View Full Version : 5 of Pentacles - the bell
I happened to look at this card this morning and noticed for the first time that the person with the crutches is wearing a bell around his neck.
Could this relate to past times, when people with leprosy or other contagious disease were forced to wear bells so others would know they were coming?
-- Lee
Indigo Rose
26-02-2004, 15:39
That is odd. I just noticed this a few days ago myself.
The only reference I could find about bells came from A Tarot Dictionary by Sandra Thomson. In the Middle Ages bells were believed to ward off misfortune and conjure up good spirits.
I am not sure if that is the meaning here, however.
Indigo Rose
TemperanceAngel
26-02-2004, 17:38
Bells also represent the element Water and the emotions.
XTAX
I'm just taking a guess & suggesting that mabee it means that the person in the picture is trying to communicate with someone. Just thinking about the bell being around the neck area.
Bell is bringing notice to words.
or
Mabee this person is to "cry" poor because someone just asked them to borrow $5000. cash, & they don't want to lend it. Mabee this card is telling us to let on that we are not in a good position even though we may be.
Originally posted by Lee
I happened to look at this card this morning and noticed for the first time that the person with the crutches is wearing a bell around his neck.
Could this relate to past times, when people with leprosy or other contagious disease were forced to wear bells so others would know they were coming?
-- Lee
Lee, I've read about the leprosy connection and that lepers used to have to shout "Unclean" when they were walking toward a group of people to warn them of there approch.
This helped me to see this card in different ways.
Not only can circumstances dictate our unhappiness but if we see ourselves as inferior it's very hard to ask for help.
Or feel we deserve more out of life.
When I notice the little bell in a reading it often means a lack of self-worth.
I had never seen the bell before now. Very interesting. I think that it could have associations with disease and contagion. It could be argued that this might serve to strengthen the associations between this card and anxiety.
It might be argued that in this case, the bell itself is a cultural symbol of anxiety... harking back to a time when the bell was used to warn others of the impending approach of a diseased individual.
This card has always struck me as a having associations with loneliness and general feelings of social exclusion. Again, the bell as linked to contagion could serve to further illustrate this association: I can imagine that these bell-wearing individuals must have had the most solitary and lonely lives.
C
CreativeFire
27-02-2004, 17:38
I also had never noticed the bell around his neck! Thanks Lee for posting this thread - as it has added some further insight to this card.
I agree with the thought of it could represent the old ways of people with disease or contagion having to warn others of their misfortune and approach so people could keep their distance - agree with Centaur that it would have been a very lonely and demoralising existence.
Could also help to indicate that this card is not just about the loss of wealth, faith or material status - but maybe loss of health as well?
Another thought on a lighter side, having spent some time on crutches, there were times that I wish I had a bell or something so people could hear me coming and move out of the way a bit - as it can be quite difficult and tiring to be maneovuring around people in a crowd :-)
CreativeFire
Another idea,
mabee these people are trying to be notice, bringing attention to themselves as they have learnt a lesson & now they are coming into light ,as in the window of the building.
Coming out of darkness or a bad situation I want to be noticed.
Originally posted by CreativeFire
Another thought on a lighter side, having spent some time on crutches, there were times that I wish I had a bell or something so people could hear me coming and move out of the way a bit - as it can be quite difficult and tiring to be maneovuring around people in a crowd :-)
CreativeFire
Interesting. Perhaps the bell could also symbolic of a cry for help, or a plea for others to be more understanding and sympathetic to the situation of another?
C
CreativeFire
28-02-2004, 16:45
Great lateral thinking there Centaur! You could have something there - gives me something else to think about with the card with what you have connected to.
CreativeFire
Also, perhaps we could relate it to the little bells which are on the Ace of Cups (under the bowl of the cup).
-- Lee
Originally posted by Lee
Also, perhaps we could relate it to the little bells which are on the Ace of Cups (under the bowl of the cup).
-- Lee
I also missed those... haha!
OK. I think that they tie up very neatly with the bell around the neck of the 5P tramp.
