What Are We Tapping Into?

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 24 Apr 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.

NiftyKracker	24 Apr 2003
I'm certain that most of us would agree that there is nothing inherently "magical," in the paper and ink construction of the tarot cards themselves, and I am curious to know what force various members of this community believe provides the power of the tarot, which undoubtedly exists. I have my own ideas on the matter, but choose not to taint this particular thread with them. Please, share some of you unique insight to one of the most fundamental questions of the tarot!

Diana	24 Apr 2003
Welcome to Aeclectic, NiftyKracker. As you can imagine, yours is a question that has come up on a number of occasions. Would you like to have a look at this thread? I think it is possibly one of the most interesting we've had on this subject. A fuller search on the Talking Tarot forum will probably reveal more threads. http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?threadid=3537

NiftyKracker	24 Apr 2003
Thank you, Diana, for directing me to this very informative thread. Would you mind expressing some of your own opinions on the matter in order to supplement those which I have already read?

Diana	24 Apr 2003
You are an extremely fast reader. My opinions are expressed better than I could by others in that thread. There are some highly articulate people there! :)

Umbrae	24 Apr 2003
Perhaps we can explore the answers with a few simple quotes… Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.". Friedrich Nietzsche Mystical explanations are considered deep. The truth is that they are not even superficial. from Nietzsche's The Gay Science There are no facts, only interpretations. from Nietzsche's Nachlass Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies. from Nietzsche's Human, all too Human Why does man not see things? He is himself standing in the way: he conceals things. from Nietzsche's Daybreak

HOLMES	24 Apr 2003
i will share this with you , i believe i channel a higher wisdom when i read the tarot. however i make sure i go into a mode of raising my vibration and connecting to the universal mind. edited to say i havne't edited my own comments this much in a long time, but i feel i just have to share my feelings. your post here brings up a lot of feelings.. . first your are asking a personal question without sharing your view. why make this thread if you not going to share with us . so please share some of your inique insight to the one of the most fundamental questions of the tarot , go out on a limb.!! i was thinking of the archtypes and symbols that speak to us on the cards that we use individually and know that these have magic in them,, if only in the imagination. (magic of art, is in every culture) the archtypes are universal symbols that speak to all our unconscious , and gives us a access to the super conscious giving us information on the conscious level.

firemaiden	24 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Umbrae Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.". Friedrich Nietzsche And that Nietzche Dude knew whereof he spoke! This is such a juicy quote. I love this quote. Can I quote this quote, Umbrae? Thank you : <> Aaaaaaaah. Thank you, I enjoyed that. This quote answers NiftyKrackers question rather well, doesn't it. What are we tapping into? tapping, tapping, tapping... (forgive me Diana, please, I see this question as a bit different than why does tarot work). What are we tapping into then, and what are we UNLEASHING????... the abyss? Precisely... as soon as we first begin to ponder, wonder at the tarot, we have begun to peer over into the abyss! What is the abyss? The gouffre! The bottomless pit! The gulf! the undending hole! We peer down into it, we see what we see... in certain cases, demons have been known to fly out... Is it eternity? infinity? God? Love? The Hosts of Hell? The land of demons? The fiery well of Id? The death urge? the life force? Kundalini? The other side of the mirror? These and other questions to be answered as soon as I can find a way out of this hole... But the short answer to your question, NiftyKracker, is, "What are we tapping into?" A never ending source of amusement and DESIRE

zorya	24 Apr 2003
the connection between all things.

NiftyKracker	24 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by HOLMES first your are asking a personal question without sharing your view. why make this thread if you not going to share with us . so please share some of your inique insight to the one of the most fundamental questions of the tarot , go out on a limb.!! I apologize, Holmes, I did not wish to seem prudish with my own thoughts... I simply did not want this to become a debate over my own beliefs, at least not in the beginning. If I were to start off with a personal theory, then it would be sure to color the rest of the thread. But since you requested... I too believe we are being given the gift of knowledge from a higher power, a bit of Celestial advice. We might disagree on what that higher power is, but I believe on this we completely agree. While I worship the God of the Hebrews and the Christians, one of my fundamental mantras is "all truth is God's truth." Many Christians (particularly Protestants) tend to look down at those who use tools such as the tarot or the sephiroth to aid in their meditations, but not all of us are mystics... not everyone has such a direct link to God. There is no burning bush in my backyard. Nonetheless, I believe that God is trying to speak to each and every one of us, at all times... but in my fallen state, I am in no condition to hear. The tarot, then, operate as a sort of backdrop... it would not be easy to see the stars if the night sky were purest white, but with a backdrop of black, each one stands out in its full glory. The tarot helps me to clear my mind, and hear more of what God is trying to say. I hope this gives you a little bit of insight, if not into the workings of the tarot, then at least into the workings of my mind.

