View Full Version : Mage: The Ascension Tarot
I have a first-edition (1995) deck and book set of this. I knew it had gone out of print, but from what I can discern online a second printing was done recently by White Wolf. The card stock of my copy is of unusually good quality, not at all what I would expect from a deck made for use in a roleplaying game (RPG), so maybe, as with the Vertigo, the first edition is sought after despite the reprint. I've been trying to figure out if this is something I should try to sell, or hang onto, or trade; but I can't get a grip on what its current value is. No one seems to be selling it on Ebay, so I don't know if that means it's not in demand at all, or extremely in demand. Anyone got information or advice they'd be willing to give me? Does anyone use this deck, and if so, how do you like it for readings?
Hi Qolus,
I have the 2nd edition Mage deck, it cost $25 at the White Wolf site. Deck sets were not available. I actually really like this deck, but to understand it is really helpful to have a really good background in the White Wolf World of Darkness, particularly in the game Mage as that is where much of the symbolism is drawn. Basically it is a themed deck, and I really think they did a great job.
Which book came with the deck? I am really curious.
The second edition doesn't have a book at all? The set I have is in a box that has two compartments in it for the cards, and the book sits on top of them. The book is maybe 5 inches wide and 4 inches tall (I don't know metric conversion, sorry). It just says "Mage: The Ascension Tarot" in gold print on the front; the typeface is almost like the one on the cards, but fancier. It has an ISBN on the inside cover, but it is the same as the one on the box, so I assume the book was only ever sold with the set. It's maybe 125 pages. There is a title page, and then a second title page which has the subtitle "Designs of Destiny." It gives several spreads and some ideas for how to work tarot spreads into the RPG itself. The card desctriptions each take up a page, and there are full-color illustrations of the cards on these pages. Each card description lists a Meaning, a Reversed meaning, and an Association, followed by an explanation of the scene depicted on the card. The "Association" is sometimes one or more conceptual keywords (Five of Primordialism [Cups] has "Vulnerability," for example), but more frequently it's groups from or aspects of the RPG. Eight of Questing (Wands) has the Association ""Sphere of Matter; Sons of Ether," Wheel of Fortune has "Euthanatos" (almost all the Major Arcana only have one keyword or game element listed for their Associations). Does yours at least have a LWB or something, Jewel?
Hi Qolus, thanks for responding. Mine came with the LWB (not that I ever read those *LOL*. Like I said I am a fan of White Wolf's World of Darkness so I really have no trouble using this deck at all. What I use as a reference book, when needed, is the actual big Mage book which I already had. Like I said, I bought the Mage deck straight from White Wolf, and I did not see an option for the deck/book set. Should you ever decide to trade ot sell your deck/book set please let me know I might be interested both as a Tarot and as a World of Darkness fan.
Hi Jewel,
Thank you, I will very likely take you up on that. I'm still debating whether or not to hang onto it for now...
Qolus just keep me posted, maybe we can work out a trade if I end up having something comparable that you are interested in, if not I'd be happy to purchase it if you decide to part with it. Just PM me when you decide.
firemaiden
19-11-2005, 20:26
Okay, I got one. It was in a used bookstore. First edition. (1995)
Okaaaaaay, this deck is weird weird weird. No, i don't play role playing games (at least not that kind, LOL), so this is me getting the deck just cause of it being sold as a tarot deck.
But once the shock value wears off, its starting to grow on me. (hopefully not literally, like a mole or a wart)
Some of these cards read like a wacked out version of the Rider Waite on drugs, or... what you would see if you looked at a RWS card when you were seriously messed up.
Oh yes, this is kind of cool. Take the Lovers card, for example: Adam and Eve (I hate it that he's blond, but whatever, at least Eve looks African), and between them is what, one of those Turkish devices for smoking tobacco - (and hashisch and opium). So Adam and Eve are holding on to their respective hookah pipes, and rising in the smoke of hookah, is the famous angel from the RWS lover's card. Behind Eve is a tree wrapped around with a green snake (not your basic garden snake) and behind Adam is a burning bush. (rofl).
