The future of tarot?

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 23 Aug 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Destiny	23 Aug 2003
Hi Just wondering about your thoughts on the future of tarot decks on styles, RWS, clones or do you see tarot becoming stagnant for a while. So far none of the new decks out really grab me What would you like to see and why?

Astra	23 Aug 2003
Hi, Destiny, and welcome to the forum! "So far none of the new decks out really grab me" NONE of them? You've checked all the offerings on the Aeclectic site? Sheesh, I haven't even gone through a quarter of them and my bank account rose up on its hind legs and said "watch it..." Tarot was, to some extent, stagnant during the '70s and possibly the '80s, but the number of new decks, from the totally idiotic to the strange and wonderful, that's come out in the last 20 years boggles the mind (well, mine at least). And people (like me) are still turning out more ideas and seeing about getting them published (I can hope!). Check out HudsonGray's Ferret cards at http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?p=999&gid=1243650&uid=728989, and the Tarot of Prague at http://www.baba-prague.com/tarot for two totally different takes.

jmd	24 Aug 2003
Destiny's first post on the destiny of Tarot... what wonderful choice of a name :) About two years ago, I mentioned that I personally thought that a return would be made towards Marseilles type decks... so far, this seems to have begun :) I was talking with some men, quite squarely and on the level, of other esoteric things after a lecture on the subject, and one (a priest) reflected that it seems that approximately every three generations important new influences arise (he reflected on materials of alchemical, rosicrucian, kabalistic and masonic innovation and expansion). With regards to Tarot, the 'big four' have already reduced somewhat to the 'big three' - with the Eteilla somewhat subsiding due to its alterations. Personally, I suspect that the Waite/Colman-Smith will also subside somewhat in importance, though the Crowley/Harris Thoth is probably likely to grow in importance and influence. Already some newer decks reflect this latter deck's influence. The future will probably have a far clearer and firmer historical knowledge available for us all, and progress will also be made in the understanding of the images made in earlier historical decks, increasing their popularity. I wouldn't be surprised if by the end of this century, the Waite/Colman-Smith deck becomes an interesting quirk of Tarot history, classed as the most popular and influential 20th century deck, as the Eteilla was the 19th century's. Though numerous decks will continue to be available, the Crowley/Harris, along with its 'clones', and the Marseille - especially one arising out of Melbourne following the 2005 International Tarot Conference ;) - will dominate the Tarot scene... ...no, I do not have a deck in plan... just thought it would make a nice post :)

Logiatrix	24 Aug 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Destiny ...So far none of the new decks out really grab me What would you like to see and why? I'm with you, Destiny...I haven't been excited about a deck for some time--not like I used to be. I think it's just me, 'cuz all the new kids on the shelves (and sites) certainly look wonderful...but I'm not all fired up to go buy them anymore. I almost thought I was burnt out, especially when I started giving away large chunks of my beloved collection. Actually, I think I'm just happy with what I already have. You can't beat the good old standards (again, with respectful nods to the good NEW standards), because they are always there for us, even when we flitter away to check out the latest deck on the market.* :) To answer your question... I'd like to see a deck with multi-ethnic people in a quality art presentation. All the so-called ''inclusive" decks are wonderful in their attempts to represent many colors, genders, ages and roles. My "druther" is that they are typically in primitive or folk art style (not "real" looking), or in a distant time, or inaccurately portrayed in some way (facial features, body structure, etc.). However, each deck I can think of also offers something very important, so I wish I could mesh the best of each of them all together for the perfect deck! So, I would like to see "The World Karma Ancestral Spirit Ages Tarot." That's all different colored people of various races, genders, ages and abilities, in today's world...wearing normal clothes, and looking like REAL people. But, then again...hmmm... Be careful what you ask for, huh? :D [edit for clarification: *this initial statement does not negate or void my continuing attendance to a "wish list," an item to which i dedicate much loyalty and maintainance. :d ]

Teranar	24 Aug 2003
One area everyone's covered is the future of the decks... but what about Tarot in general? Laws passed in places like San Francisco (Link to that thread, anyone? I'm too lazy to go fetch myself) requiring you to have things like licenses worry me, and with the growing political strength in groups that would see every tarot deck burnt (And probably with a lot of readers still clutching them) I'm worried about what else they might do, like require licenses to buy decks, outright outlaw it... Anyone else share my sentiment, or want to rebuke it? (Please someone rebuke it and give me something to indicate I'm way wrong. I hate it when I'm right in cases like this.)

