If someone doesn't believe in reincarnation, does it happen anyway?

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 09 Aug 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

DarkElectric	09 Aug 2002
I was really wondering about this. I happen to believe in reincarnation. Many of the Buddhist sects believe that everyone is reincarnated. But I wonder... do our personal beliefs affect whether or not we are indeed, reincarnated? What do you think?

RedWood	09 Aug 2002
Interesting question.. I guess if you believe in reincarnation then it will happen...If you don't then it may happen anyway or..it does not happen..I have not believed in reincarnation before but now I do..I still think I have had past lives..I guess the answer is..whether you believe it or not..it can still happen...Does that confuse more?

Strega	09 Aug 2002
Just because one does not believe in this or that... does not mean these things don't happen/exist or apply to him/her. :) Examples: Reincarnation, Karma, Heaven/Hell, God/dess, Aliens, Ghosts, etc.

the hermit	10 Aug 2002
If a tree falls in a forest, and no one is there, does it make a sound? If souls can reincarnate, and no one believes, does it still happen? Life is full of interesting philosophical questions that we would wish answers for... That's why I studied geology. You may not have all the answers, but the ones you have are hard as rocks :D

Rain	10 Aug 2002
I know for a fact that we are all reincarnated several times. However, some people may think they know they are going to heaven/hell. I for one don't beleive in either of the two...so from my point of view, yes, we all are reincarnated whether we like/beleive it or not. I don't think that the Lord would bless some that beleive in heaven by letting them go to heaven, and others that beleive in reicarnation be reincarnated...that is not just or fair...and those are two of the qualities that our Lord posseses Blessings, Rain

WhiteDrag0n	10 Aug 2002
Two pennies for you. Reincarnation happens, reminds me of the bumper sticker sh*t happens, look at it this way dark. The afterlife looks how we think it should and second when you die your soul has 3 options: Reincarnate, hang out in the astral, and will itself out of existance. Hoped that helped.

Dark Inquisitor	10 Aug 2002
I think if the laws of karma are unavoidable, you might have to reincarnate to pay for the wrongs you've done in previous lives. Could be an inescapable balancing force that doesn't care if you believe in it or not. Tarotphelia

Faerie Lin	10 Aug 2002
I believe pure enlightenment comes when we die. All of our knowledge about Heaven and such comes back to us. We're back in Heaven, a very familiar place, our home. We may decide that eventually we want to live out another lifetime, we may decide we don't want to. Its all about choice. But I do believe in Heaven our souls believe/know about reincarnation. I also believe that there are souls who have never lived out a lifetime here on Earth, that we are considered the bold and courageous ones. :D Lin

Liliana	10 Aug 2002
Im still of the thought that we go/do exactly where we believe we do when we die. Some might decide to stay in Heaven/Summerlands/whatever, which is likely a place on the Astral. Some people live life so afraid of Hell they wind up in one likely also on the Astral. Some people believe in reincarnation and will reincarnate. Some people will decide to roam the astral close to Earth and act as Spirit guides (Id love o do that after I die, but I think its likely I have more Karma to work out and will need to incarnate again so that I feel Im wise enough to give good guidance as a spirit guide) Of course your decision I believe is discussed with some spirit representative of God/dess (except perhaps when you damned yourself to the Hell realm, but to get out of that all you need to do is believe that you are wortty to be somewhere else, easier said than done). Ah heck, all this probably makes no sense lol :THP

Kyrie Blue	10 Aug 2002
Makes sense Liliana....I kinda thought the same thing. Now that I think about it though, I do believe in reincarnation and believe that it would happen anyway wether I believe or not...because basically, once we do cross over to the other side, we will remember everything and understand the concept and value of reincarnation. However, I also believe that reincarnation does not necessarily follow the concepts of Buddhism and other religions. Its just something we will find full understanding of in our spiritual explorations.

Diana	10 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by the hermit If a tree falls in a forest, and no one is there, does it make a sound? A friend of mine (male) has a t-shirt that reads something like : If I am alone in the middle of the ocean, and there is no woman around, am I still wrong? :D

Laurel	10 Aug 2002
I personally believe that a soul has more than one part. There is a quintessential immortal soul, our higher self, whatever you wish to call it, that cannot end because it is composed of pure spiritual energy- and energy only changes form. When we die, our souls join the cosmos. We burn in stars, reflect on moons, are photo-synthesized by plants, eaten by animals, reborn as offspring, and start the whole process over again. No wonder we feel so connected! :) Laurel

jade	10 Aug 2002
i believe that everyone's experiences after they die may differ slightly to assist their souls with passing.........but that the experience is the same regardless. in light, jade

Royal Cat	10 Aug 2002
When I was young a friend's mom told me that our soul is reincarnated 9 times (in a multitude of forms) and then on the ninth our soul chooses to begin again *fresh* or to go beyond to pure spirit, such as the astral. I'm just curious, does anyone know what belief system this is from? I'm very 'green' in my understanding of this sort of thing... Thanks Cat