If we look at the Ace of Cups and indeed the symbology of the card as related to joy, love, and emotional-happiness, then perhaps the presence of the bell around the neck of the 5P tramp signifies the NEED for such happiness. It might also signify hope in a very dark situation.
I am also thinking that the presence of the bell if we relate it to the Ace of Cups might also symbolise the need to love one's self: the need to address one's self esteem during such difficult times in order to enable positive change.
C
Originally posted by Centaur
I am also thinking that the presence of the bell if we relate it to the Ace of Cups might also symbolise the need to love one's self: the need to address one's self esteem during such difficult times in order to enable positive change.Good point... also, perhaps, the need to extend love to those less fortunate, such as the people on the 5 of Cups.
-- Lee
Originally posted by CreativeFire
Another thought on a lighter side, having spent some time on crutches, there were times that I wish I had a bell or something so people could hear me coming and move out of the way a bit -
I understand the bell was to warn others that the wearer had leprosy and therefore to keep well away.
Same purpose as a bell on a cat's collar - warning the birds to steer clear.
As you say CF one would have come in very handy for your situation!
G.
Originally posted by Lee
Good point... also, perhaps, the need to extend love to those less fortunate, such as the people on the 5 of Cups.
-- Lee
Another interesting take. I had never thought so much about this card. :)
Whenever I see it, I am reminded of seeing homeless people on the sat outside the Underground or stuffed into a street corner and begging for change. Awful.
C
Good thread...I never noticed the bell in 5Pentacles before...I always see the stained glass church with the pentacles in the window and it makes me think of the wealth of the "Church" the meaning that if churches have so much money/wealth, why are there so many people starving and out in the cold....people who need...
I see 5 Pentacles as ...there is enough to go around...with religious organizations sometimes coming into criticism for their wealth...I see it as a very sad card, that somewhere, not necessarly in "religion" where we may find money..somewhere there is help...
Then the bell triggered all kinds of associations..wedding bells, school bells, jingle bells, bells that toll for death, ....so I did a Bartleby's search for anyone who feels like reading about bells...seems that depending on the Q, the question and card that has the bell(s) could signify almost any meaning of bells.
I'm going to try adding the link..see if my tech skills are up to it...
bartleby.com/cgi-bin/texis/webinator/sitesearch?FILTER=col100&query=bells
I'm going there myself...terri
Now that I have read some of the "bell" quotes...while many are joyful, I think it would be appropriate to say that 5 of Pentacles is not so...I love the Shakespeare quote:
Under the shade of melancholy boughs,
Lose and neglect the creeping hours of time,
If ever you have look'd on better days,
If ever been where bells have knoll'd to church,
If ever sat an any good man's feast.
This opens up the thread of the pain and melancholy of the two figures walking outside a church? (stained glass windows)
Both of them passing a church, a place of worship and comfort?
yet neither seeing it...they look forward and pass the church by..I still find the pentacle symbols in the window disturbing..On a literal level, they could represent money....or wealth of spirit that they fail to see (in the church symbol)
Excellent quote tmgrl2.
Perhaps the use of stained-glass is important in its own right. Many churches depict idealised saints and imagery on stained-glass windows. Perhaps the presence of pentacles in the stained-glass refers to the idealisation of money: present, but out of reach?
C
Originally posted by Centaur
Excellent quote tmgrl2.
Perhaps the use of stained-glass is important in its own right. Many churches depict idealised saints and imagery on stained-glass windows. Perhaps the presence of pentacles in the stained-glass refers to the idealisation of money: present, but out of reach?
C
I like that! Is it out of reach, though, because the weary, sick,downtrodden souls walking past it don't realize that there is salvation....somehow, I still can't get a handle around the pentacles in the stained glass window...so this is one more possibility....ty terri
The origin of stained glass is obscure & may have been accidental, but evidence of the creation & use of coloured glass has been found in excavations of ancient civilizations--Arabian, Egyptian & Roman. Its best-known use has been for churches especially during medieval Europe in churches.
Traditionally, the images depicted in stained glass art tells a story or of an event; &/or creates an iconic image. The pentacle in stained glass can be seen as man in the earth, encased in matter yet striving for spiritual completion, to attain divinity.
