Waite's Hermit dilemma

Teheuti

In _The Hidden Church of the Holy Graal_, Waite uses Hermit imagery to describe his own dilemma in writing about the Grail traditions. He likens rigorous historical research (such as that conducted by a Virgo personality) to “a dry stick in the hand . . . that is for some practical purposes more convenient than a live sapling at the top of an inaccessible hill . . . in remote and unnoticed distances.” While this means that the mystical heart of imagination has “no probability of blooming like Aaron's rod,” it is also not in danger of imprudent fantasy (such as found today in The DaVinci Code, etc.). In writing about the Holy Graal, he thus chose to keep to existing texts rather than speculation. “It is such knowledge . . . that enables me to take the via prudentiæ . . . [so that] all the important points remain in my hands unaffected.” The via prudentiæ or “prudent way” is the narrow path one must trod between all forms of excess to get to the Truth. It often requires foregoing pleasure in beautiful blooms for the plain but practical dry stick that can take you to otherwise inaccessible heights without endangering the end result.

I think this shows pretty conclusively that Waite believed the Hermit to be the missing virtue, Prudence.

Waite also says that the Hermit is “the missing Persephone under the form of Prudence" (PKT, p. 22).

Mary

Elven

After reading the piece you quoted in Waites Pictorial Key To The Tarot - (PKT) I also read that Waite writes ....
"Therefore the Hermit is not, as Court de Gebelin explained, a wise man in search of the truth and justice; nor is he as a later explaination proposes, an especial example of experience. His beacon intimates that 'Where I am you also may be".

Teheuti said:
The via prudentiæ or “prudent way” is the narrow path one must trod between all forms of excess to get to the Truth. It often requires foregoing pleasure in beautiful blooms for the plain but practical dry stick that can take you to otherwise inaccessible heights without endangering the end result.

I think this shows pretty conclusively that Waite believed the Hermit to be the missing virtue, Prudence

Waite also says that the Hermit is “the missing Persephone under the form of Prudence" (PKT, p. 22)..

but doesn't Waite also say
PKT p16 - "But this is a card of attainment, as we shall see later, than a card of quest *snip* ....
"I see now that Eliphas Levishas allocated this card to Prudence, and so God forgive those who have made our discoveries before us. I am not ungrateful however, as it enables me to add that prudence is the least of its meanings and the most negligible"
... also
p17 "Prudence is the economy which follows the line of least resistance, that the Soul may get back whence it came.
"The corresponding counsel is that true Prudenceis concerned with the one thing needful; and the axiom is Waste not, want not."

In taking the full context of the reference:
"But the laws of research have never succeeded in in extricatingthe missing Persephone under the form of Prudence. Court de gerblin attempted to solve the difficulty by a tour de force, and believed that he had extracted what he wanted from the symbol of the Hanged Man - wherein he decieved himself. The tarot therefore has its Justice, its Temperance also and its Fortitude, as we shall see presently, but it does not offer us any type of Prudence, though it maybe admitted in some respect, the isolation of the Hermit, persuing a solitary path by the light of his own lamp, gives, to those who can recieve it, a certain high counsel in respect of the via prudentiae.

The last piece I thought he was refering to de Gerblins inclusion, and not how he sees Prudence and the Hermit.
He also refers to the Hanged Man and says "that this is the symbol which is supposed to represent Prudence". though goes on to say (as I understand it) that 'current' (in his time) interpretations of the card are 'cartomancers intuitions'.

Teheuti

Elven -

I can't tell whether you agree or disagree with me.

My reading of Waite's Hermit material leads me to conclude that he sees the Hermit as Prudence, but not the Prudence that most people normally think of. He rejects their views while redfining Prudence according to the piece you quote: "Prudence is the economy which follows the line of least resistance, that the Soul may get back whence it came." And, "The corresponding counsel is that true Prudence is concerned with the one thing needful; and the axiom is Waste not, want not."

He's saying that the Hermit is HIS (Waite's version of) Prudence and NOT the Prudence as defined by de Gébelin (which led to deG's wrong conclusions) nor that of other Tarot authors of the day.

In assigning Prudence to the Hermit, he is also reconceptualizing exactly what Prudence is - in a way that relates to his whole concept of the Secret Tradition that has been so misunderstood (in his view) through the ages.

Mary

Elven

Hi Teheuti

Sorry, I think I was trying to determine the text. I find, that with some of Waite writing, it difficult to read - as where I think there should be punctuation, there isn't any ... (as if I can talk about punctuation and spelling pht!

)

This was what struck me as something significant about the Hermit which I had not picked up on before, and has been that 'light' in the latern moment for me ... regarding his interpretation of prudence.

Waite said:
"Therefore the Hermit is not, as Court de Gebelin explained, a wise man in search of the truth and justice; nor is he as a later explaination proposes, an especial example of experience. His beacon intimates that 'Where I am you also may be".

Teheuti said:
He's saying that the Hermit is HIS (Waite's version of) Prudence and NOT the Prudence as defined by de Gébelin (which led to deG's wrong conclusions) nor that of other Tarot authors of the day.

In assigning Prudence to the Hermit, he is also reconceptualizing exactly what Prudence is - in a way that relates to his whole concept of the Secret Tradition that has been so misunderstood (in his view) through the ages.

Yes, I understand what you mean above ...
In some ways I think he tries to keep prudence clear of the trappings of the blossoming rod - keeping to terms and using it in its unadorned form, so that it remains pure in (his learned) context, and doesnt transmute or transgress in any form. By going back to what he sees the meaning of prudence being (in what he see's as it traditional meaning) unadulterated, he can place it after Justice and he's not being 'intuitive' about it - he keeps it in its the form he sees and placed as he sees appropriate. Though I get the impression that prudence is an aspect of the card - it is not the Hermit 'himself'. Being prudent with Prudence.

Blessings Elven x

Teheuti

Elven -

Seems like we are on the same page . . . except for . . .

By going back to what he sees the meaning of prudence being (in what he see's as it traditional meaning) unadulterated, he can place it after Justice

Don't you mean after Strength, which is #8 in the RWS? We need Strength in order to act with Waite's kind of prudence, after which we can be truly Just.

Mary

Elven

Teheuti said:
Don't you mean after Strength, which is #8 in the RWS? We need Strength in order to act with Waite's kind of prudence, after which we can be truly Just.

D'OH!! LOL!!

I suppose I could edit it - but then your post wouldnt make any sense ... I'll leave my post the way it is - and yes Strength!! Fortutide.

Blessings Elven x