Joy and the Aigle Oswald Wirth

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 26 Mar 2005, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Fudugazi	26 Mar 2005
A few weeks ago I ordered from my local esoteric bookshop the Aigle edition of Oswald Wirth magnificent 1927 Tarot (22 Majors). Last week, the shop called to say it was out-of-print ...:( I was so sad. None of the other editions come within a mile of that one. I started browsing the net, checked on ebay France...and by chance, and very quickly, came upon a website of a small esoteric outfit in Nantes called dix de coeur (ten of hearts - and indeed my heart was full!) It advertised the Aigle ed. Wirth, at a reasonable price. I ordered it - and it arrived! What joy! They are magnificent cards, almost too beautiful to believe, on good cardtstock, with a smooth, unshiny feel to them and that beautiful mat gold background... So let me raise Le Bateleur's silver Cup, which is full of red wine, and toast M. Oswald Wirth, humanist, artist and tarotist supreme!

Diana	26 Mar 2005
And let us pray to the tarot gods that no clones will be made of this masterpiece. It has already been disrespected twice (as far as I know, possibly more) - that is enough. But as the commercial gods (the more vulgar ones) also have prayers being made to them, I tremble a little for the future. I wonder if it is not better for people NOT to speak of the Oswald Wirth deck for sometimes it is better not to throw pearls to swine. Perhaps all posts where this deck has been mentioned on Aeclectic could be deleted. And then only those who seek will find it. Moderators? What do you think?

Fudugazi	26 Mar 2005
If some good soul had not told me of the Aigle edition of Oswald Wirth, I would never have known about it... ...so I wish to thank her here and now, and lift my glass to her, the gentle cynic. :)

Moonbow*	26 Mar 2005
I'm enthralled too! I had the deck for Mothers Day a couple of weeks ago from my daughter, along with the book 'The Tarot of the Magicians'. Then this week I bought Wisdom of the Tarot by Elisabeth Haich, and I'm busily reading and enjoying them all. I agree its a wonderful deck, although as yet I'm still reading the books. I got mine from playingcardsales.com in France, excellent service from them - as usual. :)

Fudugazi	27 Mar 2005
I don't have the book yet so I just gaze at the cards and try and figure out those symbols I am either unfamiliar with or haven't seen on Tarot cards, or which differe markedly from the Marseille. It's an amazingly spiritual deck (that is - there is a deep sense of mystery about it). What a joy! No wonder you are also enjoying it, Moonbow*. Have you seen the stars around the Empress's head - they give shivers down my back. (Is that where the Tarot of Prague stars around the Empress's head come from?). And the dreamy-sensuous-looking Moon? And the bags shedding gold and silver pieces held in the elbows of the Hanged Man? And the brick that knocks one figure out in the Maison-Dieu, while the other figure looks like he is doing cartwheels from joy - the different reactions we can get to shock! And the silver and red butterfly in the Stars card...

baba-prague	27 Mar 2005
Diana wrote: And let us pray to the tarot gods that no clones will be made of this masterpiece. It has already been disrespected twice (as far as I know, possibly more) - that is enough. I haven't been sure whether to say anything about this, but a friend (who is occasionally here on AT) sent us more than twenty decks from Russia a week or so ago, and among them is one that uses the Wirth Majors with... (Diana, you may want to look away now, or at least please sit down) PIPS IN THE STYLE OF BARBIE! Alex and I just gazed with our jaws dropped, You really don't know how to react. I will post some of them here if it doesn't offend anyone - or maybe I should just quietly put this deck away in a drawer? Some modern Russian decks are sadly beyond belief.

Fulgour	27 Mar 2005
Le Tarot des imagiers du Moyen-Age Langue : Français Éditeur : Tchou (9 janvier 1999) En 22 lames, les imagiers du Moyen Âge ont peint en un langage symbolique et universel la vaste représentation qu’ils se faisaient du Monde. Wirth, le premier, nous propose une investigation hardie et méthodique de ce symbolisme. (Présentation de l'éditeur) * Wirth invites us to join him on a fantastic journey through a whirling maze of symbolic interpretations and attributes, but the real joy is his Tarot, the book just his kindly notes.

Fulgour	27 Mar 2005
baba-prague wrote: I will post some of them here if it doesn't offend anyone - or maybe I should just quietly put this deck away in a drawer? This would be wonderful! (We can set up cots for the faint.) :)

Moonbow*	27 Mar 2005
I would love to see them Karen. shhhh......(it's ok Diana is at a punk festival - she won't even know)

baba-prague	27 Mar 2005
Fulgour wrote: This would be wonderful! (We can set up cots for the faint.) :) Get them ready - and would someone please pour Diana a camomile tea (or something stronger). I am scanning even as we speak. I suppose at least we can comfort ourselves with one thing - Wirth rip-offs cannot get any worse than this. Stand by, stand by...