The pentacle is composed of a 5-pointed star shape within a circle. The 5-pointed star is representative of man or the human spirit. The circle is perfect & complete in itself with no beginning nor ending. Expressive of the earthly life; life & death in the earth; eternity; the divine or the superconscious.
The depth of skill & labour required to produce stained glass relates it to knowledge & effort resulting/manifesting in a thing of beauty or the tangible (in the earth plane).
The bell seems to allude to when those stricken with leprosy were required to warn others of their condition. Old drawings oft depict them wearing not only ragged clothing, but with limbs wrapped in rags to hide the disfigurement & to prevent contact.
Bells are also used to repel "evil" or bad fortune; in ritual to dispel the negative or to mark one stage to another.
Phoenyx*
19-03-2004, 07:23
Alright, you've got two people, one on crutches with a bell around his neck, with a sandal on one foot, while the other is bandaged. The other person looks to be barefooted. Both are wearing dirty threadbare torn rags. They're not looking at the window to the church. And they're walking in snow! SNOW! I'd like you guys up north to go outside right now and try walking around in that snow barefoot and see how long you can do it? (We've got 80 degrees down here)
My question is....why don't they go inside? Alright, maybe they're not allowed to because of leprosy or whatever. But, wouldn't you expect them to look with longing towards the place of warmth and comfort? But they're not. They're specifically looking away from it, as if they are so centered on their own problems and self-pity that they cannot see the help and comfort that is right by them.
Now, I've known people that are so wrapped up in themselves that they don't want help. They like playing the victim, and when people try to help them, they shun the help and automatically think it wouldn't help anyways. I've never understood those people...:confused:
Also, has anyone noticed that the 5 pentacles looks like they are connected like in a candleabra?
Triquetra and Meewah...like what both of you have said...additonal perspectives Meehwah.."man encased in matter yet striving for spiritual completion." and Triquetra, the idea of their not noticing the "church" represented by stained glass...and not wanting help because of self-pity..like that, too...as if the help is right next to them, but they can't "see" it....good ideas...
terri
Sometimes when bad luck, poverty, sickness happens to people they shun God because they feel he has let them down.
They get angry with God and anything spiritual.
So they reject any help out of anger or disappointment.
I have also often found that this card points to someone feeling unworthy.
I had this happen the other night.
Wonderful person very competent, everytime she gets promoted she can't accept it.
Because she feels unworthy.
This card came up twice for her that night.
And we ended up talking and exploring the cards at length about where her feelings of unworthiness were coming from.
Hey…lets’ take a second and just look at this card.
We have two folks in the snow; both dressed in threadbare clothing, one on crutches with a bandage around his head and foot, bell around his neck. The other may be caressing a cross worn round the neck.
They are passing by a stained glass window.
Now let’s pick up our copies of “The Pictorial Key to the Tarot” by Arthur Edward Waite, page 272…”This card tells of material trouble above all, whether in the form illustrated – that is destitution – or otherwise.” Thank you Arthur…that will be all.
I’ve hated the simplistic approach that Waite begins us on…it locks our mind into that “Destitution” trap.
Pollack, in “78 Degree’s of Pith” (page 252) does an even worse job, describing how the church has no door, or the people DO NOT see the church that sanctuary has failed…neither author gets a passing grade.
Let’s back up the cart here. For starters, we do not know if the couple shown is headed to the church door. Perhaps they are arriving. Perhaps they are leaving. We only get a snapshot here, and we don’t get blueprints for the church…(“no door” ROFL…what a pompus idiot….).
But we miss the point.
We are not allowed to glimpse HOW these folks got to be in the place they are. We do not get the privilege to look over their shoulder (like in a reality TV show) and see the series of events that led to here and now. We cannot see if perhaps they are on the last leg of a journey to bring them here, to the church (whose doors are wide open…just around the corner).
Perhaps it’s just a begging bell – perhaps it’s a leprosy bell (note the bandages upon the man)…perhaps he is arriving in the night for treatments – as the church does have a history of providing relief for those suffering from Hansen's Disease (there was a treatment involving the bark of a tree, used for ages….).
