Pope, Strength, Hermit, Temperance

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 02 Nov 2001, and now archived in the Forum Library.

northsea	02 Nov 2001
These four cards seem to symbolize the light side of the Force (Star Wars term). Which card is the quintessential opposite (or reversal) of the Devil? The Devil represents instinct/beastliness. Strength soothes the Savage Beast. Also, the Lion can represent a mythological God. Temperance can represent the Angel of Light (Apollo versus Dionysus in Greek mythology). The Hierophant represents the upright pentagram (versus the Devil as inverted pentagram). The Hermit represents avoidance of wordly temptations; the Devil represents following urges without contemplating the results.

nexyjo	02 Nov 2001
i like to think that each card represents a wide range of meanings, from light to dark. of course, i know that others disagree... luv and light, nexy

jmd	03 Nov 2001
Which is the quintessential opposite of XV? 15 is a triangular number whose base is 5 (ie, 5+4+3+2+1=15). XV & V certainly have many pictorial similarities: they each traditionally have two smaller figures at the base of the main one; The main figure holds a significant staff; and, probably more importantly, XV is X & V! Temperance does not focus on the illusion which XV can bring. It rather becomes a virtue against it. Strength (XI) seems to indicate another virtue, this time an inner one (Fortitude), and the Hermit yet another (Wisdom). This is even more evident in a 17th C. French deck, also mentioned in one of Knight's books on Tarot, in which each of these, together with Justice, are the four cardinal virtues, each with a rayed 'halo'. The pope is here the spiritual guide. If (s/)he abuses this power, it inverses to the Devil card. Well, here is ONE interpretation...

Thirteen	03 Nov 2001
I agree with JMD. Great analysis there. The other three are different virtues, and, if you notice, they're all pictured as solitary (well, there's the lion, but still). Both Pope and Devil have two "acolytes" at their feet. In RW deck, these mirror the Lovers. In other decks, however, I've seen them more closely mirror the acolytes kneeling before the Pope/Hierophant. Their messages are also opposite: if the card is indeed "The Pope" (rather than more flexable Hierophant), then he's all about denying the world. The solution to all worldly problems is God, the spiritual, the divine; the Pope and his followers never think of the real world, only the world beyond it. The Devil is the absolute opposite of this, a corruption if you will. Only the physical world matters; and his followers are enslaved to it; they never think beyond it. Another similarity, both are "inactive." Temperence, Strength and the Hermit are all standing and doing something. Temperence mixing and transforming liquid, Strength opening/closing the lion's mouth, the Hermit traveling with his lantern, seeking. But both Pope and Devil sit; at best, they passively dispense "wisdom" and "bless" their followers. No active movement on their part; they are watchers, distant lords. Their followers are the ones that are active, standing or kneeling, ready to do their lord's bidding.

northsea	03 Nov 2001
Hello nexyo, jmd, and Thirteen, You bring-up some great insights! It sounds like the Hierophant is the opposing card. The fact that they're both inactive is a very good point. Justice being included in the grouping makes sense because Justice involves karma, the Devil invites us to ignore karma.

cayte	12 Nov 2001
I think the Fool is the opposite of the Devil. The innocence the Fool represents is the antithesis of the Devil's machinations. Being bound by the Fallen Angel is in direct opposition to dancing with the Fool.

C.N.	13 Nov 2001
In fact, I nowadays see the Heirophant/Pope as a more negative card than the Devil. The Pope seems to represents intolerance and hypocrisy. He seems to be a much harsher master than the devil, if you look at the two people in the front of the card. The ones on the Devil card are standing upright, and the ones on the Heirophant/Pope card are bowing. -C.N.

Thirteen	13 Nov 2001
Quote: C.N. (13 Nov, 2001 19:27): The Pope seems to represents intolerance and hypocrisy. He seems to be a much harsher master than the devil, if you look at the two people in the front of the card. The ones on the Devil card are standing upright, and the ones on the Heirophant/Pope card are bowing. -C.N. Not that I necessarily disagree with you, but how we feel about the kneeling is very much due to our modern eyes. We have strong ideas about individual dignity, democracy, equality, thinking for yourself and all those other "new fangled" modern ideas. And leave us remember that us Tarot readers are often very scrappy individuals with a strong resistence against bowing down to anyone ;) But even in our modern times we hold a very strong belief in submission to a higher power; in certain churches, mosques and Buddist/Hindu temples there remains the practice of kneeling/bowing in homage or surrender to that which we percieve as better, purer, divine. This out of respect as much as subjugation. Thing is, are the acolytes in the Hierophant card kneeling because the Hierophant demands it (as you say, a harsh master), because his position demands it (aka, like being Pope, you kneel and kiss his ring no matter who he is in homage to his supreme connection to God) OR, are they kneeling out of pure respect and reverence of THIS particular man (like someone in Asia might bow low to a wise and brilliant teacher)? Not that the Hierophant can't stand for a demanding, conservative hypocrite, but I tend to see the kneeling acolytes as less kneeling on demand as a mixture of respect of the Hierophant's position (salute the uniform) and in homage of the man himself. This in contrast to the Devil who I see as having the allure of a pop star. Those who chain themselves to the Devil's feet can't get enough of him, they're obsessed, addicted to him, and will do anything he says. No matter what kind of person he really is, no matter how he hurts or humiliates them. They feel chained, as if they belonged to him. And their standing position is almost jealously protective of him. They way I see it, in both the Devil and Hierophant card, the servants are "connected" to their master of their own free will. However, you chain yourself at the devil's feet out of need and addiction, you kneel at the Hierophant's feet out of respect.

northsea	17 Nov 2001
Cayte: what you say about the Fool is quite insightful

Seed Crystal	08 Oct 2004
Quote: Originally posted by northsea Cayte: what you say about the Fool is quite insightful. Here's a schema I have worked-out concerning this: Fool vs. (Hermit vs. (Pope vs. (Emperor vs. Devil). The Devil is the alter-ego of the Emperor -both are concerned with worldly power. The two of these together contrast with the Pope's ministry exerting spiritual influence in the material realm. In contrast, the Hermit completely foregoes power/influence, and seeks only to find Purity in isolation/renunciation. The Purity he seeks is found in the Innocence of the Fool who, in contrast, is possibly seeking the Wisdom (or merely Experience) of the Hermit. The grass is greener... Nice. Very nice. How about Fool vs. (Hermit vs (High Priestess vs. Hierophant) vs. (Magician vs. ((Emperor vs. Empress) vs. Devil)))? The Fool is a beginner in the journey, contrasts with the HP and Hierophant, who also contract as hidden and intuitive wisdom vs public orthodoxy and catechismic teaching; all wisdom seekers contrast with earthly power seekers or holders; the Magician whose interest is personal contrasts with the Emperor and Empress whose concern is the community; the Empress whose power is natural earthy and feminine contrasts with the Emperor whose power is of system and civilization builder; the Devil is concerned with domination, false power, and falsehoods. Parentheses are tricky but handy.

The Pope, Strength, Hermit, Temperance thread was originally posted on 02 Nov 2001 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.