Astrological Influences in Tarot Readings

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 18 Oct 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.

WalesWoman	18 Oct 2004
Lunalafey really got my mind rolling with some comments on readings we both did for the same person. I think if I had a better background in astrology my interpretations would have been a bit different. So I was doing some surfing this morning, beginning in the Non-Tarot/Astrology forum and found some amazing threads and links that put so much of what is happening into a new perspective, not only for the readings that I've done for others but what I have been feeling and experiences I've had lately. Suddenly I have a better clue of why I've been getting repeats of 5 Swords or 5 Wands, which would be explained by the Grand Quintiles this month. Judgment and Temperance have come up a lot as well, which I'm seing now as refering to the influence of Saturn and Libra, . So many things have pointed to the end of the month or phase, Moon/ eclipse was on the 14th and now I realize it's not only a full moon in Taurus (and the twins birthday) but the second Grand Quintile as well. I expect to see a lot of changes and upheaval, more mental than anything, emotional baggage and repressed emotions surfacing, things may become more grounded or family oriented. Found out I'm in the 2nd Saturn waning square group, and all that stuff is definately a factor. http://www.ata-tarot.com/reflections/02-15-03/Hazel.htm Check out the threads in the Astrology forum, if you aren't familiar with astrological influences and see if it helps make some of the cards make better sense. I know I need to upgrade my education on this totally. So have you been feeling these changes, something in the air you can't quite put a finger on? What cards would you attribute to the current celestial events or expect to see come up? What kinds of things would you expect and not be surprised at all to see happening?

lunalafey	18 Oct 2004
I have been getting quite a few 5's in my readings as well. And it's been since the start of the year. I looked at the one site- this one hit me like a lead weight Sometimes the onset of the Saturn return brings a phase of deep depression, which may be a form of grieving for the lost dreams and hopes of childhood. Some experience a phase of de-conditioning, as they become aware that some of the traits, behaviors, or beliefs about their potential that they were taught are dysfunctional, self-defeating, or limiting. The point is to accept the consequences of one’s actions. If not, the second Saturn cycle can prove treacherous.......... From age 30 to 56, the person is struggling with more complex responsibilities in family life and their career. The hidden test is the flowering of personal potential, above and beyond day-to-day responsibilities. I was aware and knew what was going on during my Saturn return, but had no idea of the after effects. Quote: So have you been feeling these changes, something in the air you can't quite put a finger on? What cards would you attribute to the current celestial events or expect to see come up? What kinds of things would you expect and not be surprised at all to see happening? OH yes! and I have said it must be planetary- and maybe even generational, because not everyone is having these trials. For me, I wonder why things are not going well around me. I expected all that during my Saturn return and oh boy what an upheaval that time was. But I knew it & was prepared and accepted it, so it was not all that bad. Now I feel I have been thrown back into that space unexpectantly. Jupiter is in Libra right now, one would think that that combination would rain down good fortune to those who deserve it. Karmic debt was caught up with Saturn months ago! And with Saturn in Cancer, such a nurturing & sensitive sign... Maybe I should write them both a letter....

ros	18 Oct 2004
The 5's and changes ~ all the things that I haven't delt with are being played out be other people. AUGH This is stress, watching people go through things that I don't talk about. I'll be glad when the planets knock it off! LOL It's easier to accept when you understand a bit of why things are happening. I know a little of astrology and can see how this is happening. Everythings connected. Thanks for the thread! I'm going to look into the planets and the Majors. I have them written down but didn't know how to explain it until now.

