I'm so ticked . . .

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 31 Aug 2001, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Talisman	31 Aug 2001
'Lo all, You all talk about Miss Cleo, and I've never seen her. I guess you all have cable TV or something, and I've never bothered. But right now, even as I type, there is a guy on TV called John Dipshit, a psychic who communicates with the dead. "I feel there is someone in the audience who has a secret tattoo," he says (Wow!) and someone says, "Well yes, I have a tatoo." "Ah yes," says JD, "and you know someone who has died.' "Gasp!" Surprise. "I really do!" This stuff goes on and on. I mean, I'm listening right now. Like I said, I've never seen miss Cleo that you all talk about. But -- Good grief! Take your favorite tatot cards and nail 'em to a stump out in the pasture. Use 'em for target practice. Wait! Wait, I feel that someone is missing something. Something is missing . . . Let me know . . . If anyone in the reading audience is missing something, send me a bunch'a bucks and I'll send you my thoughts. Does anyone in the audience have something missing? Talisman knows all . . . Let me know. Talisman

EveAnna	31 Aug 2001
I've had emails from Miss Cleo, I hadn't hear about her before. The first email i received from her used my name, still not sure how her site got my email address, and said she could see i had a few problems and she could help - I went along to her site just out of curiosity, not something I usually do and realised at once it was a scam. All i had to do was phone in and one of her gifted tarot readers would sort out my life - just one problem I come from the UK so it was going to be one hefty phone call lol I didn't bother :)

schaea	31 Aug 2001
Hi there, I agree with you 100% It is people like these who make our, honest talents sound so "fake". Just the other day, I was talking to someone about the tarot (a potential client), and they sarcastically (sp?) replied, "Oh, and I bet you work with Miss Cleo, too." I strongly believe that if these TV psychics weren't such a crock, that I could have had that client and shown him great insight into his life. Just my two cents. Andrew.

Lunalicious	31 Aug 2001
It's the media and people (or companies?) like "Miss Cleo" that scare me. I'm afraid of what they'll think of next.

StarShine	01 Sep 2001
I can relate. People at work often tease me and call me "Miss Cleo" I just say, "No, she tells you what to do, I simply offer guidance and a new angle to think about things from." I agree, people like her give us all a bad name. If not that, then her commercials give us impossible shoes to fill. People are just amazed by her ability to see EXACTLY what is going on over the phone. It amazes me that there are people out there who think that by flipping a card she can actually see a dark haired man with a mustache and a scar on his d*#@ who is the daddy of some womans baby. PUH-LEEZE! Personally, before reading for any new Querent, I make it a point to tell them that I cannot predict the future because of free will, I cannot tell them what to do, and I cannot give them all the answers. All I can do is give them a new perspective on an old situation.

Kiama	01 Sep 2001
My boyf recently received an email from this Miss Cleo woman, who I've never seen until that email... She used his surname instead of his first name for starters, than went into some male-cow poo about how she had a dream about him and that she has never had such a vived dream about somebody before, so she just, out of the kindness of her own heart, had to email him and offer him 'help'... What a crock of poo! (Please replace any not so offensive language with very offensive language in your mind, cuz that's what I'd really like to say!) Kiama

Yarnie	01 Sep 2001
Ms Cleo makes me laugh! And John Edwards? Puh-leeze! I agree that these frauds harm the image of those with true gifts of intuition. Think maybe we could start a class-action lawsuit against Ms. Cleo? She's already got one fraud lawsuite pending against her. Maybe we could join the bandwagon! She's made enough to take care of us all! Maybe we should call her to find out if our lawsuit would be successful....hmmmmm?

tarotbear	01 Sep 2001
I only saw John Edwards on TV once- and was very disturbed by the generalities he dealt in yet people were convinced he was talking directly to them. 'I see an older woman with white hair... a small child with a bandage on his knee' - you know the type of crap I mean. What made it more amazing that just before the show the network aired a 'piece' where a 'debunker' showed one of the news staff exactly how to fake it,...and the audience, who didn't know this man from Adam BELIEVED that the faux psychic host was telling them crap just like John Edwards does! Like I always said if 'Lazarus' isn't real, Jach who has been channelling him for 20+ years deserves an Oscar award. Beware the well-paid person on TV who has 'all the answers'.