Destiny	24 Aug 2003
Originally posted by Astra NONE of them? You've checked all the offerings on the Aeclectic site? Sheesh, I haven't even gone through a quarter of them and my bank account rose up on its hind legs and said "watch it..." Tarot was, to some extent, stagnant during the '70s and possibly the '80s, but the number of new decks, from the totally idiotic to the strange and wonderful, that's come out in the last 20 years boggles the mind (well, mine at least). And people (like me) are still turning out more ideas and seeing about getting them published (I can hope!). Check out HudsonGray's Ferret cards at http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?p=999&gid=1243650&uid=728989, and the Tarot of Prague at http://www.baba-prague.com/tarot for two totally different takes. ................... I've been checking this site from day one for new cards but the cards /deck you mentioned in the above do nothing for me in the slightest, even my dear friend Maud who did have some of her cards on show. I like the cards but she had done them from an art point of view rather than reading but I do think that they are OK as the quality art presentation is very good. However I do see more totally idiotic decks out but this could be done for personal projects rather than publishing in mind. I bought the Fey when it came out and I felt a little let down! I went through the deck and thought hhmmmm this is just a highly influenced combination of cards from the rest of Lo Scarabeos decks all in one. ...................... Originally posted by Tauni I'd like to see a deck with multi-ethnic people in a quality art presentation. All the so-called ''inclusive" decks are wonderful in their attempts to represent many colors, genders, ages and roles. My "druther" is that they are typically in primitive or folk art style (not "real" looking), or in a distant time, or inaccurately portrayed in some way (facial features, body structure, etc.). However, each deck I can think of also offers something very important, so I wish I could mesh the best of each of them all together for the perfect deck! ............ Also I know that most of the publishers want artists to come up with a book to go with their deck which makes sense but I'm sure that the publishers can do the book side of things as this will for sure put off artists submitting their decks. It takes long enough for the artists to create a deck and the last thing they need do do after is do do a book! sounds painful to me!

Kiama	24 Aug 2003
Teranar: I think the reason that will save all our decks from being burnt and outlawed is because so many places, stores, and companies make so much money from the Tarot industry! As for the future of Tarot... I hope that science will begin to play a larger role in the investigation and exploration of this system, possibly trying to help Tarot readers work out the true workings of the system. Kiama

Logiatrix	20 Jan 2004
I bumped this thread up, because I thought it was a rather compelling question... I never got to respond, because I was taking my time thinking about it, then life distracted me. I also wanted to see other's opinions--but not too many people answered. Sooooo... I have since reflected on what tarot will be like in, say thirty years...what will the cards be like--will there even be cards? Maybe we will have a virtual tarot...or we perhaps will hit a "retro" phase, and the "old" decks (Ciro's Gilded Tarot or Lee's Gay Tarot) will come back into vogue... ;) It's hard to predict (the cards aren't telling), but it's still fun to guess! What do you think? :)

HOLMES	20 Jan 2004
i briefly skimmed over some of the posts but i wanted to kepe my mind fresh. "the tarot is now in our hands, what we do with it is up to us." come to mind about what i wanted to say. the 1900s are over , the toth and the rider waite have influence any intermediate tarot personality. the sky is not the limite before it stops being a tarot and becomes an oracle deck. a prime example is the symbolon deck. which is full of advanced stuff still for me and i would like to see a book for that but that is a differnt matter altogether. i learnt much about myself, how i saw the cards, chakra colours when i made the hermit, five and seven of wands. (i am thinking of making my own tarot just to learn more ). with that in mind. the new tarot interest me a great deal but i vow never go to 400 (right now sitting at near 50 including oracles ) but by the time i am 90 (28 now ) that may change (if i make it that long eheh) . see i constantly do a tarot search on amazon for next year and there is some new decks that interst me. ( a prime example is the recent gothic tarot of the vampires which i will acquire some day ). for the artwork that comes out in the years to come will bring new light to the tarot, making it contempory and i come from the idea of the racheal pollack book forest of souls that only when there is no more tarot being made will we end up with the final product. i do not know the history, nor much of the symbolism of the tarot deck, i am more concerned with the relating of differnt systems to the tarot such as psychology, astrology,qabbalah. example of this is , i plan to explore sabian symbols from astrology to further understand the minors. with that being said. i am of the theory that if i made a tarot now at 28,, and one again near the middle of my life i would be full of much more detail and colours and knowledge and experience (example of this is the new palladini over the aquarian tarot which i like) and near the end of my days that would be cool to make a redone tarot. yet the questions remains for me , how many differnt ways is there to describe the source, your own version of god ? that is what the tarot is for me ,, a little picture or mirror for me to see greater signs in the universe. and so i think it will continue to grow.

Rusty Neon	20 Jan 2004
Quote: Originally posted by jmd Personally, I suspect that the Waite/Colman-Smith will also subside somewhat in importance, though the Crowley/Harris Thoth is probably likely to grow in importance and influence. Already some newer decks reflect this latter deck's influence. A great number of "new" decks use imagery that is substantially similar to that of the RWS image or, at least, use the meanings (or subset of meanings) suggested by the RWS images. Even if the "market share" of the RWS drops due to the sheer variety of RWS-inspired decks, the RWS will remain an influence because of those images and meanings borrowed by the other decks. Furthermore, even if the market share of RWS, Thoth and GD Book T decks drops, the influence of the GD will remain felt with the continuing existence of RWS-inspired and Thoth-inspired decks.