It's really an amazing, dark cynical twist on the Lovers card. Okay, so what does that say if the angel of love is not an angel but a cloud of smoke? That love is only possible for people stoned out of their gourd? If this is the Garden of Eden, they're standing in, bye the way, it looks horribly barren. The only thing green on that tree is the snake... And these two humans (the token blond frat boy and his African girlfriend) are as tall and lean as giraffes, so obviously, they've not been gorging on the fat of the land. It's like, maybe the Garden of Eden only sssseeeeeeemed like the Garden of Eden, as long as the lovers could get their puff of hallucinogens. And ouch, being thrown out of Eden is what happens when you run out.
This by the way, is not what it says in the beautiful accompanying full-colour booklet. (And no, I'm thinking maybe I don't want to part with this so fast, I'm just writing this to make you all horribly jealous and then rub your nose in it, which is after all, one of the main pleasures of the Deck forum, MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH)
The Booklet says Bathed in the emanations of a cosmic higher power [yeah right], warmed by the radiant life giving energies of the solar light, they seek the union of opposites. Self and other, carnal and spiritual, knowledge and mystery bear fruit only in the garden of loving intimacy. Unveiled to one another, the lovers follow the pathway of the senses to inner and outer harmony
I think the book is beautifully written by the way. Someone had an awful lot of fun creating this deck.
And then you have to take a look at the Moon card: If you don't look at it too closely, you might see just another moon card with lobster, dogs, and towers, however instead of a lobster emerging from a pool, we have a woman rising from (or drowning?) in a pool of blood. She raises eight gnarled lobster-like fingers to the moon who looks back down on her looking nauseated in green. The customary two wolves, (or dogs) have elongated arms that say "I am werewolf" and the expected twin towers are huge daggers planted in the soil. The skyline of a sinister Gotham like metropolis lurks in the background, and the moon's chartreuse face, and clouds of green above her look like noxious fumes, speak of a poluted world choked and drowning in its own poisons. Keeeeeewl.
LOL, Want to know what the book says? She surrenders completely to the lure of the unconscious. The realm of dreams becomes a nightmare. Drowning in the blood of her inner beasts, she sinks into the quiet ecstasy of madness. Or is she rising, renewed by her plunge into the depths of imaginative vision, to traverse the two-fold path created by the swords of matter and spirit towards a higher consciousness.
firemaiden
19-11-2005, 20:42
And then... oh my God, the SUN card, it's hilarious! Here we are (again) with the same old images from RWS.
Sun? check.
Wall? check.
Little boy with blond hair? check.
Red banner ribbon thingy? check
Sunflowers? check.
Horse?
Horse? Horse? Hello where's the horse? Is it that hobby horse lying on the ground? Or did the horse throw his rider and go leaping back over the wall.
And oh, whoops, what happened to the wall? Someone crashed through it and knocked some of it down. And why is it the sun flowers seem to be giggling their heads off?
The book says this is the card of liberation.
Liberation, I like. The little boy is naked, the horse ran away, the wall has been smashed, the flowers are laughing.
This is a card after my own heart, iconoclastic? If the wall was a hardened tarot icon, it has been smashed. The book's blurb reads Glorifying in his new-found awareness the enlightened spirit has no further need for the outworn symbols of tradition or the playthings which has marked his progress through the material world. Like the sun flowers which turn their faces toward the life-giving sun, the naked child stands, fearless and joyful in the garden of eternal light.
TaranRavenfrost
20-11-2005, 00:08
Just to put my two cents in:
White Wolfs "World of Darkness" included three big games: Vampire: The Masquerade, Werewolf: The Apocolypse, and Mage: the Ascension. Since then, the world of darkness spawned many other games, including changeling, demon, wraith (which was actually the first game), and others.
Well, the books had always been promising a thing called Gehenna, when Caine would rise from torpor and tear the world a new asshole. Well, he finally did. NOW, we have the new world of darkness, with three whole new games. Vampire: The Requiem, Werewolf: The Foresaken, and Mage: The Awakening.