Jimilyn	01 Sep 2001
Quote: Yarnie (01 Sep, 2001 21:32): Think maybe we could start a class-action lawsuit against Ms. Cleo? She's already got one fraud lawsuite pending against her. Maybe we could join the bandwagon! She's made enough to take care of us all! Maybe we should call her to find out if our lawsuit would be successful....hmmmmm? :D I love it! I love it! :D I do declare that all of these media scam folks irritate the living tar out of me. There are the Miss Cleos, the televangelists, the lawyers...and on and on and on. Of course, there are probably some legitimate ones out there as well, but the dishonest ones give *everyone* a bad name. :'( So unfortunate. Jimilyn

RiotFemme	01 Sep 2001
Ok...so answer me this? If the Miss Cleos and John Edwards of the world give folks like us a bad name, and we get made fun of, and people don't believe in what we do, then why are the Miss Cleos and John Edwards so gosh darn popular and hugely successful?? What's with this crazy contradiction? By the way, I'm proud to announce that I live in Florida, the very same state where Miss Cleo does her thing from...LOL. Anyway, the company she works for did get hit with a big lawsuit, but not for fraud. It's actually for breaking some law that says such companies are not allowed to call people's homes if they have said they don't want to be bothered.

Zac	02 Sep 2001
"...some male-cow poo about how she had a dream about him and that she has never had such a vived dream about somebody before, so she just, out of the kindness of her own heart, had to email him and offer him 'help'..." ~~~~~~ That is VERY interesting, because I got the exact same e-mail. If she's never seen me, and we've never met, then how on earth does she know I was in the dream? By my screen name???? And I dread the idea of someone asking me to tell them something like she does, you know... ."You have a box, under a table, wrapped in a ribbon. The documents you are looking for are in that box." Like how the HELLo am I supposed to know that? I don't even know where MY stuff is! I spent two hours this morning looking for a missing detachable pant leg, if I couldn't find that, how am I supposed to know where anything else is??? But really, I'd like to know her secret, lol. I'm still missing my pantleg. BTW, I've been camping, so I've been away for a while, if anyone missed me. :-p

Mojo	02 Sep 2001
I have decided that my role here in the forums is to provide the dissenting opinion, so here I go again. I think Miss Cleo is the best thing to hit Tarot in decades. Sure, she's probably a fraud. Sure, she's probably only interested in milking people out of a lot of money. But guess, what... that's just getting back to Tarot's ancient roots. Throughout history, Tarot has been associated with gypsies, tramps and thieves (apologies to Cher) and it has certainly been used for financial gain. Miss Cleo has just turned it into what today's masses want: a razzle-dazzle sideshow where people can feel better about themselves for just a little while, even if they have to pay for it. If she has the talent to keep the masses flocking to their telephones to talk to her, then she deserves her paycheck. I don't mind making a buck off it, that's for sure. It's a talent and a skill equal to that of any professional in any field anywhere. And face it, for those of us who do this for pay, Miss Cleo has been damned good for business. She has single-handedly brought about a Tarot Renaissance. We're on people's IN lists these days thanks to Miss Cleo. I don't understand this thing that so many people in here have about Tarot being some sort of sacred rite or something. It started out as a game. It has been practiced throughout time as a game, and not always an honest one. And it's still a game. I don't know about you guys, but I have a lot of fun when I'm doing a reading for someone. I don't mind the Miss Cleo jokes, even when they're at my expense. When people ask me if I know Miss Cleo, I just wink at them and tell them that I taught her everything she knows.

