orginal waite tarot where can i
Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 18 Sep 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.
| HOLMES |
18 Sep 2003 |
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get a link to the orginal waite tarot pictures ?
if you see the newest review for the rider waite tarot , that review mentions the original rider waite with it;s original colours (without the flat colours ) is being released or has been.
so those who are good at finding links please help me out :O)
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| Sulis |
19 Sep 2003 |
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Hi Holmes,
I found a page on Joan Bunning's site where you can see a comparison of the Waite decks including the Original Rider-Waite with the muted colours.
I think there are also some images of this deck at Holly's Rider waite page but I can't find it.
Anyway the link is HERE
Love and light
Crystlamynx xx
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| HOLMES |
20 Sep 2003 |
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either the scans don't do the cards justice,
or the orginal waite colourings looks like the green washed out thoth that us games offers.
what is your take on the cards ?
edited to add.
looking closer at the site i found a better scan of the orginal waite on joan bunnings site.
i think they are amazing, even without the blue and they don't have that washed out feeling of the green toth at all
*takes foot out of mouth *
hmm i think i may look into one :O)
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| Emily |
20 Sep 2003 |
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Hi Holmes,
I have the re-print of the Original Rider Waite, and the cards do look like the scans, no blue so water and skies appear green. Although the cards themselves are not green washed, the colours are very limited and muted. Some of the cards, especially the court cards have black outlines and some of the detail is lost. Also you can see the little dots of colour like in comic book drawings - this you can't see in the scans. The lady in the Star card looks like she has a bad case of the measles lol.
I was disappointed when I first had this deck, it was my first tarot deck, but I studied and used it until I bought a Universal Waite.
The colouring of the Original is unusual but some people do like this deck. I prefer the colouring of the standard Rider Waite. Hope this helps. :)
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| Dark Inquisitor |
21 Sep 2003 |
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Here is a link to some pages that do a side by side comparison of some of the cards from an old original deck & the modern US Games version, courtesy of the dedicated Holly Voley :
http://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/tcc/tcc00.htm
The loss of detail is sad & astounding- the original High Priestess is so much more lovely !!
Tarotphelia
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| Diana |
21 Sep 2003 |
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Wow. If I had known there was an "original" one, I would never have bought the one I had. I had no idea. I thought the one I owned (the Rider Waite) was the original.
US Games really messed this one up with their bright colours and with their additions and substractions.
They did even worse with the Oswald Wirth deck - one day I'll make a thread on that but on second thoughts I may not 'cos it'll just make me angry.....
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| Lee |
21 Sep 2003 |
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Originally posted by Diana
Wow. If I had known there was an "original" one, I would never have bought the one I had. I had no idea. I thought the one I owned (the Rider Waite) was the original. Actually the one US Games sells currently *is* the original one. It's a reproduction of the deck as it was produced when it was first published. The "Original Rider" deck is a reproduction of a *later* deck, and the artisan who etched Pamela Smith's drawings into the plates for that later deck was less skilled than for the original printing, hence the poorer art on the later, "Original" one. The currently-sold Rider-Waite deck is a photoreproduction, nothing missing, nothing left out, although I understand they've replaced the original hand-drawn titles with a typeset font. The colors are supposed to be authentic, but that I can't swear to, not having seen the original-original, i.e. from 1910.
-- Lee
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| Diana |
22 Sep 2003 |
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Oh thanks Lee! I can always count on you to correct my incorrect suppositions and pre-conceived ideas. :)
So then I'll stick to the one I have... if it's the original that is not the Original. :D
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| Lee |
22 Sep 2003 |
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I just read over my post, and it's clear as mud. Too many originals! :)
-- Lee
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| HOLMES |
22 Sep 2003 |
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reading the editor review and review at our own aeclectic site, i think that although the original waite came later then the riderwaite , it is closer to the original as the information says for
they are based closer waite own personal deck, and although the original plates were long destroyed by a war, waite deck survived (from what i can tell by the review)
so though the original waite is clearly not the original , it is closer in my view (just based on the reviews mentioned and seeing scans comparison ) to the no longer existent original waite tarot.
but if the original waite is a closer copy fo the waite personal tarot , wouldn't it be more original then the rider ?
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| Diana |
22 Sep 2003 |
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I am lost... hopelessly lost. It is dark in this forest of original and not original decks, and strange noises abound, and there are shadows all around.
Could someone please tell me which deck is the closest to the original, and give me a link so I can see the deck?
Thank you.
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| Lee |
22 Sep 2003 |
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The following link is a good one, it shows various versions side by side:
http://home.comcast.net/~vilex/
On that page, if you go to the link for the Manteia article by Frank Jensen, it lets you download a .pdf file (you need Acrobat Reader to read it) that will tell you everything you would possibly want to know about how these decks were produced.
The "Original Rider Waite" is a reproduction of a deck originally printed *later* than the first deck. The only thing "original" about it is that the publisher decided to put the word "original" in the title.
The one US Games now sells, in the yellow box, is a reproduction of Waite's personal deck, which was in the possession of Waite's daughter, which is where US Games got it to photograph it from. It says so right on the box. :)
-- Lee
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| HOLMES |
22 Sep 2003 |
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i saw the yellow box and i never saw that ,
how then is the claims on the amazon linked earlier in this thread wrong as to their deck is closer to the original i am confused about that.
edited to add,
perhaps it is the printing techonology as stated in the article that makes the differnce for the original like lee said in the first post is supposedly closer to the original for that is what basically we are talking about , (though that website that someone posted has a comparision between original and rider and the one eyebrow was fixed in the rider (but the rest of the drawings are intact)
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| Lee |
22 Sep 2003 |
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Hmm... I don't see where it says the deck is closer to the original. I do see that it says that the deck was produced by plates destroyed during WWII. And that's true. That deck was produced sometime between 1910 and 1945, and those plates were destroyed in the bombing on England. But that version of the deck is a later version than the first 1910 edition, of which the US Games yellow box is a reproduction.
-- Lee
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| Lee |
22 Sep 2003 |
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Perhaps to clarify, the actual line drawings on the various editions of the cards are different. What happened was, as the plates from one edition wore out, an artisan had to carve the lines into new plates for a new edition. Therefore the line drawings are actually different, etched by a different artist (all this is outlined in the Frank Jensen article). The drawings on the "Original Rider Waite" deck are not only later in origin, but they're done by an artisan who was not as skilled as the one who did the 1910 edition which was used for the US Games deck. The lines on the "Original Rider" deck are thicker and coarser than the 1910 edition.
So, if someone wants to get the closest thing to what Pamela Smith had in mind, I think you really need to get the US Games version, or perhaps a printing of it prior to this year, which is when they started putting typeset fonts for the titles instead of Pamela Smith's hand-lettered titles.
Also, the "Original Rider" deck has green skies. I highly doubt this is what Pamela had in mind! :)
I think I recently read on another list that US Games is thinking about putting out a new facsimile edition of a genuine antique Rider-Waite deck. I'm not sure how this would differ from their current version, but it will be interesting to see what they come up with.
-- Lee
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The orginal waite tarot where can i thread was originally posted on 18 Sep 2003 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.
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