the death card

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 03 Sep 2001, and now archived in the Forum Library.

New River	03 Sep 2001
a post i made earlier to Demon Goddess has led me to ask if anyone ever gets actual death with the death card? it's not a subject generally talked about, and yet, maybe is should be. we all deal with it. just this week in my layout for the week, death was the number 8 position. since i am in the process of making some life changes it meant that to me. but would i be surprised if someone in the community passes away? no i would not. does this happen to anyone else? i've had people so paranoid that they ask that this card be removed before their reading. i usually oblige as i don't want the experience to be scary for them. i have another card that signifies death to me so it doesn't matter. i know this might be a touchy subject, but i've never had anyone to ask before. love and light, New River

MeeWah	03 Sep 2001
Generally, Death is not intended to refer to physical death as it pertains to more than the material or physical world. Another name for the card is "Transformation", which expresses change as that of a caterpillar into a butterfly. Therefore, Death refers to a change on some level of one's existence. It can refer to the end of an attitude, a relationship, a job, a residence--though The Tower can also refer to those events. Personally, I have seen Death refer to all of those; but I've also had occasions to read it as hearing of a death; the death of someone close. Currently, Death is my Year Card & I am feeling its effects on many levels.

MeeWah	03 Sep 2001
Keep in mind that this card needs to be read carefully whether for the self or for someone else to avoid unduly alarming self or another as to its possible implications. Due to cultural influences &/or societal conditioning, there is the tendency to take things too literally or to apply on a mundane level only, ignoring other levels of meanings & thus limiting the scope of the readings. While literal interpretations have their place, it is more usual for the cards to express a concept in symbolic terms.

nexyjo	03 Sep 2001
actually, i seem to resonate quite closely with the death card. additionally, i haven't noticed any reluctance in discussing this card. for me, like meewah, this card means transformation. but it's a major life change. in my own case, the death card is something i'm going through now. my old self dies, and my new self is born. each card speaks about much more than it's face. in the case of death, it also speaks of rebirth, it speaks of changes, and the need to embrace change. it speaks of life, as life is change. even in death, it is change. nothing is static, and the death card personifies this. if you or any of your clients have issues with a card called "death", there are decks that use names like transformation. i can see how some people would take issue with this card, as it does portray what appears to be a rather dark story. but like every card, appearances can be deceiving. luv and light, nexy

New River	03 Sep 2001
thanks guys. since i am a scorpio i get the death card quite a bit. it shows up like an old friend and i know another transformation is in the works. i just appreciate having someone to talk to about these things as i've never had anyone to express to since i started 7 years ago. most folks around here have their cards read for amusement and don't want death to be a part of it. but i am branching out and hope to help tune people in to their amazing intuitions. thanks again for your input. love and light, New River

Demon Goddess	04 Sep 2001
I can see getting the death card because someone has died, but I don't see it signifying a death. For me it's always been complete change brought about after something else occurs. I've only gotten a card signifying death once for myself and once for someone else (there's a topic I should ask about)... Anyway... nobody else said, but what card has shown death for you in the past. Mine was the 9 of swords.

New River	05 Sep 2001
hi Demon Goddess. for me the card was the 5 of Coins and was in the #6 position on the day my own daughter died. i was away from home that day with my mother in the hospital. she was 17 and committed suicide. the 3 of swords followed in many months of readings afterward for me. i was using the haindl deck at the time and it was the mourning card. the only other time, it was the actual death card when my mother died last year from a sudden illness. let me tell you that it has been 6 years now since i lost my daughter and the tarot has blessed me with the most awesome guidance! now i even have all you great people to discuss it with! Bless us All! love and light, New River

MeeWah	05 Sep 2001
New River: Thank you for trusting us & sharing with us your loss. There are no words to mitigate such sorrow, but my heart goes out to you! Months before my father passed away suddenly, I saw his passing in my Year Card, which was 11-Justice; however, I did not then nor have I since regarded it as a "death card" since it spoke of other events as well within the same time period. I told no one about what I had seen--only hubby. I could not tell my mother & siblings because they do not understand. 3-Swords also was appearing in Daily Cards & spreads & continued for some time after. Demon Goddess: Other cards I've seen as representing death: 6-Swords; 10-Swords; 4-Swords; 14-Temperance; 20-Judgement. I've read 5-Pentacles for matters relating to state of being. Such as referring to physical health--illness or on the verge, diet concerns; spiritual poverty--lack of spirit or faith, depression; as well as financial difficulties. I see "5" pip cards as aspects of 5-The Hierophant; also 14-Temperance. Both cards also deal with matters of being.

Demon Goddess	05 Sep 2001
Interesting... I'm thinking now perhaps any card, even the Ace of cups or Ace of coins could signify death, depending on how the querant felt and where the card fell in the spread. I know I'm new here, but I have a feeling this place is going to help a great deal in helping me improve my readings. :) I'm glad I found it.

