What gives the cards their meaning?

I'm not sure if this has really been discussed, I couldn't find a thread, but it's something I've been thinking about a good deal lately and have seen come up here and there in discussions a lot, after reading the thread about reading erotic decks, I started thinking about this more.

There are definitely imagery and meanings that are traditionally associated with the cards, and that effects how we understand them. For instance, the image of the Three of Swords in Rider-Waite based decks, with the heart being pierced by the swords, definitely suggests heartache and pain. The Sun is usually a pretty cheery, optimistic-looking card.

But what about when the imagery on the cards is different? Do you feel the cards shift meaning, then? How far can you read the cards intuitively?

What, exactly, gives the cards their meaning? Is it the traditional meanings, what your intuition tells you, what the cards depict, or what? If you tend to read intuitively, how do you read non-illustrated pip cards?

I agree this is an interesting question and one worth thinking about. I hope my response doesn't sound argumentative. It's just the point I've come to in my own thinking.

If you observe what really goes on in the world then there are no "shoulds" or "oughts" but only "what is." Some people use set meanings no matter what picture is on the cards (might as well read with index cards). Others use the cards primarily as a focusing device for their own intuition or psychic insights. Others memorize meanings (btw, the oldest - with minor exceptions - are from Etteilla).

What gives the cards their meaning? People do. And people will do practically anything you can imagine them doing. Otherwise Tarot are simply pieces of cardboard (or plastic) with inks printed on them. Most people apply at least some symbolic meanings to the images on the cards that are standard in Western culture (see various symbol dictionaries). Some create their own idiosyncratic meanings.

To argue what's right or wrong is ultimately meaningless in that, no matter what we say, all the options you mention and more simply "are" - they exist. People do them. Even if we could legislate what people should do - I'm sure such legislation would change with changing fads or figures in power and differ in different parts of the world.

Mary

I think there is a maturation process that sort of happens, a flow that occurs when you've been dancing with Tarot for more than a few years. Like any dance team knows, you learn each others rhythms, you learn where your partner is likely to trip, or when you will stumble every time, until suddenly there is a seamless flow and you dance together fusing into the music, each other and the Universe, one being.

You become Tarot and Tarot becomes you. Suddenly you don't care if what you are saying is from the book written for the Tarot of Prague, because the deck is communicating something deeply personal; only you could say what you have to say because the words coming out of your mouth are deeply entwined with who you are, your experience and understanding of the world being pulled from some place deep inside of you, a place you perhaps never knew existed.

When you look up from the cards into the eyes of the person you are reading for, you don't feel panic or worry about what you will say, you don't think about the numbers or the RWS definitions, you just speak a truth that is the truth of the moment, and all of time exists in that moment. There is no past no present no future, just the incredible symmetry of connecting to someplace primal, someplace infinite and full of wisdom and love.

I think that as these moments build, and you become confident that these moments will continue to occur, you begin to develop a personal vocabulary, and yes, sometimes a book comes out of that vocabulary. But the book did not originally make the definition meaningful, the moment of truth between you and the human being whose life you touched made the moment of truth occur, and the pieces of pretty paper triggered the process.

I think there's magic in the cards.

Esther said:

I'm not sure if this has really been discussed, I couldn't find a thread, but it's something I've been thinking about a good deal lately and have seen come up here and there in discussions a lot, after reading the thread about reading erotic decks, I started thinking about this more.

There are definitely imagery and meanings that are traditionally associated with the cards, and that effects how we understand them. For instance, the image of the Three of Swords in Rider-Waite based decks, with the heart being pierced by the swords, definitely suggests heartache and pain. The Sun is usually a pretty cheery, optimistic-looking card.

But what about when the imagery on the cards is different? Do you feel the cards shift meaning, then? How far can you read the cards intuitively?

What, exactly, gives the cards their meaning? Is it the traditional meanings, what your intuition tells you, what the cards depict, or what? If you tend to read intuitively, how do you read non-illustrated pip cards?

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Tarot reading, it seems to me,is a very individual experience. There are almost as many ways to read as there are individuals. Well, maybe not that many, but you get my point. You rarely come across two people, if ever, who read exactly the same way.

That being said, the only way to answer your question, is that each reader finds meaning in the way they choose to find meaning. If you prefer to find meaning through book meanings, the meaning will be there for you. If you prefer to read totally intuitively, the cards will talk to you in that way and give you meaning. And there are many variations in between.

To me the main thing is to know that we live in a universe that gives us answers when we seek them. Life helps us along if he ask. The cards are a tool, a way the universe can communicate with us and help us understand life. Meaning comes in whatever form you search for it in. If you pick up a deck with the intention of using it literally and seeing book meanings, the universe will answer you that way. If you pick up a deck and intend to use it intuitively, the universe will answer you that way. It's like we all speak different languages, but the universe is multt-lingual and can answer in whatever language (form) we talk to it in. Perhaps meaning is not in the cards at all themselves. They are just the tool that lets the universe communicate with us.

That being said, I personally read almost entirely intuitively, by analysing imagery. And yes it can be done, and it can work quite well. Because I read intuitively, truly unscenic pips so not work for me as there is not enough there for me to analyse. But they work perfectly well for others who read in different ways from me. In fact there are those who prefer them.

In short, after this long post LOL. It is intention that matters. Meaning will come to you in the form that you intend to work with it.

Bar

elf said:

I think there is a maturation process that sort of happens, a flow that occurs when you've been dancing with Tarot for more than a few years. Like any dance team knows, you learn each others rhythms, you learn where your partner is likely to trip, or when you will stumble every time, until suddenly there is a seamless flow and you dance together fusing into the music, each other and the Universe, one being.

You become Tarot and Tarot becomes you. Suddenly you don't care if what you are saying is from the book written for the Tarot of Prague, because the deck is communicating something deeply personal; only you could say what you have to say because the words coming out of your mouth are deeply entwined with who you are, your experience and understanding of the world being pulled from some place deep inside of you, a place you perhaps never knew existed.

When you look up from the cards into the eyes of the person you are reading for, you don't feel panic or worry about what you will say, you don't think about the numbers or the RWS definitions, you just speak a truth that is the truth of the moment, and all of time exists in that moment. There is no past no present no future, just the incredible symmetry of connecting to someplace primal, someplace infinite and full of wisdom and love.

I think that as these moments build, and you become confident that these moments will continue to occur, you begin to develop a personal vocabulary, and yes, sometimes a book comes out of that vocabulary. But the book did not originally make the definition meaningful, the moment of truth between you and the human being whose life you touched made the moment of truth occur, and the pieces of pretty paper triggered the process.

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Beautifully put, elf!

Depends if you mean historically, esoterically, or personally, they all have merit, and I just realized I am too tired to even start to go into this one, but great question.

If you look at the book Keywords for the Crowley Tarot by Banzhaf & Theler they give details about all the cards in Astrological, Qabalah, Elemental, Numerology details and it is from these that the cards get their meanings (at least maybe).

I think Crowley gave all those correspondences himself, so no need to go to another source for them. There's BoT itself, and 777, as well. Lots more, but 777 is Crowley's Big Book of Correspondences.

Teheuti said:

If you observe what really goes on in the world then there are no "shoulds" or "oughts" but only "what is."

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Meaning is in the eye of the beholder.

It's what happens to one when one looks at the cards.

Whatever is available to use is available to everyone.

Somehow I suspect it all comes from the same source.