John Edwards..... Real or Not?

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 05 Oct 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

MystiqueMoonlight	05 Oct 2002
There is a new programme on Australian TV from the U.S.A called "Crossing Over with John Edwards" I suppose I have become a bit of a skeptic when I see these people having their own TV show. Certainly he seems to be mediating, but I was just wondering what anybody else may know about him? I would love to think this guy is for real, but the whole TV show thing just makes me feel a little uncertain.

Minderwiz	05 Oct 2002
He's actually called John Edward. We have the show here in the UK and my wife and I also have a set of tapes by him relating to psychic development. I think he's convincing - I've met a number of psychics, including the UK TV psychic, Derek Acorah. I've also attended a small weekend session featuring Prof. Archie Roy of the Scottish Society for Psychical Research. I am sure that a number of 'psychics' may be fakes or may read body language, be good at guessing or simply intuitive. However the volume of evidence is such that I accept as fact that psychic abilities exist. The issue is what are they - are they some form of communication with the world of spirit, are they some form of enhanced intuition or ESP, are we 'networked' so that we can pick up subconsciously from others? Again I have seen and heard enough to convince me that spiritual connection does take place. I can see no other explanation for what I have seen or heard. Now I may be credulous but on the other hand I have been brought up in a scientific tradition and look for logical and rational explanations firts. For the Sceptics its well worth reading Archie Roy's book 'The Archives of the Mind' for a more scientific examination of psychic phenomenon. Hope this helps Minderwiz

the hermit	05 Oct 2002
i don't have trouble with psychic phenomena... i have trouble with people who i feel "use" other people for fame and gain. i don't know that mr. E does this as i've personally never seen a taping of his show, but i've heard too many stories both online and in the media about what goes on behind the cameras to accept him. help me out here fellow aeclecticians... i know there's a thread where this person was discussed before!!! anyway there are charges of intense editing that misleadz the viewers concerning what actually occurred, coaching and badgering of some show participants, prepping audiences, leading questions that are then edited... etc. etc. i believe that there are many genuine psychics, but the ones that i've met and worked with are very different than folks like mr. E. they tend to be much more resistant to the limelight and much more concerned about helping than gaining fame and fortune from their "gift". too many of the tv psychics remind me of the tv preachers who seem more interested in promoting their ideas, agendas etc than they are in giving genuine aide and comfort. i may be wrong about mr. E in particular, but as the old saying goes... where there's smoke, there's fire.

the hermit	05 Oct 2002
HA! knew it was somewhere... found the original discussion on this show and man. check it out for more opinions and information... Crossing Over

Umbrae	05 Oct 2002
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5886&highlight=john+edwards http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3013&highlight=john+edwards http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2247&highlight=john+edwards http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=727&highlight=john+edwards

Kazz	05 Oct 2002
LOL...Umbrae, Yes there are many threads on this very subject. I personally like John Edward, I have seen his show a number of times. But I am not 100% convinced as yet, but my friend and I have tickets to see him in January 2003, as he is coming to Australia. I can't wait! So I will let you guys know all about it. Cheers Kazz :TQC

Umbrae	06 Oct 2002
In many ways, it matters not if he is real or not. He legitimizes our craft, in spite of Miss Cleo and others of her ilk.

Minderwiz	06 Oct 2002
I've looked at the thread relating to Crossing Over. I've not been to a show taping so I can't really comment about whether some of the claims are true. Clearly it would be possible to have 'spies' in the audience or edit the final tape to give a different impression to what actually happened. I have been to a live broadcast of one of Derek Acorah's TV shows and I have seen him operate 'live' on several occasions. Yes, there are misses - I don't think any psychic can claim to be 100% right or anywhere near that - indeed I would be very suspicious of any 'psychic' who claimed to be always right. The ability mis not always at the same strength even for the professional. A medium or channel is just that - a 'person' through whom communication passes - because they are human they may mistake or misinterpret or put their own slant on things. However the hit rate I witnessed was much higher than I would have expected with details that can't be guessed through such devices as 'I have a George here'. I have not been to a TV taping for a psychic but I have been to a taping of an entertainment show and a thirty minute show took around two hours to tape - clearly there is editing to make the show seem more coherent and polished and what you see does not necessarily reflect the order in which it happened. The editing process therefore does influence the finished product and it is reasonable to ask if it has changed it out of all recognition. It is also possible that mistakes are made in the editing room - the claim that an answer was not that to the question heard may reflect sloppy editing rather than a deliberate attempt to deceive. It does show the need for professional editing with integrity otherwise the show will be called into question. A healthy scepticism is needed. Where there is a chance that someone is faking or guessing, we do need to expose the frauds. However it is almost impossible to change the mind of a convinced sceptic through discussion or even a reading. Only when they experience something that they can explain in no other way will the door open. My feeling from watching and listening to John Edward is that he is for real, though I must acknowledge that without the opportunity to examine everthing that this feeling is not fully supported by concrete evidence. Minderwiz

marmalade	06 Oct 2002
i had a lot more faith in this show until a knock off appeared here in the UK recently... '6ixth Sense with Colin Fry'. I can accept that one person in this world could have this power, but now with this total copycat show I have my doubts.