Marion	10 Aug 2002
This is very interesting to me. I have seen many threads here more or less revolving about what people believe. And I constantly get left with this exact thought, 'does it matter exactly what we believe, does that belief affect how things work?' I think the trouble may come, for me, in the crossover between the physical world and the spiritual world. If you really truly in your heart and with every ounce of your being believe that you can fly, and, confident to depths of your soul, you launch yourself off the top of the building, you will obey gravity and fall to the ground. The problem may be that the soul thinks in metaphors. Believing that you can fly may be your soul telling you to let your heart take flight. Does all this help with whether we will reincarnate whether we believe in it in this life or not? That kind of depends on whether or not reincarnation is something like gravity, you do not have to believe in it for it to work. And how gravity works has never been proven either. Physicists have postulated elementary particles called 'gravitons', but have never found one. (I am a bit out of my range here, haven't read any particle physics for about 8 to 10 years and maybe they have found them). So, reincarnation could well just be one of those things that you must obey. hehe, and maybe like gravity if you rise far enough above the earth you get 'lighter'. lol, okay, even I am getting dizzy now!

Rain	10 Aug 2002
I comepletly agree with that. The universe has a way of making things happen whether you want it to or not, or whether you beleive it or not.

Umbrae	10 Aug 2002
Years back folks believed that if a human could possibly go faster than 40mph, their bodies would fly apart. It was once believed that there was no such thing as electricity. If reincarnation exists, one can believe all they want one way or the other, it will not affect it.

Royal Cat	10 Aug 2002
I hope this isn't too far off the topic... Newsweek magazine's cover story for this past week was titled "Visions of Heaven, How views of Paradise Inspire - and Inflame - Christians, Muslims and Jews" From the article: "According to a Newsweek poll, 76% of Americans believe in Heaven and, of those, 71% think it's an 'actual place,' but after that the agreement breaks down." The story then goes on to describe different views on what Heaven "is" - from a beautiful, lush garden to a city of friends and family, etc. Now, personally, I do not believe in a heaven or hell in a Christian/Jewish/Muslim sense at all... and I'm not even sure I believe in reincarnation fully and completely - I'm rather skeptical about many things. But, there certainly are people that I meet and have an instant attraction/connection to... did I know them in a past life? I think so, that's the explanation that feels "right" to me. But to add to what Umbrae said, and to take a completely agnostic approach: can we ever truly know, and does it really matter? Quote: Originally posted by Umbrae If reincarnation exists, one can believe all they want one way or the other, it will not affect it.

Umbrae	10 Aug 2002
My own view on reincarnation is this: it does not matter if it is real or not. It is this life and this life alone that I must live, and pay attention to. Too much effort has been exercised by too many people who have not been paying attention to what they are doing right now. Baba Ram Daas said, “Be here now”. That is it. This life, this world, and its people. You me us we now Past and future lives have no relevance (to me). I may get misguided and spend time worrying or thinking on distracting affairs, thus either hurting or allowing others to be hurt by my inattention. But that is me, and my view.

Violet Gargoyle	10 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Royal Cat When I was young a friend's mom told me that our soul is reincarnated 9 times (in a multitude of forms) and then on the ninth our soul chooses to begin again *fresh* or to go beyond to pure spirit, such as the astral. I'm just curious, does anyone know what belief system this is from? I'm very 'green' in my understanding of this sort of thing... Thanks Cat Some eastern cultures have this. More like after 9 lives (like cats) we are ready to move on to Nirvana/Enlightenment/Bliss/Heaven. I remember one "ancient" (take it with the ancient grain of salt) way of finding your soul number was to add all the digits in your birthdate together until you got a singular number. Its really Numerology at work. For instance: 6 +15 + 1973= 1994 1+9+9+4= 23 2+3= 5 This is your fifth life on earth. Then each soul number has distinctive traits associate with it. If you are on your first soul, you are very wet behind the ears. If you are on our 9th, you are the wizened sort. I believe in reincarnation to a point. Since energy is neither created nor destroyed our energy has to go somewhere. So why not reincarnation or Heaven or a tree or a river or any combination in between? In the end I believe we are all part of the same collective soul/spirit, that our thoughts create its own reality, shaped by the human experience. Given that, all destinations are possible. I remember a friend of my mothers once telling me that one out of every 7 breaths we take has an atom of Julius Caesar in it. Thats always a good conversation starter......

lunar_rabbit	10 Aug 2002
I believe that the powers of the Universe affect you whether you believe in them or not. If you don't believe in death, will you still die? Yes. To me it's the same sort of question. To me, if you believe in reincarnation, yet it does not really happen, you'll just die (and go to heaven?) like every other living thing. Therefore, if you don't believe in reincarnation, yet it is a law of the universe, than you will come back again in one form or another. Very interesting question and responses. Maybe we'll all be talking about it next time around, too! LOL

