Fournier Backs

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 14 Mar 2005, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Little Baron	14 Mar 2005
Just by accident, I purchased a book and deck set today. It has the Fournier Marseille with it and a book (with pictures of the 1JJ Swiss in it!!!!????). I am used to the Ancient Conver, another different and older looking Conver and a Grimaud, but like the warmth of the Founier and size. The backs are quite horrid and have a gold sun on navy background. I don't think that this is going to stop me enjoying the deck too much but was wondering if this back was normal. I couldn't find a picture of card backs. The card stock is also quite light and not laminated so maybe it is just because it is a deck that comes in a set and is different. LB

Kissa	14 Mar 2005
Hi LB, your backs don't sound like mine ;-) Check on Joan Bunning's site here: http://www.learntarot.com/fmdesc.htm for a tiny picture of the backs I have. Now the question is what kind of rarity did you buy (i love this part:) "by accident"... Kissa

Clau	14 Mar 2005
Hi LB! Yup, I have the fournier marseille too, but my backs are just like the ones shown on the link sent by Kissa. I wonder why are they different?? Where did you buy it from? Who is the publisher? maybe we can follow some leads... BTW, did you buy it "By accident"???? I'd love to thear the story about this... Love, Clau

Little Baron	14 Mar 2005
Hi again Yes, it was 'such an accident' - the kind when you walk in a shop, trip over a deck and money jumps from your pocket and into the hands of the lady behind the counter. It was in the most basic of packaging. The cards were not sealed, aside from in the unopened box itself. A book called 'A beginners Guide to Tarot' by Kristyna Arcarti was with it. As I mentioned, it has the cards from the IJJ Swiss in it, which I would imagine would be quite confusing for a 'beginner', since some cards use different names, such as 'Junon' and 'Jupiter'. I am imagining that usually, the cards quite sturdy but here, they are the flimsier cardboard variety, like a lot of the Lewellyn decks. I said that the backs are horrid (detail of a large sun in gold ink on navy blue background - not reversable - but I am actually warming to them. I have a deep red spreadcloth on my table with small gold stars on it, which the cards actually look quite rich against. Glancing over at them now, they look very deep and the golds set ech other off. All that the box said was that they were made in the Uk by 'Funtime' gifts Ltd, London SE10 8JA. Probably a cheaper version than what you guys have but will serve me well for now; if they do not last long but I enjoy them, I can always hunt out another copy like the ones in the link. Have to say that even though I hadn't expected to, I quite like the change of colouring for the purpose of reading; they do feel very warm and nice to spread out. LB

Moonbow*	14 Mar 2005
Littlebuddha I don't know where you live, but I'm wondering if I have a shop in my area, perhaps a branch of the same one, where I can 'stumble' across this set. :)

Kissa	14 Mar 2005
from my search, funtime gift seems to be a weird company, not selling directly to the public and not manufacturing the products themselves. So you are right, this is a new version of the Fournier Marseilles. BTW, are you sure it is the Fournier? I know that there is a tarot called "Le Nouveau Tarot de Marseille" sold in France, it is brightly coloured but doesn't use the original lines of Conver's deck. There are some pics here: http://membres.lycos.fr/tarobat/mesjeux/Jeux.htm second table, the one decribed as "avec un livret de Colette Silvestre-Haeberle". but the backs (medium picture I guess) are not what you describe... sorry, I guess that there is no point to this post then ... unless you want to update your inventory of Marseilles style decks ;) ? Kissa

Kissa	14 Mar 2005
Moonbow* wrote: Littlebuddha I don't know where you live, but I'm wondering if I have a shop in my area, perhaps a branch of the same one, where I can 'stumble' across this set. :) yeah, what a weird phenomenom indeed... the most interesting part is how those coins or bills jump from your pocket and land in the cashier lady's hands!!! can imagine the look on that lady's face!!! just like that... tada: money! or is it a particularly vicious new marketing strategy??? the personel displays in purpose certain tarot sets to be stumbled accross in the walking alleys of the shop and meanwhile, they also have developped a powerful yet undectable kind of magnetic field around that cashier lady that attracts your monetary units straight from your pocket into her hands?! dammit, those guys!!! that's why i never shop in bookstore or esoteric shops. internet is much safer LOL Kissa

Little Baron	14 Mar 2005
Thanks for the link. I think it could be a Fournier as it has 'Fournier' written down the ribbon of the 'Two of Coins'. The pictures are the same; even with the faint 'moustache' mentioned on the 'Bateleur' in another thread. I suppose that it would be possible to find them in other parts of England; this was in one of those shops where they sell all kind of stuff - wooden buddhas, beads and the like. It was an accident in the fact that I hadn't gone looking for them. As I said, I am quite warming to the back designs, which I didn't when they were opened initially. I would post a picture but I don't have subscription here. I could mail a scan to anyone if they want a look. LB

Little Baron	14 Mar 2005
Just thinking. On the box, there is a telephone number. It is 0181 853 2628. It only just hit me that the code 0181 for 'outer London' has not existed for many years. It is 0208 now, so maybe this deck has been sitting in the 'wooden Buddha and bead' shop for quite a while, and is possibly why I couldn't find anything for 'Funtime' gifts on the web - maybe the fun is over for that company, lol. LB Edited to add: I don't think that the code 0181 has existed for a good eight years.

