Christianity and Tarot

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 06 Aug 2001, and now archived in the Forum Library.

LaIslaBonita	06 Aug 2001
I have just become very intrested in tarot and would very much like to practice it, but i am also a Christian (Roman Catholic) and i was wondering if it conflicts or is against Chrisitanity in anyway, since i am a believeing and practicing Christian.

StarShine	06 Aug 2001
First of all let me say that I am in no way an authority on Catholocism, or any other spiritual path. I only know what is right for me. Having said that, let me answer your question with a question. What do you feel about it? You are the only one who knows what is right for you and your belief system. No one can give you a simple yes or no answer to your question. Those who can are answering based on their own feelings. Whatever you decide, please keep in mind that regardless of what you have been taught, people who read The Tarot and use other forms of divination are not evil Satan worshippers. Most of us are perfectly ordinary people who love and respect nature and all of her creatures, including mankind. I will now get down off of my soap box. Good luck and it is wonderful to have you here.

arizonagirl	06 Aug 2001
If you view the Tarot as a way of gaining insight into your feeling about a situation, or a way of connecting to your internal guide, it would not be in opposition to your religion.

destinyawaitsme	06 Aug 2001
The answer to this question is only one you can find within yourself. For there is no solid proof of god, heaven, hell, etc. All of it is faith. But I must tell you that most Christian denominations that I know of think Tarot and other forms of divination is wrong. Why? Some people believe you should have full faith in God and not rely on tools such as tarot to know your future. In other words, you should blindly follow your path and hope you are doing what's right. One thing I should tell you is that Tarot cards are not satanic. They are paper cards made in a printing press. But in your decision of deciding if tarot is right for you focus on this one thing: What do you believe? If you think tarot is going to send you straight to hell, don't read. I don't think it could benefit you in anyway. I personally believe in God and heaven and hell and angels and spirits, etc. I believe that there are things bigger than myself out there. I can't tell you what is right or wrong in God's eyes (neither can anyone else) because I am not God. I can only give you an opinion from what I know. This is soley a decision you will have to make for yourself. Do a little soul searching. From my short experience with tarot I have to tell you that it is a wonderful and enriching experience. People that read these cards aren't freaky roadside gypsies...but everyday people. Everyday people, jsut like you who have problems, and oddly enough...some of them are christian...just like you and me. Yeah, it isn't common, but possible. Basically in short, people come in all shapes and sizes with their own beliefs. Our beliefs are what make us...us. Decide for yourself. Don't let other people judge you from pure ignorance. Reading tarot cards doesn't make you a Satanist. In my experience it brings you closer to God. It has made me fully realize the power within myself...and the powers out of my control. I hope this helped you in your decision. God bless.

Gerrett	07 Aug 2001
like you, i too am a roman catholic. i've actually asked this question to a priest here. he told me that nothing is intrisically evil, especially something worldly, or an object, therefor the cards could have any sense of evil in them. it is when you let these cards control your lives that the evil comes. which in my opinion is very true. use the cards as a guide maybe, but don't let it run your life. in addition to that, i also asked why then do a lot of catholics think that tarot is evil. he said not to worry, it's just something that religious fanatics spread. but he assured me that nothing is evil with them alone. so have fun! peace out! ;)

catlin	07 Aug 2001
Hi, If you feel bad or guilty with your cards then your Christianity is stronger and you would always feel guilty about using the cards which is certainly not the right way to begin with. There is nothing evil about the cards, they are just a "tool" to get insight and they show the things which already lie inside you but of which you are prob. not aware.

lost01	07 Aug 2001
Hi, i am catholic as well. i havent felt that my reading tarot was in conflict with these beliefs. if anything, ive found tarot to be humbling and deeply spiritual. -mike-

Rhiannon	07 Aug 2001
I would also like to suggest that if some of the more "pagan" symbolism of tarot certain tarot decks bothers you that you consider one of the decks that are more "christian" oriented such as Master Tarot, Jesus Deck, Connolly Tarot, Angel Tarot and Soul Tidings Cards. All of these are listed here by Solandia so you can check them out and see if they are for you. I rather like the angel ones. Pretty. I'd also like to re-iterate that tarot cards are not evil in and of themselves. Hope I helped. Rhiannon :)

nexyjo	07 Aug 2001
i am not an authority on biblical issues. but it is my understanding that the bible does mention the practise of divination as being somehow evil or wrong. i forget how it words the phrase. that said, using the tarot for divination would appear to be against biblical law. on the other hand, the tarot has many uses, other than divination. i'm sure most religious people would agree that virtually every "thing" can be used for "evil" and used for "good". so the object itself is not evil or good, but instead, the intent in use of the object is what is good or evil. in that sense, i can't imagine how simply looking at the pictures on a tarot card is evil - it's no different than looking at any art work. and certainly, using the pictures to meditate cannot be evil, using the same logic. luv and light, nexy

