Serious Concerns ....

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 10 Jan 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.

allibee	10 Jan 2004
Through my website I have received a payment for a reading from a new customer, nothing new there, but it all seems a bit weird and I wondered what you thought, or if anyone else has received a similar approach This is the first person to include a copy/paste of the paypal payment page to prove their payment ... well thats a bit silly I thought, and then went on to read the information and question. Apparently this person is the chairman of a multinational investment firm and he wanted to know, simply, about finances! (even though my site says if anyone wants official financial advice they should seek someone properly qualified) So this is beginning to nag me so I go to his very official sounding website, and it is quite impressive. But still this little voice is nagging me that something is not right. So when I go to do a search for the company, there are no results for AOL search, and only one brief mention through another website that vaguely refers to this one section of this investment company . through mamma.com and webcrawler. So I'm a more than a little concerned. Have any of you been approached recently in this manner? Any and all responses greatly appreciated Allibee (with her serious head on)

TemperanceAngel	10 Jan 2004
A, I am not sure I understand EXACTLY what your concern is?? Is it that this person could be a fraud? If you really feel uncomfortable, maybe you should say you are unavailable to do the reading and refund their money. XTAX

jmd	10 Jan 2004
Here are my rather brief reflections on this... I use to have a regular client involved in financial management who would fly from Sydney to Melbourne to come get a reading, then would fly back that same day... the taxi fare alone - one way - from the airport would have cost about the same as the reading (the airport is a fair way out of Melbourne). I do think that many investors and financial advisers also have readings done. That you may be concerned in case of someone checking for fraud (against you) is always a problem... There are either one of two (and undoubtedly more) ways to handle this - and probably personally prefer the first of these: Either, when reading, speak clearly: 'what I see in the cards is ... ' this statement says precisely what you see in the cards, and makes no prediction about what will happen to the other - even if it is followed by '... that investing in campervans will yield the best results over the next 12 months'. Alternatively, mention that you do not give financial advice, but that you are willing to discuss issues as they arise in the cards - Q&A style. As for AOL finding a worldwide investment group - forget it. It just depends on how they operate... Hope this helps somewhat. [...]

allibee	10 Jan 2004
Hi TA My concern is that this is not a genuine approach and that if so, I maybe in line for litigation at worst, scam at best. Posted this concern as a *heads up* to you all, as well as a question, as alarm bells are well and truly ringing. A.

allibee	10 Jan 2004
Thank you JMD ... sage advice :)

TemperanceAngel	10 Jan 2004
A, Don't do the reading, for you to have such concern I would trust how you feel and go with that :) Very sound advice, indeed jmd:D XTAX

Astraea	10 Jan 2004
Hi, Allibee! I agree with TemperanceAngel -- if alarm bells are ringing, pay attention. The client's company might be legit, and the bells could be going off for another reason altogether. Since your stated policy is not to do financial readings, you can just return the payment and insist that he contact a financial advisor (or a reader who specializes in that area). My motto is: When in doubt, don't.

jmd	10 Jan 2004
I'd better moderate a little what I said in my first post after the wonderful and absolutely spot-on advice from you two! :) I tend to agree that if one is concerned or doubtful, then don't do the reading... However, one must also, I think, reflect on what it is that one is concerned of worried about. It may be about doing the reading itself - or it may be that already in the request for the reading, what has been picked up by allibee is that here is a person whose financial domain is, for example, rather rapidly going down the gurgler due to recent past financial mismanagement... If the latter is what is being picked up, then this would also raise alarm bells, yet one's initial response would be for self-concern and preservation. Thus, what are the alarm bells actually towards? ...and then, what to do about it.

allibee	10 Jan 2004
I will be perfectly honest ... self preservation is my number 1 priority ... number 2 is that these ARE the people to give qualified financial advice, if anybody is. But I am interested to hear your experience with investment/financial types JMD ... Perhaps I should be asking help with wording a disclaimer? A.

Umbrae	10 Jan 2004
personally - when someone is so picky about copying and pasting their PayPal stuff - I get concerned. Scams are easy to do via the internet. I smell scam...