All the old books and decks and dice and whatnot are now completely out of print.
I have a feeling this decks value could go up BIG time. Btw, I doubt if you can actually still buy any of the old world of darkness stuff from white wolf. Im off there now to see. The Website is: www.worldofdarkness.com
firemaiden
20-11-2005, 02:39
Well, I'm not going to ever get interested in the games, but what you are telling me is the value is most like going to go way up?
What I love is that it is a brilliant interpretation of the tarot.
TaranRavenfrost
20-11-2005, 10:29
well yes, the value should increase. No more are going to be made, and you know how out of print tarot decks sell.
I often think of this deck as ‘Waite goes to Dystopia.’ It is superficially dark (like the standard RWS 5 of Wands, looks like chaos – looks like a dance – ya gotta be in it to learn the steps to get past the chaos) but once you grok the deck, there is no darkness.
I want to look at the ‘This is a game” aspect for a bit.
There was a time (1985-1995), in the US, where ‘the press’ loved to print stories about how D&D (Dungeons and Dragons published by TSR, now owned by Wizards of the Coast) ‘Caused’ and/or was linked to suicides, deaths, and murders of young people. Articles were released about how D&D promoted (regardless of the intent of the ‘player’) Satanism, unwholesome acts etc…
Against this backdrop of media lies and distortions regarding RPG’s (Role Playing Games) of which RPG equaled D&D equaled Evil Satanic Death to our children media hype, White Wolf released Mage: the Ascension Tarot.
Inside the LWB they did place a disclaimer:A Bit of Common Sense, Please
Although its symbolism concurs with many traditional forms of Tarot imagery and association, this deck is not intended to be used for true readings. It is not a starter deck for would be magicians, it is novelty item only.
Tarot cards, whether traditional or modern, are not toys. Though we hope you will find their use as a tool for Storytelling exciting and inspirational, the Tarot traditionally functions as a tool toward self-discovery. Many accounts credit Tarot readings with insights beyond those of ‘normal’ perceptions, others say the cards simply allow you to access those parts of the subconscious tat we miss in out daily lives. Whatever the truth may be (assuming there is only one truth), we do not recommend using a game deck for real-life concerns, nor do we condone the use of tools by those who don’t know what they’re doing with them.
Believe or not, have some respect and common sense please.
(linguistic errors appear in original print)They follow these paragraphs with a dreadful ‘History of Tarot’….
But they make a point to state – this is a game.
Well Tarot was a game also.
The approach was to prevent lawsuits.
The Content was shear brilliance. Various artists created the deck. Joshua Gabriel Timbrook created the Majors, Alex Sheikman the Suit of Questing, John Cobb the Suit of Primordial, Larry MacDougall the Suit of Dynamism, and Dan Smith the Suit of Patterns.
Why is this important?
Rather than have one artist do each of the four suits, and having each suit end up with the same vibrational pattern - which is so wrong where each suit should vibrate differently…. Here, that problem was solved using four artists for the four suits. Each is very different, but they blend well…
This and the ITT, for me are the closest things to a ‘science-fiction deck.’
All that said – I can never recommend purchasing a deck because it is OOP, in anticipation of a rise in perceived value. “Investing” in Tarot is a bad idea. Past performance is no indicator of future results…
This deck has the ultimate Two of Swords, and Two of Cups. If you’re comfortable with your current interpretations, I invite you to gander at these two cards…he he he…
:smoker:
firemaiden
20-11-2005, 14:28
Oh wow, yes, the two of swords. Yikes! It looks like she is sitting on a tall scaffold, readying to be hung and drowned, (like the ones who went before her... now sport for fishies) except there is no noose- and one false move of her two swords will cut the cord... yeeeeow!
