Times Change, Why don't people?

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 18 Aug 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Poetlove	18 Aug 2002
I am having trouble understanding people in general. Are we in the year 2002, or not? I recently was at work, now mind you, it is not the best jobin the world, nor is it some place that I am really proud of working at, but when you need money, and have to pay for school you will work any where (McDonald's) I was recently at work, when I heard a high school student, say the workd dyke. Now, being a lesbian, I find that work offensive, and I have no idea what promts people to say things like that! They don't know at work of course, but how can some think it is okay to say that? Why are people so closed-minded, when this has been going on since the times of Egypt? I have written a paper and in almost every culture, there has been some form of same sex with same sex. Would like to hear anyone's thoughts, even if they don't agree with me. For I am open-minded.

DarkElectric	18 Aug 2002
It seems to me that people who are insecure are forever trying to impress other people, and unfortunately, they try to do it in negative ways. Was this a teenager? I have had experience with kids trying to be "cool" and using not only gender attacks, but racial slurs as well. I personally am so underimpressed when I hear some jerk slam other people for being who they are, or diss a lifestyle they can't even begin to understand, or appreciate. And maybe, just maybe, they were questioning their own sexuality, but didn't want their "normal, straight" friends knowing that. So they had to be "cool" and diss gay people. People are too afraid of being different in our cookie cutter American society. I also wish the herd mentality would die out, but there is too much emphasis placed on versimilitude. It is socially rewarded, while those who are not afraid to be themselves can be subjected to ridicule, at best. This lack of respect for gays and lesbians seems to me to be yet another ugly side effect of sexual elitism.

wavebreaker	18 Aug 2002
Poetlove: keep in mind that whatever these people are saying, says nothing about you and everything about themselves, namely that they are shallow, narrow-minded people, who fear everything and everyone that is different from themselves. That's their problem, not yours. And some of these people will probably never change, they don't know how to, that's too scary for them. Just ignore them. But then I guess that's easy for me to say, coming from a country where politicians are openly gay, where gay marriages are legal and being gay simply isn't an issue anymore...

VGimlet	18 Aug 2002
I've come to the conclusion that ignorant and narrow-minded people are afraid of what they don't know. Ignorace is no excuse for hatred, either, IMO. I do think the world is changing, but too slowly for my taste. The older I get, the less tolerant I am of that kind of crap. And I was never tolerant to start with.

jade	18 Aug 2002
i don't use degrading words and don't allow my kids to either. i teach them that acceptance and love are sooo important. as is integrity and grace! i am so sorry that you were hurt. (((hugs))) in light, jade

Kyrie Blue	18 Aug 2002
Poetlove, I have trouble understand people as well. On my end being from a widely varied multiethnic family, I constantly come upon ignorance, stereotyping, and prejudices that some people believe to be innocent but in my eyes I see the much larger impact that such 'innocent' little things might do...so sometimes I have to battle with myself whether or not to do battle with them in an attempt to open their eyes. Sometimes I'm up for and sometimes I'm not...I get tired of being the annoying one..LOL So, my point is that I always try to be open-minded and make no judgements on others and I'm truly sorry that you had to be exposed to that type of ignorance that was able to hurt you. Be well, and have hope that the future will change all things for the better!

the hermit	18 Aug 2002
Poetlove: When I hear people such as you encountered I just try to remember the words of that great philosopher, Forrest Gump ... "Stupid is as stupid does."

january	18 Aug 2002
Sadly, not everyone is as intelligent and open as we are here at aeclectic. Many people are afraid of exploring their true self, sexuality and overall possibilities. What a sad life to only allow one's self to shop in only one store in a lifetime. I call it the "cookie cutter syndrome"... feeling safe to be identical to everyone else. Too many people are afraid to be who they are, repress themselves and develop anger towards those who do. I see it every day. I feel sorry for them, and for you, PoetLove, for having to listen to such nonsnse from others. Be your beautiful self and set an example for those who are too afraid to do so!!! I am very intolerant of people who refuse to look beyond themselves and what "non-culture" has harvested and placed on their plates. What they could discover if they removed their bigoted shroud would be amazing. We teach by peaceful example and we'll win some day.... - january