WalesWoman	18 Oct 2004
Good points!!! It seems that people in these age groups, have varying tasks, but have to face some hard facts that may have been avoided for too long and can no longer do so. I've gotten the Hierophant as well for some dynamic Major face the facts 5, and discover what they are, learn from them, as far as maybe I should seek counseling to work out something I just don't want to look at or discover where these deep dark feelings come from. That Hidden Sorrows spread is pretty good for looking at things. What caused my sorrow in that spread is part of what triggered this, but isn't the real thing...or maybe I haven't seen the connection just yet, so I want to re look at all the spreads I've done lately, especially with this new light. Saturn as something to do with Fathers. I swear Tarot makes me look deeper than I want to, guess having a person in the room would make me stop veering when it gets too close to the pain. So I'm undecided about even this!!! But hey, if it would help me stop trashing myself and setting myself up for failure...what is really stopping me from doing that? Brick Wall LOL I'm wondering if also the shortness of days is creating a heightened sense that "the End" is coming soon, the end of what ever you may or may not want to part with, the end of the season, the year. A hurried, need to be prepared for what ever comes. Winter is darn cold and inhospitable, dangerous, so it could be a real subconscious factor here. That survival instinct may be what is at the base of what is coloring emotional and rational thought. Anyone prone to S.A.D.D, would start drooping about now, becoming depressed and lethargic and may not know why. What a fine mix this makes. Saturn in Cancer- there's the Cups, the emotional element, so maybe with the wobbling of Libra trying to get and maintain balance, emotions are going everywhich way and probably more family centered ones. I know I am trying to moderate my reactions to irritants and aggravations in order to modify the kids penchant for yelling, sniping, whining, arguing and fighting and just being siblings, because it is so eroding to serenity and general well being. It drives my guy nuts and then we're both tense and things deteriorate from there. With Libra/ Temperance/Justice/Judgment, yeah you would think things would be becoming more on an even keel and becoming clearer and I think that will happen, but before things can equalize, there tends to be that wobble effect before hand. Flip floppin' away to paraphrase Paul Simon. Trying to look at all sides in a non judgemental way, and having a tougher time deciding if the pros are really pros or if you're just conning yourself, not sure what sort of decision to make and not doing anything! So I wonder if 2 Swords might come up, 4 Cups, more 6's? Strength Rx. things that point out acting out of indecision and weakness??? Seem like 10's are prominent as well. LOL I'll get the whole deck here yet! LOL Basically coming up with tons of indecision, or lack of self discipline, trouble communicating because emotions and thoughts are doing a yo-yo- So the Magician could pop up a lot too, he's been hanging around, so I took him to mean loss of confidence, opportunities and lack of discipline, lost energy and to get off the head trips and DO something positive about it. I also think that thought patterns are tending to be more obsessive than focused, more ...jumbled, disjointed, flighty, darn the word I want just won't come! Impusive maybe, constantly changing your mind about things all for "equally valid" reasons at the time. Meanwhile I'm going to do some more looking at cards in relationship to the short term and long term aspects of where things are in the night sky and how they relate to readings and what is going on right now. The slow moving planets have a more global effect, where Mercury or Venus move faster, their effects are more varied and fleeting. Anyway, I've got to put the garden to bed, be QP, it won't 7Pents by itself. In the meantime, everyone feel free to jump in, to educate me and set me straight on astrological facts and correlations, please.

lunalafey	19 Oct 2004
Something in your words reminded me of a little while back when I pulled the card for all- the 3 of Swords. I'm doing research and reviews as well....back later.

WalesWoman	19 Oct 2004
Quote: Saturn Transit The transits of Saturn in the sky above us right now color the entire landscape of our life during this current time. Saturn always indicates the kind of time we are having and what we are going through. Saturn presents the limits and often the obstacles that confront us at this time -- what we have no choice but to go through. and Quote: Jupiter Transit If Saturn presents the general situation through which we are passing, Jupiter in the sky above provides some insight into how to handle our current life situation -- whatever it happens to be. Jupiter is the key to our success -- how we will get through this time, our path -- the way through or on. from http://thenewage.com/new_oracles/astro There you go, 3 Swords face things and learn from them, grow with them, accept there is no other choice!!! Jupiter in Libra would be Temperance again and Justice, and I'd pay attention to anything that had a 6, Lovers, Devil, etc. in it for the areas that need to be worked on, yes? Things that need a balanced approach or where things are out of balance?

scorpio	19 Oct 2004
Just to clarify, the eclipse on october 14th was a solar eclipse in 21 degrees libra at 10:48 pm EST. Those who are impacted by taurus, put your hardhat on for the upcoming lunar eclipse in 5 degrees taurus on october 27th 11:07 pm EST. Eclipses are generally shakeups and turning points in your chart, solar eclipse are about new beginnings and lunar eclipses are associated with endings and the influence of these events can last for up to a year. http://astrologyzone.com/forecasts/eclipse.html has a great article on the effects of eclipses and if you know what house the eclispe falls in you can aslo look for the matching influence in your readings.

lunalafey	19 Oct 2004
I thumbed through M. Greer's Tarot For Yourself and found this: 3 of Swords Saturn in Libra 4 of Swords Jupiter in Libra the 5's wands- saturn in Leo (coming up) cups mars in scorpio swords venus in aquarius pentacles mercury in taurus the 6's as a whole are associated with Jupiter and 7's with Saturn and those 5's deal with Mars- who is another very masculine sign. I have no idea the method of this associations, but they where interesting to see. Now I have been also wondering about the Grand Quintiles Where do these planet positions fit in with our natals? Being that Saturn has been in Cancer- it has been in opposition of my Sun and Mercury and more reciently my Moon. This may be the reason for my down feelings. Being that not only has Saturn been opposite of my moon but I am ruled by Saturn as well. Who's a Cancer? with a Capi moon, I want to know what your having to deal with! LOL