We do know this (or can infer it…we cannot infer the church has no door…how did the workmen leave? How did they do the window installation?). The couple is in a state of movement from point A to B. Point B may or may not be the church. But there was a series of events that led up to this picture…and that in my worldview is what the card is about. How did they get here? Destitution does not just happen.
Another point…
If you spend time in the woods, you learn to make noise, or wear bells, to keep certain omnivores away (Bears, Mountain Lions)…it just warns them off, and you may get to your destination alive. Notice the couple could conceivably have been traveling right to this spot! Enduring hardships! And there was a series of decisions that got them here alive.
Am I making sense yet?
ty, Umbrae....
Somehow, I don't see these two has having anything to do literally with the church...either coming to or going away from it.
Just that it is a dark card...destitution...as you said, U,
that part is clear...they just look as though they are passing by...not even noticing the stained glass window with the pentacles in it...I still can't get rid of the image of "rich" churches and so many "destitute" people in the world...it's as though, "religion" is not an option for solace for some poor people who need food, medical care, a home....The church stands there, a symbol for help to its members, but ....
I don't know...I just feel that it's like showing how much wealth and "religion" is out there, but how many people, also, can't or don't access that as a source.
That's why when I draw this card, I look at the others surrounding it....I did a CC reading for my friend, yesterday..and the first card was 5 pent with the 3 Cups over it....Knowing her question, it seemed clear to me that the situation was that she was needy, depressed, lost, suffering...and the 3 C (RW) were opposing that feeling by encouraging her to find an outlet for celebration or fun, not solitary (which she had been doing...glued to the tv) but something social....anyhow, that part and the rest of the reading resonated well with her...and she feels it gave her direction....I said that religion was not the place where she would find her solution...somehow, it felt right.
terri
Of course, it's always possible that the only reason for the church window (and thus the church) is so that Pamela Colman Smith would have a way to work five pentacles into the picture. :P
-- Lee
Wow..amazing thread.
I've never noticed the bell around the neck, or the tower behind the window.
Lee you have amazing eyesight. I never would have seen those tiny bells on the AoC either!
In my mind this card represents the contrast between organized religion and spirituality. In the symbolism of bells, a small bell with a tinkling sound represents spirituality while a large bell with a deep tone represents an earthy, material aspect. Perhaps the tower behind the window is a bell tower? The window itself doesn't look like the window of an actual building, but an icon placed there to symbolically represent religion.
The two figures, for whatever reason, have placed their hope in the unseen, spiritual dimension. Waite, in The Key, says they are mendicants (beggars). A mendicant can be an ordinary beggar in the street or a monk belonging to a religious order. This gives us a key clue to the meaning. The two people are associated with The Hermit, while the pentacles and symbolism in the background are associated with The Hierophant.
So, what's the point, that poverty is spiritual and materialism is not? Maybe. Waite didn't have too many kind things to say about religious hypocrites from what I've read of him. But there's nothing really good or morally superior about poverty either. I think this card is simply an illustration to show the difference between spirituality and religion. An extreme illustration perhaps, but an effective one.
fools_fool
Moongold
19-09-2005, 03:21
Yes, and it depends on the background and context, as Umbrae and some others have said. It is impossible to read as a "stand alone" card.
In Africa and other places, including here, churches are community centres with not much money at all but with good buildings and a central location where people can go for support, company and shelter if they need it.
Another thing about this card is that there are "two" people, indicating perhaps that one need not be alone in the cold. The stained glass windows light the darkness too.
I also get a sense of transition from the card. There is a before and after, as in most difficult life passages.
The Esoteric title for the card is "Lord of Material Trouble," and is associated with Mercury in Taurus. The overall scene depicts such material trouble for the couple. The astrological attribution and the card number show its connection to The Hierophant card, which is Taurus. The bell is supposed to be in the shape as that of the Hierophant's body, and represents the attribute of hearing as listening, particularly to that of one's inner voice of intuition.
The Pentagram within the Pentacle represents that of five rotations of the eight-year cyclic stations of the planet Venus. There being five pentacles, that represents five eight-year Venusian cycles, or forty years, which is biblically considered a generation of Man.