Jimilyn	02 Sep 2001
Quote: RiotFemme (02 Sep, 2001 12:08): Ok...so answer me this? If the Miss Cleos and John Edwards of the world give folks like us a bad name, and we get made fun of, and people don't believe in what we do, then why are the Miss Cleos and John Edwards so gosh darn popular and hugely successful?? What's with this crazy contradiction? Beats me! I definitely do *not* think like the majority of people out there. I don't read what they read, watch the TV and movies they watch, listen to the music they listen to. I don't admire or dislike the same people they do. I simply don't understand the tastes of most people. So I certainly don't understand why they are drawn to certain people only to turn around and say negative things about them and then turn back around and spend/donate more money. Never figured it out. I didn't mention John Edwards before because I don't know who he is. I've only seen one or two commercials for Miss Cleo, but my immediate and strong impression was that it's not where I'd be putting my money. I got one of those emails from her, too. Good grief!!! She expects me to actually believe that *she's* sooooooo concerned for *me* and that she dreamed about me???? Buncha bunk. :D Her being personally concerned for me is just about as true as me being the Easter Bunny. I guess people criticize Miss Cleo and turn around and partake of her services for the same reason they say that some of those talk shows are "trash TV" yet they watch them faithfully every day. And it's not just Miss Cleo...I mentioned TV evangelists and the lawyers that beg you to come to them so they can win you big money in a lawsuit. Like I said before, some may be legit, but I believe that most are not. It's not all Miss Cleo's fault, or the evangelists' fault, or the lawyers' fault. There are those people who are willing to spend their time and money there. Well, whatever floats their boat. ;) Jimilyn

destinyawaitsme	02 Sep 2001
Ok, as much as I hate to admit this...I'm going to do it anyway. I'll tell all of you a little story. A long long time ago (ok, about february or march) an 18 year old girl was up late at night watching infomercials. The girl was filled with anxiety, and an unsettling feeling of not being content with...well anything. She was a lone kitten walking the big bumpy gravel road at night with no stars or moon in sight to guide her. BUt all of a sudden a plump ethnic woman arrived on tv....she was jovial, straightforward, and a neat accent to boot! This woman spoke of Tarot! (isn't that those witchcraft cards?...the little girl thought.) The little girl finished watching the infomercial and immediately headed for the internet...to get all the information she could about tarot....what it is, what it does, what it stands for. And after getting several readings from the internet the girl purchased her own deck...and began to study as much as she could about the cards...everyday she practiced, so that one day she could help other people...and even help herself in the process. Ok, so if you haven't figured out already, that story is about me. Yes, as much as I hate to admit it, I was interested in tarot by watching an infomercial. But, it has turned out to be such a great experience for me and my life. I know tarot isn't responsible for turning around my life...I am, but I didn't know where to even begin to make things better...and I didn't even know that I had control over my life...I thought fate was just going to hand you what you deserved. So you can criticize Miss Cleo all you want. Yes, she does give a false picture of what tarot is about and what it can do. But she turned me on to the cards...someone finally convinced me that God wasn't going to strike me with a big bolt of lightning if I looked at them. So, believe it or not, I guess she is my mentor. Oh, and I love John Edwards. Give him a chance!

nexyjo	02 Sep 2001
Quote: destinyawaitsme (03 Sep, 2001 01:17): *clip* So you can criticize Miss Cleo all you want. Yes, she does give a false picture of what tarot is about and what it can do. But she turned me on to the cards...someone finally convinced me that God wasn't going to strike me with a big bolt of lightning if I looked at them. So, believe it or not, I guess she is my mentor. Oh, and I love John Edwards. Give him a chance! i love it - there is balance in everything. nothing intrinsically is good or bad - components of each permeate every event. it is up to us to decide how we react to these events. destiny choose to educate herself as a result of the very same event from which others chose to rant. the young can just as easily teach the old. destiny, you are a breath of fresh air. thank you! luv and light, nexy

truthsayer	02 Sep 2001
i don't think john edwards is a complete fraud for several reasons. one is the way he seems to look inward instead of directly at the audience. if he looked directly at the audience i would think he was a mentalist and figuring out what meant to who by reading body language. he even tells ppl to be quiet and not give him info so he can prove he is really in contact w/ someone. some of the material that he dredges up seem so directly personal that i have a hard time believing that what he came up w/ was faked in any way. he also shows tapes of readings that he gave that didn't go well. the way he gives his impressions of what he sees also reminds me of how i read tarot cards at times. imagery and words will just come to my mind that make no logical sense to me and i try to communicate clearly to the other person what that imagery means. he does seem to want to help ppl. i haven't seen a tremendous amount of evidence yet that he's just out to use his gift for money. i don't have a prob w/ a person using talents to support themselves. it's just when i see that the person is using that success in vain and greedy ways. i do have a prob w/ sylvia browne. in the beginning i liked her but i have talked to ppl via the net who've met her in person and felt disillusioned. i've been to her website and been astonished by the amount of money requested for services. sylvia herself charges $600 an hour for a reading. even miss cleo isn't that bad. the way she is pouring books out can't be humanly possible considering her public appearances, travel, readings, family time, personal time and time for writing. someone suggested to me--you know who you are ;) -- that she has help writing her books. it makes sense to me! sylvia is 60+ y/o recently had a facelift and is constantly changing her hair color. i didn't recognize her face at first on her latest book. i don't mind ppl looking their best but to me she seems a bit too arrogant and vain for a truly spiritual person. john edwards has moments that he stumbles on the screen but sylvia's tv performances always seem a bit too perfect. that makes me suspicious of her. i also have found inconsistencies in what she says and what's in the books. the main prob i have w/ psychic hotlines is that they seem to take advantage of ppl who are the most desparate emotionally and lacking financially. it wouldn't bother me as much if the hotlines made less money. right now they make more per hour than most mental health therapists and psychiatrists who are better trained and able to help desparate ppl. i also think phone psychics should receive training in crisis intervention, when to determine someone is suicidal, and when they are in over their heads w/ someone who needs more help than a phone psychic can give. anyhow just my 2 1/2 cents worth!!!!!!! no offense to anyone!