SummerRaine	03 Nov 2001
In my experience the death card turned out to be literal physical death on only one occasion (years ago). Since this one incident the card has indicated it's predominant meaning, which is change, ending "off with the old and on with the new." (so to speak). Years ago when I did a reading for someone and the card meant literal death, I became very frightened of the Tarot, and did not read the cards for quite some time afterward. But eventually the universe helped me to understand that there was nothing to fear, and I started reading again and haven't stopped since.

tiger lily	03 Nov 2001
Death turned up for me in the "past" position shortly after my grandmother had died. I got the 10 of Coins before my cat died and I interpreted it then as the transcendence (10) of the physical (Coins = Earth). I agree that virtually every card can mean death, since death "feels" different for each of us, depending on our past experience with and attitude towards death.

scorpio	06 Dec 2001
i have an interesting deck which features two death cards, one showing the grim reaper harvesting souls and the other an "angel" sowing the seeds of rebirth. in our example of divorce the first card represents the pain and separation from the other person and the other card shows the acceptance of loss that paves the way for eventual rebirth. pink light to you new river

arizonagirl	07 Dec 2001
For me, it's never meant actual death in any readings, always transformation. The best death card I've ever seen is in the Hudes deck (which I don't use anymoore) - a butterfly is the pelvic bones of the skeleton.

AquarianGoddess	08 Dec 2001
I was recently told that the Death card is also very spiritual and when it shows up in a reading, it's something that is "meant to be". About a month ago, it appeared in my reading in the 6th position (developing events). Ironically, I'm in a major life transitional period and it's not over yet...

Kimon	09 Dec 2001
Hello, the death card as I read it is usually abrupt, irreversible break or transformation. I see it that way that there is a force simplifyingly called Death that moves around in the world. This force can be far or near. When the death card falls it means that this force is coming somehow nearer than it was before. It depends on many factors how near it will come, or if it even will touch someone (be it a person or a cat, the force is the same). When people are physically involved I have made the experience that it comes together with other cards, mostly disks (earth to earth). I think death can be farer or nearer, and it will mostly depend on peoples attitude and inner strength how near it will come; though if it is aiming at someone we will not be able to stop it. But that is a very, very seldom meaning, though it might be if the gates are already opened to invite it in. In all meanings the death card for me always means an ending force without mercy. Death doesnt play and we cant discuss with it. Greetings, Kimon

scorpio	09 Dec 2001
[quote]Kimon (09 Dec, 2001 21:06): Hello, the death card as I read it is usually abrupt, irreversible break or transformation. I see it that way that there is a force simplifyingly called Death that moves around in the world. YEAH! what he said!!!

raveneye	15 Oct 2002
Two significant experiences with this card: several years ago I was reading for a client, a woman in her 50's, she got the Death card, I believe it was in the context (8th) position.. I was gently explaining that while the Death card can mean a literal death, the Tarot transcends the literal level, urges looking beyond the literal... the client said quietly "can I tell you happened?" I said "only if you want to" Briefly, she told me that five months earlier her husband had killed their mentally handicapped son, and then himself. She said that friends and family were saying that she should be over it by now, and be getting on with her life.... The healing in the reading seemed to be in affirming the transformational aspect of Death, that Death had transformed her as much as it had her husband and her son, that she would never be the same, that the person she had been had died with her loved ones. She seemed relieved to imagine that she didn't have to try to get back to normal, that she could get to know herself all over again. I'm grateful that she was able to share this beautiful example of the true stories the Tarot reveals. 2) The other time was significant in that I drove back to town late on a Sunday evening because a voice on the phone communicated the urgency of the situation. We agreed to meet at a well-known vegetarian restaurant in the city. I felt uneasy about meeting a stranger alone but something in his voice overruled the fear. We sat down at a quiet table in the restaurant, and, after just a few, almost terse words of introduction, I laid out a Celtic Cross adapted to include a Title card (the bottom of the deck, counterpoint to the Significator) and the Stretch card, a reach into beyond the Outcome. I believe the Death card was in the Title position of the reading. He listened to my inital interpretation of the reading and then said he would go to the washroom and tell me his story when he came back. He said that he had taken his girlfriend's son for a ride in his car, lost control of the vehicle and the boy was killed in the accident. He talked about a recurring dream of the boy drowning and catching hold of his jacket, trying to pull him to the surface, that the boy would always slip out of his jacket and sink to the bottom of the lake. He said he hadnt seen his girlfriend since the moment he left her, waving goodbye on the way out to do an errand. He said that he was under psychiatric surveillance and taking anti-depressants because his Navy doctors were afraid he would commit suicide. I asked if that was a possibility and he seemed not to know how to live, that he didn't want to die, but had lost the meaning and the will to live. Well, then, we start with the body, I thought, and my Yoga teacher came to mind and I called her from the restaurant and, without divulging the personal details, asked if she would see this man, sort of an emergency session, and she agreed, respecting the confidentiality of the situation and arranged to meet him the next day. It turned out that she was already working with the mother of the boy who had died in the accident. I did consider the confict of interests in the situation, and, had we been lawyers, the story might have ended there. She agreed to work with them both if they were ok with it, and they were. I don't know the details of their work together but I know that the little warrior yoga teacher hand-delivered a Valentine to that fragile young man on his ship a few weeks later, just to let him know that Love goes on, that he was loved and lovable. I doubt I would have had the courage to do that So, the Death card, like the Tarot itself, tells it like it is. I am still awed by the power of this process, that the story in every reading is true to life in all its depth and breadth. Thank you for bringing Death to the conscious level. It's not often that Death removes his helmet of invisibility (see Liz Greene's Mythic Tarot)