I like the Wheel of Fortune too, talk about dark!!! (The barrel of a revolver)
Nahh – look again at the Two of Swords, does she look uncomfortable? Shaky? Tired? Or does she have an air of mastery about her? Does she not possess the qualities that those before her did not have? There is a air of calm about her – as she stands poised in her martial arts style pose, one foot raised, to attack/defend against that which may soon rise up from the deep…
firemaiden
20-11-2005, 23:34
You're right! She looks totally balanced and poised - an air of mastery, yes!
Okay, what do you get out of the nine of wands? - a fence of pikes with burnt ends, strung together with barbed wire; a werewolf head stuck on one of the pikes- yowling, with glowing eyes and fangs... still alive? and the Indian in full regalia looking calm (like "yeah, the wolf head does this every night") ... and where is the ninth wand? the Indian's peace pipe?)
The LWB tells us, “Though the trees of life and knowledge stand burnt and defiled, though the wildness of the world is impaled upon the spear of progress, the power of the eagle’s keen perception endows him with unceasing courage.”
Other decks tell us that the battle is not over, to be vigilant, blah blah blah – here is an image of a spiritual warrior in full power and strength. This is spiritual fortitude in the face of mundane ‘prowess’. The muggles will not win.
firemaiden
21-11-2005, 02:34
Oooo, that's keeeeewl! I love how what looks like a gruesome scene is actually meant as a very positive metaphore, it makes so much sense, (and is very poetic). Who would 'a thunk it from a "game", LOL.
I bought this deck around 2 years ago (guess there is still an old thread about it here or in the archive).
Until now this deck did not click with me and sleeps peacefully in the collector box.
My interest is peaked to say the least!
The deck is on the way.
I promised myself ...no more decks...but I think I would love to use this one for readings.
t
Great discussion!
firemaiden
22-11-2005, 19:26
Oh terri, are you getting it? I'd love to have a tea-party group surrounding this deck. Caitlin, I'm so glad I've gotten you to take it out of the box again.
I'm looking at the Ten of Coins ("Pattern") right now. I'd be fascinated to know what you make of it. I'm thinking this is either one of the scariest, or funniest cards I've ever seen. Taken side by side with it's RWS counterpart - it's a scream. Remember the happy family? The old man petting his cute little dogs - the faithful happy dogs that recognise their long lost master - shades of the return of Odysseus, and also Wotan as the Wanderer...
Well heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeere we go, the same happy family having a cocktail party on a New York penthouse aparment. (Don't tell me that's not New York!). The old man, (dressed as high mucky-muck head honcho CEO type), has brought his pet saber-toothed dog, sans muzzle, fresh from the last kill. The guests are keeping a safe distance, (clinging together for protection?) and are smiling, politely, LOL. Your typical family reunion? or typical NY business cocktail party?
Well? The Medium-Sized Purple book says Meaning: Stability. Riches, Abundance, Prosperity, Enrichment. [...]
Raising his glass in a toast to the success of his vision, the autocrat of Pattern sees the culmination of all for which he has so zealously striven. His patriarchal rule ensures the material well-being of those who embrace his orderly philosophy. Under his ministrations, animal instinct is harnassed to the will of the mind. Stability is assured.
I almost want to add a sarcastic "NOT!" to the end of the sentence. LOL. The blood slobbering saber-toothed dog, is indeed looking very tame and happy to be next to his master. But what just happened? Who got ripped to shreds? Was it an agressive corporate take-over? Or were there massive lay-offs? It makes me think of the hypocrisy which makes civilisation possible. (Anyone see that movie "Wolf" with Jack Nicholson and Michelle Pfeifer?)
Methinks this is a fantastic tongue-in-cheek spoof and commentary on the RWS Ten of Pentacles (http://www.learntarot.com/p10.htm) and the Joan Bunning type interpretation of it.
Yup, fm....the deck is on its way....a tea-party group sounds great!
t
@firemaiden,
Ok, I gave it and started having a closer look at the deck ;)
DarkElectric
13-12-2005, 11:24
I just won mine on ebay.
The seller, however, has a semi-sketchy track record as far as prompt delivery goes. I hope this time he gets it out ASAP, because I can hardly wait for it to get here.
