"Light" vs "dark" decks

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 23 May 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.

falconwing	23 May 2003
Greetings @ll, when I browse thru' all those various sites showing different tarot-decks I always "detect" myself judging some of them to be of the "fluffy-bunny-type" (Hedera has put it so nicely...she said "whimsical") and others to be of a darker flavour. ...I'd like to know, which decks you guys think are of the "light" type and which belong to a rather "darker" category. And which decks do you think are rather "balanced"? To give an example: for me the Fey-tarot and the MerryDay-Tarot are quite "light"...I mean, there are no "nasty" pics in there, almost everything is friendly and "nice". The comments are also of this flavour. Darker decks would comprise the "Shadow Tarot" (of course), the Templar-Tarot...but these are just my 2 cents worth.... Don't get me wrong...I like and respect both "categories", but I will use them depending on the situation.... Any comments? Falconwing

Hedera	23 May 2003
Great idea, Falconwing! I mentioned the Phantasmagoric Theatre on another thread as a deck that to me has a rather 'dark' feel. Apart from all the bound, masked (rubber with nozzles, etc) and blindfolded people, I think it has to do with images like the Empress. I mean - warm and nurturing? :D I guess I have some peculiar ideas about what makes a dark deck. The Fey, for instance; maybe not dark, but whenever I use it, it's sort of stern and strict, very no-nonsense. Nothing whimsical about my Fey! And the 10 of swords is pretty scary, too....

Macavity	23 May 2003
I suppose the label "fluffy bunny" can be a bit off-putting, especially for the guys? MY concept of that has, thus far, prevented me getting e.g. the Castelli "Art Nouveau", the Gendron and many decks of the Celtic/Pagan Ilk, which I might just like? ;) Aside: Now I've discovered the "Tarot 2000 Pagan", things might change - though that can hardly be deemed a "light" deck? I suspect one should always investigate decks that have a reputation for being "dark". I held off buying the wonderful Haindl Tarot, for a long time, based on that one word reputation - And To my regret. It's actually very "colourful", in an understated way. I suppose though, it has it's share of dark imagery. I wouldn't like to be pursued by whatever it is following that Chariot. :D In a similar way, my Crowley-Thoth has lightened on me, considerably... with familiarity. And, I remain hopeful that one day my poor old Bosch Tarot will, as well! :laugh: Macavity

firemaiden	23 May 2003
Macavity, so you don't like fluffy, eh? a cat like you? Don't tell me they shave your cat fur! I just bought a new fluffy bunny deck, boy, oh boy, is this FLUFFY, and BUNNY. Can you say : flower fairies? I love it! :)

falconwing	23 May 2003
Huhu Firemaiden, are you talking about the Spirit of the Flowers Deck (the new one)?? Does it have fur at the card-borders *g? Falconwing

WolfSpirit	23 May 2003
When I look at my deck collection...I would say I don't go for the darker decks. They don't appeal to me, I think they don't really frighten me but they seem to make things more dramatic than they actually are, I am just not the person for that. Don't know about those flower fairies but I have Froud's Fairies and I would not call that fluffy-bunny at all, I find it an honest and balanced deck that shows a lot of man's (and fairy's) darker sides. The Tarot of the Spirit I also consider balanced, both in artwork as in card meaning. A deck like the halloween looks all funny but I get honest readings with it, so I would not call that sweet either. The Swedish witch I would call light I think - I see fun in every card, there are always funny little things in it that make you smile. But a deck like the legend Arthurian...beautiful pictures, but I don't want to use it because it gives me a feeling of melancholy. And I see it more as a storybook than having any relation to my own life.

Macavity	23 May 2003
Well, there ARE the cat decks - which are (ahem) obviously an exception to the (any) rule! And, as I can testify in "pilling" a cat this evening, there was nothing "fluffy bunny" as SHE gently (and in slow motion) slid a claw through flesh. It was the look of grim determination - Ours both! :laugh: I'd offer the Old English as "cute, but neutral"... Macavity P.S. Now, back to the thread ;)

falconwing	23 May 2003
WolfSpirit: I also have Frouds' Faery Oracle and I agree with you, this is a balanced set! As for Tarot-decks I would say all those RWS-clones are quite balanced, same applies for more ceremonnial/magickal decks like Golden Dawn, Alchemical and Pythagorean Tarot. What would you guys say about the Wheel of Change? I'd rather put it in the "fluffy category", but I am not sure yet...somehow I feel uneasy with this deck. FW

firemaiden	23 May 2003
Quote: Originally posted by falconwing Huhu Firemaiden, are you talking about the Spirit of the Flowers Deck (the new one)?? Does it have fur at the card-borders *g? Oh yes indeedy, Falconwing, it has fur and duckling down! I could swear each card is perfumed with the fragrance of its flower too! mmmmm ... luscious. Its been making me feel good all day!

