Who is better?

This is prompted by something tmgrl2 said in another thread. It got me to wondering. I'm not sure if this goes here or in another forum, but I'll start here.

Who would you consider to be the better tarot reader---the one who uses standard meanings as their basis for reading or the one who reads totally intuitively and knows nothing of the standard meanings?

The reason I ask this is because we've got some proponents on the forum of not paying attention to books, just to making a journal of your own meanings. This, to me, would fall under the totally intuitive category if a new reader were to follow it exclusively.

So what would be wrong with a totally intuitive reader as opposed to a reader who has learned the standard meanings, which they'd presumably be learning from books?

Also, which would you rather pay to have a reading from and why?

Editing to add another layer to the question:

I'm using the New Orleans Voodoo tarot now part of the time and, although it supposedly follows RWS, it does so extremely loosely and I'm not using those standards, if you'd call them that. So, if you'd rather have a paid reading from someone who knows and uses standard meanings, what would that do for you if, having paid for a reading, you discovered the reader didn't use a deck for which standard meanings would apply? (This is actually what prompted my whole question in the first place but I got lost. )

I think that either method can potentially work out OK, but it seems that those who can read intuitively will be better at making the cards speak to my question. All readers should have a basic knowledge of the "generally accepted" meanings of a card to fall back on when intuition falters.

I just had another thought. When I was thinking "intuitive", I was thinking of a reader who hasn't ever done any studying of tarot, but just gotten some cards and followed their own devised meanings. But then I suppose there might be yet another category of readers who just goes with whatever enters their mind at the time of the reading.

Until I started studying Tarot I wouldn't have had a clue what method, if any, someone was using to read the cards. Even a quick explanation by the reader would have meant nothing to me.

Since I've started learning about it and telling people, I've had a number of them say they had bought decks in the past and after trying to read them a few times just gave up. I would think it was the rare person who could instinctively 'just read' without some kind of idea where to start.

Maybe in 30 years I might think differently, but I think some of the long time readers forget how confusing and overwhelming 78 cards can be to the new reader.

It doesn't take very long to recognize a book or class for what its worth, and even bad ones will give us something, if only teaching us who or what to avoid.

I have a backround in tarot, obviously, and I like to know what the cards were intended to mean by the artist.

But their influence can only go so far.

If was buying a reading from someone, I would want them to work 90% intuitively. Otherwise, if we are just reading and regurgitating standard meanings, I may as well do it myself or borrow their book.

I think it is good to have a knowledge of tarot history and tradition. Even if it is just that 10%. I think it shows an interest in your subject. For some querants, I will explain the history of the cards and show them different standards. Questions about tradition have come up on more than a couple of occasions.

In my blog, I will refer to tradition. But I will not always go along with it. As I draw the card more times, my own layers develop and become that card. And they feel stronger, too.

LB

I think I agree with LB. Though I might not need as much as 90% intuitive. Probably even 75% would work for me.

I feel much more confident knowing the background of my cards, the RWS meanings, and then also knowing that I can take "liberties" with them through my intuition. Sometimes the card seems to have a plain, standard RWS meaning. Other times they don't. At least that's how they show up for me. If it were entirely intuition, I'd kinda wonder if they'd studied it at all or were just pulling it out of their butts (so to speak).

Hope I didn't come across as meaning I believe in

an

either/or approach??? I don't.

I have many books that I used in the beginning...for online readings...I also believe that people can read intuitively using the cards. I had a great reading from someone who told me they have no clue about the Tarot cards but as a tool, they work for her. She gave me some very good guidance in that "reading" even though she just kept turning over cards one at a time and talking.


Once I began to feel comfortable even knowing the names, numbers, order of the cards...a bit about court cards....I began "trusting" myself to read live......no books then...I know there was one person here who went to a reader at a fair who pulled out a book during a reading to find a meaning....but no, I don't advocate that...

Also, re journaling...I suggest it as another method...I tried journaling initially...but soon found that it didn't work for me...I also don't keep notes on readings I do now...nor do I journal anymore...that's just me.

I really feel that how one reads or how one develops as a reader is a very personal method...one that resonates with the individual.

I do feel that people who are new or that people who ask about "how" to learn can be told of various ways to approach the task of reading the Tarot.

I know that umbrae advocates journaling and we have had many a laugh about his "burn the LWB" rants....but, if I'm not mistaken, the way I take his rants...is...

At some point in time...reading with your intuition and with the guidance of 78 beautiful pictures, a few of which a sitter has drawn forward....is an important step in developing trust in oneself as a reader.

I used to read with colors and I used to use handwritings (that I studied quite a bit when I was in my 20s.....and I mentored with a man in Florida who did amazing work with color)....but always intuition jumped into the fray.

