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GoddessArtemis
02-04-2008, 06:47
I received an astrology update in my email (see below), and I have a question about the effects of Pluto in one's chart. Basically, since last night, an issue that I thought I'd let go of is haunting my thoughts with such force, it's overwhelming. This was a situation where someone took great advantage of me, to the point where it was really painful to me/my life. And though I've walked away from it, since last night...I keep thinking about how I want to exact some form of vengeance on this person because of their hurtful actions. I actually can't stop thinking about it, and though it's not in my personality to act on these thoughts, they're quite overpowering. :confused:

My chart is Pluto-ruled (Scorpio ascendant). So with Pluto going retrograde (per info below), could my dark thoughts have something to do with that? Or is it just me, randomly? Btw, I'm not thinking of killing them or anything that extreme, but if I acted on my thoughts, this person would be horribly embarrassed to no end in their life. I can't help it. Honest. :rolleyes:

Ever since January 25 when powerful Pluto entered Capricorn, the sign of the builder, you have been examining conditions you have left (or are leaving) and have been wondering where you want to put your energy and ambitions. What projects do you want to invest in? Where do you want your life to take you? These are changing times and you are feeling every bit of it!

Now, on April 2, Pluto turns retrograde for the first time in its new sign -- giving you the opportunity to review the blueprint of your life plan. Additionally, Mercury's entrance into Aries on April 2 (new ideas) and Venus' transit into the same sign on April 5 (a new love interest?) encourage you to be bold, not to shy away from these important new beginnings.

Now is the time to transform your life. You are embarking on a new chapter of a whole new story. The journey ahead is filled with all of the twists and turns that make a great novel and, since you are the author, this Pluto review in the midst of Aries energy offers you the opportunity to write, re-write and edit your amazing life story!

GA

Free Flight
02-04-2008, 08:57
Hi GA

Pluto going retrograde relates to last Feb or if you are very senstive back to when pluto went intto Sag back int he mid 90s.

Here is some more

So, Plutonically at least, you're still sorting through a little something from 2007...And, as Pluto stations retro it squares Mercury; Lord of Communications. Or, if you're really fancy and occulty - the Psycho-Pomp.
So, depending on your current situation in life, this is completely brilliant breakthroughs and eureka moments relating back to the phase from last Feb or even from when Pluto went into Sagg in the mid-90's...
Or, it's classic Plutonic Grudge Flashpoint, catharthis & skeletons crashing out of closets. It's not at all coy, you understand.
But it's a Dark Moon so all about wrapping the past - Sunday is a fantastic fresh start vibe with the New Moon in action-Aries.

best and most profound insights re the past 14 months or 14 years! Take a few moments out to think
in terms of these cycles.

Big thing du jour is to be ready and prepped to elegantly slough off old skins not because circumstances compel you to this is all so internal. Insight after insight after insight and perhaps prompted by a stray comment here or a flash of nostalgia there.

On the outside, it ought to be relatively sedate in most cases. But beneath our ever-polite and composed veneers (Moon is still in Aquarius) resolve is firming and big shifts are occurring. My fave metaphor for Pluto stations is the Glacier on a volcano - it happens! In nature!

Beneath frozen streams of ice run rivers of molten lava.

GoddessArtemis
02-04-2008, 09:32
Thank you, Free Flight. I honestly can't say I completely understand all of what you wrote, but I'll re-read it till it makes some sense. :confused:

Here's some more info that I found online about Pluto going retrograde on April 2: http://www.astralis.it/horoscope.htm

I'm still not "getting" it, but I'm sure there must be some effect on my chart because of my Scorpio rising.

GA

GoddessArtemis
02-04-2008, 09:44
Oh, and P.S...my Pluto is in Libra at 104'30, in the 11th house, and is retrograde.