Hedera	23 May 2003
Oooh, Firemaiden, I've been wanting that one for ages (well... weeks, anyway. Which is a loooong time when you're a die-hard taroholic like me!). Did you just walk into a bookstore in Berlin and buy it, or did you order it online? I've been avoiding shops that sell tarot decks lately, my budget has been a bit... well.... stretched, lately....:D Nou *that* would certainly qualify as a whimsical deck, even in my book!

firemaiden	23 May 2003
Aha, Hedera, well, I ordered it from Alida store along with the Vikings Deck (which is wonderful!). I had been wanting the spirit of flowers for a year! The images don't seem too have much to do with tarot, but they are so pretty I don't care.... I know the meanings now anyway, they might as well just be unillustrated pips, except they have pretty pictures on them :D

Hedera	23 May 2003
Ah, Alidastore, yes..... Most of the decks I looked at there seemed rather expensive, and the shipping mysteriously high. I guess Spirit of Flowers should be in the stores here pretty soon? Or else I'll wait a while and order it from Amazon, with their discount it's usually slightly cheaper than buying it here, and it supports aeclectic (I make sure to only go to Amazon through the link here, because I usually end up ordering something.....;) ) Now, the Viking deck sounds interesting. Would you say it is a dark deck? Or Fluffy Bunny Vikings? (mind you, Buffy fans can have a different reaction to bunnies.....)

firemaiden	23 May 2003
No, the Vikings is nice and dark. Deep and rich. It is wonderful. I just posted my little "mini-review". (I also put up a little mini-review of the Flower Fairies)

firemaiden	23 May 2003
Quote: Originally posted by firemaiden No, the Vikings is nice and dark. Deep and rich. It is wonderful. I just posted my little "mini-review". (I also put up a little mini-review of the Flower Fairies) Ack! I spoke too soon! There is indeed a fluffy little bunny, as in an actual rabbit, at the feet of the Queen of Pentacles. Well, that's okay, the ferocious horse-monster, spike-helmeted warrior and mamoth-thigh-bone club of the six of wands make up for it.

falconwing	24 May 2003
*hihihi...quite funny...I also ordered the two of them at Alida-store some days ago....it seems there we have two representatives of the "light" vs "dark" fraction....well, ok, except for the bunny-majesty itself....but hey, a bunny really _has_ to be portrayed in a Vikings deck.... Falconwing

xouroboros	24 May 2003
Quote: Originally posted by WolfSpirit But a deck like the legend Arthurian...beautiful pictures, but I don't want to use it because it gives me a feeling of melancholy. And I see it more as a storybook than having any relation to my own life. This Tarot has been my main reading deck for 4 to 5 years and I never really thought of it as melancholy... ...though some images come to mind as melancholic...such as Cup 5 and Sword 4. I agree with the "storybook" connotation though,as it is founded on the Arthurian/Celtic Cycles. I found it a fine deck to read with and would received many comments on its "beauty". The Moon,the High Priestess,and the Queen of Cups are probably my favorites in the deck. It is now being ursurped by the Morgan-Greer for me,which is a "darker" deck,imho...as example of the Devil card. I am drawn to richly colored,darker Earth-toned deck as of late such as the M/G. The Dakini Oracle is,for the most part,of a darker nature also,imho,though I rarely use it for a reading unless going into the deeper reaches of the Psyche. ...as for "fluffy-bunny" decks ...weeelllll ...hmm...can't say as I have any of those ...do the make a "Dark-side" fluffy-bunny Tarot?:D

truthsayer	25 May 2003
Quote: Originally posted by falconwing What would you guys say about the Wheel of Change? I'd rather put it in the "fluffy category", but I am not sure yet...somehow I feel uneasy with this deck. FW i don't consider the wheel of change superficial at all. alexandra ganetti took 10 years doing this one. all you have to do is read about a few of the cards to realize the amount of forethought that went into this wonderful multi-cultural deck. some of the concepts in my mind are pure genius like her unique way of doing the minor arcana. it's my fave part about the deck. the term "fluffy bunny" bothers me quite a bit. have you ever had a rabbit? then you don't know how sharp those teeth are or how hard those back legs can kick. depending on the reader, any deck can be either dark or light. and so called fluffy decks can pack a punch. for me, a lot depends on the intent of the creaters. if it's done by an artist just going thru the artistic motions w/o really understanding tarot, then yes, it's probably going to be superficial. however, a deck some may consider fluffy, might have been done by someone who has studied tarot. this person or persons just might not see tarot eye to eye with mr. waite, mr. crowley and their artists. it bothers me to see any deck diminished in any way. i just love tarot. i don't prefer dark or light decks and prefer not to qualify them this way unless other words fail me. haven't any of you read the children's book, "bunnicula"? ;)

xouroboros	25 May 2003
"...it's just a bunny...wot's he gonna do...nip our bums off?" (from: Monty Python and the Holy Grail)