GeminiLady	02 Sep 2001
I wasn't planning on responding to this, as I am normally more comfortable when I go with the flow...I'm with Destiny on this one though.. Out of fairness, the reason I am a fan of John Edward is that I have read his books, (his first one particuarly, and his third which I am still reading-also very good-and surprisingly, some good stories about his ethics), Listened to his tapes--which were also quite helpful. Sure, the stuff on tv is ok to watch, but I don't feel it is always representative of the whole picture. Yes, sometimes he is vague, and sometimes he is wrong. Sometimes he even just may have a bad session. However, in reading his books, it explained so many of the things that I was beginning to experience at that time. I "see" things too...not as clearly as John does but I do understand how easily it is to not grab that flash of an image fast enough to interpet it correctly. I've also heard things--again--not near as clearly as John appears to hear them. Often I get songs, or fast snips of something. So I don't doubt for a minute that it happens and that there are others out there that have the ability to "tune in" as well. When you get down to it, we are all just human and we can all miss things and misinterpet things. That said..I don't feel that you can get a clear picture of John until you have at least read his books-even if you borrow from the library instead of buying them. As far as his tapes go, he is the reason that I started tarot. His tapes are the whole reason when I felt the squeeze for money, I turned down the offer from a tarot line that insisted I didn't need any skills, they could teach me everything and be ready to go in 1-2 days. BTW, that particualar line also encouraged me to shuffle regular cards so that the caller really believed he was getting a reading. --I politely declined that job- hearing the words from that tape.."be ethical and be honest". (BTW at the time I looked at this job, I had never even touched a tarot deck-but it did make me realize I wanted to learn). This post reminded me of something that happened a couple of weeks ago. A friend of mine was visiting, and as often happens, I "saw" someone standing behind her. I gave her the description as quickly as I could, but as I heard myself describe it, I realized how vague it sounded. I wished that I could have given her a better description, but I gave her exactly what I saw. (To make things worse, I don't see in color, only black and white). We are certainly all entitled to our opinions, and that's fine. I really hope that your whole decision isn't based on one or two shows. He has more to offer than is coming across on tv. BTW I defintely agree he is getting paid A LOT of money...I don't know what it takes to support what he does, but I know I can't afford a reading. I don't know many that can. Too bad, personally, I feel he could help many more people if his rates were lower (much lower) He does have a 2 1/2 year waiting list though, so what do I know... I am pretty much undecided on the miss cleo thing. There could be something there, maybe guides, or spirits helping her, but I just don't know enough to make a judgement. Sorry for the loooooong post, this one touched a tender spot. Love and Light, Gem

