Controversial Question about Spell Work

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 20 Apr 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

cjtarot	20 Apr 2002
Hi all. Here we go adjusting my beliefs a little (or am I). I am curious about Spell Work. I am Christian and Pray for things I would like to see accomplished...NEVER THINGS OF GREED but I was wondering.. is spell work like prayer. Is it against the Christian belief (haven't researched this one yet). And most of all, would it work for a non Wiccan/Pagan? This is a major opinion question and I can't wait to hear yours..remember it's opion not Knock down drag out fight. Love and Light (Yes, I use this term in respect to The "Love and the Light" The Holy Spirit brings to our lives) cj

Bings	20 Apr 2002
IMHO... I think prayer and spell work are very similar. I used to pray for calmness when my children were out of hand. I used to pray for my husband to have a safe trip. Now, instead of prayer I will do spell work, mostly with candles and stones. I remember going to church as a child and teen (I was raised Catholic), getting down on my knees, bringing my hands together before me, bowing my head, closing my eyes and praying. I was asking for something. For my father to get well again, for my mother to stop drinking. In doing this you raise the same type of energies as you do in spell work. To this day I can remember feeling this energy around me when I would pray in church as a child. At the end of my prayer I would exhale and all that energy would shoot off towards the heavens. Spell work, like prayer, will work for anyone who believes in it. It may take some practice and some trial and error. But eventually, if you believe and raise the energy needed, your spells will work. Even if you are non Wiccan/Pagan. Dianne

Tarotbear 2	21 Apr 2002
The difference between spellwork and praying is that ( I hate to say it this way, but...) people who 'go to church' are lazy; they do not particpate in their services. They sit there while a priest does his 'saying mass' routine; they are not part of the work. It's like they feel that since they dragged themselves to church -again- that all the work will be done for them and when they finishing singing the last song, walk out and go about their usual ways, unmindful of anything until a week later when they 'do it' again. (Can you tell I'm an ex-catholic?) Spellwork is far different - you are your own priest. You conduct the ritual, raise the power, send it out, and reap it's rewards. What's the difference between you and your parish priest? - he got his hands annointed with oil by a bishop; other than that, you have the same 'powers' he does. I remember listening to people say a rosary as fast as they could, so they could get on to other things. As long as you said the prayer, you got whatever, right? The "I'll do almost anything that gets me blessed upon request' approach. Say this prayer 144 times and be guaranteed something after you die. Spellwork is a participation sport. Spellwork is not going to make Jesus mad at you. Don't forget - He turned water into wine and fed a crowd with a few loaves and fishes. Pretty impressive stuff!

joya250	21 Apr 2002
hey cj, As I learn more about Wicca/Paganism, I have been astounded to see HOW SIMILAR it is to Christianity!!! Really. I had no idea. and, it's great, because it gives me a deeper appreciation for both. :) I think prayer, real prayer, active prayer (like TB2 said, participation is key here) is really just another name for spellwork. You don't need candles and stones and incense for spellwork -- that's just the part that helps focus your intention... just like a rosary, or a medalion... the real magic is the fact that you are consciously focusing your power and your will... and that you BELIEVE that what you are doing will work... good luck!!! and remember, you don't need rules or a structured religion to connect with God, so don't worry about not being Pagan, or whatever. and keep us posted! - joya

cjtarot	21 Apr 2002
Hi.. Thank you all for your opinions and advise.... I'll let you know where this leads me... cj

MystiqueMoonlight	22 Apr 2002
Quote: Originally posted by joya250 hey cj, As I learn more about Wicca/Paganism, I have been astounded to see HOW SIMILAR it is to Christianity!!! Really. I had no idea. and, it's great, because it gives me a deeper appreciation for both. :) I think prayer, real prayer, active prayer (like TB2 said, participation is key here) is really just another name for spellwork. You don't need candles and stones and incense for spellwork -- that's just the part that helps focus your intention... just like a rosary, or a medalion... the real magic is the fact that you are consciously focusing your power and your will... and that you BELIEVE that what you are doing will work... good luck!!! and remember, you don't need rules or a structured religion to connect with God, so don't worry about not being Pagan, or whatever. and keep us posted! - joya Actually Christianity is similar to the Craft. The candles, stones and incense are actually more than a tool for focus. "Stones" do have the energies of Gaia (Earth) and are specific to certain needs...incense (the real stuff) are derived from plants and again are gifts of Gaia which contact specfic energies. I could go onto colour correspondences etc, but perhaps this isn't the thread for that. A prayer is a spell and a spell is a prayer. They both raise energies, they both are used to achieve a certain outcome. They only difference is the controlling factor, faith and experience just as Tarotbear pointed out.... Blessed be.

Major Tom	22 Apr 2002
I agree with what others have said - I only have one thing to add: Magick is not something you do - it is something you are.

Kiama	22 Apr 2002
I'm gonna add a little to what Major Tom said, with something a friend once told me. "God does play dice with he Universe, despite what Einstein believed. Magick is the art of loading the dice." Whatever name it goes by, whether ritual, magick, prayer, energy-sending... It is all attempting to do the same thing. Kiama

Liliana	22 Apr 2002
Yep after years of disenchanment, Ifound thatWicca and Christianity were so close to each other that I practice a belief system thatc ombines the major aspects of both, Christian Wicca. And Im not the only one, there are hundreds of us. Doing as search at www.yahoogroups.com for Christian Wicca, Christian Witch, and Christian Pagan willreveal a l large number of email discussion lists dedicated to combing the religions. I did a post on this awhile ago, Ill bump it up. One of our favorite sayings is that Magick is Prayer with Props, I expanded that once to say Tarot is Prophecy with Props hehe. :THP

Tarotbear 2	22 Apr 2002
'Tarot is Prophecy with Props' I like that! 8)

imperium	30 Apr 2002
If you would like to tell me more about what you are thinking of exactly?..... The advise I read here is sound and valuable but I urge you to discuss in more length - there can be more consequences to magick than you think and should be approached with caution if you have not experienced it first hand before. The magick will come to you from many sources, all of which you must be prepared for. It is not simply a case of the good inside you doing the work, and casting a circle does not necessarily make you safe. ....there is always darkness too. You need to be prepared. To light a candle is to cast a shadow. E-mail me if you want to - I will be happy to adivse further.

DeLani	05 May 2002
Imperium, I have to respectfully disagree. The only energy in the universe that you use in spellwork is the universe itself, or the tao. It is not good or evil. Unless you specifically try to invoke & command "demons," if you are doing spellwork to harm none & for the good of all, you can't go wrong. To light a candle is to cast a shadow - true & correct. But a shadow (and darkness in general) is no more evil than a flower. It is a part of the natural universe and can be neither good nor evil. It just is. blessed be, DeLani

Kiama	05 May 2002
I agree with DeLani: The energy of the Universe is neutral and only becomes good or evil when you use it in either way. I don't think that if you do magick for the good of all and to harm none, that it can go wrong. If it did, then w'd be getting alot of teenagers and kids getting bad kicks in the ass from the consequences of their dabbling. As I used to be one of those teenagers, I can safely say, this never happened. Even without a Circle. (Gasp, shock horror!) ;) "God does play dice with the Universe, despite what Einstein believed. Magick is the art of loading the dice." We load the dice with whatever our intent is. That is what makes it either good or evil. Kiama

The Controversial Question about Spell Work thread was originally posted on 20 Apr 2002 in the Spirituality board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Spirituality, or read more archived threads.