Meanings From Other Decks

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 16 Jan 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Silverlotus	16 Jan 2003
Many people here seem to use several decks, or have used many different decks over the years. I am assuming that in studying those decks, you have come up with meanings for the cards in each of those decks, and the meaning for a card in one deck may not be the same for the corresponding card in another deck. But when you lay out the cards from, say, deck A and you see a card, do you draw on only the meaning you have come up with for deck A or do you incorporate the meaning from deck B or C if that seems appropriate based on other cards, the colour of the sky, or whatever influences you at the time? I'll give you an example of what I mean. In the Witches' Tarot for the 2 of Pentacles there is a bodybuilder holding a barbell with pentacles on it. He is receiving money from three outstretched hands. Now, I've taken this card to mean rewards for your skills, etc. (Really generalised meaning there.) In the same card in the Robin Wood Tarot, there is a young woman dressed as a juggler walking a tightrope in the sky. She is balancing two pentacles. This card means to me balance, especially when you are out of your element (since Pentacles are Earth, and she is in the sky). But I could imagine it would be possible for me to see her as a performer doing tricks for money/reward because of the meaning I learned for the Witches' Tarot. Does any of this make sense? Does anyone else do this, or do you try to keep your meanings for each deck separate? I'm sorry if this subject has been discussed before, but I couldn't find anything in my search. Any keyword I tried brought up a huge amount of threads.

Jewel	16 Jan 2003
Great question and one that should get some great answers. The experience will probably vary based on decks used. Although I have used multiple decks the decks I tend to work with are somewhat traditional in symbols so the actual meaning of the card remains very similar. What I find is that other decks may give me new perspectives and depth in the meaning, but that overall it remains "traditional." Deck B possibly adds depth or point of view to my existing interpretation that helps me understand the card better. Again that is because of the types of decks I have worked with. Now with that said, as I look at other decks, I do use my interpretation and probably measure the quality of the card based on that. That is how I have developed my personal tastes for decks ... they fit and expand my interpretation of the cards. I look forward to reading other replies to this question.

patter	16 Jan 2003
I have a single, uniform interpretation of what each card means -- although the specific scenes on each card might bais the way I apply it in a particular reading.

Dhaofollower	16 Jan 2003
Hi Silverlotus I guess it depends on how closely related the packs are. If I use Cosmic Tarot for general readings, and Medicine Woman for life path readings they are sufficiently different in both presentation and intent that there is no conflict or confusion for me. Rather than try to compare/contrast/combine maybe it would be easier just to take from the card whatever elements come to mind from gazing at it. Trust intuition, and if elements from elsewhere are required then they willl come through, whatever. This pobably doesn't help a lot as my own packs are so very different, but best of luck wih resolving this one!! Love n light

DarkElectric	16 Jan 2003
Hi Silverlotus :) I read with several decks, for this very reason. I find some images give me an easier key to the insight I need to accurately assess the given situation. I think I might make up a deck with all different cards from all different decks someday, just for fun, to see what happens.

Umbrae	16 Jan 2003
A wonderful question! Truly wonderful. A textual minefield…hee hee hee… I believe that for starters, one must examine how one uses tarot (or the Oracle of the day). Let us examine some different approaches. Mind you these are my analogies and reflect not on actual users, innocents have been changed to protect the names… Left Brain Approach (LBA) 1 is essentially a memorization exercise where meanings (perhaps arbitrary) are ascribed to each card, and meanings remain static regardless of deck used. LBA 2 relies upon the study of the numbers, their sequence, and suits associated with each card. Meanings remain static regardless of deck. LBA 3 relies more upon the artwork, so meanings are not static per se, but are static with regard to each deck. Right Brain Approach (RBA) is an intuitive approach where meanings are dynamic, fluid, and change dependant upon the reading and the sitter. Meanings take on a minor importance, moreover, it is what the entire spread ‘says’ to the reader. This style of reading is difficult and takes years of practice (primarily to shut down the left brain, and create a receptive right brain). There is also the hybrid approach – an example would be the study of numbers, suits, and sequences; and a listening to the cards themselves to hear in the voice which does not speak the words the cards are saying. A reader may begin with one approach and grow to use a hybrid approach as time goes on, or they may not. There is no right or wrong, and if someone tells you that there is a right or wrong approach (including me) – they are wrong. Please understand that this is a simplistic explanation…and does indeed create further questions. In the words of Martha Stewart, “It’s a good thing…”