WalesWoman	19 Oct 2004
Scorpio- after reading the excellent article about the lunar eclipse, especially for those with birthdays or have Libra as an ascendent (the twins turn nine on the 28th and it is both my and my mate's rising sign) I really do think I'm turning off the phone, locking the door and will put up a "gone fishing" sign, maybe for the whole week or up to 4 months??? EEKS! With all the 5's I've gotten lately, I know the 5 of Swords will be referring to my old man, his Venus is in Aquarius. The other fives would be just what happens...under this influence. Like, I am going to get out the duct tape and do a 8 Swords on my mouth, do a 2 Swords with my fingers and lock myself in my room, nothing argumentative or anything that can be taken as offensive is going to escape these lips! That IS the five of Swords isn't it- empty victory ? He's just going to have to find someone else to pick a fight with. Gosh I wonder what the effect will be on birthday cake baking? It also makes sense that many of these readings with all these cards or very similar cards have also had the Moon as the outcome or in there somewhere. Groping in the dim light, trying to stay on the right path and not sure of much of anything but to stay on the path, that it will be highly emotional and to trust intuition as a guide. I guess a good spread for What can I do to avoid the worst aspects of these celestial events? might be called for.

lunalafey	20 Oct 2004
OK, just perfect, yeah right!- I did a spread of two cards called "snap-shot" out of Llewellyns tarot annual. You seperate the deck, majors and minors. The majors represent the "what" the minors represent the "how". Aside from wanting to crawl under a rock- I get news- I may be homeless- again unless I can find another place to rent. It has happened 3 times in the last 6 years. I get comfortable and the place I'm renting sells, so I have to move. Housing around here is really hard to find. Especially something I can afford. So I ask the cards "what do I do if I go homeless?" from the major pile I get the Hierophant; from the minors pile I get the Emperor- WHAT? misdeal- mental note- V Hierophant!!! I do it again and I get - get this - XX Judgement (rx- I think V was rx too.) & the Knave of Cups. ( a card we (WW) had for the same person reading. In M Greer's book, the Page of Cups is Earth of Water. I took Saturn and called it an Earth planet since it rules Cap. Saturn is in Cancer, a water sign. So Saturn's position at the moment seem to be of a Page of Cups nature. Cancer deals with home- *sigh* and Saturn deals with wall boundries and rules...rules.....RULES! the Hierophant! Now we are looking at Taurus, ruled by Venus....lol- the Empress, my souls and personality card. Eclipse in Taurus huh? Where's my rock!!!!

WalesWoman	20 Oct 2004
Tarot Forecast for October: LOTS of 5's due to bad 2's creating 10's, calling for lots of 6's and 7's, using the 9's to create 4's. Have you noticed the amount of posts with confusion around Temperance?

WalesWoman	20 Oct 2004
How about three swords for a terrible tooth ache and knowing there is no other choice but to make a trip to the dentist?

scorpio	20 Oct 2004
WalesWoman what a coincidence, i have an early degree scorpio ascendant so if you have a late degree libra ascendant the eclipse probably falls in your 12th house as it did in my chart, and i'm having horrible pain for trying to hold out to travel crosscountry to my holistic dentist. Susan Miller talks about the eclipse in the twelfth triggering the need for a medical/dental procedure or surgery, bummer! You must be feeling better than me though i can't get past the pain to read! You can read how the eclipse impacts the 12th house at (even tho you arent a sco sun this will apply to your libra asc if it is late degree) http://astrologyzone.com/forecasts/monthly/scorpio_full.php

WalesWoman	21 Oct 2004
Night before last suddenly I was in some awful pain, and when I saw Lunalafey's earlier post about three swords, it became suddenly clear what the three of swords I got last week was about. Wish I would have thought of the dentist then instead of yesterday, maybe I wouldn't have spent the past week wondering if I might be looking for a new address in the next month or so. Oh man! I really have to re read my spreads, I just am reminded of bits and pieces as new revelations appear. I am feeling better, I haven't tried biting into anything harder than a banana and yes, antibiotics can be wonderful. When it's neccessary and it IS. I can't figure out how to read charts yet, besides natal ones, so I'm not sure. The link you sent said something about the lunar eclipse being in Taurus in my 10th house.

lunalafey	21 Oct 2004
Quote: Originally posted by WalesWoman How about three swords for a terrible tooth ache and knowing there is no other choice but to make a trip to the dentist? You too??? The Eclipse falls in my 8th house. The grace under pressure house. The progressed Moon will trine my natal Sun in Cap and Jupiter in Virgo...