Kiama	07 Aug 2001
I feel that no matter what religion you are, if you are comfortable using the Tarot, and blending it with your beliefs, then it is the right way to go. I'm pretty sure one's God/s will be pleased for knowing one is trying to gain wisdom, knowledge, and experience in such an enriching way: Not only does the Tarot offer these, but you can use it to help others and offer guidance in times of pain. And don't most religions teach that this is a virtue? Being a guide and helping hand for somebody (See the parable of the Good Samaritan) is what a religious belief system is all about, isn't it? There are many ways in which we can enrich our lives. The way we view those methods all depends on how we have been bought up to think. Maybe by using the Tarot aswell as being Roman Catholic, you can create awareness about it. It only takes one good person to show that using the Tarot does not mean you are evil or Satanic. I know you're a good person cuz you wouldn't be askig questions like this if you weren't. As for Christianity's views on divination, I don't know much, I'm not Christian. However, I do know that King Sol visited a diviner to eithe rprotect himself or his son I'm not sure which one. There are many references to John the Baptist being 'that way inclined' towards divination... But only in the Apocrypha. I can also speak from the side of the Tarot and it's many gifts.... Looking into the furture and counselling yourslef of your problems doesn't always have to be the work of the Gods. Maybe we need a little assistance when trying desperately to understand what They (Whichever Divine Being you believe in) want u to do in life, and what They are trying to tell us. The Tarot can do that I think. Anyway, I have babbled on for far too long on a question I can only really answer half of. Hope my rambles helped some. Kiama

MeeWah	07 Aug 2001
The Bible frowns on "divination" but I believe that stance was due to concern over the misuse of such means (as well as other reasons that aren't needed for the purpose of this discussion). Also the possibility of distraction from learning the higher concepts of a power greater than Man & the process of faith. Man's understanding is finite by reason of his human condition. It is not always clear to us why something is or why something happens as it does. Since Man is endowed with free will & the power of reason, it makes sense to seek understanding & wisdom. Those qualities are what sets us apart from the rest of the animal kingdom. The Bible does indicate that Man was given dominion over the earth. As such, we are caretakers of all that is--including that of knowledge. After all, the three magi consulted the position of the stars & planets in order to determine information about Jesus & His birth. Those men were likely adepts in occultism who understood how to use their knowledge. Having just seen the comments on this post, I see everyone here has given intelligent & thoughtful consideration to this query. Tarot is primarily a tool for self development & guidance. Divination is a secondary quality; can be seen as a natural result from the study of Tarot should one seek to avail the self of it. I recommend y

Yarnie	07 Aug 2001
Looks like MeeWah's post was truncated for some reason. I AM quite versed in the Bible (although not necessarily the Roman Catholic version) and I am also a practicing Christian. MeeWah is right on track regarding the prohibition on divination and the reasons for it. Personally, I use the Tarot as a method of self-, problem-, and situation-analysis--as a way to force my mind to think along tracks that I had not considered up to that point. As has been stated prior in this thread, if you are uncomfortable using the Tarot and cannot reconcile your use of Tarot with your spiritual faith, put aside the Tarot.

MeeWah	07 Aug 2001
Sorry, do not know what happened there--except maybe it was too long? More likely the pesky twitchy finger struck again :D To finish my previous post-- At the risk of repeating myself, I recommend that before you invest in any books or a deck, to first be an informed consumer! Check out Tarot online. The old Forums would've been great as a source of information but the material is not currently available. There are countless Tarot-related websites. After you have had some time to absorb & to think over some basic information, see how you feel about it. Then if you are still interested in Tarot, proceed accordingly. I've found Tarot to enhance one's life & understanding, no matter what the spiritual background or lack of same. For me, Tarot is first & foremost a spiritual quest. The divination is a fringe benefit, a natural result of the individuation process. As a means of self-development & guidance, it is a highly subjective experience, relative to the individual & not suitable for everyone. You may be able to make a more appropriate decision on it after some more examination of what Tarot may offer.

LaIslaBonita	08 Aug 2001
Thank you so much everyone for your thoughts and insight. I have decided to get into the Tarot, thanks to you all =). Again, thank you!