WolfSpirit	25 May 2003
Quote: Originally posted by truthsayer the term "fluffy bunny" bothers me quite a bit. have you ever had a rabbit? then you don't know how sharp those teeth are or how hard those back legs can kick. depending on the reader, any deck can be either dark or light. and so called fluffy decks can pack a punch. for me, a lot depends on the intent of the creaters. I agree, animals are never just cute or mean. Those cute rabbits can still defend themselves, and that mean crocodile can be a good mum defending her eggs. But about decks... I think dark decks can be superficial as well, just made dark to create a dramatic effect. The Vampire tarot comes to mind...seems to me all about effect and superficial (I apologize to those who do read with this deck - I know I couldn't) I love decks with natural or pagan themes and they are never dark but not superficial either. I don't need grinning skulls or lightning striking to get the message across. Xouroboros: I have never heard anyone feel that way about the arthurian either, but for me it just IS melancholic. For example the 5 of swords the horse coming home alone..sends shivers down my spine. But maybe the deck gets me in storytelling mode too much :laugh: I do love it though.

xouroboros	25 May 2003
Quote: Originally posted by WolfSpirit Xouroboros: I have never heard anyone feel that way about the arthurian either, but for me it just IS melancholic. For example the 5 of swords the horse coming home alone..sends shivers down my spine. But maybe the deck gets me in storytelling mode too much :laugh: I do love it though. Ah! The infamous Five of Swords. Reading of the myth of how Gawain fought the knight whose Hart was slain by Gawain's dogs;this knight had cried for mercy but Gawain,in rage refused and raised his sword to impale him. At that moment,the lady of the knight entered the hall and threw herself over her husband and pleaded for his life. Again Gawain refused and in the ensuing confusion,slew the lady instead. He had broken two solemn vows of a knight - to show mercy and not to harm an innocent. His pennance was to return to Camelot in shame with the lady's body upon the mane of his horse (indicating how his noble steed bears his shame also) and her head suspended below his head by a rope tied around his neck (which the artist mercifully did not illustrate). It was subsequently ordained that Gawain be the merciful champion of every lady,regardless of their standing. This,to me,was an extremely powerful depiction of the consequences of the rashness of the Five of Swords,action without thought or mercy. Ruthlessness. I,myself,prefer images that pull no punches (...thanks to my Mars/Scorpio square Sun conjunct Pluto/Leo:)). The directness of some of the images of the Legend Tarot was one of the factors in it being one of the more potent decks I have used in readings. I also loved its beauty.

firemaiden	25 May 2003
Awe...come on Truthsayer :D we're just having a bit of fun! I love bunnies too, truly I do. Fluffy bunny is just a term of endearment, right folks? I have the Lupatelli elves deck, the Gaudenzi fairies deck, the new LS spirit of flowers deck, the fey deck-- all of them have their depths, their shades of light and dark. There are of course, quite a few bunnies :-). I love artwork with humour and fantasy. I wouldn't exactly say I like "dark" decks, but I like depth, I think depth sometimes conveys the impression of darkness - for this I love the Crowley, and the Margarete Petersen. Both Light and Dark, I think is the Spiral. Some of those cards are daaaaaaaaaaaark, like the five of swords. Shudder! But see the cascades of color and light in Temperance. Yummy! Love Firemaiden

xouroboros	25 May 2003
...then there are those cards that make you want to got take a shower ...like Crowley's 7 of Cups - Debauch ...all drippy and stagnant ...yum

falconwing	25 May 2003
Truthsayer: I love rabbits, too!! I don't use the term "fluffy bunny" in the sense of something being "superficial" - not at all neither do I disrespect or even despise those "lighter" (more gentle or friendly) decks...as I mentioned in my opening-post to this thread: I do respect and like them all, but I will use them differently...depending on the mood and situation I am in. So, none of them is "better" than the other. One example for another "gentle deck" for me is the Medicine Woman Tarot, which is a really positive, constructive deck but not superficial at all!!! It's interesting, this idea of the Legend being a melancholic deck or providing a melancholic feel (I think it was WolfSpirit mentioning this?)...I have a similiar feeling with the Avalon-deck...I really love it for it's deep art and all and when I am reading with it I find it to be extremely accurate..but...it leaves me with a feeling of melancholy and that's why I don't use it that often ;). FalconWing

truthsayer	25 May 2003
sorry i came across harder than i planned. i've been bothered by the term fluffy bunny for a while and guess i unloaded in that post. just been somewhat more irritable than usual...rain, boredom, moon in scorpio... ;)

The "Light" vs "dark" decks thread was originally posted on 23 May 2003 in the Tarot Decks board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Tarot Decks, or read more archived threads.