Fudugazi	27 Mar 2005
Fulgour wrote: Le Tarot des imagiers du Moyen-Age Langue : Français Éditeur : Tchou (9 janvier 1999) . Having seen both the Tchou and the Aigle editions, I can safely say the Aigle flies way above the Tchou in the quality of it reproductions, its detail and colouring - and cardstock. Baba-prague, I am appalled by the Barbie pips. I'm going to need camomile tea as well, followed by a strong eau-de-vie, and then I shall suggest a ceremonial burning. And offering to the Tarot Devils. Barbie and Oswald Wirth! It's not even funny :(

baba-prague	27 Mar 2005
Here it is! Yes, this is all one deck. No it does not have 78 cards (why bother with that?) Yes, it does seem to have simply taken the Wirth from low-res web images. But this is a real published deck! What can you say? http://www.bohemian-cats.com/examples/barbie-wirth.jpg Maybe when Diana gets back from the punk festival we should warn her before she logs in? ;-)

Moonbow*	27 Mar 2005
Helvetica Since you are looking so closely at the cards and I'm still working my way through both books, have you noticed the strange hand signals in card 13? There's one hand that seems to have two thumbs and some of the others have the middle two fingers joined. I need to get through these books!

baba-prague	27 Mar 2005
Helvetica wrote: Baba-prague, I am appalled by the Barbie pips. I'm going to need camomile tea as well, followed by a strong eau-de-vie, and then I shall suggest a ceremonial burning. And offering to the Tarot Devils. Barbie and Oswald Wirth! It's not even funny :( Even worse than you feared? In recompense when you are here I'll show you our 1926/7 Wirth (please bring your deck so we can compare, I'm fairly certain ours is this age, but it would be fantastic to be able to compare and verify). I can't burn this deck as it was a kind present - but I may think of something appropriate to do with it!

Moonbow*	27 Mar 2005
Nooooo! Oh my, she aint gonna like that at all! It's worse than I thought. *Moonbow is laughing her head off* :D That deck is what I would call nasty. Edited because, the Majors do seem to be the De L'aigle deck but with borders.... bad borders.

baba-prague	27 Mar 2005
It's REAL, I am not making this up and it is NOT April 1st. This is a real deck, comes in a tuck-box and everything.

Fudugazi	27 Mar 2005
Moonbow* - I can't see the two thumbs but the hand signal of the far left hand I can see - some kind of masonic gesture? ;) (they wouldn't tell us...) Alternatively, Wirth was a boy scout and hitchhiker all in one... As for the Barbie Wirth - I am only surprised they left the crayfish in the middle of the Moon's pool rather than put one of these rubbery hearts there.

Moonbow*	27 Mar 2005
Do you know what I would do? I would use just the Majors and get Yabooting them.. snip snip.. Helvetica the hand on the far left... try to do that with you hand. It could be the left or right hand!! Very odd. :rolleyes:

baba-prague	27 Mar 2005
It's a tiny little deck so if I snipped it I'd end up with a postage-stamp size Wirth. I think I'll just keep it as an awful warning of what can happen to even the most serious decks. Okay, I will now stop derailing this thread!

Fudugazi	27 Mar 2005
Moonbow* wrote: Helvetica the hand on the far left... try to do that with you hand. It could be the left or right hand!! Very odd. :rolleyes: Gosh you're right - this is one double-or-triple-jointed hand doing some masonic sign at us!

Fudugazi	27 Mar 2005
baba-prague wrote: It's a tiny little deck so if I snipped it I'd end up with a postage-stamp size Wirth. I think I'll just keep it as an awful warning of what can happen to even the most serious decks. Okay, I will now stop derailing this thread! I'll bring you the Aigle, which is mercifully large :) Postage stamps is too good for this - merde. But maybe you can use it in some kind of voodoo ceremony against stalkers, or something...

baba-prague	27 Mar 2005
Helvetica wrote: I'll bring you the Aigle, which is mercifully large :) Postage stamps is too good for this - merde . But maybe you can use it in some kind of voodoo ceremony against stalkers, or something... Not sure I'd want to offend the voodoo gods either! No, it will just have to be kept here to frighten visitors!

Rosanne	27 Mar 2005
Very Easterish -Wirth de Chocolat- Now that would probally be available here in NZ as the an esoteric example of how cosmopolitan we are here. Where as something simple like a Tarot TdM is seen seen as passe. No accounting for taste. Thank you Baba Prague for such a Versache example.

Fudugazi	27 Mar 2005
baba-prague wrote: Not sure I'd want to offend the voodoo gods either! No, it will just have to be kept here to frighten visitors! Visitors are duly warned. You might want to provide a basin, too.

