Weight Loss Surgery

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 06 Aug 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Rhiannon	06 Aug 2002
Since Kiama brought up the subject of weight, I thought I'd see how everyone feels about this. If you don't know what I'm talking about, then lemme 'splain (if you do, then skip to the next paragraph :) ). Weight Loss Surgery is basically altering your stomach and intestines so that you take in a smaller amount of food and you process it differently than you did before the surgery. This results in rapid, and most times, permanent weight loss. You are in the hospital for about 4 days after surgery and can't really do much for about 4 weeks. Then some side-effects are nausea and vomitting (if you eat too much), diarrhea (if you take in too much sugar), and things of that nature. This can also help you if you have adult onset diabetes that is related to obesity. In order to qualify for the surgery you have to be considered obese (100 lbs + overweight). Now that we've established the basics, how do you feel about it? I know several people who have had the surgery and they are doing beautifully! They admit that the first few weeks were rought, but they all agree that is was worth it. They are all looking and feeling better than ever and doing more than they ever would or could before. In fact, I have not heard one story where the person who had this surgery was unhappy! Just wondering about your opinions. R :)

WolfSpirit	06 Aug 2002
For myself personally...it makes me sick just to think of it, but then, I don't need it and would not qualify to get it either. I suppose if you're that obese it becomes a serious menace to your health (and not a beauty problem) you are willing to try it. Even though you can't eat much with the balloon in your stomach I think you still need a lot of will power to alter your eating habits as well (I guess otherwise you throw up all the time or are in a lot of pain). So if people benefit from it, why not...crazy as it sounds though.

Red raven	06 Aug 2002
I believe surgeries like this should only be done if it's for a medical condition.

jema	06 Aug 2002
well, when you have more then 100 pounds overweight it is a serious health problem and i think this may be the very thing that could save ones life. i have friends who had this done and while it has not been an easy time for them - they are all 3 of them healthy and active now. none of them did this as to just look pretty. they had to do it or they would probably have died within a year or two. for me, well, i am just not that overweight but who is to say i won't need it in the future. i do think i want to try all other means first though. the idea that i could never ever eat ice-cream is devastating. i think this is a last resort kind of thing and for the brave only. it is in no way the easy way out.

wavebreaker	06 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by jema i think this is a last resort kind of thing and for the brave only. it is in no way the easy way out. That's what I believe to. I don't know anyone personally who had this done, but have seen a documentary about it on tv and the people interviewed weren't all happy. It hadn't worked for all of them (some of them were still overweight) and many of them were miserable because they couldn't eat properly anymore. It wasn't just that they couldn't eat ice cream anymore, some of them even had difficulties eating a plain biscuit. I think this should only be done if there is no other solution, and for medical reasons only.

amyel	06 Aug 2002
I, too, would hope that this is a last resort thing, after every other traditional attempt at weight loss has been tried. I'm overweight - for me - and as tempting as it would be to have this type of surgery, I *know* what I really need is to exercise and eat better. I suppose, though, that for those so seriously overweight that they are in danger anyway, well, give it a go. But eating less is not the only thing these people will have to do. I actually don't eat enough and so my body, as it has matured, and coupled with a lack of any regular and meanigful exercise, stores what little I do eat because it is afraid of starving, hence the weight gain.

StormCloud	06 Aug 2002
I post on a low-carb BB, and we've had some folks on there who went for the surgery. Some had horror stories, some it worked for. Others went on a low-carb diet like Atkins or Protein Power instead of having the surgery, and that worked for them. I guess YourMileageMayVary :) You might want to check out http://www.pfangserver.com/bbs/ especially the Century Club if you want a biased opinion - these folks believe in their low carb (I do too - have lost 50 pounds in the last year and feel wonderful)