MeeWah	24 Apr 2003
NiftyKracker: Welcome to Talking Tarot! Diana has indeed directed ye to a "nifty" source of ideas regarding the same subject--sorry, I could not resist that, no offense intended :) I tend to see the process or the magick as *inherent wiithin the reader*. That is, 'tis the reader who accesses the knowledge, understanding & insight that may well be unique to each individual. I also see it as tapping into a collective consciousness. The cards merely serve as a means of focus; a launching pad for the consciousness. In that sense, the reader is a messenger, the vehicle for the message. This view is based on how I read.

firemaiden	24 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by NiftyKracker . The tarot, then, operate as a sort of backdrop... it would not be easy to see the stars if the night sky were purest white, but with a backdrop of black, each one stands out in its full glory. Wow! That is a seriously Nifty was to look at it! Thank you for that, NiftyKracker!

HOLMES	24 Apr 2003
ah it is good to hear you opnions, :O) here is a book you might look into listed under aeclectic book list. http://www.aeclectic.net/meditations-on-tarot/index.html

NiftyKracker	24 Apr 2003
This is the best reference I have gotten thus far in your forum, Holmes, and for this alone I consider the time I have spent here a good investment. This certainly seems like the book for me, I will rush out and buy it post haste (or log on to Half.com from whence I collected most of the works of Dion Fortune). I am certainly glad to have been so candid with my beliefs, now, since you would not have known to suggest this work otherwise. *winks* Thanks again! And thanks to everyone for responding so kindly to my first thread.

Cerulean	24 Apr 2003
This is a lovely thread. I do respect your purity in seeing and touching tarot images as reminders for the divine or universal symbols. My own slant is reaching for delight or compassion when I reach for the cards. First off, please know that I am a lifetime Western Humanities student, so I’m slanting my view right off. I like best to see how tarocchi archetypes capture humanity—in scenes, fable, in fictional or mythical situations. The first time I saw Giordano Berti say he wrote a screenplay to the Dante Tarot (Lo Scarabeo), that phrase opened windows in my mind. It made me think of Gareth Knight’s scenario of certain card majors, such as Justice, as a ‘theatre’ figure in its own right. I thought of touching tarot art cards with my fingers, with my touching nerves running up to my brain and also stimulating the nerves behind my eyes, my mental eyes of imagination. It was a creative, accessible play such as unrolling a scroll or the opening scene or opening a beautifully illustrated book. This is the mood I enjoy tapping into the most. So I think touching the tarot art of human interactions or figures is delightful. At best, it brings out to me respectful compassion to human conditions. If my mood and mind wants to delve down into an abyss, that’s allowed in my private work with the cards and poetry---a flexible tarocchi deck may address this mood. If I want to reach for the stars, it may take a different deck that might better be an oracle…I haven’t found the one deck that allows me that reaching deep down and also upward. I am discovering more about one of the original tarocchi poets (Maria Matteo Boiardo) who mixed an affable warmth, common language for his day, a tendency for laughter and fresh Renaissance ways to present medieval virtues or courtly themes. He did have affection, wonder and marvelous originality at the fitness of things, so he is considered a good poet for his day. I really want to reach back in time and feel this as well, with sympathy for the human moods, conditions, dreams and desires. I wouldn’t mind doing the same. My hope when I reach for the cards is sharing tarocchi cards with laughter, courtesy, a wonder felt in your best-loved days.

Two of Wands	26 Apr 2003
Quote: ------------- "Nonetheless, I believe that God is trying to speak to each and every one of us, at all times... but in my fallen state, I am in no condition to hear. The tarot, then, operate as a sort of backdrop... it would not be easy to see the stars if the night sky were purest white, but with a backdrop of black, each one stands out in its full glory. " ------------- I love your take on Tarot Nifty! I really enjoyed reading it!

