Question about Rising Sign

Here'a a good one: my Mom isn't quite sure of my time of birth but has given me a close estimate. Problem with that is, when I do my chart and want to find out my ascendant sign, if I move my birth time 2 minutes back or forth...my ascendant changes! My ascendant is either a Libra OR a Scorpio. I've read many descriptions for both and I'm a combo of both ascendants.

Can ascendant cusp? Can I be both? Or is there another way to figure this out?

Thanks.

GA

Well I'm not one of the pro's here, but I would assume and I think I have also read that you can have a cusp on the ascendant and that would make you have qualities of both signs.

I suppose that would make more sense to me, if true, because I'm at least 50% of both signs, but not a 100% of either. Is there a particular time when one might be more prominent than the other? Times of year...time of day...particular activity involved, etc?

GA

I'm not aware of any theories about a particular time when one sign might be more prominent than the other in a "cusp" situation. I would look at the placement of the planets, Sun, and Moon to see what support is available in general for the two signs involved in a cusp placement. You could also look closely at the ruler of each sign and its placement and what is happening to it in terms of transits and so forth from day to day.

Assuming that your chart calculations are correct and that the '2 minutes' you refer to is time, then your Ascendant is somewhere around 29 and a half degrees Libra on your calculations. If you were born earlier than this time then you will be Libra, however the next two minutes take you into Scorpio.

In practice it isn't easy to come up with an answer to this one, even for a professional. - you could try pressing her for more precision to narrow the range but if it's quite narrow to start with, I doubt this will be useful.

There are arguments about the transitions between signs, many Astrologers will argue that for the Ascendant you are either Libra or Scorpio but not a mixture of both. There's a minority view that there isn't a sharp change at ingress but a smoother change over four or five degrees, which is likely to mean that you have a fair Scorpio influence.

There are a number of methods open to a professional to 'rectify' the birth time - these are usually related to the timings of major events in your later life, such as the year you got married or went to University, or got picked for the local Sports team, etc. However you will probably get ten different 'rectified' birth times from ten different professionals - it just isn't that precise.

So unless your mother's memory suddenly improves, I think you have to take yourself as 'cuspal'.

Minderwiz...I think that makes sense. Aside from taking my self as "cuspal"...I also think that putting the two signs next to each other...I'm perhaps about 60/40 Scorpio/Libra. But sometimes its less or more. But either way, I'm often bound to respond that my rising is, indeed, in Scorpio. I just wanted to make sure I understand my own chart better by knowing the correct rising.

But I see your point otherwise, and agree. And yeah, doubt my mom's memory will improve any more than this!

GA

the part of the Ascendent?

I've found this discussion interesting, though I'm not in the same situation as GA (I am a firm Gemini asc - if Geminis can ever be called firm!)

But I do wonder about the part played by the asc in a chart, with so many other influences - particularly a cusp asc; but in fact all asc. How do I know if I do something or react in a specific way because of my Gemini asc, rather than the aspect between two planets or which house another planet is in? How do we - in practice, not on paper - make out which part of our chart is influence what and when? In the case of GA's cusp asc - how can you tell the 60/40, as distinct from other influences?

I've been wondering about all that for a while.

Helvetica said:

How do we - in practice, not on paper - make out which part of our chart is influence what and when?

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I'm not sure you can divorce "on paper" from "in practice" in astrology. In other words, you have to study the chart, which is (for me, anyway) "on paper" (or on a computer screen!) If you are interested in trying to figure out what was going on in your chart at the time of a particular event, you have to look at the chart and examine aspects, placements, and all of that. You can get a general sense of what is "strong" or "weak" in your natal chart and that might help you understand general tendencies you have -- but the minute you get into specifics (in my opinion) you have to consult the details of the chart.

Helvetica said:

How do I know if I do something or react in a specific way because of my Gemini asc, rather than the aspect between two planets or which house another planet is in?

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Personally I don't think you can tell so easily. Ppl are complex and multilayered beings. Often contradictory. It's amazing how we can function so well while having deeply ingrained contradictions in our belief systems! But like Flidais has mentioned, some parts of your chart can be stronger, others weak to pull out tendencies.

As for the ASC's influence, I would consider the following:
- planets conj or in the 1st house. (If in the 1st but a different sign, this is interesting and adds an additional layer of complexity)
- ASC is often the social role one adopts/is given esp w/i family dynamics and as such, often ppl will identify more w/ASC than the sun sign.
- ASC's modality/element to the rest of the chart. (e.g. If we have a Cancer rising and the rest of the chart lacks water, this could be interesting. The person could be moody, yet still a very "detached" personality, and not sentimental)
- ASC's interaction w/other planets.

Helvetica said:

I've found this discussion interesting, though I'm not in the same situation as GA (I am a firm Gemini asc - if Geminis can ever be called firm!)

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Here Here helvetica! Firm is not my sparkling quality and it probably makes my schedule-keeping worse. My friend has actually told me to be places when she really plans on leaving 10 min later! She tells me to be somewhere at 730 and she plans on leaving by 740. She plans on holdups too; to this she says "dont worry, i planned on this"

Another one says "Ok how about we leave around 3? Ok, you plan on 245."

No respect, no respect at all!