Cary Yale Visconti
Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 01 Dec 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.
| Little Baron |
01 Dec 2004 |
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Hi all
A few days ago, a good friend bought me an early tarot gift. Unfortunately, it was not something I felt I could use so I asked her if she would mind my exchanging it for something else. She has the receipt and didn't mind.
I have had my eye on the large Cary Yale Visconti cards for a while now. Was just wondering who has them here and what they are like to work with. Thed last time I saw them in a shop, there were quite a few sets. A smaller pack than the ones I am thinking off were faced with some kind of gold and looked a little gawdy. However, the scans of what seem to be the larger ones that I have seen on the internet look nice, so hopefully, they will be the ones I will exchange for.
Any help with this would be really appreciated; I know there are some on here that know much more about these decks than I do.
Best wishes
Yabs
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| darwinia |
01 Dec 2004 |
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A few days ago, a good friend bought me an early tarot gift. Unfortunately, it was not something I felt I could use
What was the deck or book you were originally given?
Curious.
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| Little Baron |
01 Dec 2004 |
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Hi Darwinia
It was the 'Gilded' tarot. As much as I have said here that I think the artwork in the deck is wonderful (which it is), it is just very different from the decks I have been using recently. The packaging is lovely and the whole thing is of a very high standard; I can understand why it is such a hit with people here. It just wasn't for me, thats all.
As much as it was a lovely thought from my friend, I really don't need any more decks at the moment. The only one that I have looked at 'on and off' for a long time, was the Visconti so I thought that if there wasn't something else in the shop (such as book), then maybe that may be an alternative.
Yabs
*Cirom, if you read this, I hope you are not offended. I do appreciate the beauty and worth of your deck. I am sure that once returned, someone else will get a lot of pleasure from it*
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| HearthCricket |
01 Dec 2004 |
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I am not sure why, but after looking at your list of tarot decks and your profile (love of art), I immediately said, "This guy needs a Leonardo Da Vinci deck!"
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| le pendu |
01 Dec 2004 |
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Hi Yaboot,
There are two large sized Visconti decks out there. The first one is called the "Cary-Yale" deck. It *might* be the older of the two, and the artwork on it is very, very beautiful.. but it might not make a very good reading deck as it does not follow the "standard" tarot system (in fact, it may have been created before there was a standard 78 card pack). It has the additional three virtues of Faith, Hope and Charity in it and there are SIX court cards for each suit. It's great to have for historical interest and for the beautiful artwork, but as I said, seems to be quite difficult for many to read with.
The other large deck is the Visconti Sforza Pierpoint Morgan. It is a deck with the standard 78 cards. We are historically missing the Devil and Tower from this deck, so they have been recreated in the same style. It is the one I would recommend for reading with, especially if you have become comfortable reading unillustrated pips like in the Marseilles decks.
The new, smaller, guilded decks are nice enough, but I too find them somewhat flashy and not really that interesting.
Do get the Sforza, just studying the artwork is a pleasure, and there are many secrets to be revealed in it's use. The cards are large, so you won't be able to handle them like an ordinary deck.. but the size also encourages you to appreciate the magnificant details of the artwork.
best,
robert
Cary-Yale Review:
http://www.aeclectic.net/tarot/cards/cary-yale-visconti/review.shtml
Cary-Yale Images:
http://www.aeclectic.net/tarot/cards/cary-yale-visconti/index.shtml
Visconti-Sforza Review:
http://www.aeclectic.net/tarot/cards/visconti-sforza/review.shtml
Visconti-Sforza Images:
http://www.aeclectic.net/tarot/cards/visconti-sforza/index.shtml
Edited to add.. there are a few different publishers of this deck. US Games and at least another. Cerulean has written some posts about the differences, or you might want to PM her for more details. (this is sounding like a discussion on the Thoth versions, isn't it! hee hee)
-r
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| Little Baron |
01 Dec 2004 |
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Thanks Robert. That does help.
I think that the one I was interested in is the one with the extra cards. As I already said, I have enough decks at the moment and don't really need any more. I think I have wasted enough time chopping and changing between the ones I have, hehe. However, for the beauty of the Visconti and as a historical learning tool, the Cary Yale would be a nice early Christmas present from my friend and something that would be nice to just 'have' - whether to be read with or not. I have seen what I 'think' is the more readible deck before and it did seem a bit flashy and tin-foily for my liking.
Hearthcricket, I will take a look at that deck as I don't remember it off hand.
Yabs
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| Little Baron |
01 Dec 2004 |
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Just looked at your links Robert and it is the first one that I like. Is that the 'over-sized' one?
Yabs
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| le pendu |
01 Dec 2004 |
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Both the Cary-Yale and the Sforza are oversized, (huge really) decks. There is a third-foil stamped, regular size deck as well, based on the Sforza.