Minderwiz	06 Oct 2002
Well, I've seen a fair number of people with these 'powers' to varying degrees - some are professional mediums, some operate out of Spritualist Churches, some are amateurs. I would guess that the proportion of the population who can use their psychic abilities is quite high. The operative phrase is 'to varying degrees'. My wife has reasonable psychic powers and on her day she can match John Edward, Derek Acorah or Colin Fry. However there are days when nothing comes - she can't turn it on or turn it off at will. When its flowing she can tune out but if its not flowing she can't tune in. I've also experienced one or two interludes of quite strong psychic power but 99% of the time I get very little to nothing. Just as not all good singers or actors end up becoming TV stars and 99% of them remain in obscurity, so not all psychics get on TV either - the large majority of them are only noticed by family, friends or neighbours. Minderwiz

Violet Gargoyle	06 Oct 2002
Sort of related: Have anyone seen the "Pet Psychic" on TV where Sandra Fitzpatrick speaks to animals living and passed on? I do watch John Edward on occasion, the happiness and feeling of connection brought to the people on the show is nice to watch, even for the skeptic like myself. I don't know if I can believe it, but I have not experience in the matter either way so it is a "Why or Why not" proposition for me. The pet psychic, Sandra Fitzpatrick, seems to be a bit more....I'm not sure of the word for it. I guess I have a harder time with it other than entertainment value....

Alissa	06 Oct 2002
When I first saw his show (on SciFi) I was amazed -- "was it real??" was all I could think while I watched it again and again. I have a theatre/performance background, so with an insider's eye I was avidly watching every show. I thought, He could be using plants in the audience, reading for insiders only. Hell, I've *been* a plant in an audience, but not for psychic readings mind you. If so, all of them were character actors, obviously, since most that he reads on tv look "normal" and not attractive enough to be leading men/women. And, they all had the uncanny ability to go from laughing to tears, convincingly, in just seconds. That's reallllly hard, even for a lot of pros. You usually need a few moments to work out those tears. Even if it's short, you need more than a few "beats" to get it to happen and squeeze out a few wet drops when belly laughing moments before. Eventually, I came to believe he was doing it, for real. Since I'm open to such things, and experience it just a little myself, I have no problem accepting it exists. He's a damn good medium, I think. I've seen John Edward lecture and read live as well, and yes indeed his show is greatly edited. But *not* because I think he stacks it so that he "hits". You would not IMAGINE the ions of time that a person being read for will sit and blink at him and have no clue whatsoever how to speak English, or any other language. I'm a fairly compassionate person, but I thought I was gonna roll over on the floor and DIE waiting for some of these people to respond during the 4 hour session I saw John E. at. The editting of his tv show is obviously cutting out and splicing together the "important" moments. Any tv show on television does that though, so that in itself should be no big deal. When he lectures in person, this was a room of 3,000 btw, he was up on an elevated platform and there were cameras in several strategic places. They had several people as microphone chase crew, they would run to the hand he was pointing at. So, cameras pick up plenty before and after a show, and microphones can be left on ... yes it is possible to glean evidence from innocent audience members who are all sitting en masse, discussing with their friends who also came about how they want to hear from their (mother lover father friend). it's really easy to fake a show like this, if you use the technology right. Pipe it right in to the dressing room on the "god mike" -- that's the open channel that speaks to any intercom in the back of the "house" (that way you can hear what's going on onstage and know your next entrance). I thought about that too, when first watching. But I still changed my mind when watching him work, and believe that he's for real. And then, seeing him live, I had the only time I've ever seen energy actualized. The lighting of the place he lectured at was like a gymnasium, industrial overhead lighting only. NOT stage lighting. That's important to know, and I took time to look for any, even hidden, stage lighting (specials, follow spots, overheads). None. However, I've never seen auras before, but I could see his. He paced back and forth MADLY while talking, which he doesnt do on his show, and I could see his energy leaving a "trail" behind him. Then, i saw these "energy balls" that would chase after him, buzzing around. I was amazed! (I asked my friends about it later and they had no clue what I was talking about. I was the only one amongst us who saw it.) I know others can do this all the time, but that event was my first and last thus far, so it's still a big deal to me. And it did plenty to convince me on a whole new level that J.E. was just a damn good medium.

