Did you guess right in the presidential election (NOT a political discussion!)

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 06 Nov 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Ace	06 Nov 2004
I was curious how many who posted readings guessing who would win the US Presidential election got it right. Did you really predict a Bush win? BE WARNED: I am not asking if you LIKE Bush or voted for him. Please keep this NON-political. (Moddies: If it is too political to keep, feel free to pull the thread.)

Moongold	06 Nov 2004
Hi Ace ~ I interpreted Wales Woman's throw in Your Readings and felt that Bush would win. WW posted 10 Swords instead of 10 Spears (Wands) which skewed things at the end but everything else about the reading indicated that Bush would win. I also felt that it would be much closer than WW's 10 Swords indicated but the 10 SW could have been interpreted a number of ways. It was an interesting experience since I am not American and had not been subsumed by the commentaries. WalesWoman's throw, just in its own right and free of the influences that inevitably come with immersion, was fairly clear I thought. It made me think a lot about projections - their inevitability when situations are deeply felt - and how they influence our readings. Moongold

jlbvt	06 Nov 2004
I had no idea- it was too close to call, all the way to the last vote. I know a lot of people who stayed up too late watching the results come in. I was biting my nails the whole time. Since this is non-political, I can't say whether it was worth staying up to find out...

Shalott	06 Nov 2004
A reading I did said, basically, if nothing big happened, Bush would win.

lunalafey	06 Nov 2004
I have no trouble with it being here as long as it keeps to the element of prediction and accuracy. But I feel that it wold be better in a Tarot Forum because it deals with the perdiction of a tarot reading.

VGimlet	06 Nov 2004
I predicted Bush would win - I did a reading, and oddly enough, on New Years Eve our local TV station had a tarot reader on who also said he would win. I bet my co-worker a latte he would win. If that was profiting from my knowledge, it sure packed a karmic punch. :P

jlbvt	06 Nov 2004
due to the tiny typeface I'm seeing since the upgrade, I didn't even realize this thread was about prediction readings. I thought it was just whatever feeling we had... excuse me. (pulling proverbial foot out of mouth) Joan

Ace	06 Nov 2004
lunalafey wrote: I have no trouble with it being here as long as it keeps to the element of prediction and accuracy. But I feel that it wold be better in a Tarot Forum because it deals with the perdiction of a tarot reading. Can you guys just move it? I put it here since i didn't think of that!

Tarot Sparrow	07 Nov 2004
Well, I didn't POST my reading (one card each) until after the results, but from that and from what I had seen on here I just knew Bush was going to get it. My reading was quite clear on that and was reinforced by another on the forum.

jema	07 Nov 2004
As usual, everyone here is a lot better at reading the tarot then I am. I made a reading - and had it all wrong.

Diana	07 Nov 2004
VGimlet wrote: I predicted Bush would win - I did a reading, and oddly enough, on New Years Eve our local TV station had a tarot reader on who also said he would win. I bet my co-worker a latte he would win. If that was profiting from my knowledge, it sure packed a karmic punch. :P In my family, we made our bets months and months ago and put our predictions in an envelope. But I was FORBIDDEN to use my Tarot cards before making the bet - as my family thought that would give me an unfair example. So I was not allowed the joy of giving a karmic punch. Does one need special gloves for this?

Imagemaker	07 Nov 2004
About two weeks before the election, I did two draws (Morgan Greer), with this question: When all is said and done, and all the votes are counted, what are the prospects for Bush to win? Moon (Same Q for Kerry) 7 Cups The illusory element of both cards fascinates me, but I took the major as a slight Bush win while Kerry would be left pondering many feelings.

FantasyWorld	07 Nov 2004
This is a spread I did with thoughts of the election Monday or early Tuesday before the results had come in. I used 5 cards somewhat descending like stairs. I used the Tarot of Prague for this. 8 wands 4 swords The Empress The Tower 7 Swords Everything happening at once Rest/pause Growth Chaos/upheavel Revenge/thieft/sneaky I felt having drawn the Tower and 7 of Swords- that Bush would probably win.

catti	07 Nov 2004
Imagemaker wrote: About two weeks before the election, I did two draws (Morgan Greer), with this question: When all is said and done, and all the votes are counted, what are the prospects for Bush to win? Moon (Same Q for Kerry) 7 Cups . Then the win was through deception???? Just being a devils advocate...if you feel offended , please relax , i would hope that civilized people could at least discuss the possibility that elections are not always what they seem. Especially American elections...to this day the electoral college is strange to me and the idea of proclaiming victory before the votes are counted and the election certified.Also there is no standard across America on how to vote...it is so strange...so that moon card...well certainly the forces behind the election. The power that the Bush dynasty has cannot be discounted .

Chubby Mummy	07 Nov 2004
I used my morgan greer cards and asked whether Kerry would win the election and got Queen of Wands 3 of swords 5 of wands So although I tried to see the 3 of swords as a delay card, it was a disappointment card, and the 5 of wands was the defeat card... The Queen of wands represented Kerry and his intentions... Oh well...