TemperanceAngel	10 Jan 2004
Is it ok if you post what you dig-up, as I would be very interested?? Thanks :D XTAX

miss_apples	10 Jan 2004
Allibee...Ive seen your site and it looks like you have all the necessary legalities and disclaimers in place. I dont think you could get in trouble for fraud. Of course if you dont feel comfortable...just dont give the reading.

allibee	10 Jan 2004
Can I just say i do have a privacy policy on my site and as part of my ethics ... hence the reson no names or other confidential info in my outline post ... sorry!

TemperanceAngel	10 Jan 2004
I am interested to know if it is a scam or not, not who the person or company is :) Just clarifying! XTAX

Mojo	10 Jan 2004
I say take his money and provide a reading. Include whatever disclaimers you feel you have to, but there is little to worry about as long as you don't make any specific financial ADVICE. Here is a perfectly sellable and legally acceptable Financial Tarot Reading: I see many potential pitfalls and hazards in the road ahead. You must exercise caution with all investments and make sure that you have a plan B for every plan A. A plan C would also be advisable. Putting too much of your resources in any one investment is not necessarily a good idea. I can sense that your attitude about money is to leverage all your risks based on their payoff potential. You may sometimes be tempted to take risks for an immediate payoff, but you can usually temper these urges and act more cautiously. Whether you realize it or not, you have learned to trust your own gut instincts over outside advice and you will likely continue to do so in the future. There will be some viable opportunities which cross your path in the near future, so you need to be alert and aware in order to take advantage of them. Beware of "get rich quick" schemes and remember that patience is often rewarded. And don't take any wooden nickles.

Alex	10 Jan 2004
Alibee What's the worst thing that could actually happen? Alex.

Teranar	10 Jan 2004
I fully agree with Mojo, but if he does pull something pm me so I can arrange for any trace of his existance to dissapear via means of ninjas, hookers, and hackers. But seriously, just put your sites disclaimers at the beginning of your reading.

TemperanceAngel	11 Jan 2004
Have you checked if he has really paid? XTAX

HudsonGray	11 Jan 2004
One way to cover your butt in a reading, also, is to have it tape recorded--two machines. One for his tape, one for yours. Just a thought. But listen to your alarm bells.

allibee	11 Jan 2004
Thanks all for the great advice, lots to chew on there ... Mojo: superb :) Thanks again A.

Emily	11 Jan 2004
Hi Allibee, Was it a Limited Company - if so you can check if he is still trading, or what his status is now. All Limited companies by law, here in the UK, have to be registered. :)

Umbrae	11 Jan 2004
there is also the issue of 'is it a real compay?' Having a web-site means nothing - and with the whole pay pal thing raises doubts. If they could access your bank numbers...then they can steal not only your money, but your identity, your credit rating...need I go on?

mzmystic	11 Jan 2004
There's a scam going on for the last several years both by snail mail and more recently on the internet where an appeal is made by someone in another country to supposedly help them out with hiding large sums of money. I don't remember the details, but that's what this reminded me of. Maybe you should put a disclaimer on your site that you have the right to refuse to read for anyone and then just refund or don't accept his payment. And I surely wouldn't give any kind of investment advice, either, under any circumstances, if that's what he supposedly wants.

TemperanceAngel	11 Jan 2004
A, I am still going with the 'don't do the reading', it sounds more and more dodgy everytime I look at this thread... XTAX

allibee	11 Jan 2004
Hi peoples Thank you all for you input. I have returned the funds, pointing out the appropriate bit on my website and I am away for two weeks now ... a trip to the Metaphorical Isles methinks .... This has been a very interesting thread, and I hope maybe more than just I have learned from it ... I feel this is a grey area for many a professional reader, and perhaps there are many other grey areas that would be beneficial for us all to explore together Thanking you all again A.

TemperanceAngel	11 Jan 2004
Quote: Originally posted by allibee I have returned the funds, pointing out the appropriate bit on my website and I am away for two weeks now ... a trip to the Metaphorical Isles methinks .... I am glad to hear that, yes, a very interesting thread, HAVE FUN :):):) XTAX

allibee	12 Jan 2004
I did thanks, LOL ... a minute for the soul is a lifetime on earth :)

The Serious Concerns .... thread was originally posted on 10 Jan 2004 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.