As an inveterate gamer geek girl, I was starting to become familiar with the Whitewolf scene, but ended up truncating my association with the other folks I knew who were into it. However, my BF is also a serious gamer, and is conversant with Whitewolf. He'll be jazzed to see this deck too :)
lunakasha
22-12-2005, 09:41
I just bought the 2nd edition Mage Tarot (and love it) but I am wondering if any of you also have the book that comes with the first edition set??? I would like to know the title and/or ISBN of a book which might be helpful in working with this deck??? I found several versions of Mage: The Ascension books on amazon, but I have no idea which one would work best as a tool for working with the tarot. What I am looking for is some background on the characters and "language" of the RPG that the deck is based upon.
I also posted this question in the Books forum but have had no luck so far.....if anyone can help me out, I would greatly appreciate your input.
Thanks!
:) Luna
firemaiden
22-12-2005, 09:47
Yes, I have the book that came with the deck and have posted stuff from it on this thread :). It's a great book and a great deck. It doesn't really have background on the "language" and the characters (or maybe it does, but the RPG stuff is all Greek to me) it is really about the deck as a tarot.
Nahh – look again at the Two of Swords, does she look uncomfortable? Shaky? Tired? Or does she have an air of mastery about her? Does she not possess the qualities that those before her did not have? There is a air of calm about her – as she stands poised in her martial arts style pose, one foot raised, to attack/defend against that which may soon rise up from the deep…
I just got my deck...2003...with a LWB. The paragraphic descriptions are wonderful. Mine is The Mage (doesn't say Ascension, but refers to that in the book).
Two of Swords. I was waiting for the deck so I could see it.
My first impression was that of the Karate Kid, standing in the "bird" pose for hours...as per Mr. Miagi. Interesting that the figure faces to left as I look at the card...so I then think of
Receptive, passive, looking to past (yet one sword over the shoulder points toward the right). The right pointing sword with the other pointing left, reminds me of the Magician. In the Magician, I think of ....as it is above, so it is below, as though channeling the insight and energies from above. since the one hand points up and the other looks as though it is the conduit for what is coming through.
Here we have a channeling from past, while collecting information from the future, all made possible by the stillness of the meditative pose, almost as if integrating all information to break down duality, allowing the movement forward toward "new" creation with the three.
Just some random thoughts.
What a deck!
Some cards seem quite traditional in nature. Others I had trouble even placing in the correct suit. Ten of Cups, for instance.
terri
lunakasha
22-12-2005, 11:47
Yes, I have the book that came with the deck and have posted stuff from it on this thread :). It's a great book and a great deck. It doesn't really have background on the "language" and the characters (or maybe it does, but the RPG stuff is all Greek to me) it is really about the deck as a tarot.
Thanks firemaiden....that sounds like exactly what I am looking for, a book that will add to my understanding of this particular tarot deck!
I am curious as to whether or not the book could be purchased seperately, would you mind posting the title and ISBN for me so I could research it???
Since the first edition/set is OOP, I hope that does not mean the book is also unavailable. :(
:) Luna
firemaiden
22-12-2005, 14:20
Sorry hon, I think it does. There is no ISBN listed separately on the book, it is only listed on the outside of the box (which includes the cards)
ISBN 1-56504-433-9
firemaiden
22-12-2005, 14:46
Didn't the second edition come with anything? No little white book?
lunakasha
22-12-2005, 14:52
Didn't the second edition come with anything? No little white book?
Yes....and it is actually pretty good for a LWB! ;)
I was just looking for a little more....and I did find several books online, but did not want to buy something that is more focused on the RPG and not so much on the tarot deck, if you know what I mean.
Hmmm....thanks for the ISBN, I will keep going with the search.
And thanks for taking the time to respond....I appreciate it!