Vengeful Buddah	27 Apr 2003
Is it possible that the tarot is just so damn vauge that anyone can project onto them what they want?

Major Tom	27 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Vengeful Buddah Is it possible that the tarot is just so damn vauge that anyone can project onto them what they want? Indeed this is entirely possible. ;) I would submit that if you take the time to create your own version of whichever tarot card you choose - you won't be able to avoid seeing yourself looking back at you. :laugh: I submit the following for your inspection: It works because everything is God, pure and simple. })

Vengeful Buddah	27 Apr 2003
"Everything is God"?! I can name countless things that are NOT God...at least not my God...Im not sure who your god is but if hes everything it must utterly suck to be you.

Major Tom	27 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Vengeful Buddah I can name countless things that are NOT God...at least not my God You could not even begin to name one thing that is not God. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: And that begins and ends with you. :laugh:

Two of Wands	27 Apr 2003
Quote: ___________ Is it possible that the tarot is just so damn vauge that anyone can project onto them what they want? ___________ More than likely, I shouldn't wonder!

skytwig	27 Apr 2003
I AM, YOU ARE. THE ETERNAL SEARCH FOR THE ANSWER IS THE ANSWER; OR IS IT A QUESTION? Behind the mirror? Very likely. And what is behind the mirror in the mirror? Belief is a varied as the shades of color in a sunset. Can we hold it, or is it as fleeting as the light that adorns us?

bec	27 Apr 2003
haven't read all the replies yet, so it might already have been said - and it might not. What are we tapping into ? tapping.......hmm I guess we are "pluggin" into the read's heart and soul - feeling energies, vibrations. what is realy going in my opinion is that by tarot we are learning to open our third eye, some more by intension than others - but it is our intuition and gutt-instincts that tells us "today 2wands means this and tomorrow it dont" Also I think that is why it can be so hard reading for one self or others very close to us, as it is "dangerous" getting that close to the REAL person7soul I have heard many comments from long time tarot readers who say they don't need the cards anylonger to do a tarot reading - they just know what cards are rigth for the read. I have had that feel to my self once or twice. So how can paper and ink give us that gift, or open that gift for us ? my answer would be that the merely fact of being open and understanding for the paper and ink, or any other material; stones, crystals, pendulums, stars - is the first step to start listen to what we have forgotten to listen to a loong time ago. And what about those who claims they only read by books, math calculations and numerology ? they still give themselves into a system they believe in - and I think that is what we are tapping into - our own abilities.

Kiama	28 Apr 2003
I'd agree with Meewah on this one: We tap into ourselves. I have a very 'Carpe Diem' view of life, so to me, I prefer being in control of life. Therefore my view on this is that when I am reading the cards, I believe that the cards are merely prompting my mind to get the answers that were already there... The cards show us the causes, so our mnds can then be prompted to examine the effects. Of course, I'd also agree with Major Tom that God is in everything, and that because of this, we can be prompted into examining causes and effects. Vengeful Buddah: (Is that a deliberate mispelling of Buddha? ;)) Just looking through the cards in a Tarot deck without actually having them in a reading, yes, they can seem vague. But when they are actually in a reading, they are far from vague, because they almost always become specific depending on the question, and of course the questioner's situation. Kiama

jlbvt	28 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by HOLMES i believe i channel a higher wisdom when i read the tarot. however i make sure i go into a mode of raising my vibration and connecting to the universal mind. the archtypes are universal symbols that speak to all our unconscious , and gives us a access to the super conscious giving us information on the conscious level. I agree with Holmes. I think that everyone is part of one universal conciousness, and if we were to use every bit of our brains (we only use like 10 or 20%) we would know everything, including what everyone eles was thinking, we would understand completely the God or Goddess who is in charge (?), and we would probably put our eyes out and go crazy. So I think we all have the capability to know whatever we want, most people just aren't sure how to go about it. And I think Tarot is one way to go about it. I think that once you learn the archetypes and what the cards mean to you, you will pull the ones that tell you what you need to know. It does help to quiet your active brain by meditating a little first. Also, on a related note, I think that "God" is just everyones collective conciousness, or maybe just the conciousness(es) of the people who are currently dead. I think the "dead" spirits do get recycled back into living bodies again.

The What Are We Tapping Into? thread was originally posted on 24 Apr 2003 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.