truthsayer	06 Aug 2002
i know 2 men who had it done and another who was preparing for it. one weared over 600 lbs when he had the surgery. he lost around 300 pounds and was still overweight but he was better off than he was before. i don't know how much the second guy lost but my husband has known him at least 20 years. the next time he saw the guy after surgery, hubby didn't even recognize him! the last guy who was preparing to have the surgery only weighed around 450 but the doctor refused to operate unless he loss 100 lbs first. i understand what the doctor was doing but the last time i saw this guy he was in a living hell b/c he was allowed to eat so much less just so he could have that surgery. i never understand what the diff b/t him and the 600 lb man was. these men had the surgery to save their lives. dieting and exercise did not help them. their doctors supported their decision to have the surgery. the third man i mentioned WAS physically active as a construction worker and he still couldn't lose the weight. i know weight gain is usually related to lack of exercise and a diet high in fats but sometimes there's more behind it. one thing that can happen is an eating disorder and being obsessive/compulsive about food. i worked as a medical counselor 11 years. i studied nursing nearly 2 years. among the medical problems i've often dealt w/ was chronic obesity. morbid obesity is a complex problem. some of the women i worked w/ had been anorexic or bulemic in their youth became overweight after a pregnancy or the metabolism changes of being over 30. i tried to help one over weight woman see that she still had food rituals that she wouldn't break that were reminiscent of her bulemic days. she only ate one meal a day and at the one meal ate everything she wanted. i tried to explain to her that 3 or more smaller meals would help her lose weight. she couldn't see out of the obsessive compulsive behavior. unless she recognizes her eating disorder as the root of her obesty i doubt she'll ever lose weight. her body hangs on to every pound b/c she goes from starving to being over satiated everyday. there are many roots to obesity and many different treatments that may or may not work. sometimes medications cause weight gain. i was always around 115 to 125 until i went on medication. i gained weight so fast on one drug i could literally feel my body expanding. since i am on meds that can cause weight gain, i try to drink lots of water and a diet low in fats and refined sugars. i exercise some but more than a certain pace tires me too much. i accept myself for the weight i've gained tho. when i look at old pictures i notice how emaciated i looked. i think i'm actually better off to weigh more than i did then. geez! now was my point and i know i did have one... ;) LOL oh! do i agree w/ weight loss surgery? depends on why the person weighs so much. i think a doctor should do a thorough medical exam and that includes endocrine system and psychological screens. some weight gains are caused by disease processes such as hypothyroidism. if the person has the surgery is s/he emotionally stable enough to handle the additional strain of being on a special diet and the difficulties that come w/ rapid weight loss. another consideration is diet drugs but these are very often quite dangerous. i know one woman who could go blind, one will have to have heart surgery, and one had epileptic seizures--all due to weight loss drugs--both over the counter and prescribed. they lost weight but the price was too high to pay. it always has to be a decision b/t the doctor and patient. the doctor needs to be aware of the patient's motivations of wanting the surgery and agree the patient is healthy enough to survive surgery and has exhausted every other attempt to lose weight. anyone who thinks it's a quick fix for weight loss should not be considered for the surgery. once a person is over 400 lbs overweight, the chances of being able to lose the necessary weight naturally go down drastically. the chances of a major illness significantly increase.

Mermaid	06 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by truthsayer these men had the surgery to save their lives. dieting and exercise did not help them. the third man i mentioned WAS physically active as a construction worker and he still couldn't lose the weight. [/b] I'm not picking on you, Truthsayer, but how can dieting and exercise not help a physiologically normal person to lose weight? Unless you have a metabolic disorder, the only reason you will get fat is if you eat more energy that you burn off through physical exertion. Other factors (eg metabolism) come into it, but if you strike the right balance between exercise and energy intake, you can't not lose weight, it is a physical impossibility. Perhaps I'll come across as harsh here, but I don't agree with this surgery at all unless there is a clear medical cause for the obesity. Otherwise, it is just a 'quick fix' to avoid dealing with the real cause of the problem. If the obesity is caused by lack of exercise, bad eating habits, psychological problems or poor nutritional knowledge, I believe there are much healthier ways of losing weight.

Cocobird55	06 Aug 2002
I know two people who had this surgery. The first was a woman at work who had diabetes, high blood pressure, and had trouble loosing weight. She was sick for months after the surgery, and didn't lose that much weight. The other person was the sister of a good friend of mine. She was very overweight, and I guess her doctor recommended it. She had the surgery about a month ago. I thought it had gone okay, but last Friday she died from a complication (blood clot went to her lungs). I guess the surgery is okay as a last resort, but there are no guarantees that it will fix everything. I'm overweight, and working with a nutritionist. It's hard to make major changes in your life... but I'd rather struggle with it than have the surgery. Sue