scorpio	22 Oct 2004
WW i know it can be confusing, if your ascendant is 21-29 libra, then the earlier solar eclipse in 21 degrees libra fell in the 12th house in your natal chart, activating 12th house issues if your ascendant is 0-20 degrees libra then the solar eclipse fell in your 1st house. Astrologers use charts with the ascendant/rising sign the same as the sun for forecasting to show the relationship of the transiting planets to the sun, so since you know your rising sign you can read about the transits influence by reading in this case scorpio or libra(ignoring the "natal" tendencies and just reading transit influence) depending on the degree. The upcoming lunar eclipse in taurus will fall around your 8th house depending on the degree of your ascendant. I'm sorry i totally am not explaining this well, and didn't mean to confuse you! Sorry!

WalesWoman	22 Oct 2004
Scorpio, don't worry about confusion, it's a been a normal state of mind lately, but all is becoming clearer...phone calls can do that as well as the Moon & Mercury transiting the sky, bringing clarity as well as Sun ( Sunday, the 24th). That could also be the change of the signs, so close to going from Libra to Scorpio. No wonder Death just showed up! Not needing to look at both sides any longer, finally finding the balance by what is needed to be known and what decisions may need to be made, or what path to follow, the transformation has begun or very soon to be. My outlook seems to have changed just as fast too. I wonder what the configuration is for Idiot, I know the card would be The Fool, because I am feeling quite foolish for over reacting to the whole thing. Misreading what the 10 Swords and 5's were about in the first place and taking 9 Swords to the extreme limits. The Moon has been coming up again and this insight from the Old Rose helps put it into a better perspective, rather than feeling I've been groping around in the darkness: Quote: THE MOON You have reached an enchanted moment in which you can see the past, present and future as one continuous process of unfolding. You have reached the dark moment where fear threatens to paralyze you. Yet you move forward into the unknown psychic landscape with a certain curiosity. You recognize a kinship with the unconscious world. Your dreams inform you instead of terrorizing your sleep. Confidence comes from the instinctual world. You reach deep into your inner being for inspiration. Then examine your thoughts and feelings logically. Balance your intuition with intellect, trust with circumspection. From the psychological reading with the Old Rose Tarot at this site : http://thenewage.com/new_oracles/tarot/index.asp?orig= So I'm actually beginning to look forward to this event rather than dreading all the percieved gloom and doom conflict possible with the 5's and the endings of the 10's. I also understand now better what the 5's that seem to be occuring are about and can neutralize or defend myself from them, rather than freaking out. That this has been a period of unclear thinking because of having to confront conflicts in the subconscious and cut through them. Libra/Justice Hierophant-5 Another way to look at the 10 Swords and most likely the others as well, would be liberation from the strife and negative influences, which all seems to be pointing to the Grand Quintille and Full Moon on the 28th. So then Jupiter in Libra can finally start pouring out it's good things and positive aspects. Am I getting there yet?

scorpio	23 Oct 2004
The moon is related to pisces/neptune which corresponds to the 12th house in astrology, now i think you are on to someting WalesWoman, if the eclipse in libra was in your 12th it plants new seeds to be worked with in the realm of psychic endeavors as well as bringing opportunites to find healing especially with a certain person (libra is partnerships). The moon also probably reflects that the upcoming lunar eclipse in eclipse will be more emotional for you and this is the one that deals with endings and depends on what house it is in.

WalesWoman	23 Oct 2004
This is making more sense all the time. I guess I really need to take a class on astrology, how to read charts, ephermeris and progressions. Last week was so confusing, this week, or towards the end of it, it's like light bulbs have been going off, making one connections after another. It's one thing to figure out what triggers different responses, thought processes, emotions and actions, and then digging deeper into what is at the root of them, understanding it, making sense of it and discovering what to do about it. It really seems to be following the night sky (and the day one too, just can't see it), as well as now I really am understanding some spreads that I've been having in the past two months. Thank you so much Scorpio and Lunalafey. What is pretty cool, depending on how it's been manifesting in our lives, is the synchronisities that have been happening lately as well. Ok, the law of averages would say out of the 5,000 + members, 3 people having toothaches or needing to see the dentist, would have to be expected...but ones responding and sharing their knowledge to help me understand this...is not coincidence. So from now on, I think when a spread tends to throw me for a loop, I'm going to look up at the sky and then re-examine my cards. It will be most interesting to compare notes next week.

