Choosing decks to please clients

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 26 Mar 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Lee	26 Mar 2002
Hi, everyone -- I don't do a lot of reading for others, but I've been thinking lately about what decks one would choose if one's primary concern was avoiding difficulty and/or offense for the people you're reading for. I've come up with the following considerations: A scary Devil card, or simply the card title "Devil." Even some people who are not necessarily religious Christians get uneasy when they see a card like this. This would mean no Rider-Waite or most Rider-Waite clones. Detailed nudity. I'm differentiating here between non-detailed nudity and detailed nudity. I can't imagine anyone objecting to the non-detailed nudity on the Rider-Waite, but I'm afraid people might giggle at detailed nudity, which might not be helpful during a reading. This one would mean no Robin Wood, Cosmic Tribe, Pythagorean, Rohrig, Motherpeace (there must be others that I can't think of now). A scary Death card, or simply the title "Death." No matter how you try to prepare people, they may still be terrified if this card comes up in the "Outcome" position. Violence. No overly bloody decks, like Matthews Arthurian (Wounded King/Hanged Man card). Extreme negativity. This could be a real downer in a reading. No Cosmic Tarot, Tarot of the Imagination. Non-illustrated minors. This isn't an offense issue, just that it seems like an illustrated deck would be more enjoyable for the client, because they can look at the picture and participate to a degree that they can't if it's just four cups or something. Unfortunately, this doesn't leave a lot of possibilites. Connolly is one; but I don't care for the Connolly, I don't like those cards where she changed the symbolism in ways that I don't find nearly as interesting as the originals. The Vision Quest deck is one that might work. Now, I'm not saying that these considerations should necessarily be taken seriously. But I do find myself with a perhaps irrational desire to please and reluctance to offend the person being read for. I'd appreciate anyone's thoughts. :) -- Lee

kayne	26 Mar 2002
That list is well construsted but leaves for a pretty bland collection of decks... Perhaps the Osho Zen (anything but bland!) could work, although it differs greatly from traditional decks and, like it has been said in another thread, is a better deck for personal exploration than reading for others... I really like the idea that when reading for others you could present a range of different decks to them and they could choose a deck that they feel comfortable with. You could even include a little personal ratings system with each deck (eg. 5 stars for Graphic Nudity, 1 star for Violence etc) to help the quarent choose a deck. I'm sure others with more decks could provide more ideas, Lee...

Umbrae	26 Mar 2002
If you read for others, your primary responsibility is to that person Your post is a good issue. Right on target. When a sitter appears nervous, blue haired, fidgets right off the get-go, I know it is time to use ‘The Old English’ deck. It is not scary, and the pastels put them at ease. It may be a difficult deck to use when you first start out; because the meanings are not plastered all over it like a RW. However, it is a truly GREAT deck for accurate readings with non-confrontational artwork.

Kiama	26 Mar 2002
I always let the querent choose the deck themselves. Even if they are my best friend, I can never know truly what they think about each deck, and how they feel about certain cards. Although for children under the age of 11 I would no even let them see the Manara Erotic Tarot! And for children under 10 I would not let them see the Cosmic Tribe, unless they were my future kids, cuz my future kids are gonna be perfectly okay with all types of bodies: Naked or not! You're choice about Robin Wood containing detailed nudity I'm not so sure about. By detailed, I thought you meant really realistic painting, or photographic, like the Manara, or Cosmic Tribe. The Robin Wood's catoon quality makes the slight nudity in the Lovers and Star and Devil less realistic, and thus less offensive. My little 10 year old sister uses this deck alot, and never flinched at the nudity, which she did for the Cosmic Tribe! Kiama