Kiama	02 Sep 2001
WHO'S JOHN EDWARDS??!!! WWWWWHHHHOOOO??!!! I'm lost... Kiama

truthsayer	02 Sep 2001
gemini lady, please reread my post. i know my posts aren't always clear but i really like john edwards very much. i haven't read any of his books but i consider him the tv psychic w/ the most integrity that i've seen. i consider his admissions that he isn't perfect part of his personal integrity and charm. personally, i don't trust any psychic who tries to come across as infallible. he is very human and i like that. i often watch his shows. for those of you who don't know who john edwards is, i have cable and watch him on the scifi channel. when i have money that isn't delegated to buying tarot cards i'll take your advice gem and buy one of his books. if he is as genuine in his books as he is on tv then i'm certain that i'll like his books very much. got a particular title you can recommend? another person i really like is gary zukav. he doesn't pretend to be psychic but he's very intuitive and has lots of integrity. i'm undecided on james van pragh. i do know i definitely don't like the psychic who calls herself char. when i've seen her on tv, she seems to have a verbally abusive way about her to ppl asking questions. she'll go thru the alphabet asking if the person knows someone who has a name beginning w/ a certain letter. i've never seen anyone yet who could figure out what she was getting at. i guess if your reputation and lots of money are on the line you might feel that gives you a license to be verbally abusive. i have no respect for her or her techniques.

Rhiannon	02 Sep 2001
Agreeing with Mojo! To a point. I still think Miss Cleo is full of it, but she's also making big bank. She has brought alot of interest into tarot again as well. I told a friend of mine that I read and he said "Ok, I'll ask a question as long as you don't charge as much as Miss Cleo!" and my response was "No, It'll only cost you your regular long distance rates. Try 10-10-220 or something. ;) " I like watching John Edwards too. He's kinda creepy though, even through the TV. Rhiannon :)

GeminiLady	02 Sep 2001
Truthsayer, I'm sorry if I came across as directing my message to you or anyone particular on the board. What I was going for is just a general "this is what I think". I respect everyone's opinion here, and I think that everyone is entitled to their own thoughts. Sometimes the atmosphere doesn't come across clearly here on the net though, so if that is the case, I certainly apologize.--it may have been where I hit the reply button at that made it look like I was directing it your way...? never really thought about that when I posted... Actually, I was wondering if the sylvia brown topic would come up, and like you, truth, I really liked her at first. I have noticed though, that in the last couple of years, I see a lot of repeating in her books. hmmm....and a lot of new books.... I haven't seen Char, and from what you said, I probably wouldn't care for her. --One of the reasons I like John is his "humanity". I like that he is not afraid to admit that he can be wrong. Anyone who is interested in reading his first book (library or bookstore, no difference) it's called "One Last Time". For personal reasons,(you all know by now, some odd things happen to me) it really touched me. Truthsayer, I really hope no hard feelings, I respect your opinion, and I respect everyone's opinion here. That's how we grow. *S* Love and Light, Gem

truthsayer	03 Sep 2001
i was never upset, gem. i just wanted to make sure the lines of communication were clear on all sides of the issue at hand. simple misunderstandings can start the stupidest flame wars. my mother is a huge sylvia brown fan. she reads everything the woman writes and marks places in the books that i just "HAVE TO READ"!!!! out of respect i do but i haven't seen anything to date that made me think sylvia has extraordinary gifts. i think mom thinks sylvia is the new messiah :D !!! what worries me is that i'm afraid sylvia thinks she is, too! :-o i have trouble accepting the Bible and nobody wrote the Bible as quickly as she's writing these books. there were prob centuries b/t different books of the Bible so ppl had time to learn and grow. unless you count the experience of different lifetimes, SB has done all hers in the past 10 years or so. SB fans, please forgive my sarcasm (and don't tell mom!) ;D my sarcasm is for entertainment purposes only like my multiple references to the so called "elvis" archetype. now how many of you actually thought i was serious about that? i can "see" many hands raising thru my computer screen... :p :D :o

magnwa	03 Sep 2001
I have a friend who went to John Edwards show. At the beginning of it, they make you sit in a room with the audience for fifty minutes. During this time, they tape record things that you are saying, and everyone is asked to remain as quiet as they can while they "channel." Then, John comes out, and basically repeats what his lackeys (He has a staff around, just listening) hear and what he can cold read deduce. Even then, he doesn't hit very much. The real magic is when you say "Yes.. " Just once. Then his production staff edits your "Yes" answer onto a few things, removes all the bad hits (My friend said he got about 20% , maybe less..) and puts it into a 30 minute show. Here's a hint.. they film 4 hours worth of video for that 30 minute show. :) Magnwa