:) Luna
firemaiden
22-12-2005, 15:02
I wouldn't be surprised if the LWB you have carries the same text that is in my book. The (medium-sized purple) book, could be condensed to a LWB by removing all the graphics. It reproduces each card in full-colour, with a very interesting blurb. There is also an interesting Introduction and a chapter called "Using the Cards".
lunakasha
22-12-2005, 18:02
I wouldn't be surprised if the LWB you have carries the same text that is in my book. The (medium-sized purple) book, could be condensed to a LWB by removing all the graphics. It reproduces each card in full-colour, with a very interesting blurb. There is also an interesting Introduction and a chapter called "Using the Cards".
I will take a closer look at the LWB, maybe you are right. I just got the deck so I haven't read the whole book yet, but what I did read was interesting, not your typical *generic* LWB.
Thanks again firemaiden.....maybe I will post a blurb for one of the cards and we can compare with your BPB (big-purple-book)??? ;)
:) Luna
Ilithiya
22-12-2005, 21:00
I just bought the 2nd edition Mage Tarot (and love it) but I am wondering if any of you also have the book that comes with the first edition set??? I would like to know the title and/or ISBN of a book which might be helpful in working with this deck??? I found several versions of Mage: The Ascension books on amazon, but I have no idea which one would work best as a tool for working with the tarot. What I am looking for is some background on the characters and "language" of the RPG that the deck is based upon.
I also posted this question in the Books forum but have had no luck so far.....if anyone can help me out, I would greatly appreciate your input.
Thanks!
:) Luna
This'll be a trick, now that White Wolf's decided to screw with it (apparently) in the same vein that Wizards of the Coast slaughtered AD&D (yes, I'm still pissed about that)...
Try going for - seriously - one of the basic, OOP player's handbooks. The first edition handbook had great explanations of the different things that make this deck so different - the suit's namesakes, Paradox, the Technocracy, as well as the "schools" and rest of it. Skip the gamerbabble; there's a lot of good sections, anywhere from two paragraphs to five pages scattered through the handbook.
There's a 1st Edition up on eBay for less than $5 current bid... do a search for "mage the ascension" and you'll find it.
Good luck!
Illy
DarkElectric
23-12-2005, 14:08
Mine just arrived...it's the 1995 first edition. It's gorgeous. I'm soooo glad the book came with it. Somehow, I completely lucked out on this one. It has become one of my fave decks, instantly.
lunakasha
23-12-2005, 18:04
This'll be a trick, now that White Wolf's decided to screw with it (apparently) in the same vein that Wizards of the Coast slaughtered AD&D (yes, I'm still pissed about that)...
Try going for - seriously - one of the basic, OOP player's handbooks. The first edition handbook had great explanations of the different things that make this deck so different - the suit's namesakes, Paradox, the Technocracy, as well as the "schools" and rest of it. Skip the gamerbabble; there's a lot of good sections, anywhere from two paragraphs to five pages scattered through the handbook.
There's a 1st Edition up on eBay for less than $5 current bid... do a search for "mage the ascension" and you'll find it.
Good luck!
Illy
Thanks so much Illy! :)
I will definitely be on the lookout for this book....will check ebay and amazon.
I REALLY love the *look* of this deck....and I know I will get more out of it by understanding where it came from, the meanings of the suits, etc.
Will keep everyone posted....and it is really nice to see so many people here getting interested in the deck right around the same time as me!
:) Luna
lunakasha
24-12-2005, 10:09
There's a 1st Edition up on eBay for less than $5 current bid... do a search for "mage the ascension" and you'll find it.
YIKES....I found it all right, LOL! Did a search as you suggested and....there are SO MANY books listed that I have no idea where to begin!!! :eek: :confused: :(
Please....if you read this, and when/if you have the time, would you be able to help me "narrow down" my options??? Likewise, there are a number of MTA books listed at amazon, and I just don't know which one(s) would be most helpful in terms of using the tarot.
Thanks again Illy (or anyone else who wants to jump in!)
:) Luna
Ilithiya
24-12-2005, 12:11
Here you go:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Whitewolf-Mage-The-Ascension_W0QQitemZ8740941018QQcategoryZ1183QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem is the 1st edition softcover.