I'm actually thrilled you are interested in the Cary-Yale. I think it is the more beautiful of the two and there are many wonderful distinctions to it that make it a must have for the study of Tarot art and history. I would love to have a study group to just discuss these two decks, there is that much to learn about them, and of course, it's kinda cool knowing that you are holding a deck that is over 500 years old and quite possible the great-great-great- grandparent of all tarot decks. (Ducking while the TdM people start gathering stones)
-r
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| Little Baron |
01 Dec 2004 |
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I have been interested in them for some time (years infact) but whenever I have ran into one, I have never had the pennies or couldn't account for the price tag. Since I am returning the other set, I have the excuse to just go and buy something and I think that one of these decks would be apt, since I have oggled them for so long.
When I started with the tarot, a lot of the older or historical decks were not my cup of tea, but as the years have gone on, I have become more and more interested in them. I do understand what you mean about viewing a photo reproduction of something that is so old. Even online, the Cary Yale looks beautiful. I like the way that some of the figures seem to come out of the pictures as if they are emerging from shadows.
If I manage to get my hands on the 'right' deck, I would be more than happy to discuss it with you and others interested in the future.
Best wishes and thanks for all of your help.
Yabs
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| darwinia |
01 Dec 2004 |
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Hi Darwinia
I really don't need any more decks at the moment.
Hi Yab,
Yes I can understand this. I am waiting for the Ironwing and that's probably it for me.
Interestingly, I am making something for the Gilded right now, and I almost considered buying the deck. I think I've just reached saturation point, the last decks I bought (which are now in the mail) were not tarot decks, they concerned trees and Celtic mythology but were more like oracles or art decks.
Also, due to my work with the Thoth, I favour that vibe more these days than the R-W model. I'm sort of away on a different route these days, a transitionary period of excruciating waiting.
Plus, I'm trying to teach myself lino cutting and read about Lewis and Clark and I'm Dreaming in Color. Away, away.
Well, I loved the Soprafino you bought, so I hope you enjoy this deck when you get it. If you can get big cards, that would be more appealing for a historical deck I think.
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| Little Baron |
01 Dec 2004 |
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Yes, I think that big cards would be a bonus - especially after looking at those scans in the last post (thanks Robert - they were a treat). Seeing them as large as that was wonderful. The details within the 'World' card are stunning - could really see myself falling into it. I also love the fact that at first glance, I didn't see the cups engraved within the gold. Even if they are not to read with at first, I think there is a lot in them to find out and learn from.
I love the Soprafino also, Darwinia - it feels like some old story book and is very romantic.
As much as I appreciate new decks, I do feel that as time goes on, I become less interested in the re-working or changing of different tarot 'models'. I have also worked away from the RW model (even though I do use it for some readings - the Original Rider Waite) and even though some new decks based around that tradition are visually stunning, to me, if feels a little like 'chinese whispers' - as the new decks are born along the line, something is lost with each birth. Does that make sense? That is probably why, in recent years, I have tended towards the historical and ancient decks - like the Cary Yale, Soprafino and other Ancient Italian packs. Of course, this is just a personal thing. In that sense, I suppose that a lot of decks I find interesting, I have already and no longer get that buzz for new packs that come out, as I once did. The Cary Yale is one that always slipped out of my grasp for one reason or another, so hopefully, after Saturday, I will have it in my 'grubby little mits',hehe.
Yabs
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| darwinia |
01 Dec 2004 |
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as the new decks are born along the line, something is lost with each birth. Does that make sense?
Yes. I would consider that people get used to feeding off old energy instead of creating their own. I prefer to think of William Blake creating his own system and use him as an ideal model for creativity. It's amazing how often the spirit of the artist can overcome the stereotype, but often they sink in sameness. The same old thing in a new package loses steam to become last year's trend of the moment.
That's why the Ironwing Tarot has been important to me for the last three years. It's a different system, completely tied up in Lorena's work, life and experience. Also strange decks like the Navigators Tarot of the Mystic SEA, they are stand-alones that endure without systemic compromise.
Chinese whispers. . .perception is an ever-changing drama as are tesselated networks and whispers misinterpreted. Loss and birth are quite upsetting, as is time and the wait, endured.
Does that make sense? ;-0)) Ever yours. . .
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| Cerulean |
01 Dec 2004 |
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I've only seen one printing of the Cary Yale outside of a museum catalog and the Cary-Yale slides--and even worn as it is, the U.S. Games version is the only one out there that I am aware of right now.
In terms of the Pierpont Morgan Visconti, with various printings and reproductions out there, one can easily pay too much for a dull printing in a shop. And if you are saving your pennies, people have linked to the full scans of the Dal Negro printing of the Visconti for study purposes and can also check all the cards of the Pierpont Morgan and Cary Yale versions for free first...
I've been fortunate to get different versions of the Pierpont Morgan Visconti deck for less than full price and 'earlier' printings of about 1978 by U.S. Games or the later printings from Italy--and they are much fresher, vibrant and really a better alternative to me than plucking down the equivalent of $40 for a
dull and bad color reproduction.
Hope you have delight in your new deck! The little white book with the deck is rather good as well.
Regards,
Cerulean
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The Cary Yale Visconti thread was originally posted on 01 Dec 2004 in the Tarot Decks board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Tarot Decks, or read more archived threads.
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