Little Baron	14 Mar 2005
Just looked on the web - "The London dialling codes changed in 2000. The old 0171 and 0181 codes were replaced with a new single code, 020, with a 7 or 8 added to the original seven-digit number to create a new 11-digit number" I suppose this deck could be five years old. But then again, it could have been sitting there for some time before that. LB Edited to add: The book that came with it is here - http://www.tarotpassages.com/arcarti.htm It says that this edition was published in 1999.

Jewel-ry	15 Mar 2005
I have this deck! I won it on e-bay thinking it was Fournier but it isn't. I'm afraid it isn't nearly as good as the 'real thing'. I did post on here about it at the time and the general opinion was that Fournier probably allow it to be copyrighted but with small changes. As far as I can remember the only difference I found was on the 3 deniers which is upside down. The other big difference (apart from the hideous backs) is the general feel, which is very 'cardboardy'. I kept it until just a couple of weeks ago when I did a reading for someone and gave her the deck as a gift.

Little Baron	15 Mar 2005
Thanks Jewel-ry I am quite enjoying working with them at the moment and they were very inexpensive so I am going to see how it goes, and in time, if I continue to enjoy the colouring, will invest in a sturdier and real Fournier. The reason I posted in the first place was because the backs seemed so unlike any I had seen before - they didn't seem to fit, if that makes sense. Otherwise, I wouldn't have thought any different and accepted them. Having said that, because of my rosy and gold cloth, they do complement each other nicely, so for now, I am going to keep using them. I do like the colouring of the cards. I am used to the Grimaud and Ancient so it makes a nice change - like seeing the colours of one suit predominant in a reading; it kind of switches a light on for me, where interpreting the other decks can sometimes be a little harder. Even though this is probably not one of the nicer variants/clones of the Marseille tradition, I was also quite pleased to see a 'beginner pack' that was based on a Marseille, rather than a Rider Waite or clone. I am looking forward to getting used to these cards and when the time is right, purchasing a 'real' Fournier - another 'little accident' forseen on the horizon, lol. Cheers for the info. LB

Jewel-ry	15 Mar 2005
I really like the Fournier deck too! :) I use it a lot and its small compact size makes it easy to transport. This deck by Kristyna Arcarti is pretty much the same, the colouring is a pretty good likeness, its just the quality and the backs which is a little lacking. If I hadn't already had the 'original' I would probably have used it too! Enjoy it! :)

Little Baron	15 Mar 2005
I completely agree with you. The backs have a 'cheaper' feel about them and I am sure that the card stock will not stand up for many years, as a lot of decks do. In a way, I quite like the battered up feel so hopefully, after some use, the design may actually lend to looking a little worn. What is good about getting this deck was that I had looked at the Fournier a new times on the web and never gave it serious consideration. It was only that I stumbled on this accidently that I considered buying it. I have read other threads about the Fournier since and read others views that this it is not a 'true' Marseille, due to the colouring. This is not such a big deal for me, as since getting this one, the colours are a bonus. I love reading weith the more historic Marseilles but I think that this one gives an edge to readings for me. I really do like the colours; they kind of beg me to read with them. I must say that I like the minors and courts a lot more than the majors though. They feel much more vivid and direct. I think that I would have prefered a deck where the colouring was as block coloured and vibrant as the minors. Do you understand what I mean - rather than them being more like paintings and the colours merging. All in all, I am not disappointed with it. I think it will take my readings in a different direction and am going to use it for a good while and get used to it. As I said, if a reading has more 'batons' in it, for example, you instantly feel the beautiful green wash through the cards and I like that. One thing I woulod be interested in knowing though, is how the colours for the minors were determined. Does anyone know? I would have associated the cups with another colour than 'orange' - maybe orange would have been more fitting for Batons and fire. The 'blue' for swords fits well with me - nice and icy. Maybe green would have fitted well for coins. Liking it a lot though and am glad that this little deck, even if not as nice as the original, has provoked a greater interest in the Fournier. LB

The Fournier Backs thread was originally posted on 14 Mar 2005 in the Tarot Decks board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Tarot Decks, or read more archived threads.