For the 1st edition softcover, the ISBN is 1565040651
For the 2nd edition hardback, the ISBN is 1565044002
Sorry for being unclear... :) I hope this helps.
Illy
lunakasha
24-12-2005, 14:21
Here you go:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Whitewolf-Mage-The-Ascension_W0QQitemZ8740941018QQcategoryZ1183QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem is the 1st edition softcover.
For the 1st edition softcover, the ISBN is 1565040651
For the 2nd edition hardback, the ISBN is 1565044002
Sorry for being unclear... :) I hope this helps.
Illy
Thanks again Illy.....very much appreciated, I will check these out and report back here later. Hmmm....now I need to decide: 1st or 2nd ed??? :confused: LOL!!!
:D Luna
I know this thread is old, but I am new here :)
I have had this deck off and on for years and LOVE Mage (The Ascension anyway, although I don't 'play' anymore. I really love this deck and use it for myself sometimes when I want a modern and slightly dark reading. I have found some intense and creepy true readings from using a deck that taps into the techno driven world. Life has all kinds of elements to it and this deck (for me) taps into those layers by translating old symbols into modern, yet somewhat exaggerated, concepts. Anyway... fun none the less to see other layers of reality through a darkly shaded lens.
I have always liked this deck, but I do find that having knowledge of White Wolfs World of Darkness is very helpful in understanding it. Not essential, but really helpful. I was never into the White Wolf RPGs, but I have enjoyed the fiction novels that were written based on several of the RPGs including Mage. I also got the Mage the Assention players guide as I always thought it would be a nice thing to have to go along with this deck and understand the suits and what the strengths and weaknesses are, basically being able to read the symbols used as they are within the context of the RPG.
rwcarter
13-05-2008, 15:50
I also got the Mage the Assention players guide as I always thought it would be a nice thing to have to go along with this deck and understand the suits and what the strengths and weaknesses are, basically being able to read the symbols used as they are within the context of the RPG.
Jewel, did the player's guide work for that purpose? I have the deck but haven't used it. Love the imagery, but it's a foreign world to me. (Although after the strides I've made with researching symbols and making connections with the Ancient Egyptian Tarot as part of the IDS, maybe putting some concerted effort into the Mage isn't as daunting a prospect as it was two months ago....)
Rodney
firemaiden
13-05-2008, 16:09
Hi Mina! It's great to meet another enthusiast for this deck!
Player's Guide was definitely helpful. As Jewel said having knowledge of WoD was helpful to flesh out the understandings. The Tradition books go into more specifics but that may be more info than one really wants or needs unless they are a total geek about Mage like I am. There are a bunch of websites based around the old Mage: The Ascension game that are also fun to add into the interpretation. Here are a few links that may be helpful.
http://www.tarotpassages.com/mage.htm
http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_2733.html
http://hem.bredband.net/arenamontanus/Mage/comments.html
the above are someone's note on Mage Tarot
WoD Mage Deck Symbol Meanings
http://wiki.white-wolf.com/worldofdarkness/index.php?title=Tarot_in_Mage_(Mage:_The_Awakening)
The Tarot in Mage
Major Arcana Card/ Keyword/ Mage Symbology
* The Fool- Possibility/ Acanthus
* The Magician- Empowerment/ Prime Arcanum
* The High Priest- Secrets/ Spirit Arcanum
* The Empress- Fertility/ Life Arcanum
* The Emperor- Command/ Mind Arcanum
* The Hierophant- Teaching/ Silver Ladder
* The Lovers- Recognition/ Space Arcanum
* The Chariot- Conviction/ Adamantine Arrow
* Strength- Willpower/ Obrimos
* The Hermit- Illumination/ Mysterium
* Wheel of Fortune- Destiny/ Fate Arcanum
* Justice- Measure/ Time Arcanum
* The Hanged Man- Sacrifice/ Guardians of the Veil
* Death- Transition/ Moros
* Temperance- Synthesis/ Matter Arcanum
* The Devil- Desire/ Mastigos
* The Tower- Revelation/ Seers of the Throne
* The Star- Insight/ Awakening
