Things we shouldn't know...

Niti

Do you think our cards (or other divination methods) would tell us things we (or our querent) are not meant to know, simply because we ask? Are cards absolutely truthful, or do you think they are bound by some higher power that may wish to conceal things from us for reasons of it's own?

I have had readings where, in the certain positions, especially 'the future', I got ambiguous cards (seeming to evade the question) or courts that seemed, rather than answering my question, to be looking mischievously at me ("haha I know and you don't!"). I have had readings for others come up with cards in certain positions (such as "the past") that seemed to be saying "you don't need to know that; it's none of your business."

Often-times, even if my question isn't worded constructively (something which many readers insist is essential), the reading itself will come out in a constructive manner...

Perhaps it has to do with the reader doing the reading...or the deck...some feel certain decks are "harsher" than others. Maybe some give constructive advice unbidden...

But I can't help but feel that the tarot cards do conceal things from us sometimes, and when the querent (or other person in question) has something they really don't want us to know, the cards will reflect that - by not telling us!

Does anyone else agree? Is all of this "constructive wording", "rearranging of questions" and flat out avoidance necessary to protect ourselves and our readers, or is it bigger than that? At the end of the day, is it okay to trust the tarot universe to sort out what you need versus what you've actually asked?
 

elvenstar

I too have at times gotten the message 'I'm not telling you' and have accepted it. I have also told people I'm reading for that they're not supposed to know this at this time, because that was the message I got from the cards. I'm not sure why but it does happen and I'm fine with it. :) Sometimes you just need to live and make decisions unbiased.

As for the future, I think sometimes they're vague simply because it still hangs in the balance.

The process of careful phrasing occasionally gives you the answer already, by the time you've sorted through the problem you don't need the reading any more :D On the other hand, good phrasing etc. is all well and good but often not necessary for me. And yes, I do trust the tarot universe to tell me what I need to know or pass on, nothing more and nothing less. It's this trust that allows to me to do readings, otherwise I can't do it at all.
 

SunChariot

Niti said:
Do you think our cards (or other divination methods) would tell us things we (or our querent) are not meant to know, simply because we ask? Are cards absolutely truthful, or do you think they are bound by some higher power that may wish to conceal things from us for reasons of it's own?

I have had readings where, in the certain positions, especially 'the future', I got ambiguous cards (seeming to evade the question) or courts that seemed, rather than answering my question, to be looking mischievously at me ("haha I know and you don't!"). I have had readings for others come up with cards in certain positions (such as "the past") that seemed to be saying "you don't need to know that; it's none of your business."

Often-times, even if my question isn't worded constructively (something which many readers insist is essential), the reading itself will come out in a constructive manner...

Perhaps it has to do with the reader doing the reading...or the deck...some feel certain decks are "harsher" than others. Maybe some give constructive advice unbidden...

But I can't help but feel that the tarot cards do conceal things from us sometimes, and when the querent (or other person in question) has something they really don't want us to know, the cards will reflect that - by not telling us!

Does anyone else agree? Is all of this "constructive wording", "rearranging of questions" and flat out avoidance necessary to protect ourselves and our readers, or is it bigger than that? At the end of the day, is it okay to trust the tarot universe to sort out what you need versus what you've actually asked?
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I believe the cards are always truthful. But yes there are times when we are best not knowing an answer, usually when the answer involves something we are meant to come to learn on our own and come to terms with. Being given the answer too soon would disrupt that learning experience.

It has been my experience that in cases like this we are not given the answer. I have seen cards come up in readings saying that the cards will not answer a particular question and that it is not in the best interest of the querent to know that right now.

In fact, I remember a particular reading that said just that in relation to someone's future. The cards said they could not answer because it was not in their best interest to know. I told the querent that and they told me they have gotten the very same answer from the card themselves and from other readers as well. So that was that. They simply were not meant to know.

The cards talk to us like a loving parent, sortof. That is how it seems to me. They are always ready to talk and tell us what we need to know, unless it will harm us in some way to know or unless it is not in our best interest to know the answer now.