tarotbear	16 Jan 2003
There is nothing wrong in knowing five completely different interpretations for a card, even if they might conflict. You merely 'plug in' whichever meaning stirkes you as the correct one for the current reading regardless of which deck you are using at the time. Isn't this how everyone reads cards? If not, there would be no need for books like 'Tarot Made Easy' or 'Tarot Plain and Simple' {IMHO, there is no need for Tarot Plain & Simple - but that's covered in another thread} I mean - if you are reading with Rider and the reading would be better served by a meaning from The Cosmic Tribe - wouldn't you use the meaning from the Cosmic Tribe?

Laurel	16 Jan 2003
I draw meaning from everything I've studied and learned, including other tarot decks. Yet there is still something unique to cards within a particular deck, that will influence what I have to say. Each deck has a style that will affect what I have to say. That's why I tend to collect new decks when they're on sale or because the art inspires me, but I traditionally read with one deck for 2-3 year stretch and only "swap" for a different one under special circumstances. Since I tend to read for only a handful of people now, but I read for them consistently, sticking to one deck is most helpful for all of us since its easier to see general trends. ~LAS

Jewel	16 Jan 2003
Quote: Originally posted by tarotbear Isn't this how everyone reads cards? If not, there would be no need for books like 'Tarot Made Easy' or 'Tarot Plain and Simple' {IMHO, there is no need for Tarot Plain & Simple - but that's covered in another thread} I mean - if you are reading with Rider and the reading would be better served by a meaning from The Cosmic Tribe - wouldn't you use the meaning from the Cosmic Tribe? ~chuckles~ Actually Tarot Bear, it is the Cosmic Tribe precicely that I use for readings and whose meanings I use ... I just love this deck and could not just not say anything when you posted it. This deck really gave me some new perceptions and depth which is why it is now my primary reading deck. It is the depth of the meanings for me that created the deep connection I have with the CT. (BTW, IMHO there is no need for either of the 2 books you mentioned ... which as you said is covered in another thread).

magpie9	17 Jan 2003
Personally, I use the Hybrid approach, but I 've been reading for a very long time, with a very many decks, so it's become natural. A lot of the time I'll be reading in deck A and a card meaning from deck c will flash through my mind and I'll go with it. I find that the more decks I use enough to get really into the more they meet and greet and fertilize my readings. I think reading with a lot of decks helps with the sense (and reality) of always learning. The main thing, I think, is to trust yourself and your gut feelings in a reading. Actually, I think it takes more work to get it wrong than to get it right, LOL.Do have a wonderful time with it! :)

Aoife	18 Jan 2003
Quite often I'll lay cards from another deck on top of the original deck spread. I try not to re-read the spread ['cos i find that too confusing] but go away, leave the spread out and occasionally glance at it in its totality to see if it triggers anything which might relate back to the original deck spread. This is why I like to buy decks in pairs - different moods or imagery e.g. Haindl overlaying Hudes gives an entirely different 'picture'. Sometimes it helps - more often it confuses, but I persevere.

Trogon	18 Jan 2003
Very interesting question Silverlotus. Doubly so since I was just discussing this very topic with a friend of mine at work. I do use several decks for readings. For the most part, when someone asks me for a reading, I let them choose the deck they would like to use. Then these different decks give me variances, nuances, in the meanings I "get" for the cards. For instance, take a card I just started another thread about... the Page of Pentacles. In the RWS deck, I get the strong feeling of contemplation, study, introspection, etc. But, in the Röhrig Tarot, the Princess of Disks gives me a strong feeling of motherhood, pregnancy, learning to be a good mother, but also an awareness of the life-force within all of us. In other words these both have to do with the keyword "fertility" in a way... but in completely different aspects. The RWS Page of Pentacles has much to do with fertility of the mind, while the Röhrig Princess of Pentacles has more to do with the fertility of motherhood. However, in my perception, there is a definite "self-awareness" in both of them as well. So there is some overlap. Other decks, such as the Victoria Regina and the Dragon Tarot elicit still other perceptions for me. The V.R. Princess of Coins is more along the lines of a straightforward, hard-working, plodding intellect (she gets the job done without being so introspective - she is, however, still self-aware). The Page of Pentacles in the Dragon Tarot is, I feel, looking more for something outside herself. I have not yet had the opportunity to really study the Princess of Pentacles in the Goddess Tarot yet. But... the LWB states; "The abillity to create opportunities for growth and beauty..." So, yet another take on this card. So... after all of this... the short answer is, yes... I do get differences in meaning for the same card in different decks. Gee... I sure hope that is what you were asking. :|