Since Libra is the planet of relationships/partnerships, does that mean Pluto going retro in this period will affect those? Also, my Mercury (in Aries) opposes my Pluto at 220; my Venus (in Taurus) quincunxes my Pluto at 023, my Jupiter (in Capricorn) squares my Pluto at 349, my Saturn (in Gemini) trines my Pluto at 017, and my Neptune (in Sagittarius) sextiles my Pluto at 411. That's a LOT of Plutonian activity, isn't it?

Am I confusing myself here? What am I talking about...? :laugh: Am I worrying too much?

GA

star-lover
02-04-2008, 10:07
i think pluto works with your subconscious more and is not a planet to think of in day to day terms with stuff

i would equate mars more with day to day emotions, revenge that kind of thing

balenciaga
02-04-2008, 22:09
Sunday is a fantastic fresh start vibe with the New Moon in action-Aries.


Also, one might want to note that Mercury enters Aries today, 4/2, until 4/17. I suppose good advice would be think before speaking, esp. what one dredges up with the help of Pluto/retro.:)

Barbaras Ahajusts
02-04-2008, 23:47
i think pluto works with your subconscious more and is not a planet to think of in day to day terms with stuff
i would equate mars more with day to day emotions, revenge that kind of thing

Also, one might want to note that Mercury enters Aries today, 4/2, until 4/17. I suppose good advice would be think before speaking, esp. what one dredges up with the help of Pluto/retro

All these things intertwine on some level. Yesterday I saw verbal missles go off and I wasn't in a bomb shelter being smart. I was on the battlefield. I knew April would be rough, but between Pluto in my 5th house and Mars in my 12 house, I don't just need duct tape, I need a plaster cast all over my body to keep me completely still so I can THINK not ACT! I need to think like I am still in the cocoon developing, not the beautiful & talented butterfly enjoying life.


Barbara

dadsnook2000
03-04-2008, 01:48
We have to remember just what the Pluto retro cycle is focused upon. Being very far away and slow moving, we are used to seeing it's slow progress back and forth thru the signs. What is often overlooked with the outer planets and their retro motions, is that these backward-moving period occur between the "trines" -- when the Sun exceeds a trine aspect to a outer planet and approaches the opposition point. Each of the outer planets has its own retro arc relative to the Sun, but all reach an opposition to the Sun during their retro period.

PLUTO opposite the SUN is a focus on achieving independence. On June 21st the Sun will oppose Pluto at 29 Cancer-Capricorn. Moon will conjoin Pluto early that day. Venus will only be 4 degrees ahead of the Sun. So, we have Sun-Venus opposite Moon-Pluto; a day when our heart-strings will be twanged, when we find others so exciting, a time when someone fateful may walk into our lives. All of this is, of course, the opposite of just the SUN-PLUTO opposition. So independence is sort of "up in the air" as we might give it away on an impulse. Just some thoughts. Dave

Barbaras Ahajusts
03-04-2008, 03:43
...What is often overlooked with the outer planets and their retro motions, is that these backward-moving period occur between the "trines" -- when the Sun exceeds a trine aspect to a outer planet and approaches the opposition point. Each of the outer planets has its own retro arc relative to the Sun, but all reach an opposition to the Sun during their retro period... Dave

Hey Dave, I understood all of your paragraph except the above. Can you bring it down for me?

Thanks so much,

Barbara Ann

GoddessArtemis
03-04-2008, 04:23
Also, one might want to note that Mercury enters Aries today, 4/2, until 4/17. I suppose good advice would be think before speaking, esp. what one dredges up with the help of Pluto/retro.:)I have Mercury in Aries, so I imagine I'll feel more free to express myself. Not that anything much ever stops me :laugh: but I might actually be able to express anger, too..instead of putting a lid on it so often that I want to implode.

Still, I'm not quite understanding this Pluto retro thing...I believe I need it to be in quite lay person terms...help?

GA

dadsnook2000
03-04-2008, 04:54
Duck soup simple, as my grandmother used to say.

On June 21, 2008 we on the Earth will have the Sun on one side of us, and Pluto on the other side of us -- "we" being in the middle. The Sun will have Venus very close to it. Pluto will have the Moon very close to it in terms of zodiac alignment. This gives an opposition between Sun-Venus and Pluto-Moon.