Dee 04	09 Aug 2001
Hi: I am also Catholic and most, if not ALL, of the people I read for are Catholic. This is very interesting. It seems like you have a great interest in the Tarot. Follow your inner guide! What will make you happy and what is best for you? As you can see from the above postings to your question - there are many practicing Catholics reading Tarot. You are not doing anything mean or hurtful to anyone - right? I used to battle with the same issue as I was growing up so I understand totally. However, as I continued to develop spiritually I realized that our spiritual needs change all the time. It starts to transcend what we knew as "law" or "rules" in the religion we were raised in. I feel I made a healthy separation fro these views that prohibit all forms of divination and I followed my inner guide which always told me - GO FOR TAROT!! This made me so much happier. I am still catholic and I am still a Tarot reader. For me, I can be both even if others disagree. I do not follow the Roman "law" of Catholicism to the word but I do believe in Saints, the Virgin Mary, Jesus, the Holy SPirit, etc. I do not know if this helps but this was just my experience from my point of view. I hope you choose whatever makes you happy andmost liberated.

Kiama	10 Aug 2001
Dee: It's wonderful to know that there are so many people out there who accept Tarot for what it really is. I thik what happens with good people reading Tarot for others is that the others see, through that person, that the Tarot is not bad. I mean, how can someone as nice as you or anyone else who is on this forum, be into anything evil, they will ask themselves? It's great. Really, readers are an advert for the Tarot... Kiama

raeanne	10 Aug 2001
Maybe I am a little more cynical, but I know there are people who use the tarot for very evil purposes. That does, unfortunately affect the people that use the tarot for positive spiritual growth. But, I would also state that there are people who use the Bible for very evil purposes as well. It is not the tool that is good or evil, it is the intent of the person using that tool. I would be interested if MeeWah, Yarnie or anyone else could give some references to where in the Bible any statements are made about divination. I would like to look them up and see specifically what it says. (I just read what I wrote and I don’t want anyone to misunderstand. I am just curious, I’m not challenging anyone for any reason!) This is an interesting topic and I want to look into it a bit deeper.

tarotbear	10 Aug 2001
Raeanne- to quote "Evita": "there is evil ever around- fundamental; system of government quite incidental". Anything can be preverted to be evil; the trick is knowing the truth. Look at all those ads about Proctor & Gamble being connected to the Devil because they have stars in the logo? I mean- are we reading between the lines here - and seeing what we want to see? That is why fanatics are dangerous, and the only way to fight against them is to know the truth and be able to toss it back at them. Fanatics hate the truth.

MeeWah	10 Aug 2001
Raeanne et al: These references from the New Testament are the immediate ones I can locate, translated from Greek text. The source is The St. Joseph Edition of The New American Bible (Catholic). 1 Corinthians 12.4-11: *There are different kinds of spiritual gifts but the same Spirit; there are different forms of service but the same Lord; there are different workings but the same God who produces all of them in everyone. To each individual the manifestation of the Spirit is given for some benefit. To one is given through the Spirit the expression of wisdom; to another the expression of knowledge according to the same Spirit; to another faith by the same Spirit; to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit; to another mighty deeds; to another prophecy; to another discernment of spirits; to another varieties of tongues; to another interpretation of tongues. But one and the same Spirit produces all of these, distributing them individually to each person as he wishes. * (The passage is similar in the King James Version; however, I find the Catholic version in this instance easier to understand.) Ephesians 4.7, 11-16: *But grace was given to each of us according to the measure of Christ's gift... And he gave some as apostles, others as prophets, others as evangelists, others as pastors and teachers, to equip the holy ones for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of faith and knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the extent of the full stature of Christ, so that we may no longer be infants, tossed by waves and swept along by every wind of teaching arising from human trickery, from their cunning in the interests of deceitful scheming. Rather, living the truth in love, we should grow in every way into him who is the head, Christ, from whom the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, with the proper functioning of each part, brings about the body's growth and builds itself up in love.*

raeanne	11 Aug 2001
MeeWah, Thank you for posting the references. How in the name of (insert deity) could anyone interpret this to be against divination? It sounds to me like the Bible is saying that we all have our gifts and we should use them to the best of our abilities. Is there any place that anyone know about that the Bible talks against divination?