Moongold	18 Jan 2003
I tend to use the Tarot for personal development and different decks suit different needs. I use the Shining Tribe for personal work along with the guide for this, as Rachel Pollack has incorporated mythology from all of the world and it's good to learn it. I use three cards a week and am getting to know some quite well. Soon I'll be able to use these at an unconscious level. I've just begun to read again for others and use the Tarot for the Old Path and the Morgan Greer for this. They are visually quite different and conceptually a little different and give me unique things. Tarot is just six months old for me but I'm much more likely to read intuitively now that I have some grounding. Sometimes using a different deck can give you a very fresh view. Using an Oracle like the Faeries really gives an interesting perspective to things as well. If reading tarot is about accessing our deepest personal and collective spiritual wisdom, then a whole range of things can help: different decks, meditation, self-awareness, academic knowledge, life experience, personal gifts such as intuition, insight, empathy and so on. This might sound a little wild, but I have to be spiritually well before I can read for others. This means........having hope and energy and belief.........If I feel like this then I get so many clear and gentle messags. And the insights come from anything - a scene in a garden, the breeze on my face, the sound of birds in the morning. At times I feel so clear that reading is not a problem. At others, I would only read for myself. Moongold

Karenwhe	19 Jan 2003
Truly a wonderful thread. With most decks that I know, have researched or own, there is a common general meaning, but with the new one I am researching I don't see any relevance what so ever, that would be the Silicon Valley tarot. I just don't see a strong (if any) connection to the origins of the tarot though it is a tarot deck and another tool for the readers. Therefore, I don't see yet how to incorporate the "classical" interpretations of a card (even the bare basic ones) into this deck, but I am still working on it. Hence, so far I came to the conclusion that it depends on the deck itself and how far fetched it is from the origins and roots of the classical decks and/or tarot. If it is close, of course meanings can be combined and will work well, otherwise I don't see yet how, but I am still working on this.

WolfSpirit	19 Jan 2003
If you studied several decks, I think it is impossible to keep different meanings completely separate unless you consciously try to do so. What we call "different meanings" here I think is often different aspects of the same meaning. I think the first impression that comes to is still from the image of the card, but if the meaning does not come to you by just looking at the card you'll start thinking "now what else can this card be". Then you will probably come up with meanings (or aspects) you read somewhere else, not related to that particular deck. Aoife: i used to do the same thing, just to see what the spread looked like with another deck. I used itsometimes with a new deck that i did not want to use for reading yet but when i was curious what a spread with that deck would look like ;) I have to say: I also now use the animal wise tarot, and i don't use meanings from other decks with that one. The meanings do correspond with traditional meanings, but they are interpreted differently and i don't want to put traditional meanings in it. That is not necessary with this deck because it speaks very clearly on its own :D

Silverlotus	19 Jan 2003
I've certainly got a lot of wonderful replies to this topic! And I'm glad to see that I am not the only one who doesn't or can't keep the meanings in separate boxes. I think it's an interesting experience when I'm reading with one deck, and the meaning for the same card in another deck flashes into my head. But I guess this partly happens because I've never used a deck that strays far from the RWS model, expect perhaps my Faery Oracle, which I am just learning to use. I'm very interested in trying the Osho Zen deck to see what sort of meaning correlations I create between it and the RWS meanings I already use.

Marion	20 Jan 2003
Hi Silverlotus, I also noticed this, and for a while, no matter which deck I used, the actual cards from Robin Wood would pop into my mind, and more or less I was reading from Robin Wood no matter which deck I used! As my collection got bigger, I found that I enjoyed reading with other decks and as I studied them I found my ideas about the cards and how they fit together altered with the decks. Now I find I take a while to select a deck for the reading and then I read 'to the deck'. Curiously I find now even that is changing and I am starting to read the minors more and more to the number/suit terminology. At any rate, the deck sometimes just fits a particular reading and its particular terminolgy should be used.