Minderwiz	06 Oct 2002
Alissa, Thanks for that commentary I found it most informative, not just because I happen to believe he's real but to put out some issues for the sceptics to deal with. It also occured to me that the claims about audience rigging or other devices should also be treated with scepticism. If the can't be evidenced then they are hearsay and should be ignored. I was struck by your point on auras. I've watched Derek Acorah live on two occasions and I saw his aura quite plainly. I don't do auras (well I have felt them but until then never seen one). I've stood next to him and felt the presence that is his guide, Sam. Those things can't be faked - not in a school car park in Oldham anyway (which was the latter one). Minderwiz

Lee	06 Oct 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Minderwiz It also occured to me that the claims about audience rigging or other devices should also be treated with scepticism. If the can't be evidenced then they are hearsay and should be ignored. Hi Minderwiz, I think I need to respectfully disagree with this. It seems to me that if someone makes claims like John Edward does, then it is up to *him* to provide scientifically verifiable evidence, and not up to skeptics to come up with evidence to disprove him. After all, it's really impossible to disprove anything. -- Lee

the hermit	06 Oct 2002
Quote: Originally posted by Lee Hi Minderwiz, I think I need to respectfully disagree with this. It seems to me that if someone makes claims like John Edward does, then it is up to *him* to provide scientifically verifiable evidence, and not up to skeptics to come up with evidence to disprove him. After all, it's really impossible to disprove anything. -- Lee i agree, in that healthy skepticism is needed in the case of psychic "gifts" when so many use them (or pretend them) in order to gather fame and fortune. i must disagree though with any claim that it matters not whether or not he is "real" when it comes to the legitimizing of craft. if he or anyone is a fraud and has such public exposure then he can do nothing but harm the legitimate users of such gifts. as i said earlier in this thread i believe in the existence of such phenomena and gifts... but i'm skeptical when so many accusations are made of the misuse of these gifts by Edward. at the same time i haven't personally witnessed the use OR abuse by him.... which is why i'm skeptical but still trying to remain open. i might add that with today's technology little or nothing is not susceptable to fakery... even auditoriums or car parks. this is not an accusation, simply a statement.

MystiqueMoonlight	06 Oct 2002
Quote: Originally posted by the hermit i agree, in that healthy skepticism is needed in the case of psychic "gifts" when so many use them (or pretend them) in order to gather fame and fortune. i must disagree though with any claim that it matters not whether or not he is "real" when it comes to the legitimizing of craft. if he or anyone is a fraud and has such public exposure then he can do nothing but harm the legitimate users of such gifts. Thank you Hermit, This was my concern. As a Tarotist we are constantly faced with scepticism.....thanks to people like Miss Cleo for example. Now I'm not saying I don't believe John Edward to be for real, I'm just a little sceptical when I see the whole TV thing and of course now he is in the papers, magazines etc. I would like nothing more than for him to be 100% for real....but history does prove otherwise. Kaz, Can't wait to hear about your experience when you see him.

Kirali	07 Oct 2002
ARgh I'm trying to remember what the name of the show was called. Along with a bunch of other psychics or so called psychics, John Edward let himself get hooked up to a machine and had little stickum pads on his head while he did some stuff to prove he was real. It was a show on the Discovery Channel or The Learning Channel! I think a year or two ago. I remembered him when I first saw his show. So it was before his show came out here in the U.S. Maybe it was a lie detector test or something but I believe he passed it. They also had skeptical people come on and get readings. He gave this woman a reading and she started crying and it seemed like she was into it. And then afterwards she seemed embittered and said he was playing on her emotions. I thought she just was irritated that he was able to speak with her passed loved ones and she wasn't able to! Just my opinion! Maybe they'll replay the show since it is October! :) ~Kira I also think he's for real! :) Quote: Originally posted by Lee Hi Minderwiz, I think I need to respectfully disagree with this. It seems to me that if someone makes claims like John Edward does, then it is up to *him* to provide scientifically verifiable evidence, and not up to skeptics to come up with evidence to disprove him. After all, it's really impossible to disprove anything. -- Lee

ladycj	07 Oct 2002
I watched a live taping of his show as well. He was completely intense. He paced back and forth across the stage. He reminded me very much of a panther. He seemed very real. And yes, people seem to forget their own names the minute he starts talking to them. It is amazing. lol And yes, he did allow himself to be tested. He along with several psychics went to be tested at I belive it was the University of Arizona. The results have been documented and studied. I don't remember the name of the book, but John E. mentions it in his book "Crossing Over".

The John Edwards..... Real or Not? thread was originally posted on 05 Oct 2002 in the Spirituality board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Spirituality, or read more archived threads.