MeeWah	11 Aug 2001
Raeanne: There may be confusion with the Old Testament enhortations regarding idolatry--Deuteronomy 4.15-24 (St Joseph Edition of the New American Bible): *You saw no form at all on the day the Lord spoke to you at Horeb from the midst of the fire. Be strictly on your guard, therefore, not to degrade yourselves by fashioning an idol to represent any figure, whether it be the form of a man or woman, of any animal on the earth or of any bird that flies in the sky, or of anything that crawls on the ground or of any fish in the waters under the earth. And when you look up to the heavens and behold the sun or the moon or any star among the heavenly hosts, do not be led astray into adoring them and serving them...Take heed, therefore, lest, forgetting the covenant which the Lord, your God, has made with you, you fashion for yourselves against his command an idol in any form whatsoever. For the Lord, your God, is a consuming fire, a jealous God.* The Ten Commandments are listed in Deuteronomy 5. Also, Deuteronomy 13.1-19: *Every command that I enjoin on you, you shall be careful to observe, neither adding to it nor subtracting from it. If there arises among you a prophet or a dreamer who promises you a sign or wonder, urging you to follow other gods, whom you have not known, and to serve them: even though the sign or wonder he has foretold has come to pass, pay no attention to the words of that prophet or that dreamer; for the Lord, your God, is testing you to learn whether you really love him with all your heart and with all your soul. The Lord, your God, shall you follow, and him shall you fear; his commandment shall you observe, and his voice shall you heed, serving him and holding fast to him alone. But that prophet or that dreamer shall be put to death, because, in order to lead you astray from the way which the Lord, your God, has directed you to take, he has preached apostasy from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt and ransomed you from that place of slavery. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or your intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nation, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him...You shall stone him to death...If, in any of the cities which the Lord, your God, gives you to dwell in, you hear it said that certain scoundrels have sprung up among you and have led astray the inhabitants of their city to serbe other gods whom you have not known, you must inquire carefully into the matter and investigate it thoroughly. If you find that it is true and an established fact...you shall put the inhabitants of that city to the sword, dooming the city and all life that is in it, even its cattle...you shall burn the city with all its spoils as a whole burnt offering to the Lord, your God...* Strong words, aren't they? They seem to be in direct contradiction to the New Testament; however, I've understood the Old Testament is usually associated with Judaism; the New with Christianity. The various books of the Bible were written by different writers & in different times. The prevailing cultures, social climate & intellectualism (or lack thereof) may have had their influences on any written records.

Jimilyn	11 Aug 2001
Oops! Used the back button and reposted a couple of times. Sorry. :( Jimilyn

Jimilyn	11 Aug 2001
Oops!

nexyjo	11 Aug 2001
i believe these quotes, from the king james version, are what were referred to: Deuteronomy 18:10 There shall not be found among you [any one] that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, [or] that useth divination, [or] an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch... 2 Kings 17:17 And they caused their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire, and used divination and enchantments, and sold themselves to do evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger. Ezekiel 12:24 For there shall be no more any vain vision nor flattering divination within the house of Israel. Acts 16:16 And it came to pass, as we went to prayer, a certain damsel possessed with a spirit of divination met us, which brought her masters much gain by soothsaying... Ecclesiasticus 34:5 Divinations, and soothsayings, and dreams, are vain: and the heart fancieth, as a woman's heart in travail. for biblical searches, i've found a pretty good resource: http://unbound.biola.edu/ hope this helps. luv and light, nexy

Jimilyn	11 Aug 2001
Quote: MeeWah (12 Aug, 2001 06:14): For the Lord, your God, is a consuming fire, a jealous God.* (snip) I've understood the Old Testament is usually associated with Judaism; the New with Christianity. The various books of the Bible were written by different writers & in different times. The prevailing cultures, social climate & intellectualism (or lack thereof) may have had their influences on any written records. Jehovah is indeed a jealous God. The Old Testament is indeed associated with Judaism. However, both Old and New Testaments pertain to Christianity. The New Testament is considered to be the fulfillment of Old Testament prophesies. Many Christian denominations consider the Bible to be the inerrant word of God regardless of human, societal, or intellectual influences. Not all Christian denominations believe this, however. I have significantly modified how I look at it (I was raised Southern Baptist)...obviously, or else I wouldn't be interested in learning to read the Tarot. lol Catcha later, Jimilyn