DarkElectric	06 Aug 2002
I have a friend who is morbidly obese. He is 28, and weighs over700 lbs. He's 6'ft tall, but you'd never know, he's so wide. His life expectancy is probably about 10 more years. I wish he would consider this form of surgery, because I don't want him to die. Extreme cases such as this are what the surgery is for. I had another friend who weighed 250 lbs, 5'2" tall woman. She wanted the surgery, but went on the Atkins diet instead. She lost 65 lbs. She is glad that she didn't have surgery now. For the terminally obese, the surgery may be the only way to prevent them from digging their grave with their fork. For the rest of us, diet and excercise. (I went on Atkins too...lost about 20 lbs so far,20 more to go.)

destinyawaitsme	06 Aug 2002
I think this is good for people with severe health problems linked to obesity. But weight problems are highly connected to emotional problems. Not to say anyone is crazy. But I know plenty of women me being one of them that hit the refrigerator when they are depressed. It's just a substitute for comfort. And for a lot of obese people, it's hard to get out of. They've lived so long with this behavior it's hard to reprogram. The surgery forces you to. If you binge you get sick. It isn't as easy as some think. My friend's mom had it done and she's much healthier for it. A downside to it though is your skin doesn't stretch back all the way. Lots of people have to go to a plastic surgeon and get skin removed or thhey have bat wings.

wavebreaker	07 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by destinyawaitsme But weight problems are highly connected to emotional problems. Not to say anyone is crazy. But I know plenty of women me being one of them that hit the refrigerator when they are depressed. It's just a substitute for comfort. And for a lot of obese people, it's hard to get out of. They've lived so long with this behavior it's hard to reprogram. The surgery forces you to. I agree that in many cases weight problems are linked to emotional problems, such as insecurity. In those cases, dieting and exercising often won't help, but I seriously doubt whether surgery would help; it would probably only make you feel more miserable. In these cases, tackling the emotional problems would be a better solution I think. I'm talking from my own experience here... A few years ago I managed to lose weight (nearly 10 kilos) with hardly any effort at all (I wasn't on a diet, but just stopped eating "bad" stuff, and I didn't do any extra exercising). I was feeling really well at the time, was very self-assured. Then something happened, the "good" feeling was gone and the insecurity AND the kilos came back. Not just the 10 I had lost, but an additional 20 as wel... :-( Instead of trying all sorts of diets, I'm now trying to get back that good feeling from then, because as long as I don't feel good, no diet is going to help...

mara	07 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Red raven I believe surgeries like this should only be done if it's for a me dical condition. I agree with Red raven. I think it should only be used as a last resort especially if the state of health is at stake for the person involved. Mara

truthsayer	08 Aug 2002
it's okay if others here don't agree w/ my opinions b/c that's what they are. BUT my opinions do involve considerable personal experience and training w/ many ppl other than myself w/ weight loss and obesity issues. i have been feeling pretty sensitive the past few days--moon time and a dear friend died. i felt picked on by some of the comments here so i copied my post. deleted it here and had diana read it b/c i couldn't tell if what i said was inappropriate or if i was being overly sensitive. diana reassured me it was my hormones and i wasn't being offensive. i did change some of my wording and added a few more statements to clarify what i said. whether or not you agree w/ me is fine. i respect everyone's opinion. but i do believe and stand by what i'm saying. this isn't saying i won't change my opinion at some point but these are the conclusions that my experience and training have led me to believe at this point in time.

purplelady	08 Aug 2002
I think that surgery to staple the stomach , or whatever else they do, should be reserved mainly for the Very Morbidly Obese. I'm talking the guy who weighed 700 lbs. or even 400 lbs plus. Extreme cases. If you define morbidly obese as 100 lbs overweight , then that is a very large population and probubly more people than you think! (especially maybe in america!) 100 lbs overweight may sound "grossly overwieght" to a small or slight person. But a tall or "large boned" person can carry that weight without necessarily looking "morbidly obese", many probubly appear slightly overweight or "big". Well , that said, it probubly IS unhealthy for all those people! I suppose it is our ever increasingly processed and fast food diets, and our ever more sedentary lives. I would also gauge the need for extreme surgery on what the person could or could not do. If the person can pretty much lead a normal life with physical activity then I would say no to surgery. (depending on their weight too) BUT there are people who can barely get around or get out of bed, or do a lot of things that "normal" people take for granted. Those are the people who would definitely consider surgery. But then it has to be an individual choice too. Truth- I missed your unedited post but I doubt you offended anyone! Anyhow , this IS a place for different opinions, right? There is someone I'm concerned about. It's my son's friend. This kid is 12 years old and he's Huge! I would call him very obese . And I've seen him eat too. I don't know his parent's at all. But I can't help Wondering if they care or are concerned or if they try to get him help to lose wieght or anything? I would be concerned if I had a child who was that large I would probubly be taking him to a specialist for a check-up and a special program and diet. Oh well, there's nothing I can do since he isn't my kid. I worry about his health though. As for the diets- there are so many different diets and opinions and even the experts don't agree! They still disagree on the high pro-low carb thing. I've read all about the Atkins diet and the others like it and I Still can't bring myself to do it! The thought of all meat and protein grosses me out! And I Like all my carbs! Bread and pasta and fruit etc. And ice cream . I like ice cream ! ;) .

