If The Mantegna is a Tarot...

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 18 Jun 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.

blackroseivy	18 Jun 2004
Does the Mantegna deck count as a true Tarot, or would that one go into the other forum? I am wondering, because I really don't consider it a Tarot at all, but I need to know the opinion of the forum. Thanx!!!!!!!

le pendu	18 Jun 2004
What an interesting question! I understand what you mean. It is not a 78 card deck. It does not have suits, courts, or pips. It doesn't fit the description of a tarot in almost any way. But, some people read with just the tarot Major Arcana. And in many ways the the Mantegna is like a big blown out version of the Major cards. The direct relationship is visually obvious and historically interesting. In *my* opinion, it is not a tarot, but I would still allow it to be considered as a close enough relative to stay in this forum. Same with the Sola Busca. Let's see what others say, robert

Kiama	19 Jun 2004
I am by no means anything near an expert on this, and I eagerly await the input of jmd and the other history buffs here... However, personally I view the Mantegna as being a close cousin of the Tarot deck as we know it... possibly one inspiring the other? It works on the same principle, and many of the Majors we know can be seen in the Mantegna. Kiama

blackroseivy	19 Jun 2004
...I wonder why my thread got moved???

Luminessence	19 Jun 2004
Quote: Originally posted by danubhe ...I wonder why my thread got moved??? I guess because this counts more as a question about a deck than a reading exchange? Even though it has to do with the readings you will offer...

Cerulean	19 Jun 2004
to read the meanings and study what allegorical figures of the time might mean. That is if we are tarot fans looking back, we can say this is a historical card game similar to tarot trumps. We just have 50 of them rather than 22. I have never felt inclined to use them for reading, just casually looked at them for historical story reference. So many tarot writers and related art historians have discussed them, so I have the Silver set and black and white set--again for design reference. Hope you enjoy and have great readings with them. Regards, Cerulean Mari

jmd	19 Jun 2004
My views remain my personal views - yet I am not a relativist (ie, I do consider that there is a clear answer, whether or not my current one is along those lines is another question). The answer hinges partly as to how one characterises 'Tarot'. Tarot has, to my mind at least, clearly and precisely twenty-two Atouts (Major Arcana), and four suits - Bastons (Sceptres), Cups, Coins and Swords - each of these suits having pips from 1-10 and four specific court cards (Valet/Page, Knight, Queen and King). Any variation on this is precisely that: a variation on Tarot. Can Tarot 'incarnate' in a deck which differs from this? yes, but it will not have its being proximally reflected. In the case of the Mantegna, it seems to me to be an inspiration which manifests out of a seeking to understand Tarot, but which also misses the mark significantly. A cousin, therefore - and a beautifully bodied one at that, but without its Soul or Spirit.

The If The Mantegna is a Tarot... thread was originally posted on 18 Jun 2004 in the Tarot Decks board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Tarot Decks, or read more archived threads.