Getting out of the tarot-closet...

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 08 Apr 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Jenny-Li	08 Apr 2002
Hi everyone! Back again, thought I'd try and squeeze you guys for some more interesting tarot-stories and experiences here...! ;) When I came to the forum I actually thought I was the only one in the world of tarot-readers who cultivate this interest/passion in silence and secrecy. Now I have heard (well, read) the word "tarot-closet" a couple of times, and have realized there are a few of us out there (or should I say "in here" - in the closet...?) When I took up Tarot, I wanted to get to know it by myself, in my own time, without having to answer any tricky questions before I'd figured out the answers for myself, and so I never told anyone. Hardly even my parents know, even today - my fiancé is the only one, and he can hardly miss it, if I'm not sitting somewhere flipping cards, I'm reading in a book about them, or making notes in my journal about them...! But I'm getting tired of always just reading to myself (my fiance is superstitious, he let's me do whatever I want, but he will never let me read for him. And as he wouldn't take it seriously anyway, I don't think I'd want to either...!), and I would like to sit down with an other person and do readings "for real". Not for strangers, I have no wish to get out THAT much... just for friends. But how should I suggest a reading to someone who have no idea I do this at all? How do you explain quick and simple what kind of answers the Tarot can - and cannot give? How would you do? And, of course, how do I get out of this closet...?!! :D I imagine (and hope...!) there are at least a few of you who has dealt with this questions - I'd love to hear about how you slammed that closet door open...!! Love and light! Jenny :-)

Silence Dogood	08 Apr 2002
Jenny- not an easy question to answer. Many of us have a 'sliding door' on our tarot closet because some things are not for everyone to know. And the main reason is probably safety. Yes, safety from those who find it is 'suddenly' their job to tell you how bad you are, how fast you're going to hell (my handbasket has a nice bow on it) and whatever else we talked about in another thread - in other words we hide to save us from the religious nuts ( thanx, Kiama, for that clever quotation). Here on the internet you can be safely anonymous; in your company cafeteria you are not. Walt Whitman, the acknowledged gay American poet was widely recognised even in his own time for his 'gay' poetry. He did not push the issue since I'm sure he was glad to be a pioneer, but he did not want to become a martyr. Don't become the poster child for Tarot.

destinyawaitsme	08 Apr 2002
well, coming from Bible Belt USA it's hard to wear a big sign on your forehaed that says you read tarot cards. First of all with a lot of the psychic hotline scandals (Jamacian woman who shall remain nameless) it's hard to be seen as valid or credible. Also, many people think it's stupid to make life decisions on the basis of what a deck of paper cards say. (hehe..if people say this they know nothing about tarot, therefore shouldn't judge it). Also, you could be told you are burning in hell...and let's not forget those miscellaneaous weird looks. There are many times when I have gone to bookstores and bought a deck and gotten this look of fear from the cashier...like I was going to go home and practice my voodoo on her. Let's face it...there are some ignorant folks out there. So I can completely understand how someone would want to stay in the "tarot closet" so to speak. BUt I have come to face the fact, why do I care what ignorant people think of me?? But to tell you the truth. I keep my tarot readings on the down-low. There are some people I feel that I can talk to it about...and some I can't. I keep it on a need to know basis. So to answer your question...I have one foot out and one in. I wish I could be open and tell everyone and they have respect for my beliefs, ut honestly, we all know it will never happen...so...don't feel bad for being in the closet. lvoe and light destiny

Malachite	08 Apr 2002
I think in my case its not so much a closet as three wooden walls that happen to be around me...living at home has problems... I know my family don't object...they already know i have a tarot deck, and other mildly occult things. However, my dad's a bit conservative on some issues, and i've never dared raise the issue...My mum just doesn't really take it seriously...she's the kind of person that used to go to gypsy fairs to hear about the tall dark stranger, in centuries past... Also, most of my closest friends see it as something interesting, but on the whole, don;t really care....so i've got used to not really talking about it... Still, I should be able to be a bit more open about it once i go to uni...