Ace	07 Nov 2004
jema wrote: As usual, everyone here is a lot better at reading the tarot then I am. I made a reading - and had it all wrong. Really, jema? what did you get?

Ace	07 Nov 2004
catti wrote: i would hope that civilized people could at least discuss the possibility that elections are not always what they seem. Especially American elections...to this day the electoral college is strange to me and the idea of proclaiming victory before the votes are counted and the election certified. Actually, the American system IS Strange. it is based on the fact that the founding fathers really didn't trust their own people. The original people that could vote were only White, male, LANDOWNERS. They wanted only educated people to vote. Originally also, the vote was to elect the electoral college who actually picked the Prez. So there was no POPULAR VOTE the way we see it today at all. Back in the 60's and early 70's there were some novels written on the possibility that the popular vote would be so close, the electorial college would deadlock and the vote would go to the Congress-who would ALSO deadlock.... A real possibility but not very likely. The closest we have ever come to disaster was vote 2000. My history isn't great, so someone fill in the gaps or correct me, please!

WalesWoman	07 Nov 2004
If I'd have been reading it objectively- I probably would have seen what was coming...alas the reading was right, I interpreted it wrong, but at the time I couldn't decide who was going to win. Need a new card--fingers crossed! or is that the Star?

DollieAnna	07 Nov 2004
Ace If the Electoral College is tied 269-269 the House elects the President and the Senate elects the Vice President. See ...another type of "checks and balances." Also, the USA cannot go on popular vote alone. The candidates would then likely only stump to populated areas...that is why the Electoral College was created. adam_atom

Ace	07 Nov 2004
adam_atom wrote: Ace Also, the USA cannot go on popular vote alone. The candidates would then likely only stump to populated areas...that is why the Electoral College was created. adam_atom Now that is the first good reason I have ever heard for the electoral college! The votes of a state all go to ONE candidate, correct? So, the individual has a say, but ultimately, the STATE has a say too. Thanks for clarifying that! it isn't really OT at all.

DarkElectric	07 Nov 2004
I didn't do any readings on it, but I did analyse a few, and from what I saw it all looked as if it would end up in favour of Bush.

Nevada	07 Nov 2004
I did a reading, but didn't post it before. Here it is: ---------- Kerry---------- Bush popular vote --------1--------------2 electoral vote --------3--------------4 presidency---5--------------6 ------1. King of Cups---2. 2 of Swords ------3. 4 of Cups------4. 3 of Cups ------5. IX Hermit------6. 2 of Disks I saw this as Kerry winning the popular vote, and the electoral vote being tied up, perhaps in draw. I (perhaps emotionally) predicted a Kerry presidency. I really should've looked more realistically at positions 3 and 4 regarding the electoral vote, since the 3 of Cups indicates a celebration for Bush. The Hermit card confused me. If anyone can shed interpretive light on that, I'd be delighted. I think I let my emotions get in the way. Nevada

Nevada	07 Nov 2004
Ace wrote: The votes of a state all go to ONE candidate, correct? So, the individual has a say, but ultimately, the STATE has a say too. In some states, such as Maine, and I believe two others, the electoral votes are split proportionally. I believe out of Maine's 4 votes, this time Kerry got 3 and Bush 1. Nevada

Imagemaker	07 Nov 2004
Quote: the win was through deception Actually, one major concern is whether the electronic voting is secure and accurate. My husband has been following the software discussions of how election machines are programmed, and the protests of the ACM and IEEE on the monitoring and secrecy of the companies and their machines. There is much concern in the fact that there is no paper trail after voting occurs. Registers (number counts) can be changed very easily with no tracking of the action. But until we find a documented case of machine fraud, or courts insist that machines have a paper trail, no one knows if miscounts or deception happened. As for me, I have no problem seeing the moon in Bush's team and operations.

lawguy51	07 Nov 2004
You might be interested in this thread I started in Your Readings forum where I laid out a special election spread the night before the election. There are some very interesting comments and interpretations in the thread. http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=32940 Lawguy51