jema	08 Aug 2002
if we agree that it is perfectly normal for skinny people to be skinny and eat lots and still not gain weight - why can we then not also realize that some people can stay fat no matter how good and healthy they eat and how much they exercise? what is the difference here? i think at the bottom of it all is the view that fat people are all lazy and eat too much. this is a predjudice. it is perfectly "normal" to eat just like anyone else and go for long walks each day and STILL weigh too much. i do. i am not fat simply because i eat too fat food or am too lazy to move. i am fat because my mother used to be fat, my grandmother and her mother and my father and his parents and all his siblings were fat. we can praise someone for having "good genes" in that they are finely built etc. but somehow it is still due to our own selfish and lazy behaviours that fat people are fat. it makes no sense. our metabolism is really not all that easy. it is not a matter of simple math. sure i can loose weight too. but for me it might take double the effort of someone else with a different set of genes/behaviour. as for who should be allowed to have WLS? who am i to say? what is a medical reason? what is an emotional reason? if only body/mind/soul would be so clear cut so we could tell them apart... i am a "chubby chick" and every day i have people telling me i am (fat. yeah?, really? oh my, glad you told me, i had no idea!!) everyday i face the images of how i "should" look and i am sick and tired of it. i stopped smoking 10 months ago and gained 20 kilos. i had co-workers telling me they would rather i smoked. i am fat and healthy and darn it! i am pretty too:) and if i want WLS i will go and ask for it - even if it is not for "medical" reasons... (i just hope i don't offend anyone here - it is not my intention and this is not directed to any specific person but to an attitude that i meet every day)

purplelady	08 Aug 2002
jema, yep, I think I have "good genes" :) and I STILL gained 40 lbs when I quit smoking and haven't lost it YET! And THAT was 7 years ago , this july ( yeah!) I Hope it's healthier to not smoke but be 40 lbs heavier- but I'm not totally convinced. I guess I can die of fat instead of lung cancer or emphasema, or, or...........chronic pulminary disease or some other really nasty smoking caused affliction? And I had to buy a whole new wardrobe, REALLY! Plus I'm fatter! I can't wear a bikini anymore or really "cute" stuff :( . I have no clue what a "kilo" is in body weight or how it relates to pounds so maybe one of you european people can enlighten me? I'm sure genes have quite a bit to do with it , as they do for so many things. Some people will remain thin all their life no matter what they eat. (Well , I don't really know I guess, I'm not there 24 to observe everything they eat!) My older son was thin and lean the day he was born, not an ounce of babyfat. And 19 years later he is Still thin and lean and shaped exactly the same without a bit of fat or an inch to pinch! And you bet he can eat whatever he wants! Maybe someday a computer will compute everybody's bodyfat/ metabolism/genes/health and come up with the perfectly personalized diet for every person. I'm sure they must have this on "star trek" as Almost no one is fat and almost all of the crew are very lean and perfectly fit! :) .

truthsayer	08 Aug 2002
our genes have a whole lot to do with the size we end up being. another thing is simply our lifestyles aren't as arduous as they were over 100 years ago. i don't know if any of you saw the pbs special called "frontier house". it features 3 modern families and their adjustment to frontier life. one of the things that came up was that they all lost weight and couldn't keep weight on them. one got so worried he had a doctor come check him out. the doctor told him he was the healthiest he had ever seen him b/c he had lost weight and toned up. during frontier times they had to work from sun up to sun down to survive. there was very little leisure time. today we can get so many things w/ a push of a button or flipping a switch that was back breaking labor for our ancestors. for example, we just turn on a fawcette to get water. they had to go to a stream and haul it up to their house for everything they used water for. i've also heard one theory about the obesity epidemic that's pretty interesting. it has to do with how our ancestors probably faced starvation often. it was improtant for the body to hang on to and store fat in case of a shortage of food. now we don't need for our bodies to prepare for days of starvation and yet the body is programmed to do store fat. i agree that this is a very dangerous surgery and no one should ever consider it unless there is no other option left to prolong life.