By itself, Sun opposite Pluto suggests striving for independence -- the Sun being will and self-hood, Pluto being change and control.

When we add Venus and Moon into the mix we get a whole different meaning. This is much like baking; flour and water gives you wet flour. Adding an egg and some yeast may give you bread. Those who would be astrologers have to understand this. Dave

GoddessArtemis
03-04-2008, 04:57
Duck soup simple, as my grandmother used to say.

On June 21, 2008 we on the Earth will have the Sun on one side of us, and Pluto on the other side of us -- "we" being in the middle. The Sun will have Venus very close to it. Pluto will have the Moon very close to it in terms of zodiac alignment. This gives an opposition between Sun-Venus and Pluto-Moon.

By itself, Sun opposite Pluto suggests striving for independence -- the Sun being will and self-hood, Pluto being change and control.

When we add Venus and Moon into the mix we get a whole different meaning. This is much like baking; flour and water gives you wet flour. Adding an egg and some yeast may give you bread. Those who would be astrologers have to understand this. DaveI don't like duck soup :), but this simplified version helped a lot. Then if we don't even have much of a cake mix until June, why are a lot of astrology sites hyping up the Pluto retro starting today? We're only in April.

GA

dadsnook2000
03-04-2008, 06:22
There is a big difference between a "natal Pluto" and a "transiting Pluto."

NATAL PLUTO in your birth chart is a "whole life" influence, more of an influence for some, less or none of an influence for others. It all depends if Pluto is close to an angle in your chart or if Pluto is in an aspect pattern with one or more planets or planets/angles. Natal Pluto, if retrograde, is said to mean that one has a life time of learning about the ramifications of using power or forcing change upon oneself and others. However, this is enhanced or diminished if there are aspects to other planets or no aspects to other planets.

Also, if we view Pluto through a "progressed" chart such as a secondary progression format, we might see Pluto being acted upon by other faster- moving planets over the years. This would suggest a form of "personal growth" in terms of how we gradually modified our Pluto energy over the years of our life.

TRANSITING PLUTO is up in the sky now. It can "do" two things:
A) Transiting Pluto can impact the world as a whole, as it will on the date I had mentioned earlier, June 21, 2008 when it opposes the Sun, and as it will on any other day it has aspects with other planets. When an aspect day happens, the position of Pluto within the world's sky where it is on an angle (Ascendant, MC, Descendant or IC) will show where its engergies will be seen. Or, if Pluto on that day contacts a sensitive point in a national chart, then that nation will be affected.

B) Transiting Pluto can impact an individual when its position makes a conjunction or other aspect with one of your natal planets. You would then take the meaning of that planet, as your are used to expressing it, and modify it as if Pluto were acting upon it. Pluto conjuncting Mercruy, as an example, might show up as a hypertense period, when badly upsetting news arrived, etc.

Hope this helps. Dave

GoddessArtemis
03-04-2008, 06:47
Hope this helps. DaveIt does help, Dave. Thank you.

GA

balenciaga
04-04-2008, 00:53
might show up as a hypertense period, when badly upsetting news arrived, etc.


GA,
So watch for explosions rather than implosions:)

dadsnook2000
04-04-2008, 04:44
Transits tend to show up as "external" events, people, developments, etc., rather than internal or self-actuated events, actions and desires. This is not always true, but mostly seems to be.