Jenny-Li	08 Apr 2002
Hi! And thanks for the replies I've had so far, maybe I'm not so bad off after all - I don't think I'm running any real risk of being hunted down by "religious nuts" - people in this country don't generally give much for church anyway, and burn in hell is not something anyone would predict for anyone else, without being considered VERY odd. (I think that person would rate a lot higher on the "weird-o-meter" than a tarot-reader, actually...!) I don't have to worry about getting funny looks from the lady behind the cashier, because there's only a handfull bookstores in this city that sell Tarot-stuff at all, and out of those there's only one with a decent range do choose from, and in there the only reason people stare is because I look so NORMAL... (Which is a very odd feeling too, I can tell you...!) (By normal I mean nothing else than the observation, that if I go in there after work, wearing work clothes or (my, my, my) a suit - then I really get the feeling they think I'm in the wrong place!) Anyways, I was thinking more of how did you let your _friends_ know you've fallen for Tarot? Or do you all just hang out with other "readers" - naaaah, I can't believe that...! The worst case scenario for me, I think is if the person I talk to asks questions I don't feel I can answer, or question the whole thing and I'll end up not being able to argue for what I believe in (which has never happened before, but there's a first for everything, right...?) - I'm afraid that might put me out of touch with the whole thing... Does that mean it's not time for me yet...? Or does it just mean I'm not sure how much I can trust my friends...? ...hm... :confused:

fairyhedgehog	08 Apr 2002
Hi Jenny, You do ask some really interesting questions, I've been reading them and the responses with great interest. I'm 'out' to my husband and sons, but not my mum or sister. I'm not out to friends, although one saw my website and said something about it being surprising (but he said it in a nice way.) I'm just dreading the moment someone sees my website and discusses it with my mum, sister, work colleague etc. In fact, I'm seriously thinking of taking out the Tarot stuff and having it on a separate site which doesn't include my real name.... One close friend saw my first Tarot deck, but I have never read for her and I'm not sure how to offer. One friend was very disparaging when I mentioned it, she 'thought better of me' :eek: One friend I've told recently actually seemed interested and has been to tarot readers. Yay! There's hope yet. So, in Surrey and Croydon UK, it is probably best to have one foot in and one foot out of the closet :) Regards, FH

Pedeka	08 Apr 2002
Ive had to be more "in" than I like and more "out" than I like at different times. I started working with tarot it was much more public than it should have been, because it started out as a prop between shows to keep the crowds around. (put myself through college by preforming with a "gypsy" troup, firebreathing , bellydancing, juggling, bed of nails etc...) I had no clue what I was doing and the other woman in the troup kept her "secrets" about things like tarot cards. Once I got serious and started studying, I liked less and less people to know about it. The speach where I justify that I dont worship the devil just got to old to repeat. Plus it seemed that the people that didnt think it was evil, CONSTANTLY wanted readings. I turned into their free "Miss Cleo". I have also moved into careers where I was a teacher, and ran a child care and have been training in nursing homes.I do not want peoples prejustices to get in the way of the fact that I am an intelligent, caring, and moral person. The fact is people get even more judgemental when you are taking care of their child or sick mother. I "came out" to a co-worker at my last job when she dropped her bag of runes out of her purse accidentally. It was our guilty secret. We had lots of fun laughing at people. Plus I always had her as a back up if someone thought tarot was odd of me to do. I could always say well "Grandma Phyllis" does psychometery and runes and you don't think anythings wrong with her. Personally, I think life is tough enough without encouraging others to question me or my motives for doing what I do. I dont lie or hide, I just dont share the information too quickly. Im thinking about teaching a basic tarot course through local community adult classes. Ill just have to work that out with myself, although I dont think anyone that would enroll in a class would be too wierd about it. It might just be my guilty conscience. I was raised with a strict Luthern pastor for a Grandfather and he taught that Catholics were idolators for having statues and praying to saints. My knees get shakey just thinking about what hed think about me if he had known about the tarot cards. Pedeka

MeeWah	08 Apr 2002
I can relate to Destiny's "need to know basis". There are phrases that come to mind: Cast not thy pearls before swine. Silence is golden. I think most of the people who know me know I practice Tarot. That includes relatives (about a third of whom ignore or disapprove); friends, neighbors, co-workers--some by word-of-mouth. I choose to be careful with whom I share my interests. I am not eager to publicise because past experience has indicated that I will get hit on as a convenient reader for free readings. I am not unwilling to be of assistance, but being taken advantage of is something else! In addition, the area I reside in is also home to extremists of all ilks. Despite the diversity of the population, there have been incidents of hate crimes--cross-burnings & other acts of vandalism against those seen as different. The authorities may chalk it up to the malicious mischief of "youth", but the source of negative energy is *never* of innocence nor child-like! & yes, my property & my family have experienced some of the effects in the past that seemed to be due to both prejudice as well as mis-spent energy. Like the criminals they are, such individuals choose to do their dirty work under the cover of night.