The card can be taken to represent the general state of humanity, with the light from the church as being that of the Inner Light of Esotericism through that of the Western Mystery/Metaphysical Tradition, which is hidden from the materialistic mundane world. Unless the individual becomes aware of the existence of that Inner Light, they move throughout the world in the travails and bonds of materialistic ignorance unaware of that Sanctuary of Liberation which may be nearer than they imagined and/or realized.
tarotbear
19-09-2005, 23:23
This has been addressed elsewhere (but everyone does not read 'elsewhere') but I have always thought the five pentacles were placed on The Tree of Life, not a candleabra, as someone mentioned.
It may be 'traditional' to see it as a church, but prominent buildings and large homes have stained glass windows, too! They could have been turned away from the rich man's dinner party (there's a Biblical nuance in there, I think) or have been refused financial help because there is none to be given. The point is that the window is usually glowing indicating that inside is light and warmth and on the outside our poor travelers are neither.
Good Lord! Will this card pop up if we were to do readings for the 'Katrina survivors?' ***shudders at the realily of the statement***
tarobones
19-09-2005, 23:38
Umbrae wrote: Let’s back up the cart here. For starters, we do not know if the couple shown is headed to the church door. Perhaps they are arriving. Perhaps they are leaving. We only get a snapshot here, and we don’t get blueprints for the church…(“no door” ROFL…what a pompus idiot….)."
Seems both viewpoints are possible, and neither is right or wrong. Personally, I'd go with Rachel on this one, who is neither pompous, nor an idiot, it seems to me. But that's just me.................Michael
Fudugazi
22-09-2005, 11:50
I would guess a leprosy bell, because of the bandages and the literature & iconography associated with lepers & bells. But it could be a war veteran with a begging bell.
Why is everyone saying it's a church? All we see is a wall and a stained glass window. Anyone who has visited London knows there are stained glass windows on Gothic Revival buildings all over the place - even loos have them! Since Pixie Colman-Smith was working in London, we can't assume a church - only a building with a stained glass window.
Having said that, we are free - as is Rachel Pollack - to thread our imaginations round this image. It is very evocative. I don't believe in censoring the intuitive imagination in reading, anymore than I think we should take Rachel Pollack's word as gospel (I assume she'd be horrified by that - it is her wonderful method that we should be emulating - her free-wheeling, inquisitive approach of the cards, using myth, kabbalah, daily experience and imagination - which does give her insights I cherish, but am not chained to. They are her insights).
tarobones
22-09-2005, 14:54
Thanks, Helvetica, for your words about Rachel Pollack. I agree 100%, she would be horrified if we took her words as gospel, but she has taught me a wonderful, freeing, creative approach to the tarot you so aptly describe. Her method is where her wisdom lies. What a treasure. BB, Michael
It should be borne in mind that in the idea of "Church" as relates to the card, that one might be better served if they view the word "Church" in context not of organized religion, but of individual spirituality... The body being the Temple of the Soul.... The Church of Inner Light within... The Spark of The Divine that connects All to One and One to All, etc....
Fudugazi
23-09-2005, 04:17
Oh, it's perfectly possible to see a church, in all its symbolic spiritual dimension, as you say, RChMI - but it's also possible to see St Pancras Station or a private house, in all their symbolic dimensions (I have a friend who swears St Pancras is very spiritual - so we can get back to the "church" that way). It's actually a wonderful card for free interpretation. Who are these people? What is their relationship? (are they strangers, friends, is the cripple following the woman and begging or are they walking together? is she a prostitute, a mother, old, young?) What is the building? How much or how little spirituality can we attach to this card? The answer will be different depending on our imagination, experience, use of Kabbalah, numerology, spirituality, etc. Not to mention the querent's question! (if the querent is asking you for the outcome of his investment, you'lll probably not bring in a spiritual dimension...you'll suggest he try another investment!)
All that from the bare image of two people, one presumably a woman, walking in front of another, a cripple leaning on braces - presumably a man, in the snow, passing a stained glass window showing 5 pentacles, foliage & 2 roses.
Michael - I agree with you about Rachel Pollack. She is a treasure!