Rhiannon	09 Aug 2002
I appreciate all your opinions guys! I love it when we discuss things. I have had 3 children so my body has been stretched every which way and I am still holding on to the weight I gained with them. My youngest is 3 so I don't really have an excuse of just having a baby anymore. According to the body weight charts I AM 100 lbs overweight. I really feel I only need to lose about 60 lbs to be comfortable again. That will get me back to the weight I was before my daughter was born. I was never skinny. At my lowest weight I was 150 and I looked TOO thin. My face was all sunken in and gaunt. That may seem stranged because I'm only 5'4" but I assure you that it's true. I've decided (with the help of interpretation by RedWood ;) ) not to get this surgery. We both decided that the 8 of Wands in my spread (from Nigel Jackson) was telling me to go buy a treadmill. :D Right now I look like the blue woman on the Universe card from World Spirit Tarot. I need to lose the weight because I'm unhealthy and because I can't play with my kids they way I'd like to, they tire me out too quickly. Right now my weight problem is not life-threatening. And I don't intend to let it get that way. Thanks so much for your opinions again. You've helped me to confirm my feelings about this decision. I'll let you know if I change my mind ;) . R :)

truthsayer	09 Aug 2002
i wouldn't encourage you to have this surgery to lose 100 lbs. this surgery impacts one life too deeply for 100 lbs. if the amount is 200 or 300 lbs., that's when i think it should be considered an option. i don't recommend diet pills either. i think w/ diet, exercise, and emotional support you can lost 100 lbs. it won't happen overnight and will take a lot of focus. is there a support group around like overeaters anonymous to give you emotional support? it's a proven fact that you can lose more weight w/ 6 mini meals instead of 3 large meals b/c your body never has time to feel hungry. lots of raw veggies and fruit w/o the dip. drink lots of water. grill, boil, or bake meats. use olive oil if you need an oil to cook in. this is what i do. avoid foods high in fat. i have found that if i have a chocolate craving it's better for me to go ahead and have a taste to kill the craving than to have it on my mind for hours or days. by the time i weaken, i'm really ready for chocolate and one piece isn't enough! involve your children by doing things w/ them like going to the playground. maybe you could walk while they play. going swimming is another good exercise. i don't know how old your kids are but my brother the fitness freak swears by bicycling. family biking can be a fun way to exercise. whatever you do, rhiannon, i wish you the best!!!!!!!

wetsheep1	09 Aug 2002
I have to agree with Mermaid on this one. Absolutely. Surgery is, and should be, only the very last of the last resorts. And that surgery in particular is terrible. If someone overeats again, binges in particular, it's entirely possible that their stomachs will burst and death is imminent without immediate help. And my god, how can someone live with that burden?? If someone doesn't realize that they have a problem with food addiction, then this is just as bad as putting a gun to their heads. I was an overeater for years. The fact I was big-boned helped to hide my obesity somewhat, but I was over 100 pounds overweight when I decided I was sick and tired of being sick and tired and did something about it. I had to face the fact that I was abusing food, just as I had other substances (ahem). And I didn't realize it at all! It wasn't as if I snacked a lot -- I didn't. I still don't. Couldn't care less about potato chips, snacks, whatever. But don't call me late for dinner either, lol! My portion sizes were huge, and I wasn't eating anything balanced. I was a protein freak, and carbs were an awesome thing too. But vegetables? As far as I was concerned, I hadn't clawed my way up the food chain to eat "rabbit food." I wanted to learn how to eat food properly; how not to abuse it to cover up my own insecurities and deficiencies. And the very idea that fats or carbohydrates or refined sugars were taboo was, and still is, anathema to me. Various foods from various food groups were put here on earth for a purpose; and I have learned the hard way that eliminating one or more of them can be dangerous. The body has to have at least a little something from each of them in order to be able to process nutrients properly. So I asked my doctor about it, and we developed a food plan I can live with. I can eat ice cream, steak, cookies, whatever I like -- but I have to remember that each of these things is a type of exchange and work to live within those parameters. So far, I've been living on the plan for about a year now and have lost over 90 pounds. I'm just fifteen pounds shy of my goal, but that's not altogether a bad thing. I'm not planning on being another Calista Flockhart -- oh hell no!! But having all the weight off is a relief, and so is being able to learn to respect and love myself -- something I was trying to do with food. I ate to fill that HP-shaped hole within myself; and I gotta tell ya, it doesn't work. The hole's too big, and the HP seems to fit it just right all on His own ;) I realize that not everyone can do this. And there are digestive and metabolic problems that preclude solutions merely through food plans and support groups. But by the same token, if one hasn't given this approach an honest try, I can't help feeling that stomach reduction surgery is a death sentence. It makes me very, very sad. :( My prayers for guidance for you, sweetie. I know it's a tough decision. Please be well. :) ((((Rhiannon)))) -- k