Kaz	08 Apr 2002
MeeWah, what part of the world do you live ? kaz

Kiama	08 Apr 2002
I've been using and studying Tarot since I was 9, and I can't actally remember 'coming out' to my parents at all, which is weird, cuz they both know I'm a Tarot collector, both know I'm hopelessly addicted, both are quite okay with me sitting down by the TV of an evening, looking at the cards... My Dad is more of the 'Don't raise the subject' type, but has never condemned me for what I do. My Mum is more sympathtic, and is one of the only people off the forum and not Malachite or my boyfriend, who will actually sit and listen to me rambling on about this new deck I got...! All my friends know, I think.... I'm not really sure though, cuz I never have been one for sitting people down, and telling them. I just let nature take is course! It is difficult to hide such a passion of mine from my friends though, and they are all very open-minded people, so they just accept it as my hobby. I did have one friend who would keep coming to me for free readings, which began to grow annoying, but we've grown apart, and other than that, everyone's pretty much okay with it. Most of my teachers know that I read Tarot. One walked in on a reading I was doing for a friend in need, wasn't too happy, and walked back out again after having 'a word'... One asked me for a reading at the end of term... One was fanatical about Shakespeare, so I showed her my Shakespearian Tarot, which she loved.... I think most of the sixth form I am in know too.... Its common for me to be giving somebody a reading in the Study Room, and whilst there will be a few people who will whisper and point, they just get on with life, and think nothing of it. There is the odd skeptic who will challenge me, and if this is the case, the cards come out, and I show them they're mistaken! It always works, and I must say, enjoy it! I haven't had any problems, apart from one teacher, with peoples' reactions to Tarot. So, I guess I'm totally out of the Tarot-closet, which is nice. It means that if I'm stuck for something to do of a lunch hour at school, I can pull out my Robin Wood deck and study the cards some more, with no interruptions! My view of most things in life is only tell if asked. Don't go glaring it in peoples' faces. If somebody was to come up to me at school and ask me what I was doing with that funny looking deck of cards, I would tell them. No point lying! As far as I'm concerned, if they have a problem with me using Tarot cards, it doesn't affect me. It their problem, not mine. Nothing anyone will say could stop me using the Tarot! Kiama

Kaz	08 Apr 2002
i have never been in tarot-closet, i never have felt the need to hide tarot in my life. i sometimes read for collegues at work, and frankly, i have no idea what others there think or say about it. and, i am not the only one interested in this, i work in a bank which is huge, so i don't think anybody really cares about what others do. friends know, and some are interested, other aren't. family knows as well, but hey, i am a bit weird in their opinion anyway, so this isn't out of line. here in this small village i live the people that come inside the house may know, as i have decks lying in the kitchen and other places not out of sight (site ?). i never had comments on that, but who knows what they say behind my back? i guess this is a small shocker compared to the fact i live here in the "bible-belt" area with my girlfriend. kaz

slinky_jo	08 Apr 2002
I'm totally out of the tarot closet - not that I go around trying to give strangers readings! But all my friends know, most of my family, and whoever cares to ask "are you into that stuff?!" ;)

MeeWah	08 Apr 2002
Kaz: I also live in a "bible belt": Virginia Beach, Virginia, USA! We are home to a diverse group from New Agers to the traditional religious/spiritual (though I have not met any of alternative religion). The Edgar Cayce foundation is located here as is the ministry/broadcast network of a tele-evangelist. This is also considered a "transient" area as it is both a resort & military town. Oddly, I have seen less obvious prejudice here than up north, which has "traditionally" been a bastion of "freedom". I leave my Tarot stuff & other materials out throughout my home, where I feel comfortable doing so. There are also altars throughout my home. The occasional stranger who walks in is usually a client, but everyone else including most of my children's friends know I do readings. Some of them have been clients, too. Do not misunderstand: I love this area, which is why I live here. The few incidents that occurred to me/us personally horrified, but did not discourage us from staying.

MystiqueMoonlight	09 Apr 2002
Well I've always been the black sheep in my family. *smiling cheekily* Actually when I started to read the cards no-one was more surprised than myself I think. I had been reading palms since a teenager and my readings were always fighteningly accurate. My sister had been reading cards for quite sometime and so I suppose I just ventured over out of curiosity. People I know are aware that I read, but they are strangely more skeptical to my following The Craft rather than reading cards. Usually when someone finds out they ask for a reading. Do what is best for you. If you feel and know that it possibly better for you that you don't share with all and sundry that you read than keep it to yourself. What do the cards advise you? Blessed be....