Thirteen	26 Mar 2002
Good observations. Of course, you've picked a pretty timid hypothetical querent here. I'm not saying they don't exist, but I'm not sure your hypothetical querent--scared by death/devil cards, offended by nudity, etc, would want a reading at all ;) When I go to parties and read, for example, I know the person who threw the party, and I've got an idea of the kind of folk he/she might invite to a party, so I know what might offend them or not. In most cases, I can get away with most decks--excluding the really extreme ones. That said, there are decks out there that are just fine for very timid folk. Like Tarot of the Moon Garden which I gave to a woman who was paranoid of sword cards. She loved this deck. It's all unicorns and dragonflies, pretty and fun and very inoffensive. The Dragon Deck is also a good one. It's less scary in its death and devil cards because they're dragons, not people, and so people see them more as symbols than as omens . And a lot of folk just love dragons. Then there's the Mandala Astrological Tarot--square cards, bright colors, and all "symbols" no people. The Death card has a rainbow in it--though I probably wouldn't use it for anyone with real Christian leanings as the Devil card is still pretty scary. Mythic tarot--a very nice deck, all Greek Mythology. That helps--as with the dragon, it puts a degree of seperation from the Death card (Devil is Pan)--people see it as a "myth" not as "death." Greenwood--all swirly pastels; Death is an animal skull, no Devil. That would seem to be the key, by the way. You can escape nudity and violence pretty easy. Escaping Death/Devil cards is harder. Death especially, as it's pretty common to 90% of the decks. The question is, how scary is the "death" card. A skeleton with the scythe scares folk, but something symbolic, like an animal skeleton or a phoenix (Renissance tarot) is not so bad. In the end, I think you can trust your instincts. Those who are too afraid, won't want a reading. I usually pick the deck for the querent, by the way, whichever one feels like "their" deck. I'm usually pretty spot on, too. One of the best parts of a reading is to lay out those cards and have your querent start to "ooo" and "ahhh" over the cards. Let's face it, we readers love to show off our decks :)

Phoenix	26 Mar 2002
What about the Gendron Tarot?

truthsayer	27 Mar 2002
i don't know if i can help but this is what i generally use for those situations: 1. what about the tarot of the saints for the scarey devil card problem? it shows st. margaret inside the mouth of a dragon but she looks pretty calm. vision quest is good, too. 2. no detailed nudity--whimsical tarot, halloween, sacred rose, legend arthurian, tarot of the saints, vision quest, mary hanson roberts deck, tarot of a moon garden. 3. no scarey death card--tarot of the saints-st. stephen stands on some rocks with a skull under his feet--looking holy, vision quest, moon garden, tarot of the old path 4. postive images: ancestral path maybe?, tarot of the saints, vision quest, songs for the journey home 5. illustrated minors--all of the above, nigel jackson, tarot of the cloisters, sacred rose, hansom roberts, universal tarot, moon garden there's probably more but that's all i can think of now. too bad you don't like the connally b/c it seems to fit all your criterion best. the mythic is pretty safe, too. i really like the matt myers art nouveau deck but i can't remember if it meets all your requirements.

blumoon	27 Mar 2002
i think the hudes tarot deck would be good for people who arent religous or if they dont like nudity...the death card does have a skeleton but it also has a butterfly, the only nasty-ish card would be the 5 of swords...the tower is like the usual tower with lightening and a couple of figures in shadow being thrown out but i like it better than the rider waite, the dark blue background is quite beautiful... :)

MeeWah	27 Mar 2002
Interesting topic & one that merits attention. I have never had a client choose a deck. I choose the deck either prior to the reading or I choose at the time of the session, relying on impressions of the client. I have not received any negative feedback on any of the decks; however, I do not know how accurate that is as most do not seem to pay much attention to the cards. The least "offensive" deck I have is Hanson-Roberts. I use it for younger clients & a few others. Also The Chinese Tarot, although its version of The Hanged Man as The Hanging Ghost may give one pause.

Pedeka	27 Mar 2002
Great question! I put alot of thought into what deck I use for who. I have decks with graphic nudity, but I keep those at home and only use them with people that I know wont be offended. I have done many reading sessions for charity fund raisers. Some people manage to get offended just because I am there doing what I am doing, and a dark or offensive deck would just be worse. When I am in a position to be a "spokesman" for tarot readers like that, a bright deck like Hanson Roberts or Osho Zen seems to help make it more acceptable to some people. As for Death and the Devil, I don't worry about it unless they come up in a reading or the querant expresses a concern about them. Then I just explain that the cards dont represent Death and the Devil actually, but concepts like endings and temptation, And I for one, can think of a few situations where Death showing up would be for the best all around! P.S. I also have a friend that, when she has me read for people she knows, insists that I use the Adrian Deck, cause she likes to play "find the big green penis". So whats good for some people isnt good for others!