Dark Inquisitor	19 Aug 2002
There is insult intended maybe, but also confusion. For example, in the Gay Pride parade, there are "Dykes on Bikes", self-titled I am assuming. Sends a conflicting message. Tarotphelia

Diana	19 Aug 2002
I often suspect that people who insult gays, are suppressing their own tendencies to be attracted to the same sex. They can't handle it, so they use aggression to avoid acknowledging the truth.

Poetlove	19 Aug 2002
Thanks all! Yes, she is a teenager. I guess I expect to much. I mean, first is was white and black people getting married. I have always figured it is hard enough to find someone you love, why put color, or sex or anything else in the way! I will try to be more psotive about the issue. Hugs to all

Minderwiz	19 Aug 2002
I think much of it is unintentional - in the sense that they do'nt know any better. I am not excusing it or mitigating it - but the sad state of affairs is that for all the belief in 'individualism' that is claimed very few actually make judgements about individuals without trying to impose some supposed group norm. It's easy to say ignore it or forget it but your alternative is to try and teach others not to make such judgements and that may will mean revealing your sexuality to them. With love Minderwiz

Faerie Lin	19 Aug 2002
I don't know why people assume the people around them have their same views, or maybe they just don't care, and they just bust out saying anything. I think when something like that comes up one should talk about it like Minderwiz said. When I was pregnant, I was lying in bed half asleep (just waking up, but dreading trying to roll out of bed). And I heard a knock at the door and my husband answered it, I could tell the person was let it. It was a guy selling newspaper subscriptions at an introductory price. My husband gave him some money for it. They were chitchatting for quite a bit and then the salesman busts out with "Ya know, Black people will hardly give up their money for anything. I haven't gotten any money from them yet, blah blah blah." And so of course my husband says "Now wait a minute, my wife is Black." The man completely changed his tone so quick, trying so hard to change what he said around (which he failed miserably), I am sure he felt stupid.... ya never know who you are talking to. I wish I wasn't in bed that day, I would have loved to wobble my pregnant butt in there just to see his face. Lin

jade	19 Aug 2002
unfortunatly, some people say the wrong thing alot. they hear the wrong things alot and they repeat them. this is why, as a parent, you can never allow yourself or any adults around your kids to use racial slurrs and insults. my hubby has this statement "oh that driver must be ______" i give him heck everytime he says it.....what is it teaching our children? jade

Laurel	19 Aug 2002
Certain types of teenagers need someone to hate and despise. They're so afraid of rejection that they're quick to do the rejecting -first-. Queers and fat people are the favorite targets these days and in general the media feeds the negative stereotypes on sitcoms and other low brow sources of learning. In the recent past dark-skinned people and Jews were the targets of rampant middle American bigotry, but now that's no longer as socially acceptabe as picking on us fat and/or queer people. Laurel A fat queer person :)

fairyhedgehog	19 Aug 2002
I think people diss other groups of people to make themselves feel less inadequate. I agree with Laurel that fat people have been added to the groups that people choose to pick on. I'm not fat, black or gay, but I will put the other point of view when people diss black or gay people (and I've just added an awareness of fat peoplism to my consciousness, so thank you :) ) My kids picked up the word 'gay' as an insult from school, but they know better than to use it in front of me - they can't stand the lecture. English schools are very bad in this respect - there is a local government clause which makes it illegal to 'promote homosexuality' in schools, so teachers are afraid of getting into trouble if they affirm a gay lifestyle. Still, we have recently had a Conservative MP openly owning his gayness, so maybe there is hope for us yet. I live in hope that we'll become as enlightened as the Netherlands but I'm not holding my breath. Love and light, FH

The Times Change, Why don't people? thread was originally posted on 18 Aug 2002 in the Chat board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Chat, or read more archived threads.