Fairchild	09 Apr 2002
This truly is a great forum to learn from. Just this morning, I was asking myself the very same question Jenny asked. Not that I'm an expert at Tarot reading yet, but I do wonder about how people react upon learning that one even knows how to read Tarot cards. While I'm so excited to learn about Tarot and runes, I've been having problems sleeping as of late, and realized after several nights of dreaming about tarot and runes, that my sleeplessness has something to do with my feeling 'guilty'. If that's the right word, I'm not sure yet, still need to work my feelings out. I know there's nothing to feel guilty or ashamed about, but when you're raised Catholic, you're always taught under strict guidelines. Heaven forbid, if my Mom and sisters were to find out what I've delved into lately. I can hear my Mom telling me, it's because I don't go to church often enough and that I probably won't go to heaven for dabbling in this. Mind you, I still consider myself Catholic. Granted I don't go to church every Sunday, but I still say my prayers (a nun in Sunday school once told me that I can pray anywhere, even in the bathroom and that God could still hear me, and that church wasn't the only place where God listened). I know someone once said that studying Tarot had nothing do with the occult and I tend to agree. I don't see anything wrong with getting in touch with one's inner abilities and learning new ways of spirituality. It truly depends on a person's beliefs. As for 'coming out of the closet', that too depends on the person. I believe that even if I do have the experience of Tarot reading down to a science, that I would keep it to myself (I'm just an introvert) and since I don't like negative energy around me, I would prefer not to be bothered with judgmental people (as much as I love my Mom, I would have to include her in this little group). As for my husband, well, I can always revert back to what he claims I sometimes go thru, phases. I really am very happy to be a part of this group, as we really can learn together. Warm regards, Fairchild

Jewel	09 Apr 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Jenny-Li I imagine (and hope...!) there are at least a few of you who has dealt with this questions - I'd love to hear about how you slammed that closet door open...!! This will crack you up ... my deck collection grew so large that I ran out of storage space so I had to place the decks in the open *LOL*. Once that happened I just let go and stopped worrying about what other people would think. Now I do not only have all of my decks out in the open on my bookshelves, but also have a large array of books on Wicca and Paganism as well ~shrugs~. Feels great to be out!

Jenny-Li	09 Apr 2002
Hi everyone! It's funny how this turned into a much different question than the one I had in mind when posting the question, this area turned out to be a lot wider than I expected it to be! I read everything you write with great interest. I do believe that most people here would be more curious than superstitious and condemning, but then they would also probably bite my head off with rational arguments...! ;) I don't think I will deliberately go public with Tarot, I wouldn't be comfortable with that. I'll keep letting the tarot take up space in my life, and when people start stumbling on it, they'll ask and I'll let them in on my "secret". Because that's just it - secrets never quite was my game... I suppose that's why the question came up - and having learned so much - I am so glad it did! :D Thanks - all! /Jenny

Zhritza	10 Apr 2002
This thread has helped me realize how lucky I am. My parents have never had a problem with the tarot thing. My brother and most of my friends think it's sort of silly, and in my friends' case maybe kind of "cute," which can be trying for me in certain situations; but certainly no one passes any judgment on me because of it. Work is not an issue -- at the bookstore where I work, I will periodically chat with people about the next deck I'm getting and how nice it looks, etc. I live in a very liberal city where, as in Stockholm apparently, Bible-thumpers are much more of an oddity than tarotists are. It's been interesting to hear the use of the terms "closet" and "out" in this context. I will say quickly that I have been out as bisexual/lesbian (it has varied) since I was 14, which was in 1989; and I have suffered far more for being "out" in that sense than I ever have or will because of tarot, or because of my Judaism. Being different in terms of sexual and love orientation has been my main "difference" from others, even when I was a child, and it's fascinating to me that religious or spiritual beliefs could be seen as setting people apart from others to a similar extent. Now, I wonder if you guys could help me with something related to all this: Like many people, I like going to coffeeshops to read books. Lately, though, I have had really strong urges to take one or two of my newer decks with me to the coffeeshop to study them, and maybe do practice spreads. I don't think any customers or proprietors are going to have problems with this, per se; what I'm concerned about is that a) people I don't know will assume I am offering to read for them; and b) lonely, bored men I don't know will be even more inclined than usual to try to make conversation with me. (It never fails to stun me, how many men think that a woman alone reading a book is desperately in need of their attention; I'd imagine that this would be like that, only more so.) So, my question is, does anyone think I have a snowball's chance in hell of fulfilling this weird urge of mine? If I whip out a deck in public -- something I have never done -- will everyone around me assume that I want them to be part of my ensuing tarot experience? And if so, is that a fair assumption for them to make, and am I the one who is being a jerk by not wanting to read for them or explain tarot to them? Is it okay to ignore people and/or give them dirty looks, or is that just plain mean-spirited? If I dress like a black-magick goth or something, will that successfully encourage people to leave me alone? Has anyone tried to do this?