Starfish	10 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Violet Gargoyle Its really Numerology at work I find this point fascinating. Glad I read this post. Quote: I believe in reincarnation to a point. Since energy is neither created nor destroyed our energy has to go somewhere. So why not reincarnation or Heaven or a tree or a river or any combination in between? In the end I believe we are all part of the same collective soul/spirit, that our thoughts create its own reality, shaped by the human experience. Given that, all destinations are possible. I remember a friend of my mothers once telling me that one out of every 7 breaths we take has an atom of Julius Caesar in it. Thats always a good conversation starter...... Wow! I love this idea too. And that Julius Caesar comment is truly a great conversation starter. edited because of spelling errors (fumble fingers ;)) :TLOVE Starfish

VGimlet	11 Aug 2002
I'm with those who think - if reincarnation happens, it will happen if you believe or not. I do like to think that this isn't my only time with the people I love. A lifetime just isn't enough for some relationships.

the hermit	11 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Umbrae My own view on reincarnation is this: it does not matter if it is real or not. It is this life and this life alone that I must live, and pay attention to. Too much effort has been exercised by too many people who have not been paying attention to what they are doing right now. Baba Ram Daas said, “Be here now”. That is it. This life, this world, and its people. You me us we now Past and future lives have no relevance (to me). I may get misguided and spend time worrying or thinking on distracting affairs, thus either hurting or allowing others to be hurt by my inattention. But that is me, and my view. Be careful my friend, lest you be mistaken for a philosopher... or worse, a virgonian :)

Liliana	11 Aug 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Violet Gargoyle \ For instance: 6 +15 + 1973= 1994 1+9+9+4= 23 2+3= 5 Cant say I can agree with that, Im a 2 and I know Im on more than my second life, maybe Im on my 11 (which is what my number works out to before reducing) I can see that, but 2? I really dont think so lol :THP

Marion	11 Aug 2002
I wondered about that too. My horoscope and some very intuitive friends have told me I have had several lives, and I am a 1.

Violet Gargoyle	11 Aug 2002
Using the birthdate to determine your soul number is one way. I have also seen the same method used with the letters of your name. All numbers 1-9 have good and bad personality attribute associated with them. Actually another exercise I am familiar with is to figure out the number of the name that your parents gave you (either your whole name or just your first name) to find out what kind of person your parents "expected" you to be. For instance- B O B (2nd letter, 15th letter, 2nd letter) 2 + 15 + 2= 19 9 + 1= 10 1 + 0= 1 Then you find out the number for just your given last name to find out what society expects of your family. Then you do the same thing with the name that you prefer to go by, nickname, magical name- you get the idea, to find out what you expect of yourself. I find Numerology interesting, though I do not hold to it very much. I would agree that intuition may be more reliable in this case...

midnightmerry	11 Aug 2002
What a great thread! I believe that in the Afterlife we go home. I believe that Creator is so vastly superior to anything we could ever imagine and that there is really nothing at all to fear. I think that even people who've led horrible lives here are enlightened and accepted and that the presence of Creator is so loving and wise that any error in thinking or perception is corrected in us. And I also believe that in the next life, joy/bliss/contentment of being is a natural state and that if we wish to re-incarnate, then Creator allows it for our own happiness. I have never been able to accept any dogma that embraces a hell/punishment/torture in the afterlife. I don't believe that being in the presence of the Omniscient, Infinite Wisdom of Creator is anything other than complete happiness. I think that we have all experienced this Presence before we were born and that this innate knowledge of a wonderful place of Home is where all of our best ideas come from. And I believe that every wrong that has been committed or sorrow that has been experienced only heightens this feeling of bliss in the next life, because all is made right.

Minderwiz	11 Aug 2002
Goddess_Leah I know your question was rhetorical but if the answer to your questions is no then the world has no independent existence - it is part of our imagination and we are in effect sleep walkers in our own dream. If this conclusion is true then reincarnation would not exist if we did not believe in it. Like everyone here I reject the above view that the world is simply illusion. If others exist independent of me then my beliefs do not affect reincarnation for them and, if the creator is indeed external to me, she determines whether I am born again, not me. I'm not sure whether she is bound by numerology though - despite my interest in it! Minderwiz

napaea	11 Aug 2002
I think we may also have to look at what someone else here mentioned, the collective soul. Regardless of whether people believe in reincarnation or not, if the Universe, God/dess, great spirit feels more work needs to be done to enlighten those on this plane, people will be brought back to assist in the raising of universal energy and vibration. maybe on the other side we all had accomplished what we needed for our souls, but decided to come back here to help the poor blokes on the planet reach a higher level of spirituality. just a thought.

Mateo06	11 Aug 2002
I believe we are reincarnated several times, each time we live a new way of life, i.e. rich then poor, good looking then ugly, ect. Each life is suppose to show us a new lesson and different way of living. i refuse to believe we only get one life! cuz some ppl get way more than others. and that in itself is not fair!!!

The If someone doesn't believe in reincarnation, does it happen anyway? thread was originally posted on 09 Aug 2002 in the Spirituality board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Spirituality, or read more archived threads.