Cindy	12 Aug 2001
umm, I can't remember just where but I think there is something of the sort in there opposing divination. Of course the passage you were speaking of Raeanne is also in the Bible. I don't have my Bible handy so I cannot say exactly where these passages are. Also alot depends on which Bible you are using. They all slightly differ. In my take of it all, I don't particulary see or use Tarot for means of divination. I believe the Tarot can show you some past circumstances, and also your current tread. The 'future' part, which would be where divination comes into play can get rather sketchy. Alot people believe the Tarot can show where you are 'most likely' going to end up in your situation if you stay on the path you are on presently on. Everything is subject to change. That is where free will comes in. So I guess how you personally choose to view the Tarot will depend on alot of how you feel about its divination aspect. I tend to use the Tarot as a means of self exploration. I also explain 'how' I read the cards to anyone that wants mean to read for them (which I don't personally like to do, but...) so they know up front, I am not a fortune teller! lol!! I think that is all now..... Cindy ~

rob	12 Aug 2001
Well, this is an interesting thread. As some one who lurked alot before the rebuilding I'm glad to see that nothing has changed. As to the questions and answers here, I think that the major point everyone made that I most appreciated (as a Catholic myself) is that the tool, though it may be used for evil, is not evil unto itself. As others discovered, my priest also agrees with this. If you let ANYTHING rule your life it can be turned to evil. As to the bible, as many have already said, depending on your interpretation, there are passages in the new testament and old that are viewed as condemnation of divination. I don't accept that interpretation, but that's for me. If anyone is uncomfortable with the use of ANY tool, then I suggest you stay away from something that will cause you a dilema of concience. -rob

MeeWah	12 Aug 2001
Nexy: Thanks for the web addy & the additional info! I had a rough idea of where certain passages were located, so went through my bibles with a fine tooth comb :D It didn't occur to me to look online, but that's ok because now I shouldn't forget-- Rob: Welcome! Glad you've joined us--we are an eclectic group :) I grew up with strong Buddhist & Catholic influences & appreciate both. As I see Tarot & related studies as primarily vehicles for knowledge, I have no problem with the divinatory aspects. Knowledge is a two-edged sword. Having respect for knowledge as well as how one uses such knowledge or any other material are the keys.

Knight of Swords	20 Aug 2001
I'm a Christian (a "somewhat practicing" Episcopalian) and I read tarot. I view tarot as a tool that can be used for good or evil, and part of my ritual when doing a reading is a silent prayer for God's guidance, and that what I am about to do may be pleasing in His sight. By the way, I just found a Christian-themed deck called the Tarot of the Saints (published as a book/deck set by Llewellyn) that, as the title suggests, relates the lives of the saints to the tarot, especially the Major Arcana and court cards. I haven't worked with it too much yet, having just gotten it yesterday, but am eager to get to know this new deck. While the box says that the set is a "gnostic Christian" tarot, I think the emphasis should probably be on "Christian." There are some gnostic references, but most of the themes in the cards would be consistent with orthodox (small "o") Christianity.

Kimon	21 Aug 2001
Hi, in the bible St. Paul is talking a lot against it (as to many things), later Augustinus condemmed it (also as many other things). But this all is subject to interpretations; open-minded catholics said and are saying that they meant the heretic pagans that used divination in their cult. The main movement against divination was in the middle ages and up to the inquisition time, where not divination, but the witches (who used this) were the topic and the church was fighting for its existence by trying to kill all of them. Greetings, Kimon

Kiama	21 Aug 2001
Kimon: There is much contoversy over whether or not the Epistles were actually St Paul's actual words. Many now say that he was originally a Gnostic, but because the Church didn't like it at the time when the Bible was put together by Bishop Eusebius in the 5th Century, his words were cut and pasted with others', and his original messages were twisted. There is evidence though within original parts of the Epistles, which reference Gnostic ritual practices.... So th eidea that St Paul was against Gnostics, Pagans, the Elusean rites, and divination, is under scrutiny at the moment from various people such as Bible scholars, philosophers, archaeologists, etc.... Just some interesting info. Kiama

WaterQueene	22 Aug 2001
Good morning: I am a Roman Catholic (practicing) and I have been reading tarot and playing cards for clients for over a year now. I studied them for a decade before that. I never felt the presence of the Holy Spirit more strongly than I do when I am helping a client to unravel the issues in their lives. I think that reading the tarot can only enrich your spirituality ... whatever it is. If you feel conflicted over this, pray and try to tune in to the voices that guide you, whoever you believe they are: God, the angels, your higher self. You will find the answer you seek. But I think that as you work with the tarot, your fears will evaporate. Also, you may find that as time goes by, you will see more and more Magick in the Gospels. Jesus Christ was the greatest magician of all time. :) Good luck and God bless- K.

Dee 04	22 Aug 2001
Ditto Waterqueene!!! :D

The Christianity and Tarot thread was originally posted on 06 Aug 2001 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.