Kiama	28 Mar 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Pedeka P.S. I also have a friend that, when she has me read for people she knows, insists that I use the Adrian Deck, cause she likes to play "find the big green penis". So whats good for some people isnt good for others! I love this deck, purely for that reason! I mean, you're doing a reading for somebody, then suddenly you notice this huge penis super-imposed on one of the cards! And you're like, "What?!" I believe there's also a huge nipple somewhere.... I reckon your friend would LOVE the Cosmic Tribe deck. Then, she can hunt for penises to her heart's content... www.steevee.com Enjoy! PS- Check out the Knight of Swords first! Kiama

Logiatrix	28 Mar 2002
thanx, lee, for posting this topic! i went through about a year's worth of convulsive deck purchases, in search of the perfect "reading" deck that would please everyone. i wanted a multi-cultural, equally gendered, non-violent, religiously neutral AND attractive deck of tarot cards! i tried voyager, osho, gill, medicine woman, light and shadow, robin wood, hanson-roberts, nigel jackson....bleh. that's how collections start! the problem was that i couldn't ever get comfortable with any of these decks, so my readings were mediocre at best. the querent might have been pleased with the pretty, client-friendly cards, but my own reading ability was seriously impinged. a major reason for this difficulty is that i am still a novice. my number-one deck, my "comfort" deck is my visconti deck. while it pretty much breaks all the requirements of the previous list, it is the deck that i read very well. i don't know why this deck works for me, and i've given up trying to accomodate the client in the deck department. i find that i serve my querent better when i read better and feel comfortable with my deck.

truthsayer	30 Mar 2002
i agree w/ you taz. while it's good for querents to be comfy w/ a deck, never sacrifice a quality reading for a deck you can't relate to very well. i have decks i just adore but i can't do a quality reading for a querent w/ them yet. i can do quality readings w/ the rws, art nouveau, zerner farber, universal waite, and mary hanson roberts. fortunately, most querents are comfy w/ these decks. i love the rohrig but it's such an intense deck that trying to convey what the deck says to me can be too overwhelming. i think querents will like the connally deck but i have to get accustomed w/ the christian symbolism and pollyanna outlook. have you ever heard the song,"garden party"? the moral of the song is "you can't please everyone so you might as well please yourself!"

Lion-O	30 Mar 2002
Maybe I'm being too blunt which could very well be due to the fact that I don't do readings for other people at all. Still I can't help thinking 'why do a Tarot session at all?'. If the people you are doing a reading for are so sensitive to nudity, nature (death, hanged man) and "religious meanings" (devil) then I really wonder why they would want to join a Tarot reading at all. After all; if you take the devil card that seriously you should be doing exactly the same for the whole reading itself; after all; most religions don't particulary like this idea of 'self meditation' or 'predicting the future'. Personally I'd take some time to prepare the people you're reading for and make sure they understand what a Tarot deck is, what it usually looks like and what might/could happen during a reading. Then it would be up to the reader to decide if the people can mentally take it and are open to your story or....

Lee	30 Mar 2002
I really appreciate everyone's observations. On thinking about what you've all written, I basically agree with those who say we should read with the decks we like and not worry too much about the querent's likes or dislikes. Thirteen makes a good point that if someone was that timid, they probably wouldn't be asking for a reading in the first place. I also found very interesting MeeWah's comment that most people don't notice the cards that much anyway. This is something I wouldn't know, since I don't read very much for others (I'd like to but don't get much opportunity). This gave me much food for thought. On thinking about it, I can see how this could be; the cards say loads of stuff to us, but to someone who's not familiar with them, it does seem more likely that they pay more attention to what the reader is saying rather then staring at the cards themselves. But I do have to tell you all something -- I bought a deck today which not only fits most of the criteria I mentioned in my first post, but is a great deck besides -- and not a goody-goody deck either, but one with some bite to it. It's the new Victoria Regina Tarot. I'm so excited about it, I guess I should start a new thread about it. -- Lee

Jimilyn	30 Mar 2002
Oh, Lee! I've heard about the Victoria Regina deck. I simply gotta, gotta, gotta have it! I'm soooooo envious. Jimilyn

Lee	12 Apr 2002
BUMP :)

AutumnMoonfire	17 Jun 2002
If you are reading for a woman you could use the Goddess Tarot, mimimal nudity(nothing showing) no "scary" button pushing cards. You might get a rather plain vanilla reading, but I doubt the "little old lady" client will get offended. I have looked at The Herbal Tarot. It is more gender balanced but the images are not in your face with violence or nudity... hmmm

Kellinator	17 Jun 2002
Phoenix mentioned the Gendron. Just about everyone I've ever shown this deck to has fallen in love with it (one of my favorite stores now stocks it because I brought mine in to show it off!). It really does, in my opinion, come the closest of a deck I know of of meeting these requirements without being boring. There's only one really sad card, in my opinion: the 9 of Swords. Death is Transition and the Devil is the Deceiver.

The Choosing decks to please clients thread was originally posted on 26 Mar 2002 in the Tarot Decks board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Tarot Decks, or read more archived threads.