadsnook2000
31-01-2004, 10:37
Thank you for your comments. It is quite likely that dealing with overwhelming grief and loss of family and friends could be a major part of your parent's lives. It can be mind-boggeling to think how that may have shaped their values, their ability to face life and risky situations for themselves, the impact on adopting a conservative position to avoid risk, the pressure to become more private and not reach out so as to not suffer additional losses later on -- etc., etc.

Reflection on these matters will, as you noted, take some time and effort. We'll keep this thread open for quite some time in order to share and support each other in this endeavor. Thank you again for sharing. Dave.

dadsnook2000
09-02-2004, 05:26
Hello All. As indicated earlier, I have let this thread remain quiet for awhile to allow each of you to work on your own life's purpose. Now it is time to start jogging your minds a bit.

M-Press asked about the many changes in my life and what signified them. I'd like to introduce a new thought, and a question, to each reader of this thread about the planet Saturn. I am going to make reference to a book titled, "Astrology and the Edgar Cayce Readings" written my Margaret H. Gammon, published by A.R.E. Press of Virginia Beach, VA USA (home of the Edgar Cayce Institute), and published first in 1967.

This book reviews many of the Edgar Cayce readings and relates those that include astrological comments to the mainstream form of astrology. Many of Cayce's readings do relate closely to our concepts of astrology -- EXCEPT FOR SATURN.

Cayce states that Saturn rules "Change." Yes, much of the popular claims about Saturn remain OK, but Cayce emphasizes that "change" is a big part of Saturn's influence.

So, given that statement, I would like to pose this question. Go back to your charts, look at Saturn's position and aspects. Think about how your view of your chart whould change if you now considered that Saturn also brought "change" into your life along with the need for caution, persistance, diligence, etc.

Edgar Cayce's "change" statement would certainly ring true in my chart -- some 20+ living locations (just homes, not counting apartments) more than that number of discrete jobs and career fields, and certainly changes in my family.

Let's not get mired in details, but just consider how adding the "change" description to your view of Saturn would add or change your chart reading. Have fun. Dave. PS, we may add some tools for helping you explore your parent's life's purpose in the root thread if I get any reasonable response level here for this question.

M-Press
09-02-2004, 17:22
Hi Dave!
very interesting the "change" factor for saturn... I have a narrow bucket held by saturn which opposes everything, and i think that the change there relates only too well!!!
There is something about this excersise like "reading for yourself". I feel that I see things but then I can't see them or what they mean...
i've been probing into my chart for years, only to still look at it like a sparkling promising diamond, blinded by it. As if i don't want to accept some things, or afraid to put the real name to what has already happened...
I'll be opening my thread soon, against so many fears and limitations... There is no way I'll miss this opportunity...
:)