GeminiLady	03 Sep 2001
wow, I've never attended any of John's shows, but that is sure enough to make you think...honestly, if I had that experience I'd sure walk away disillusioned. I guess I want so much to believe that he is the real thing because he opened things up for me. Plus, the fact that he got his start doing readings with "the cards" ... John, if you are out there, say it isn't so!!! LOL...ok...ok...if this guy is ever proved to be a fraud feel free to thump me on the head...:) I'll take it like a trooper, but it'll be a sad day for me. Love and Light, Gem...or should I just rename myself Queen of cups...hahaha

MystiqueMoonlight	03 Sep 2001
Greetings everyone, I suppose the issue of charlatan vs sharman is a complex point in today's society. I have always read palms. I tell people that I do this by deciphering the lines on their hands because that is what they want to believe. In actual fact a do it by the simple touch of their hand in mine. If I told them this they are less likely to believe what I see and tell them. I suppose in some ways this makes me a fake. I'm not really doing what I tell them I am even though my readings are always accurate. I then went on to read the cards. Similarly I read on intuition. If people are to believe (and most do) that the cards are the actual medium which provides the guidance to the querent not the reader then maybe that makes me a fake too. I have to admit that I have been amused and bemused by those people who have tried to diligently digest and recall every passage in the accompanying books that come with the cards as they believe that is the only way to truly read them (ie: the tradition meaning of the 7of Swords means this becuase that is what the author tell me it means). Who is right? The card reader who remembers all of the meanings in accordance to the book or the intuitive reader? Who is wrong? I have never heard of these two people that you all are up in in arms about, but I suppose they do have a right to interpret what they do in the fashion in which they do. Sure they may not be "real" they may even be "fakes". Live and let live. Rise above it and show the world that what YOU do IS real. These people exist in all walks of life; solicitors, judges, doctors, artists, astrologers etc. But their profession is respected and revered. Gain strength from this Miss Cleo and Edwards fellow you can learn from what they are doing and channel your energies into your skill. Blessed be and may the guiding light of the Divine light your pathway through life. MystiqueMoonlight.

Yarnie	03 Sep 2001
(a la John's patois....) "I'm getting a sentence. It's a short sentence. It's a very old sentence that has become a cliche." (gasps come from audience) "Ok. Ok. Now I'm getting it clearer. Here it is. The sentence is..." (presses fingers to forehead) "'Buyer Beware.' Does that mean anything to anyone? No. Ok. Ok. Here comes another one. This one is coming in faster. It's a longer sentence. Here it is..." (audience holds its breath in anticipation) "'Don't believe anything you hear and only half of what you see.' Does that mean anything to anyone?" (fade to black)

Jimilyn	03 Sep 2001
Yarnie, ROFL! :D ROFL! :D ROFL! :D Very good! Jimilyn

truthsayer	03 Sep 2001
yarnie, that was terrific and very funny! :D i really don't think anyone is angry or up in arms about this topic. it just happens to be a very interesting subject that's getting lots of feedback. i've had a dangerous thought about why "psychics" are so popular...seeing a psychic isn't as taboo as it is to see a member of the mental health system.your car being seen at the local shrink's office is a great way to ruin a career or reputation. you suddenly become "CRAZY" to everyone you know. ppl start pulling their kids in off the street or sick the dog on you when you walk by their house. ppl laughed off nancy reagan consulting an astrologer. ppl would have been shocked if she had seen a psychotherapist. "the first lady's in therapy! OH MY GOD! what is going to happen to the country! the country's going to hell in a china cabinet!!!" however, i have a solution for all of this. ;D :p have legit psychiatrists and psychotherapist start their own psychic hotlines and charge like the other ones do. 8-) that way ppl get the counseling they really need and aren't bashed by the mental health treatment taboo. they can pay via their phone bill and insurance never has to be involved. ppl also don't have to know they are getting real help either. PSYCHotherapists might make what their education is worth--$200 to $300 an hour prob on psychic hotlines against the $100+ they make now(at least around here). the really heavy ammo psychics--the PSYCHiatrist would have to make $500 or $600 and could include prescriptions meds(herbal treatments), too. 8) if a person needs psychiatric hospitalization it might be kind of hard to explain how a psychic hotline got you there! (truth is rofl at these thoughts.)****it's okay if you don't understand her wacky sense of humor. she's used to it! you'd prob have to have worked in human services to totally get the absurdity of it all. ;)**** :D :D :p ;D :o :-o :D