Kazz	15 Oct 2002
Raveneye, they were amazing stories, thankyou for sharing them. New River....I am so sorry to hear of the tragic loss of your daughter. I respect your courage in sharing this and you are in my thoughts. I haven't yet seen a death in my readings, so far the death card in the readings I do has been an ending of something which sometimes can be a relief (like an ending of a bad situation etc) and I always tell people that it is a good thing in some situations, as it is finally over and you now can move on from this. In other cases, like relationships, they have ended completely and in most cases, divorce, as it idicates a complete ending (there are no ties left) I would think that to have the Death, 10 Swords and or 3 Swords with a court card, that then would indicate a death, possiblely by an accident (10 swords), or with 9 Swords, by an illness. Cheers Kazz :TQC

MeeWah	16 Oct 2002
Raveneye: Welcome to Aeclectic! Thank ye very much for sharing your personal & insightful experiences with this card. I look forward to your continued presence in the forums. I find it synchronistic that this thread has re-emerged. New River posted this thread way well over a year ago & recently returned to Aeclectic. Also, aside from it being my last year's card, I & am sure others, too, have an interest in the expressions of Death. New River: If ye happen to read this: welcome back!! I am so glad to see ye again!!

NocturneSanguis	24 Oct 2002
I do not pertain to be an expert, a mere novice on a path is all I am, but consider this. I performed a reading for a friend. Card one was Death. Card two was the Devil. He asked for the reading as he had split up with his girlfriend hours before. Days later he moved back to London, meaning our band was no longer to continue. Various meanings of Death, and nothing new to learn, I realise, but I considered the Devil to not only represent bad omen for the situations, but also took into account the fact he is a Satanist. Earlier today I thought that it may represent bad advice that I offered him from the reading, but have changed my mind on that. Perhaps he would be a better judge of that? Thanks for reading, and I hope for some input from the more skilled of you, if you have any opinions.

Fuzzmello	24 Oct 2002
Hi NocturneSanguis, [quote]Originally posted by NocturneSanguis Various meanings of Death, and nothing new to learn, I realise, but I considered the Devil to not only represent bad omen for the situations, but also took into account the fact he is a Satanist. [quote] I agree with your observations that Death means an ending of some situation or relationship, but I don't think I agree with the idea that the Devil represents some bad omen. The Devil is more about an attitude within ourselves that outside influences. He represents ignorance of our habits and ways. This ignorance binds us by blinding us to the solution of the basic problem, and the result is despair. Since Death was the basis of this situation, I'd say the cards really want this fellow to know that any unhappiness resulting from failed relationships and the like are due to his unwillingness to take a good look at himself and the way he relates to the universe. It could be he makes many decisions based on habit without realizing that this is the real basis of his troubles. (This doesn't make him a bad guy by the way, most of the world is caught up in this little scenerio.) I can't say more without seeing the rest of the spread, but I'll bet it goes on to tell him specifically what he needs to look at if he wants to end this cycle. Fuzz

nina	30 Oct 2002
Hello, i have always been very affected by the concept/image of Death as a harvester. It's time to reap up what this past season has grown- if you don't it will rot in the field and something that might have been useful will become rancid and possibly harmful. "Verily, Verily, I say unto you, except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit." -John 12:24 Dostoevsky used this quote to open Brothers Karamazov, a novel that put its three main characters through personal hell but somehow constantly kept it's eye on the benefit that would come of it; at the end one brother even speaks of being "reborn through this trial in a way I desperately needed, but if it had not been for this torment I would never have brought myself to it, never!" This is what The Death Card calls to my mind- it may not be an actual physical death, but it might feel like one- and the querent should keep in mind these things come to you when it's necessary for them to happen. Fight it and you might end up with a lot of useless, rotting wheat in the field. -Nina

anjocoxo	31 Oct 2002
I have to be honest and say that to me the death card is not the card that frightens me. I'm a bit afraid of the tower, i think the tower represent worse things than death card... but that's just me, and it's just a feeling i have everytime i look at the tower, i just feel creepy. new river - you have my total respect, i wish all that's good for you in your life ;)

The the death card thread was originally posted on 03 Sep 2001 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.