purplelady	09 Aug 2002
Rhiannon, I am SOOO glad to hear you won't be trying to get surgery! :) . If I were to look at a weight chart it would probubly say I am 60, maybe even 70 pounds overweight. (I wince when I say that! It wasn't easy! ) . I had 2 kids and looked GREAT ! I had a flat stomach a few months after having kid #2 . Of course I was only 26 then. .............But it's the quitting smoking thing that caused me to gain weight. I really believe there is a genetic componant in cigarette and nicotine addiction. I heard of a theory that has to do with how your body metabolizes sugar , and it has to do with cigarettes. But I don't think much research has been done on this? I'm 5'8" tall and did a lot of weight lifting years ago, especially for upper body. I have bigger arm and chest muscles than a lot of guys! I think that I am pretty well proportioned Except I actually do "abs of steel " work-outs and, well.................my stomach doesn't even look Close to the instructor's on the tape! I Heard that body builders actually starve themselves before competition so they can look like that.I always hear "muscle weighs more than fat!" So I stand in front of the mirror sometimes and tell myself "it's muscle" ! ;) . I don't think I look that bad but what Really bothers me is that I can't wear a bikini anymore. And I can't wear those cute little jeans that go halfway down one's a------! Or a little belly shirt! petty of me isn't it! :) .

purplelady	09 Aug 2002
Truth- I actually saw an episode of "frontier house" on pbs! Was really interesting! And I did see the episode where the one guy lost so much weight that everyone was worried there was something wrong with him but the doctor said he was very healthy.

TallTarotGuy	09 Aug 2002
Rhiannon, I guess I'm getting in on this discussion after the fact, but I wanted to share my story. I had the surgery when I was 18 years old. At the time I weighed 330 lbs. I'm 33 now, weigh 205 lbs (I'm 6'5", btw) and have kept the weight off this whole time (more or less). I do know a LOT of people who have had the surgery and gained the weight back. It is a DRASTIC change. The first time you overeat...OMG, you think you're going to die. You just want to curl up in a ball and lay there, but you can't because you have to get up and walk because that's the only thing that will help the food to digest faster. Am I glad I had the surgery? Well, yes and no. I am definitely a lot healthier now. And it has definitely helped with my self-esteem. However, as I am older and wiser(?) now, I realize that MY overeating was from self-esteem issues, being gay, lack of exercise, etc. So, I was able to take off the weight, but I still had to deal with why I put the weight on in the first place. I had this nice skinny body all of a sudden, but in my mind I still saw myself as a fat, unloveable person. I never really had a problem with sugar...ask anyone that knows me, and they know I have a HUGE sweet tooth--mostly chocolate. :) However, I am not able to digest wheat (gluten) and dairy products now. I don't know if it was because of the surgery, or if it would have happened regardless, but I didn't have that problem before I had the bypass surgery. I guess everyone is different, and the side-effects for one person will not be the same as for another. Anyway, I'm glad to hear that you made a decision that was right for you!! ((((HUGS)))) TTG

VGimlet	09 Aug 2002
For myself - I would have to say no. As a person who has been both 100+ lbs overweight, and thin enough to be questioned about having an eating disorder (only by someone who never saw me eat, LOL) I know that there are many reasons for being overweight. I was thinking about having one of the surguries, at one point, and after doing a *lot* of research, decided it wasn't for me, the risks seemed to outweigh the benefits. BUT that's just me. My husband's cousin had it done, and he is really happy with the results. He's lost about 120 lbs, and he looks and feels wonderful.

