Why No Queen

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 06 Jun 2005, and now archived in the Forum Library.

cirom	06 Jun 2005
My mother taught me a card games way way back, that she in turn had played as a child in Italy. The deck was the usual with suits of Swords Cups, "Bastone" and Coins. Two questions, there were pages, knights and kings but no Queens. Why. Also in this partcular game, points were won in a number of ways. By accumulating more cards than your opponent, but also by accumulating more coin cards than your opponent, and the seven of coins the "sette bello" was worth a point all on its own. This card game was quite popular, I believe even a train was named the "sette bello". Whats the explanation for the missing Queens, and the extra importance given to suit of coins and in particular the seven?

rainwolf	07 Jun 2005
Well if this was made to resemble a regular playing card decks layout, there are only three court cards. Sometimes they just recreate a deck of cards, and so the number of cards remain constant. If there are no majors, then i would think that was the answer, but if thats not the case, then i don't know.

wizzle	07 Jun 2005
Here are some links about this game: http://www.seeyouinitaly.com/cardgames/scopa.cfm http://www.pagat.com/fishing/scopone.html and a discussion of "latin" card decks http://www.pagat.com/class/latin.html and a view of decks from various countries. http://gamesmuseum.uwaterloo.ca/vexhibit/plcards/index.html#suits From what I can gather, today's standard poker/playing deck derives its courts from French decks. Italian decks are, well, Italian. I think we should make up reasons why there are no queens in an Italian deck. She was busy in the kitchen making lasagna, maybe? Or out on the veranda listening to love songs.

cirom	07 Jun 2005
What a great site, thanks for the link. That is exactly the deck I was referring to. And yes come to think of it my morther does make a rather good Lasangna, unfortunately she lives in London, and I'm here in Miami. Probably from my waisteline's point of view that might not be such a bad thing.

Kissa	07 Jun 2005
Hi cirom, i don't have access to the book right now, though it would be good from my buttockline's point of view to climb the stairs and go get it... ;) i think i read in the (excellent) book "understanding the tarot court" that there were no women in the early playcard decks, because of the low status of women in the society back then. i really have to find the complete text but i'm afraid it won't be tonight... stay tuned. not much help, uh? kissa

The Why No Queen thread was originally posted on 06 Jun 2005 in the Tarot Decks board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Tarot Decks, or read more archived threads.