Ravenswing	20 Jan 2003
Well, well... Every once in a while I'll do this one: I'll take my Universal Waite and throw out a spread. Before I do anything with it, I'll add matching cards from Robin Wood, Thoth and Deva decks to each position. Now you have four cards per placement. For me, these four decks work well together this way. This is also my method of contemplating the concept of a card before I work on creating my own image for the deck Laurel and I are designing. From the mathematical viewpoint, four can be represented by the tetrahedron. This figure has been considered both the basic unit of energy and the primary structure. Works for me. great thread guys ravenswing

MeeWah	20 Jan 2003
I use several decks for readings. I think it is the years I spent reading with a regular deck of playing cards & using numerology that insinuated themselves into my throws with the RSW, which I used for a long time. For a while, no matter what deck I used, the RSW overlaid its images on my throws. Since then, it does not matter what deck I use, nearly any deck's card will intercede; sometimes more than one. Even when I am reading someone else's throw, the experience is like thinking in multiple Tarot card images along with other images thrown in for good measure. Edited to add: I forgot I have The Comparative Tarot!! Shall be trying it out, as that should be very interesting :)

firemaiden	21 Jan 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Umbrae I believe that for starters, one must examine how one uses tarot (or the Oracle of the day). Right Brain Approach (RBA) is an intuitive approach where meanings are dynamic, fluid, and change dependant upon the reading and the sitter. Meanings take on a minor importance, moreover, it is what the entire spread ‘says’ to the reader. This style of reading is difficult and takes years of practice (primarily to shut down the left brain, and create a receptive right brain). A bit off topic, sorry, but related: Umbrae, do you think the Right Brain Approach can be learned in complete absense of left-brained learned information? Or would it be the icing on the cake after years of left-brain study?

Umbrae	21 Jan 2003
Quote: Originally posted by firemaiden …do you think the Right Brain Approach can be learned in complete absence of left-brained learned information? Or would it be the icing on the cake after years of left-brain study? I do believe that a Right Brain Approach can be learned in complete absence of Left-Brained leaned information. After years of Left-Brained indoctrination, learning a Right-Brained approach is difficult, but not impossible. The issue is that we live in a society seemingly driven by information. We are told we must have more – information. “Back when I was a kid, we used to watch the Huntley-Brinkley Report. These two guys would sit and read the news. Smoke cigarettes, and read the news. Half an hour. That was it. “Now the news comes on they do local news for an hour, then spend half an hour on global news, then another full hour of local news. Hold on there…then we get Entertainment news, 20-20, Nightline, Dateline, 60 Minutes, 48 hours, Evening Magazine, News 24-7… McNeil-Leher report, SportsLine, SportsNight, Wall Street Week with Louis Rukheyser, Lou Dobbs…CNN, CNN Headline News, CNBC, CNNFN… “Marketing departments have successfully convinced you that you NEEEEEED the news. Gotta have it, need it, you have to demand it… “It’s hard to compete against the massive flow of information. “It’s hard to ignore it. Especially when it has nothing to do with reality. "Further, news does not move stocks. “Often, stocks have their biggest moves when there is no news. They will also experience large move days before news comes out. “In addition, each and every one of you has bought into the lie of information. “Most books tell us to impose mechanical processes to the market and to be devoid of emotion. Most strategies fail over time because they eliminate the human (emotional) element. The markets are silent, and brutal, but not devoid of emotion. Emotion is the most dominant force in the market; when we understand it, it can be a source of profit.” Excerpt from a speech “The World has Changed” by Dan Pelletier, Overland Park, Kansas, 04/09/01 The points are not that dissimilar. On the surface it appears as though I might be comparing the stock market with tarot. In reality, I am comparing how the dependence upon a supposed flow of pseudo-information, more of a reliance upon Left-Brained dependence and behavior leads us away from where we wanted to be. You see: Too much information never makes for simple decisions. Over intellectualizing causes one to be too slow, and delay decisions. For a Right-Brained approach, the new and older student alike, must realize that they are taking a completely diverse path, with the same goal in mind. Thus meanings should not be deck dependant for one type of reading. For other types of readings, they may be different, or blurred as a hybrid approach to meanings begins to emerge. Is there a right or wrong? Absolutely! And the rights and wrongs will vary dependant upon your school of thought.

firemaiden	21 Jan 2003
Thank you, wise Umbrae. I will be buying my toothpicks tomorrow. ;)