Tarotbear 2	10 Apr 2002
I used to do this all the time; in fact after my Tarot classes we would go to Barnes & Noble or Borders and sit in their coffee shop- doing this exact same thing. What you must be careful of is if you start charging- because that can get you thrown out because you are 'conducting a business' within their business. Last year we had a discussion about this because one poster was furious that a waitress at Denny's told him to put the cards away or leave and he got indignant. Even though you may view these restaurants as public places, they have every right to stop you from doing something that might hurt their business or frighten their customers.

Zhritza	10 Apr 2002
I don't have any desire to charge people for readings. In fact, I've never done a reading for a stranger, and I think it will be quite a while before I'm capable of it. But I'm comforted to know that my desire is not totally alien, and that someone else has done this thing. :)

dolphingirl	10 Apr 2002
Hi I think people will always ask questions about tarot if they see it since alot of people are curious. One thing you might try if you want to discourage this move the chairs that are not being used at your table to another or set your coat/ bag on them to discourage people to just park there rumps down. If you take your cards out be prepared to answer questions and maybe have a few anwers ready ( I am not doing readings ) (Thank you for your interest but ....) etc but if you feel the urge to do it go for it. Sam

Jenny-Li	10 Apr 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Qolus So, my question is, does anyone think I have a snowball's chance in hell of fulfilling this weird urge of mine? If I whip out a deck in public -- something I have never done -- will everyone around me assume that I want them to be part of my ensuing tarot experience? And if so, is that a fair assumption for them to make, and am I the one who is being a jerk by not wanting to read for them or explain tarot to them? Is it okay to ignore people and/or give them dirty looks, or is that just plain mean-spirited? If I dress like a black-magick goth or something, will that successfully encourage people to leave me alone? Has anyone tried to do this? Just give him a real witchy glance and show him the Death card (keep a spare one in your sleeve so you won't have to go through the whole deck to find it...!) - that should make him go away...! }) No, seriuosly - I've had the same idea, but always decided against it, for the very same reason. No, not always - once I did take out my deck and pick out one card at the time and make some association-notes in my cards-journal. But I did this in a sneaky sort of way, with half an eye behind my shoulder...! I didn't get harrassed though - then again, being so isn't one of my usual problems either...! ;) I can see what you mean, though, and no I don't think you should have to read for strangers in a coffee shop, just because you happen to be in there, with your cards. The suggestion I made in the beginning might not be very good either, because that will only add to people's superstition and presumptions about Tarot-ers... I mean we don't want to ADD to that, do we - even if most of us want to avoid being a target of those presumptions. Hmmm - will you let us know if you do any experimenting in the area...? :) Jenny

Zhritza	11 Apr 2002
Sure I will... Gotta get up the gumption to do it, now... :rolleyes:

zorya	11 Apr 2002
}) many many years ago, when i was a dirt poor student, a friend wanted a reading while we were at a bar. it drew quite a bit of attention. i soon discovered that i didn't have to worry about how i was going to pay for drinks or food or drinks or drinks.... anymore! ........i did burn out on this pretty quickly though and don' t really recommend it.

Butterfly	11 Apr 2002
I'm lucky, I guess. Never been in the tarot closet. My mum has probably bought me most of my cards, and I have bought her some of hers (I introduced her to it). Mum and Dad have always affectionately called me Witchy Poo (Remember HR Pufnstuf?). My mother and her female bloodline have all had psychic talents. My hubby is my biggest fan, although I rarely read for him, and his mother is a little too addicted to my readings than I would like. My friends don't consider it at all out of the ordinary. I can't imagine spending a lot of time with someone who I can't be myself completely with. I think Australia is incredibly tolerant with this kind of thing- although I believe that Queensland laws do forbid the practice of witchcraft- but don't quote me on that.

The Getting out of the tarot-closet... thread was originally posted on 08 Apr 2002 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.