HOLMES	20 Jan 2004
i would agree with you rusty neon yet, the marsielles is the basis for the gd tarot (as well as influence by ettila tarot i think ) i saw that in the qabalistic tarot book. and the marsielles i think from what i understand is prefered by the traditionalist ( as well as older decks ) in the french european area?. (please clarify anyone ). yet i do agree that the golden dawn, waite, toth and let us not forget case bota influence as well will be around for some time. and so qabbalah, and astrology will grow more strongly in the tarot influences in the years to come as well i do believe.

Jeanette	20 Jan 2004
Teranar, I am rebuking you! I don't have any concrete facts to back up an argument per se, but I am hopeful that you are way wrong with your predictions. The thought of some kind of "Big Brother" monitoring me in this area is horrible. I can sort of see the licensing issue if money is being exchanged, because "city fathers" generally want their share of the pie from whatever goes on that involves money. I guess they view it as a business, and a business that generates revenue. After all, it (tarot card reading) wasn't prohibited, was it? I'm not familiar with the situation you're talking about, I'm just speculating about the details. But you're right to be concerned with some of the "extremists" who view anything that isn't their opinion/doctrine as wrong ~ that's a dangerous path to go down, not tolerating and respecting others beliefs. And that goes both ways, those extremists are free to cherish their beliefs as much as they want (as long as they don't interfere with mine, anyway)! That's how I'm seeing things from Pennsylvania USA, other places in the world may be different.......

miss_apples	20 Jan 2004
I actually think that people are opening up more to tarot and divination in general so I really dont think it will be banned or what not. I dont neccesarily oppose to the idea of licensing because unfortunatly there are a lot of scam readers out there and granted they can get license too, but then hopefully they can be caught easier if they are licensed. I mean look at the whole Ms Cleo ordeal...that woman was ripping people off! Sorry if Im offending any Ms Cleo fans...thats just my humble opinion. I dont find most of the decks very appealing either. Most likely because a lot of the decks I see are focused around faries and celestial and mythical symbols and I really dont get into all that. I like the animal ones and the ones that have more "realistic" (for lack of a better term, im not trying to say that fairies and angels and things like that arent real) theme to them. I personally love music, and Ive seen a rock and roll deck somewhere and Id like to see more decks like that. So as far as where do I see the future of tarot, I see it becoming more accepted and widespread and I see it becoming more creative in style.

CreativeFire	31 Jan 2004
I also think that Tarot is becoming more widely acknowledged and accepted, and not only in the areas of divination. Also see it being applied more and more to realms of psychology, as an additional tool for self awareness. Also am hearing more of its use as an inspirational tool for artistic pursuits - painting, writing (help with the story / characters). It is also being used as a technique for brain-storming in the corporate world of marketing, sales - a picture paints a thousand words and it gets people thinking or talking about their different interpretations from one picture etc. But more importantly where 10 years ago even, the availiabity of shops etc that carried any range of tarot cards was far less than what it is now, and this is only growing. And with that is growing the 'audience' of tarot - more people not directly involved in either the divinatory, collecting or historical / symbolic research are now taking an interest - where previously it was considered more of a mumbo-jumbo thing and consequently practitioners where not as open. As time progresses on into the future, we also have to consider the aspect of our children, grandchildren, the next generations - that are growing up seeing tarot cards and books used in the home, in shops that they are taken into with their parents - accept it as another "normal" interest - and as a result of this its acceptance and uses will continue to grow with ever changing beliefs, technologies and imagination! Of course I can only express my views from my part of the world - Australia - and of course acknowledge that different countries and cultures beliefs may affect Tarot's evolutionary progress :-) Look forward to being around in 30 to 40 years to see if my views (and hopes) come about. CreativeFire

HudsonGray	31 Jan 2004
Hmm, Destiny, have you looked through the visual images of over 300 decks on the Aeclectic tarot list site? Or paged through the 'available' decks over at Tarot Garden? SOMETHING has to ring a bell with you on some level (horrors if it doesn't!). Nobody should get jaded about the many thousands of decks on the market right now. One has to fit, it's just finding it that's hard. (Oh, just wanted to update here that the Picturetrail site for my Ferret Tarot is going down this month, the deck images are moved to my permanent web page now, at: http://www.falconsmew.com/prodcut4_1.html ).

TemperanceAngel	31 Jan 2004
I think clone decks will come and go... The resurgance of Marseilles will continue and then fade and continue and fade, as cycles go. Marseilles is a great reference point, but I do think, at times, the imagery does not reflect the changes of the centuries. Where I think RWS does, and will always be a deck of choice along with Marseilles and Thoth. I don't think we will see a new deck come into real prominence until next century.....XTAX

ol_crazy_Legs	31 Jan 2004
I think that Tarot will always come with new decks everty year. I cant wait to see what new decks will be out for 2004. Im actually in the beginning process of making a deck myself, The Blood Tarot. When its done Im going to get it published to sell. Depending on how that deck goes Im concidering maybe making it a business? I dunno well see.

The The future of tarot? thread was originally posted on 23 Aug 2003 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.