Jimilyn	03 Sep 2001
truthsayer!!! That's toooo funny. :D Quite creative, too. :) Although you have a great selling point in being able to bypass insurance. :D :o :p :D Jimilyn

magnwa	03 Sep 2001
Nevermind.. I found it :) Ignore post. Double post cause I couldn't find page two :)

Kiama	04 Sep 2001
I have been to two of these Psychic show thing sin the past two years. One was with Keith Charles: He's a cop, and he's psychic, and he lives in Britain. I went with my friend Luke, and we sat in the audience with my father, who was looking very sceptical. Keith Charles walked on the stage, and the lights went up, and he started chatting. Then he went into it. He was very accurate, and I'd say about 80% of what he said hit the spot... The most amazing one was where two ladies were sitting opposite to me and Luke in the row across: Keith asked if there was a Sarah in the audience. Five women put their hands up. He then asked if they had a dog called Samantha. One woman remained with her hand up. He looked at her, and went into something about she had distant relatives who were miners. She said she doesn't know, but that her family is Welsh, so it could be right: She didn't know much about her family's history. Then the man said, yeah, but I'm getting a relative's name as Lucy... Do you know a dead relative called Lucy? And this woman next to Sarah gasped and said, yep that's me, I'm Sarah's twin sister! Just three names he picked out of billions. All were right. All shoes fit the foot.... This same man reduced one widow to tears by telling her that her 'Bertie', who she used to call 'Snuggle Bum' (BTW: If you have anything to hide, don't go see this man!) was telling her to take his old mucky hanky out of her handbag and wash it! She cried, and revealed that in her handbag was the hanky he had in his pocket when he died.. Kieth also used the dead man's mannerisms saying 'You silly bugger' to the woman. The audeince was shocked, but the woman said that that was her husbands' fave saying... My father came away from that show feeling alot less scpetical, but he still reckons those people were set ups... Personally, I'd like to believe they weren't set ups. I'm not sceptcial. and I don't see what people find so hard to believe about talking to people after they die. I mean, when we die it is only our bodies that decay... Science has proven that the energy remains th esame, because energy cannot be destroyed: It merely changes form. So why can't we still communicate with the dead guys!? Surely live transcends life and death.... Kiama

Yarnie	04 Sep 2001
(bows graciously) Thank you...glad you enjoyed my little funsie! I agree that its an interesting subject and I'm glad to see so many varying opinions come out regarding Ms. Cleo and John Edwards. (Not to mention that its nice to see that this discussion hasn't sunk into a flame war!) Personally, I think I come closer to believing John Edwards than Ms. Cleo (who, in my opinion, is WAY over the top!), who obviously is a fantastic business woman--I won't venture to guess her aptitude with tarot since I have no personal experience on which to base an opinion. Actually, John Edwards' apparent talent is only a step or two away from the gift of psychic sensitivity that seems to run in my family. Contact with those on the other side is something that I'm more familiar with than tarot. (shrugs) Maybe that is why I'm a bit more skeptical of Ms. Cleo than John. CAVEAT: Don't take this as an endorsement of one of these people over the other. This is just my opinion and, as far as I know, they could both be the biggest fakes or the most gifted that is out there. As stated in my "funsie" post, "Believe nothing that you hear and only half of what you see."

destinyawaitsme	04 Sep 2001
I forgot who said something about therapy, but I guess this is a kind of reply to that. The reason psychics are so popular is because I thnk you can always blow it off and say, "well I was just curious...I wanted to see if it was real or not." BUt no one would spend an hour at a therapist and spend 120 bucks just to say, "um...i wanted to see what it was like." I wish there wasn't such a stigma attatched to mental health...my mom and brother are manic depressive...it doesn't mean your crazy...it's a disease. I think you should be considered crazy if you have real live problems and you soley stick to a tarot reader for all your advice. True, tarot is a great tool, but it you can't talk back to it. It should never replace therapy. I have read for people that seriously have problems (not that everybody doesn't...i'm talking about big ones that stress me out by just hearing about them.) that I could read for them for hours and still not get all the answers to their questions. So, sometimes I do reccomend counseling...because frankly everyone needs it! People go for all sorts of reasons, to learn how to raise a kid, or how to get along with other people. Saying you don't need counseling is saying that there's no reason for you to go to school because you know everything there is to know. Ok, after all that rambling I forgot what I started out to say but basically...um...yeah.

tarotbear	04 Sep 2001
What was that movie a few years' back when Steve Martin played the phony evangelist who staff did the same thing- followed people around listening to then, recording when they said, then transmitting the info to Steve by headset ' The lady in the front row of section two, in the hat with the red cherries- her unwed daughter is pregnant'. He then came up with some BS line and led into the fact that her daughter had a big problem and had something important to tell her. The audience was always amazed at what he 'knew'. I think it was called 'Leap of Faith'.