Note that these "external" events may have actually been propagated by ourselves through our attitudes or actions or words -- then, someone comes along and responds to the "role" that we put out there to be fulfilled. Right now, I have Pluto going over my 7th angle. It will back off a bit, but by years end it will be back and active for several years. I may go find a Pluto cave to hide in until it passes. Dave

GoddessArtemis
04-04-2008, 05:21
GA,
So watch for explosions rather than implosions:)Hehe. :laugh: I can only hope that only those deserving of the explosions will come around to experience it. I have already shown a more "fiery" side of me earlier this week, and I was worried that it would backfire..but it actually didn't, surprisingly. It was completely well-deserved by the other person, as they crossed lines...but you just never know how someone might react. It felt good to direct the aggression where it's meant to go, instead of letting it eat me up inside, you know? I wouldn't mind keeping that up. ;)

GA

prudence
04-04-2008, 05:58
hmmm, I have pluto, retrograde in my natal chart, in 7th house, almost right on top of my DC....at 26 degrees virgo, I wonder what is in store for me.... I guess I will wait and see.

balenciaga
04-04-2008, 23:32
hmmm, I have pluto, retrograde in my natal chart, in 7th house, almost right on top of my DC....at 26 degrees virgo, I wonder what is in store for me.... I guess I will wait and see.

Wouldn't this then mean that you might analyze your relationships with others - 7th house of partners, and pluto retro causing one to become suspicious of others' motives. I have read what Dave posted about pluto and society/exterior, but I have also read that Pluto retro is a trip into the interior self - internal purging of all that does not work. Mix that with 7th house here and if I was your partner I would watch for flying axes!:)

dadsnook2000
05-04-2008, 02:45
The mythic Pluto story involves his abduction of a young lady, Persephone, who spends part of her year in Hades, part of the year with her mother, Demeter, when the earth blooms, plants grow and all is well. During her time underground the earth is barren and cold. With the intermixing of myth, Greek and Roman god-stories, Pluto takes on double meanings as well.

Power and control, rebirth and regeneration, tearing down so as to start over, hidden forces, non-reversible action, cataclysm and destructiveness, secretiveness (unlike Neptune's deceitful, illusionary, distractive approach) with malice, and obsession.

Well those of us with Pluto on the 7th cusp/angle might analyze what is/will happen(ing), "analysis" is not the operative Pluto-word. Total change leading to a difference in who/how we relate to others is the theme. Scary, isn't it? Dave

prudence
05-04-2008, 04:28
Wouldn't this then mean that you might analyze your relationships with others - 7th house of partners, and pluto retro causing one to become suspicious of others' motives. I have read what Dave posted about pluto and society/exterior, but I have also read that Pluto retro is a trip into the interior self - internal purging of all that does not work. Mix that with 7th house here and if I was your partner I would watch for flying axes!:)
Thanks for this, Balenciaga.....and thanks Dadsnook for helping Balenciaga, which in turn helped me as well. :)

None of it sounds like a whole lot of fun, but it does sound familiar in that I have been growing very suspicious of the motives of some people in my life. I am struggling with how to relate to those people and how to establish certain (extremely important to me) boundaries. I do feel like if things go on with me saying nothing that I will eventually blow up and say it in a harsh way, which I seriously would like to avoid. Thankfully though, this is not about my spouse! Just friends who have no clue about certain boundaries, and it really is up to me to establish them, since they do not know they are trodding in such territory.

ETA: but on the other hand, is this energy making me a bit too nitpicky as far as my expectations are concerned? I do feel like I am noticing every little thing that certain people do and feel anger about those little things....yes, and a bit of obsessing is happening when I sit and ruminate on what a friend did or said that I took offense to....hmmm, I want to pick my battles correctly and not go for each and every one that seems to appear.

balenciaga
06-04-2008, 00:44
Total change leading to a difference in who/how we relate to others is the theme. Scary, isn't it?

Thank you, Dave, and yes, it is indeed scary, albeit necessary at times.:)

balenciaga
06-04-2008, 00:48
is this energy making me a bit too nitpicky

Prudence, could be, but this also sounds moon-related:) Also, there are at least three planets in Aries; by Sunday, 4/6, there will be four. Aries can make us hot-headed, quick on the draw. You might want to consider Aries and how it affects your placements.

prudence
09-04-2008, 03:33
Prudence, could be, but this also sounds moon-related:) Also, there are at least three planets in Aries; by Sunday, 4/6, there will be four. Aries can make us hot-headed, quick on the draw. You might want to consider Aries and how it affects your placements.
yeah, that sounds about right...my natal Mars is in the first house, in Aries, so I would expect it to affect me on some level. Although all I have been feeling for the last few days is a great burst of optimism.