WalesWoman	25 Oct 2004
I figured out what was behind the 9 Swords, finally. Saturn square Neptune! Oct.1- Oct. 11 Isn't it wonderful to find out it's the planets and where they are in the sky, that makes us crazy sometimes and nothing else, really? But as for the Moon, with a lunar eclipse, how would you read that? RX, would things be so unclear there is no path visible at all? Dark emotions? mass confusion? What might we expect to see in a reading? What sorts of events or emotions would not be surprising to see?

lunalafey	25 Oct 2004
Quote: Originally posted by scorpio The moon is related to pisces/neptune which corresponds to the 12th house in astrology This one confussed me at first- then I caught on that this is the tarot associations, where I was stuck with astrological. When I think moon I think Cancer, 4th house- which is odd because my study of tarot is more than my study of astrology. BUT it does give me food for thought. How are we to combine astrological astrology- natals and progressions; to the associations of tarot? Do we look at a planets position and find the card that fits the sign or take the signs ruling planet and look into that card? Do we take a card from a reading and find it's sign or the signs ruling planet thengo back to the card that represents that planet? keep going and we might go full circle! If we want to get reall nutty, we can take our natals- do one of my astrological twist spreads for the year 2005 and keep referencing the cards to our natals and progressed planets.

HOLMES	25 Oct 2004
i have done my natal chart with the tarot astrology assoctions of the golden dawn. and i did a reading with it here in the reading exhange last fall i think. however since there is no astrology standards across the boards , there is no wrong astrology assoctions in the sense that how can that be ,, that is WRONG . just has to be work is all. i believe that one can do a chart with the tarot cards in order to see a snapshot of time, that it could work in the theory of astrology natal chart and progression but would be tarot related. of course it would't be a snapshot of how the stars are today,, but in the sense of a tempory snapshot like an picture of how your inner astrology is working.

Flavio	25 Oct 2004
Quote: Originally posted by WalesWoman Found out I'm in the 2nd Saturn waning square group, and all that stuff is definately a factor. http://www.ata-tarot.com/reflections/02-15-03/Hazel.htm Thank you very much for sharing this link, the article was so useful and interesting, recently I addressed the Astrology forum about Saturn's 7 year periods in our life.

lunalafey	25 Oct 2004
something I'm gonna go look at- I took all the majors...started with my rising sign- Virgo Ok- so I have the Hermit card, with that card I found the majors that associated to the planets I have in Virgo- Fool, Wheel of Fortune, Judgement. I went around the astrological wheel like this...the results being- Hermit-- Fool, Wheel of Fortune, Judgement. Death--Empress, Hanged Man Devil-- Magician, High Priestess, Sun Star-- Tower Emperor-- the World On the surface- it's already WOW!

WalesWoman	25 Oct 2004
OOO what a great idea! I've seen some astrological spreads laid out like a chart. This would be very interesting to use the spread and using the corresponding cards to the current or projected future progressed chart rather than drawing cards for the spread! The way my chart is most of the planets are in a few houses on one half, a bouquet of planets with a stem and the rest are empty. Shhhh (I'm not well balanced, that's why I have my old man, we compliment and balance each other) So I guess when he's not around, I feel more than my heart is missing. LOL Interesting though would be coming up with the connections for the opposing, trine, sextile, square combo's too. Just following the lines on the chart and going in a circle. This one came from one of Rachel Pollack's books I think, I'll have to check on that to be sure. It might have been in the Keeper of Legends book or off a spread site or MAYBE from the Spreads section here. It's grouped in my folder with other's from here, so maybe. If anyone recognizes it as their own, please let me know. I try to make sure I get the creator's name included, but sometimes I space it out. Astrological /House/ Birth Chart Spread Lay in circle counter clockwise, end with 12 in 12:00 position 1st House Self , outer personality, way you look at the world 2nd House Money & possessions 3rd House Communications, relations 4th House Beginnings, home life, father 5th House Pleasure, creativity sex 6th House Service & health, work environment, body 7th House Partnership, marriage, enemies, business 8th House Death & regeneration, wounds, self sacrifice, psychic & spiritual energies 9th House Mental Exploration long distance travel, philosophy, vision 10th House Career, Public Standing mother, responsibility, career 11th House Friends, hopes, wishes, ideals gossip, social involvement 12th House Secrets, sorrows, self undoing unconscious forces or for a site that lists the Houses and their meanings...Which is basically the same as this spread I think.... http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_house2_e.htm Another one would be to shuffle and lay out the cards in all 12 positions and then look at the chart after reading the spread. New connections we'd never thought or not be one bit surprised by the cards that did come up. Do it both ways? comparison?

The Astrological Influences in Tarot Readings thread was originally posted on 18 Oct 2004 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.