truthsayer	10 Aug 2002
tall tarot guy, i'm really surprized that you were approved for that surgery at 18 when you're so tall-6'5". 330 doesn't sound as bad as ppl i know that are under 6'0" that weigh that much and more. i remember morbidly obese one guy around 21 that had sleep apnea. he didn't get enough oxygen while he slept b/c the fat in his facial and neck area interfered w/ normal breathing. instead of pushing weight loss w/ him, his doctors were pushing disability and a c-pap(breathing machine)to sleep with. now i wonder why gastic bypass wasn't recommended for him. perhaps it had a lot to do w/ the fact he was on medicaid and not private insurance... i've been under the impression that the surgery was only done for dire medical reasons and the failure of all attempts for weight loss. all the ppl i know that had it were over 25. 18 seems young to have such a life altering surgery. your metabolic system is faster at burning calories for one. TTG, i hope i'm not being too personal b/c i can't understand the motivations of your doctors unless your health was seriously at risk. the doctors i used to work w/ would have said you were too young to give up on diet and exercise. i have a gluten and dairy intolerance too btw and i haven't had this surgery. my understanding is that food intolerances usually result after you have a gastric upset when you've eaten certain foods. hypothetically, we're genetically programmed to become lactose intolerant. i learned from a doctor that you should be able to tolerate aged cheeses if lactose intolerant b/c the lactose enzyme isn't as active as it is in fresh milk and cheese. i've been eating aged cheese and occasional ice cream for several years now w/o much problem. i just stay away from straight milk. my stomach does not like milk!

TallTarotGuy	10 Aug 2002
Truthsayer, Glad to find someone else with gluten & dariy intolerance. Maybe we could exchange some good recipes sometime?? :) I do eat some hard cheeses occasionally, and I really like goat cheeses, which I can tolerate. For the most part though, I stick with soy..milk, yogurt, etc. I can drink soy milk now like a glass of regular milk, and I like it just as well. It has to be SILK though..love chocolate Silk especially! My mom actually looked into the weight-loss surgery for me. She was concerned about my health, because I was so heavy. It is my understanding (correct me anyone if I'm wrong) that anything over 100 lbs overweight is considered morbidly obese, and a threat to your health. I've known several people recently have been LESS than 100 lbs overweight, yet wore weights to the doctors office so they would be weighed-in as "officially" morbidly obese. Which I don't understand AT ALL. My self-esteem was so bad at the time, I just wanted the weight off as fast as I could. Now that I look back, that was the wrong reason to do it. I needed to deal with the real reason I was gaining the weight. Which I've MOSTLY dealt with now I still find myself reaching for food for "comfort", rather than being hungry. Guess it's a process that takes awhile to correct. I exercise regularly now, and try to eat balanced meals. So, all-and-all, I've done pretty well. TTG I

truthsayer	11 Aug 2002
i appreciate your honesty, ttg. it does make sense that if your mother was that concerned a doctor would be more likely to pay attention. perhaps she was concerned about a potential for suicide if you weren't helped to lose weight in some way. whatever it was, it helped you pull out of your depression so you could get to the point you are today. who knows if you could have faced the real reasons you needed the weight until your life wasn't more than you could emotionally bear? you had an awful lot to deal w/ being only 18. it's an unusual reason but it does make sense in retrospect. i'm glad your mother loved you so much that she was willing to do what it took to help you. it reminds me of the time, i had a young woman wanted us to help her get breast reduction surgery. she was a 38C and she said it would help her neck and back pain. i wasn't able to get it approved but it was obvious that her self-esteem was very low. i wonder if the surgery would have made the impact on her emotional life she thought that it would. we did help a woman get breast reduction who'd had back surgery and basically had no lap but that was a very extreme case. yes, over 100 lbs. is morbidly obese. anybody who'd wear weights to weigh in more so as to be considered for this surgery has some serious problems. moreover, i'd be really concerned about the ethics of any doctor who'd do this kind of risky surgery so blithely w/o weighing in w/ underwear only. i know anorexics that put weights in their clothes to avoid hospitalization so at weigh-ins they either had to be frisked or weighed in underwear only to get a true weight. it looks like this would be done routinely prior to a gastric bypass, too due to the high incidence of eating disorders in this country. i guess you don't see what you don't want to know. yeah, we can trade recipes! i'm so used to cooking this way i'll really have to think to remember which ones and how i changed them. i have a food intolerance to soy, too so soy products aren't really an option. i've been to dieticians trying to find a compatible diet. one told me i was worse off than a diabetic b/c they were allowed to eat more foods than me!! mostly what i do is try to juggle food intolerances in my meals. on some days i eat more dairy and less soy and wheat, for example. at least, i'm not allergic to chocolate so life isn't too bad. ;) :D ;) if i couldn't have dove dark chocolate, i think i would have some serious problems! (i allow myself 4 a day.)