Thanks for replying to my posts, Balenciaga, it feels good to know that I am not actually invisible :D :)

Sophie
09-04-2008, 05:14
I have just realised that Pluto Retrograde is going through my 8th house, and come June, it will be squaring exactly my natal Saturn (Pisces 29 56') and later will come within 4 degrees of my natal Chiron.


Oh joy. Do I order the funeral already? Is there ANYTHING positive to say about this transit?!

Sophie
09-04-2008, 20:42
I have just realised that Pluto Retrograde is going through my 8th house, and come June, it will be squaring exactly my natal Saturn (Pisces 29 56') and later will come within 4 degrees of my natal Chiron.


Oh joy. Do I order the funeral already? Is there ANYTHING positive to say about this transit?!Anybody wants to comment, please? How can I best make use of this difficult transit? It's been going on for a while and due to go on until mid-late 2009, I would appreciate some help. Some websites mention death of father or total collapse of life structure, and that really freaked me out.

prudence
10-04-2008, 05:33
Anybody wants to comment, please? How can I best make use of this difficult transit? It's been going on for a while and due to go on until mid-late 2009, I would appreciate some help. Some websites mention death of father or total collapse of life structure, and that really freaked me out.
(((Fudu))) If I had the knowledge I'd gladly share it with you. Other than that, all I can say is don't worry. (easier said than done)

Sophie
10-04-2008, 06:10
Thanks, pru! I'm still hoping someone will answer, because I am really worried. Last time some crappy transit happened in my life, some not very great things happened. But I also know that studying astrology is supposed to be empowering, so I hope to be empowered and give myself a chance to learn and act in a positive, life-affirming way, avoiding the worst of the transit by using whatever opportunities it does offer.

For reminder: it is Pluto transitting my 8th house, squaring my natal Saturn and coming close to squaring my natal Chiron. My natal Saturn is involved in a Grand Trine in Water, btw.


This is supposed to be a learning forum, but it's difficult to learn when one's questions aren't answered. Perhaps the question has complex ramifications I can't see, or perhaps there aren't enough people who know a lot about astrology on AT. I feel very intimidated on astrology forums, so I really don't know where to go in order to learn and interact with others.

balenciaga
10-04-2008, 13:03
Fudugazi,
I only dabble in astrology out of interest, but I did take the liberty to look some basics up that you mentioned:
Pluto transiting 8th H: very psychic, extra-sensory, the metaphysical
Pluto sq natal saturn: you are your own worst enemy - you think you do not have the talent (and here is where I would add in the psychic ability - you work against it, doubt it). You feel the universe is working against you, but you are projecting your own inner doubt. have faith in yourself. You are the one responsible for holding yourself back. The restrictions you feel that are coming from the universe are of your own making.
You might want to check www.astrologyweekly.com for more info.:)

Sophie
10-04-2008, 20:34
Fudugazi,
I only dabble in astrology out of interest, but I did take the liberty to look some basics up that you mentioned:
Pluto transiting 8th H: very psychic, extra-sensory, the metaphysical
Pluto sq natal saturn: you are your own worst enemy - you think you do not have the talent (and here is where I would add in the psychic ability - you work against it, doubt it). You feel the universe is working against you, but you are projecting your own inner doubt. have faith in yourself. You are the one responsible for holding yourself back. The restrictions you feel that are coming from the universe are of your own making.
You might want to check www.astrologyweekly.com for more info.:)Thanks, Balenciaga! Funny, but in the past year or so, my psychic sense has shot up - it was always fairly well developed, but now it's clamouring for attention. I don't tend to doubt an experience as it happens, or shortly after - but then later, the old worry-machine starts turning and churning out doubts. Also, I don't regularly practice as much as I ought, and I know that Saturn is also about developing regular habits, a structured practice.