* The Moon- Instinct/ Thyrsus
* The Sun- Clarity/ Forces Arcanum
* Judgment- Rebirth/ Death Arcanum
* The World- Freedom/ Free Council/Apostates
Minor Arcana Card- Symbology/ Thaumaturgical Practice
* Aces- Potential/ Knowing
* Twos- Focus/ Unveiling
* Threes- Decision/ Compelling
* Fours- Order/ Ruling
* Fives- Change/ Veiling
* Sixes- Solution/ Shielding
* Sevens- Mastery/ Fraying
* Eights- Direction/ Weaving
* Nines- Completion/ Perfecting
* Tens- Transcendence/ Imperial
* Pages- Growth/ Patterning
* Knights- Motion/ Unraveling
* Queens- Creation/ Making
* Kings- Passion/ Unmaking
Suits Element/ Expression/ Rules
* Cups- Blood (Water)/ Feeling/ Emotions
* Pentacles/Coins- Diamond (earth)/ Sensation/ Crafts
* Swords- Thunder (air)/ Thinking / Ideas
* Wands/Batons- Star (fire)/ Intuition/ Endeavors
Not certain if someone else mentioned this but you would not want to buy the new (third edition I believe) books for Mage and try to use them with this deck. The different sects of mages that appear in the cards are not all represented in the new version.
Edited: Ah someone already mentioned this.
Jewel, did the player's guide work for that purpose? I have the deck but haven't used it. Love the imagery, but it's a foreign world to me. (Although after the strides I've made with researching symbols and making connections with the Ancient Egyptian Tarot as part of the IDS, maybe putting some concerted effort into the Mage isn't as daunting a prospect as it was two months ago....)
I have not explored this fully, but I think it will based on what I know of the World of Darkness and the type of information included in the players guides. Like Mina mentioned, it will have a bunch of irrelevant information, but you will get the workings of the "traditions" which are expressed in the suits (including the way people dress in some instances which can be a representation of what tradition they belong to). It has been a long time since I have pulled this deck out, but if I recall correctly I also saw some cards that at least inderectly referenced the Vampire The Masquerade (Brujah Clan to be exact) of which I do have knowledge and that is what sparked me to get the Mage Assenscion guide book. I have the original guide book and deck, plus my deck did come with a small book (which I have not read *LOL*). But the second edition deck did not come with a book. I will pull these things out and take a look at them.
The World of Darkness is a very detailed and complete and intricate RPG world. Understanding it can really put this deck into context.
rwcarter
22-07-2008, 14:21
I was at a used bookstore this past weekend (with Shade no less!) and saw a number of Mage guides. Of course I hadn't written down the name of the guide that I should look for (and had forgotten that Shade had chimed in on this thread so could've helped me figure out what to get!). I thumbed through them all, but nothing jumped right out at me, so ended up not getting anything. But I've written down and printed out the relevant info, so I'll be prepared next time. (Plus Shade will more than likely be with me, so I'll be sure to enlist his aid. :D)
Rodney
D'oh I wish I had been more help, that store has a lot of great PRG books.
The books that would give the most basic information about the setting for teh deck would be the core game book and the players guide (called the Book of Shadows I think).
rwcarter
22-07-2008, 18:59
D'oh I wish I had been more help, that store has a lot of great PRG books.
The books that would give the most basic information about the setting for teh deck would be the core game book and the players guide (called the Book of Shadows I think).
My fault, not yours. I was off on my own back in that aisle while the rest of the gang was over in the metaphysical section. Never even occurred to me to ask if anyone in the group knew anything about Mage: The Ascension....
Rodney
Chorazin
23-07-2008, 20:43
I'm surprised there is so much love for this tarot! I played a ton of World of Darkness games in college, so this was a must buy for me back then, and was my second tarot ever.
If anyone has questions about the Mage (or any other WoD setting) setting I'll do my best to answer them, I have WAY to many Mage books and need an excuse to crack them open again