Minderwiz	11 Aug 2002
I also don't like the idea of surgery. To me this is a psychological problem rather than a physical one and the 'treatment' should be psychological too. I don't mean a shrink or such like - I mean altering our attitudes to eating. One of the big problems of Western society, especially in the USA where food is cheap, is that we spend too much time eating either for pleasure or to offset depression or other problems. This is reinforced by restaurants and diners who seem to feel that providing very large portions is a positive sign rather than the negative one it actually is. I know that its not easy to change attitudes - I have been significantly overweight before and I'm currently trying to get my weight down following two weeks in the States. But unless we succeed real problems await us. Minderwiz

Mermaid	11 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Minderwiz One of the big problems of Western society, especially in the USA where food is cheap, is that we spend too much time eating either for pleasure or to offset depression or other problems. Eating for pleasure alone might not be a great idea, Minderwiz, but there's nothing wrong with taking pleasure in eating - I think that nice food is one of life's great pleasures! :D I guess what I'm trying to say is that I think seeing food as 'the enemy' is just as unhealthy as seeing it as the cure for all life's ills - I think striking a balance is pretty important.

Rhiannon	11 Aug 2002
Thanks so much for sharing your story TTG! I really appreciate another point of view. I agree that I sometimes eat for the wrong reasons. But then I do the opposite too... I forget to eat when I'm really busy, so my body hoards what it gets as well. *sigh* Right now I know the Atkins diet will work for me. I've lost weight on it before. I really need to add excerse in with that to make it work even better. Like I said... the 8 of Wands wants me to buy a treadmill. I would like to say that I use a modified Atkins diet ... I do eat lots of different veggies, I still take tylenol if I need it and I drink caffeine. I have to have my caffeine. The best thing I think I've done is switch to diet soda! LOL I really don't plan on having the surgery. I'm hoping that I don't get to a point where I truly feel I need it. I'm mostly wanting to lose weight to improve my health. Although, I'll admit to wanting to wear nicer clothes too... but I'll never be able to get into a bikini! I've got too many stretch marks for that! Thanks to all of you for your encouragement and the willingness to discuss what sometimes is a touchy subject. (((((((all of you)))))) R :)

floracove	12 Aug 2002
I know 3 ladies that had this by-pass done. The 1st died of complications, the 2nd weighs more now than to start with, and the 3rd is doing good except that she looks sickly. I have always been a big girl, I don't think of myself as "fat" but others may, but who are they to me...could care less "what they think". I do not over eat, I get enough exercise, I have a slow metabolism. While in college, my roomates told me they did not understand why I weighed more than they did when they ate more than I did. And yeah I'm sick of people who think that just cause someone's big that they are lazy hogs! Shows their ignorance. Never taking into consideration that there might be another reason for the weight than just eating to much. No, I would not have this done, because I do not want anyone lose with a knife and me laying there naked thank you very much! Thats how I feel about it for myself...if some one needed it and wanted it then go for it, but if I knew them I would try to talk them out of it. I have a brother that eats like Jethro and hardly weighs anything. His metabolism is high. Go figure! To bad we couldn't have split it down the middle.

wetsheep1	12 Aug 2002
Tell me about it. My grandfather used to be able to eat an enitre chocolate cake in one sitting and never gain an ounce. :-/ *sigh* Ah, well, ya can't have everything. I hav brains, so....conventional beauty goes by the wayside. Not all a bad thing, either ;) Be well, -- k

The Weight Loss Surgery thread was originally posted on 06 Aug 2002 in the Chat board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Chat, or read more archived threads.