Dhaofollower	22 Jan 2003
Umbrae...Hi Sorry, this is still off thread I think, but as a newbie I'm not yet quite sure about how to address this one appropriately. I have just aquired the Haindl set, which is very different to my normal cards which I have been learning by TRYING to memorise meanings and feelings rather than free thinking them. I could however, with little effort, carry across meanings from the other packs if not careful. To start off on the right path with this new set would you advise that I ignore the description books altogether or maybe just use them initially? I would appreciate guidance in this. Blessings to one and all Dhaofollower

firemaiden	24 Jan 2003
back to the theme of meanings from various decks. I had the thrilling and mind blasting experience last night of reading with two different decks, and seeing the same cards come up in the same positions in a dream interpretation spread, I read first with the Fey Deck first and then with the Roots of Asia Deck. Please, I would really love it if some of you wouldn't mind reading my post (in "your readings section") and tell me what you think. http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10957

Umbrae	24 Jan 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Dhaofollower I have just aquired the … would you advise that I ignore the description books altogether or maybe just use them initially. Take the book that came with the deck…and store it someplace high (and in a back corner where you can’t get to it)…get a spiral back note book, some pencils, and start journaling with your deck. Journal individual cards – all spreads – all readings… Remember – you want to relate to the deck, not the other way around! Go back after a couple months and compare your notes with the book…

Silverlotus	24 Jan 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Umbrae Take the book that came with the deck…and store it someplace high (and in a back corner where you can’t get to it)…get a spiral back note book, some pencils, and start journaling with your deck. Journal individual cards – all spreads – all readings… To bring this back to my orginal topic, I'm wondering how this works when you've already worked with tarot for many years. I've studied tarot off an on for a while now, and I've pretty much always used books to help come up with my definitions. When I get a new deck, I generally read the LWB that came with it. So, how to I come to formulate all new definitions when I already have some using the book method? It seems most of the posts here agree that it is difficult to "forget" or not use definitions from other decks. How do you achieve a clean slate when starting with a new deck? (This is of course assuming you are using a deck with "traditional" symbolism, similar to other decks you have used in the past.)

Umbrae	24 Jan 2003
You do not need to forget everything you know. You need to simply learn something different. Back in the Seventies, in California, they changed the gas pumps from Gallons to Liters. Everyone freaked out. They could not figure out how many miles to the gallon they were getting. I explained to some friends that they were not getting miles to the gallon, they were getting miles to the liter. They looked at me dumbfounded. They never thought of it. They were stuck in ‘old-think’. So you go out and acquire something radically different. Go where you have never gone before…Never owned a Marseilles deck? Get one. Never owned a Thoth? Get one. Personally I’d suggest Soul Cards. Then when you move back to a more traditional deck, perhaps your brain will no be ready to fall into the old groove. You see you will never start with a clean slate, you will always carry the seeds of your past…that’s you…it’s who and what you are – embrace it and move on, and build upon the foundation that is already there. (Does this help?)

Silverlotus	25 Jan 2003
Yes, it does. The different deck I just purchased was The Osho Zen Tarot. I think it might help me look at meanings in a new way. The Thoth deck is also something I am consider now that I've decided to look into the life of Uncle Al and the GD. I really have got a lot of good ideas from this thread. That's why I love this place so much. :)

Umbrae	25 Jan 2003
You know what? I have no idea what I'm talking about. I read with the same dang deck for far too many years. Only within the last 17 months have I expanded. During those years I read little on Tarot (nothing for over two decades) and had no mentoring, no guidance. I had a deck and a bunch of spiral back notebooks. My old deck was a Waite-Colman Smith (and assorted decks of regular playing cards). Now my decks are Waite-Colman Smith clones, and Marseilles. Yeah - each one 'reads' different, way different. My VR reads different than my Russian St. Petersberg. Why? I have no idea. The VR reads more like reading regular playing cards (Brutal and honest). My Russian is more subtle and my Marseilles…sometimes distant. Why? How? I have no idea. They are like different friends, you treat them different, develop a different rapport with each. I'm not going to ask folks to spend half their lives with one deck…without help. So…what do I know?

Silverlotus	25 Jan 2003
Maybe it's not so much what you know but what you feel? Maybe it's the feeling you get from one deck that stays with you, not the meaning. Maybe that's why many of us seem to go more for one style of deck then another. And maybe my thinking out loud isn't making any sense! :-)

The Meanings From Other Decks thread was originally posted on 16 Jan 2003 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.