Fulgour	27 Mar 2005
Helvetica wrote: Having seen both the Tchou and the Aigle editions, I can safely say the Aigle flies way above the Tchou in the quality of it reproductions, its detail and colouring - and cardstock. Helvetica, I know it's after noon there, but please... my post referencing Tchou was in regard to the book. * Amazon.fr The tarot impassions many authors but, incontestably, Oswald Wirth remains a reference in the field and the Tarot of the imagiers of the Middle Ages is essential like a bible. One cannot include/understand arts like astrology or the tarot without penetrating the mystery of symbolism. Often too "intellectualized", the symbol diverts the modern man. And yet, its simplicity opens many readings. However, Oswald Wirth teaches us the discovery of this universal language and clarifies, the kind, the reasons which make tarot a play of divination. This work is extremely complete as well on the historical aspects as practical. * Amazon.fr Le tarot passionne bien des auteurs mais, incontestablement, Oswald Wirth reste une référence dans le domaine et Le Tarot des imagiers du Moyen Âge s'impose comme une bible. On ne peut comprendre des arts comme l'astrologie ou le tarot sans pénétrer le mystère du symbolisme. Souvent trop "intellectualisé", le symbole déroute l'homme moderne. Et pourtant, sa simplicité ouvre bien des lectures. Or, Oswald Wirth nous enseigne la découverte de cette langue universelle et éclaire, de la sorte, les raisons qui font du tarot un jeu de divination. Cet ouvrage est fort complet tant sur les aspects historiques que pratiques.

Fudugazi	27 Mar 2005
Fulgour wrote: Helvetica, I know it's after noon there, but please... my post referencing Tchou was in regard to the book. I'm never at my best before 6 pm... Thank you for correcting me! And for the reference :)

Fulgour	27 Mar 2005
"nothing ceases, everything continues!" Page 115: Le Tarot des imagiers du Moyen-Age

Diana	27 Mar 2005
baba: Thanks for those scans. They remind me of the looters that Ayn Rand speaks about in Atlas Shrugged. Fascinating and quite scary.

baba-prague	27 Mar 2005
They are actually SO awful that I don't expect anyone will ever seriously use this deck - so in that way they are quite harmless. I would like to see Firemaiden do a reading with this deck though (no, no, on second thoughts...)

Rusty Neon	27 Mar 2005
For those who have become enanamoured with the Russian deck referred to above, keep on a look for them on eBay. :) You can find a closed auction for this item (closed March 22/05) under the title: Russian TAROT cards of LOVE - MAGIC The vendor started bidding at 5 euro (plus 9 euro worldwide shipping). There were no takers. :) Attached is the first of the four scans from that closed eBay auction.

baba-prague	28 Mar 2005
Rusty, be careful, you could start a craze!

Fulgour	28 Mar 2005
baba-prague wrote: It's a tiny little deck so if I snipped it I'd end up with a postage-stamp size Wirth. I think I'll just keep it as an awful warning of what can happen to even the most serious decks. I'm beginning to see what this may be all about. Remember when Rod McKuen went to Russia? "Even wrinkled water stretches out along its roadway to the sea." Rod McKuen, homepage: http://www.mckuen.com/ Born on April 29, 1933, Rod will be 72 this year.

Rosanne	28 Mar 2005
Forgive this antipodean denseness... but is Rod McKuen on a postage stamp- did he become less serious when he went to Russia-Is he known for bastardising Tarot Decks-Or is he just plain Wirthless?????? Huh? Huh? ~Rosanne

Fulgour	28 Mar 2005
The gifts that one receives for giving are so immeasurable that it is almost an injustice to accept them. ~ Rod McKuen * I know when I'm in trouble, and that usually means that the hole I've dug for myself is deep enough to bury me. Rod McKuen and I have never met, but he seems alright. About the Tarot (McKuen-Wirth) joke, my thinking was, there are probably people who love those big red hearts in the same way many people love Rod's personal poems. And the truth is, when good things happen, angels smile.

Rosanne	28 Mar 2005
[that iquote=Fulgour]The gifts that one receives for giving are so immeasurable t is almost an injustice to accept them. ~ Rod McKuen * I know when I'm in trouble, and that usually means that the hole I've dug for myself is deep enough to bury me. Rod McKuen and I have never met, but he seems alright. About the Tarot (McKuen-Wirth) joke, my thinking was, there are probably people who love those big red hearts in the same way many people love Rod's personal poems. And the truth is, when good things happen, angels smile.[/quote] Ain't that the truth Fulgour-I hate to see an aside go by when I don't get it. (LOL) I have read his poems from your link. Thank you. I tried the quote thing, as a learning, and I got your whole post-sorry- that is not how you do it obviously. I will go to Tech support. About cards like that mixed Deck. I did not realise there were merchants out there who could mix and match quuite like that. Very Sick. ~Rosanne

The Joy and the Aigle Oswald Wirth thread was originally posted on 26 Mar 2005 in the Tarot Decks board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Tarot Decks, or read more archived threads.