My view is that the cards tell us what we need to know over what we ask, if the two are not the same. That has been my experience. I have also seen the cards tell me info totally unrelated to the question I asked, but that was valuable info I had to know at the time all the same.

Babs
 

IndigoWonders

I also believe the cards are truthful. In the case of ambiguous cards, I would use a clarification. I know exactly what you mean by that "ha ha" face on the court cards though. That little smirk!

I also believe that sometimes there's too much uncertainty for the cards to give us a crystal clear picture. The cards work for me as a snapshot of current circumstances if my path (or someone I'm reading for) remains the same.
 

frelkins

Doesn't Indigo Rose have some beautiful Bible verse about how all secrets are revealed to those with sincere faith?

"Jeremiah 33:2-3~
This is what the LORD says, he who made the earth, the LORD who formed it and established it—the LORD is his name: 'Call to me and I will answer you and tell you great and unsearchable things you do not know.

Daniel 2:22~
He reveals deep and hidden things;
he knows what lies in darkness,
and light dwells with him.

Matthew 10:26~
...there is nothing concealed that will not be disclosed or hidden that will not be revealed."

http://www.tarotforum.net/showpost.php?p=1123308&postcount=20
 

Niti

IndigoWonders said:
I also believe the cards are truthful. In the case of ambiguous cards, I would use a clarification.
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Sometimes they are clear in their ambiguity - there are some things it is not in your best interest to know. So instead, they tell you to leave it up to your imagination, to make it go the way you want, that the future is uncertain, or that you will know when the time comes.

I am not saying the cards *lie*, but when I use them, it seems they have their own code of ethics and order to follow, and they only tell the truth as it fits in with that. It makes me wonder if some of the fuss surrounding "ethical" and "constructive" use of the tarot is necessary.

frelkins said:
Doesn't Indigo Rose have some beautiful Bible verse about how all secrets are revealed to those with sincere faith?
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In the case of those quotes, frelkins, many of us would be out in the dark with tarot! There are a lot of us with no faith in the Christian bible or the existance of a God (let alone THE God of the Christian bible) who use tarot and still seem to get results...

Further, the idea that *all* secrets are revealed to anyone (even if it's because he has strong faith) is...strange to me. I would like to see that Matthew quote in context with the rest of the passage. I hold firmly with the belief that there are some things we are not meant to know, and revealing *all* things to *some* people could be a highly dangerous game. Surely any God would know that?

(But please, for the love of all things holy, let's not turn this into a religious debate.)
 

willowfox

The cards, like the runes and I Ching do not know right from wrong they are just ways to gain unknown information, they have no concept of what people consider bad or good, what we should or should not know, these system just are. We as humans make the rules, we as humans who determine whether something is right or wrong not the cards.
 

AJ

I agree with WillowFox, what we pull from the cards comes from us, not the paper and ink before us. Someone else sitting beside you reading the same cards might not find them ambiguous at all and vice versa. The cards are not sentient.
 

Briar Rose

I am the type of person that believes that everything in my path is my business.

But sometimes, like what other's say, the cards do tell you you don't need to know at this time.

I am not one for mysteries.
 

SunChariot

In a sense, I guess this is a bit of a philosophical discussion. It depends a bit on where you think the answers to your questions come from and that is something that there are many theories on but that no one can prove.

To me, yes the cards are just cardboard and ink. But the answers, to me, come from my higher powers (call that G-d, angels...) They are the ones who send the right cards at the right time and place to give you the answers you seek. So while I agree completely that the cards are not sentient, I believe that the answers are sent to us by sentient beings. They are there to answer if you ask, but yes there are some things we just are not meant to know right now. And yes they have their own code of ethics, not the cards themselves but those who ensure we get the right cards that give us the answers that we are meant to have.

The way I see it if two people who thought and read differently asked the same question, and the answer not meant to be known, they would each receive the message in whatever format would make them see that it was not in their best interest to know. It's my opinion that we don't all get the same cards in answer to the same question. We each get the cards that will give us the accurate answer according to the way we think and read.

Just my feelings on it,

Babs
 
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