Shalott	08 Nov 2004
Ace wrote: Now that is the first good reason I have ever heard for the electoral college! The votes of a state all go to ONE candidate, correct? So, the individual has a say, but ultimately, the STATE has a say too. Thanks for clarifying that! it isn't really OT at all. Adam_atom had it exactly right, but I'll throw in a bit more background (as objectively as possible, actually I see no reason for my personal views to even peep out on this, it's just historical facts): when the US was first founded, the colonies had ALL the power, there wasn't much of a central government to speak of at all. The Continental Congress had very little power. When the settlers (our old friends, the Puritans, et al) arrived, they built up villages pretty much where they landed, and the colonies grew out of these. Then after the Revolutionary War, when they wrote the Constitution, they had to be very careful not to take too much power away from the colonies, now states. They didn't even have a common currency. There was quite a bit of bickering between Founding Fathers, as Alexander Hamilton in particular wanted a bigger, stronger central government, most of the others saw that they had to give the bulk of the authority to state and local government, else there might be another rebellion right away. It wasn't until after the Civil War, and the series of Civil War Amendments, (Amendment 14 here: http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.amendmentxiv.html) that the central government could even override the will of any individual state, if it chooses to and it doesn't always choose to. Which is why we still have the electoral college and each state has it's own way of voting. Here in Minnesota, we fill in little ovals with a Bic pen. I mean, to me this seems flamin' archaic, but that's how we do it. Minnesota is such a safety-conscious state that there's no way they would send ppl into booths with a sharp object to punch a hole. And I sure hope that if they make it computerized, they use a Unix-based platform and not MicroSquash. But this is, in a nutshell, why individual states here have sovereignty over SO much... (Professor Shalott steps off of soapbox...)

Alta	08 Nov 2004
Hi folks, I guess you know that Solandia has banned purely political discussion. This thread is on the topic of whether you did a spread on the election, and if you correctly (or not) interpreted the outcome, or discussions of the reading. Posts other than that are off topic. Marion Co-moderator of Talking Tarot

sagitarian	08 Nov 2004
My intuition was correct with predicting who would win the presidential election, I thought it was going to be George W. Bush. Sagitarian

shelikes2read	08 Nov 2004
I was semi-correct. My reading, which I posted on the Gilded Tarot Daily read thread, didn't give me a clear idea as to which candidate would win. However, it did leave me with the impression that there'd be a messy result instead of a clear-cut winner. If Kerry hadn't conceded the following day (which surprised me), it could have turned into at least as big of a morass as the election four years ago with the recounts and whatnot. Actually, my cards left me with the slight impression of a Kerry win, but it wasn't really that clear (to me) which candidate would win. I guess that interpretation was just wishful thinking on my part.

Ace	09 Nov 2004
Thanks guys, this is fun! I am a little surprised that 2 of Pentacles comes up Bush repeatedly. It does look like a "coalition government"-with a compromise rather than a clear win. But there it goes...

jema	10 Nov 2004
I am at work now but will see if I can find my reading when I get home. I remember it was very clear that Kerry would win. Just goes to show ya, right? hehe, perhaps I should think of better things to do with my cards...

wildchilde	10 Nov 2004
I have taken some time to think about the election issues and the many spreads that were done leading up to and beyond the actual election. Personally I was very surprised by the outcome because of what my cards had told me...however, I wonder if we are not missing our own #1 lesson with using cards. And that is that the information of the cards is not "set in stone"...many thoughts and actions influence the result. Some we control, and some we don't. So what I'm saying is that it's not a matter of whether we interpreted our cards right or wrong, but what influences, both personally charged emotions and 'behind the scenes' actions and emotions, have been present to affect the ultimate manifest outcome. I am finding it very interesting the number of people who have drawn corresponding cards (in differing positions of course), for example: the Queen of Pentacles, The Devil, The Moon, The Chariot, the Seven of Wands, the Six of Wands, the Two of Cups, etc. To me, the sheer number of correspondences, begs further study of the draws that have been done. Maybe someone will have the energy to do so? ;)

Paradox	10 Nov 2004
I predicted right. My tarot deck (animal-lords) seems to be completely accurate on predicting the outcome of events, if there is a known date.

paradoxx	12 Nov 2004
I felt that the readigns reflected moreof the nuances and details behind the election year process. The Media was supercharged in 2003 with the Iraqi conflict, and now the US Elections are the top spot, the Olympics just didn't make the cut though. I also felt that because of the close call in most of the states, the readings reflected a narrow win for whomever won, and one that may be retracted by popular demand. The final conclusions I could gatghter is that the process would be direct, but time-consuming, and some fault would have to be placed somwhere, there are votes that have been lost and manipulated in Nebraska due to e-voting.

NightWing	29 Nov 2004
In early August, I did a reading regarding the factors that might lead to a Bush win or loss in November. This was at a time when Kerry was looking better, and no one around me believed that Bush could be re-elected. I should add that I was not a Bush supporter, and not able to vote. The cards indicated to me a definite Bush win, though not a landslide, considering the war, personality, domestic issues, and so on. I consider that a pretty good call, as far as tarot is concerned. Not so good in other regards, some might say.

MAR	29 Nov 2004
Ace, yes, I predicted Bush was going to win even I had my doubts in the beginning cause a month before the elections, I watched on a tv show a known very experienced woman which predicted Kerry was going to win the presidency, and of course I have to say that I believed that, coming from her, but when I did a reading before of the election's day, my Ramses: Tarot of Eternity said the opposite, Bush was going to be the next president and I just pulled 2 cards, one for each of the candidate. :)

The Did you guess right in the presidential election (NOT a political discussion!) thread was originally posted on 06 Nov 2004 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.