Logiatrix	04 Sep 2001
i'm with mojo, destiny, et al... the aforementioned t.v. personalities have served as wonderful "spring-boards" for discussing tarot with people--eventual querents, whom i believe would have had no other reference for it other than the negative, but instead were allowed to be curious. like it or not, "pop" culture does that sometimes! i enjoyed john edwards' biography, for what that's worth. my take on his work is this: whether his or miss cleo's or anybody else's gifts are as they profess them to be, and truly merit the commerce represented, i think that is between him/her and Spirit. hopefully, one who serves others with such gifts doesn't forget Who provided the gift! ;)

tarotbear	04 Sep 2001
It's kind of interesting to note that this forum is filled with many of us who are in the field, yet we are skeptical of others in the same field.

truthsayer	04 Sep 2001
Quote: destinyawaitsme (04 Sep, 2001 23:26): I forgot who said something about therapy, but I guess this is a kind of reply to that. The reason psychics are so popular is because I thnk you can always blow it off and say, "well I was just curious...I wanted to see if it was real or not." BUt no one would spend an hour at a therapist and spend 120 bucks just to say, "um...i wanted to see what it was like." I wish there wasn't such a stigma attatched to mental health...my mom and brother are manic depressive...it doesn't mean your crazy...it's a disease. I think you should be considered crazy if you have real live problems and you soley stick to a tarot reader for all your advice. True, tarot is a great tool, but it you can't talk back to it. It should never replace therapy. I have read for people that seriously have problems (not that everybody doesn't...i'm talking about big ones that stress me out by just hearing about them.) that I could read for them for hours and still not get all the answers to their questions. So, sometimes I do reccomend counseling...because frankly everyone needs it! exactly my point, destiny! i once worked for a crisis hotline and some of the ppl i hear on these shows w/ psychics are so much like the ppl i once counseled. you can consult a psychic for "fun" and blow off the $120+ you spent. but if you go for some real help that means you have to come out of denial and face the fact you have real probs that may be an illness that requires meds or something you need objective support w/. you can still kid yourself some things aren't as bad as you thought if a call to a psychic helps w/ the prob. i think the key to tarot or any intuitive ability is about the forgotten art of LISTENING. so much suffering in this world could be eased if we could slow down our busy lives and listen to each others pain. being busy only hides the real you that comes out after everyone else has gone to bed and the only place left to call is the psychic hotline. sad statement for our modern society. tarotbear--i agree it is indeed interesting that as intuitives ourselves we are so suspicious of others who claim to have similar gifts. could it be some jealousy that we aren't making the big bucks like them? instead of doing what our hearts call us to do, we are all stuck in the same mundane jobs? i'm a nursing student. don't think for one minute i wouldn't rather be self supporting reading tarot cards. at least i can be honest w/ myself about this. the only thing holding me back is fear. fear of not making it financially, of being rejected, laughed at, of being doubted like tv psychics... ;D

Jimilyn	04 Sep 2001
Or maybe we are correctly skeptical sometimes...our own intuition may be letting us in on the other person's true abilities. Jimilyn :)

Yarnie	05 Sep 2001
To expand on Jimilyn's post: Perhaps we are skeptics because our subconscious sees just enough evidence to cause our intuition to timidly raise its hand and say, "Hoax?" I've often heard intuition defined as the ability to take the tiniest bits of information, correctly discern the hidden parts, and come up with a meaningful part of the whole picture. Perhaps that is what we have done: we've seen things that don't fit with being genuine, we've seen how the "phone-a-psychic" industry works (remember that article someone posted the link for in the old fora?), and our intuition is saying "hey, something's not quite right here!" (shrugs) Oh, well, just my rambling away in the pre-dawn hour with some thoughts on this.

The I'm so ticked . . . thread was originally posted on 31 Aug 2001 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.