For me, it isn't a conscious process once my sitter and I get going. I often can't remember what I said shortly after, and rarely a week or two later...yet, at other times, I can still see a card from someone's reading standing out. Something takes over for me...for me...doesn't mean that others should read the way I do, or that my way is the only way or the right way....

I don't think you meant that, Lyric, when you started this thread.

But I definitely don't think that there is ONE way, and the ONE way is better than another...but I do believe that at some point, it is a good idea to put aside the books and keyword meanings and let the "magic" happen...let the story begin....

terri

Books? Intuition?

Dear tmgrl,

As usual you're right on the button. Regardless of anyone else's beliefs, each person has to find her own way of reading cards ... the one which works for her.

Blessings.

***For me, it isn't a conscious process once my sitter and I get going. I often can't remember what I said shortly after, and rarely a week or two later...yet, at other times, I can still see a card from someone's reading standing out. Something takes over for me...for me...doesn't mean that others should read the way I do, or that my way is the only way or the right way....***

I agree. You and I do it just about alike then. Journalling didn't work for me, either, and I never write down my readings, or if I do write one down, I immediately misplace it. I don't remember readings I've done, either, but once in awhile if something entirely new about a card in a reading comes out, then I might remember it. Or if it's striking in some other way, I'll remember it.

I read books that go with specific decks just to see what the artist might have had in mind and out of curiosity. I don't use them when I'm reading, though. And I sometimes read other books about other aspects of reading, like making spreads and 21 Ways to Read a Tarot Card.

I think just about everyone uses books, if at no other time than in their early learning days.

Your statement did get me to thinking, though, because I'm sure there are probably some readers who haven't ever cracked a book or learned standard meanings and just use the cards as they've given them their own meanings.

Then, LB made me think about a reader who may never even have done that and just pulls things out of thin air as they go, different with every reading.

I wonder about odd things at times. For a lot of my young life and into young adulthood, for instance, I wondered if bugs have muscles. Dumb, huh? I mean, couldn't there be something of true importance I could have pondered about?

Thanks, Emma!

Lyric said:

Journalling didn't work for me, either, and I never write down my readings, or if I do write one down, I immediately misplace it.

Click to expand...

This goes bigtime for me, Lyric! I tend to obsess when I start writing longhand...and my handwriting deteriorates ....it's just a mess when I try to journal...the only think I do still is keep a pad by my bedside and occasionally write down the theme of a dream...but my Tarot notes from the beginning...I threw them out actually. When I do an online reading though, since I type so fast, the reading flows almost as if I were reading live, only with the interaction that goes on in my live readings.

Lyric said:

I read books that go with specific decks just to see what the artist might have had in mind and out of curiosity. I don't use them when I'm reading, though. And I sometimes read other books about other aspects of reading, like making spreads and 21 Ways to Read a Tarot Card.

I think just about everyone uses books, if at no other time than in their early learning days.

Click to expand...

Me, too. I almost always read the book that comes with a deck...I glance at the LWB, but if there is a companion book, I read it, since often there are things in the book, especially in the introduction, that help me develop my perspective on the deck..more so with some books than with others.

Lyric said:

Your statement did get me to thinking, though, because I'm sure there are probably some readers who haven't ever cracked a book or learned standard meanings and just use the cards as they've given them their own meanings.

Then, LB made me think about a reader who may never even have done that and just pulls things out of thin air as they go, different with every reading.

I wonder about odd things at times. For a lot of my young life and into young adulthood, for instance, I wondered if bugs have muscles. Dumb, huh? I mean, couldn't there be something of true importance I could have pondered about?

Click to expand...

LOL!!! I have been to several readers who have never cracked a book or learned standard readings...they have told me so...one, as I said, gave me some fine guidance. The other, actually was using some of the standard, even keyword meanings all throughout the reading...so I don't know if he "lied" to me or if he had some bigtime connection with the great keyword record in the sky. Kind of like Waite...he made everything so "secret" that he came off as not putting forth much in terms of card meanings, yet Pixie Colman Smith was a brilliant artist and probably the more intuitive of the two.

BTW, I just finished reading K. Frank Jensen's The Story of the Waite-Smith Tarot.....fabulous book!

When baba opened her thread about what to look for when hiring a reading for the studio....it gave a few of us some pause...but here is a case, where I believe she actually should expect the person she hires to have some background in The Tarot...with capital letters....totally different from an independent reader who sets up a shingle either at home, at a cafe, store or at a fair.

Bottom line...we each have to find our own way....Now that we are a ways into this thread, I am glad you started it, since I believe we need to discuss this topic on a regular basis. These threads get lost...and sometimes, newbies may fall upon a thread or post and feel that if they don't learn in a certain fashion that they just aren't nor will they ever be good readers.

Once a person begins reading professionally or live, they will develop a reputation....and people either will or will not return based upon experience with that reader.

terri

P.S. Do bugs have muscles????