When a card and it's position is irrelevant to client

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 11 Jun 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Kazz	11 Jun 2002
Hi All, I have a little problem that I hope you can help me with. When reading a position that is work/career and the client doesn't work or has or had a career, and he/she is not searching for either, how do you read this card in this position? Or should you (before you commence) ask the client "are they working etc" Which i don't like to ask to many questions (but i know that sometimes they are neccessary) . The reason i ask this is, the card in this position should give me information about the client's work situation, and then i would say "ok your work situation is this " then only to be told that they don't work, retired, etc for example. I have never come across this yet (thank goodness) as i usually know that they work or they tell me what they do before hand, but l will no doubt (as i am almost ready to do readings at home - Pro) or maybe i should put it off a little longer?? may need more knowledge???Hmm Anyway i hope some of you can help me out here Cheers Kazz :TQC

zorya	11 Jun 2002
kazz, please don't ever tell a stay at home mom, she doesn't work!

Kazz	11 Jun 2002
Zorya, I am really sorry if that's how i came across, but i too am a stay at home mum and yes it's DEFINATELY work, i mean't the "workforce" out - of - home - work Please don't take what i wrote the wrong way as i really really didn't mean it like that. Again i am sorry if i offend anyone. (i think i will edit my post) Cheers Karen

Kazz	11 Jun 2002
Ahhh! that's better It's gone i edited it out

Liliana	11 Jun 2002
I think zorya was just making a joke :) and its exactly what i was thinking everyone has work, even if its not a job, If i read a work card and the person said they didnt have a job thats exatly what id tell them. Work an e wathing kids, doing dishes, dealing with their relationship, paying bills. We ALL have work :) :THP

Starfish	11 Jun 2002
Kazz - I know that I wasn't offended (I'm a SAHM too) and interpretted what you said as "workforce" (out of the home). Starfish

Jenny-Li	11 Jun 2002
I think I'd regard carreer/work in a wider sense if that happened - that is perhaps as a card of "life achievement" - even though someone doesn't work, it doesn't mean that person doesn't have the need to achieve something in life. This could be a parallell to a working carrer, couldn't it? *I* see it that way, I think. :D That means you will see in this position a card for how the client regards the aim of what he or she does during the days, whether that is a professional carreer, or the general feeling he/she has for being retired, her perspective on being a stay at home mother or whatever it is. Or perhaps you could here unveil a longing to change what he or she is doing, an interest that this person would like to focus more on and make a bigger part of their life... etc. Could this work for you? Usually, if I don't think a position doesn't work in a specific case, I try to find a wider sense of understanding for that position, let the postition get a less limited meaning. Good luck! jenny :)

zorya	11 Jun 2002
i wasn't offended kazz! i was trying to make a joke. splatt! LOL

Umbrae	11 Jun 2002
Actually, I think this question is huge, and if I may, I would like to wax eloquent for a bit. As readers, we have difficulty seeing the sitters’ life from a subjective viewpoint. The sitter has difficulty seeing their life as any different. When you say, “You are going to win the lottery…” They laugh because they know they never buy tickets. They cannot see themselves finding a ticket. They cannot see their lives objectively. To understand the variance in point of view is imperative. Are we reading the card (lwb), the person, or the intuitive message the card is attempting to tell us? Is the court card a person, or is the court card trying to impart a set of behaviors? Sometimes we see a particular issue, the cards are all pointing to an event orchestrated by a person (court card). The sitter is unable to correspond either the event or the person. Career issues are common with SAHM’s. We may see a career ‘change’ for them. Of course, they may disagree. What we do not see is how their lives may take a zig when they think it may zag. They may remain SAHM’s, but perhaps they take on volunteer work, perhaps take on watching a friends child during the day. Possibilities are what cards are telling us. We must always keep in mind, the variance in point of view, and possibilities presented by life itself. …and of course the choices a person makes along the way. Nothing is ever immaterial.

HudsonGray	11 Jun 2002
Even if a person isn't 'employed' there are plenty of things that can be considered 'work'. It doesn't always have to be the traditional "I earn a paycheck" thing. Hobbies for instance (especially those they spend a ton of time on). Mentoring/volunteerism -- that's work in a different sense. Or anything that they do regularly out in the community, even if it's volunteer dogwalking! The regular trip to the coffee shop to talk to the same old people day in & day out--not only is that a regular routine, it's regular socializing & even though it doesn't pull in a paycheck, a lot of people stick to routines like this all the time. Having someone they took under their wing. Whether a relative or friend, any regular interaction to teach or network with would qualify as a 'work situation' in my opinion. You'll have to think outside the box on this one. Work means far more than a regular paycheck for time put in at a location. I'd qualify it as anything done regularly, mostly outside the house (well, ok, inside too for all those stay at home parents!) that's done on a continual basis. Hobbies, skills, clubs, volunteer work, steady intentions, learning experiences, etc. Anything there's a focus toward on a regular basis.

Kaz	11 Jun 2002
read "work" as "network", in the broadest sense of the word. kaz

cricket	11 Jun 2002
There is never an irrelevant card in a reading, imo, unless the whole reading is 'off' for some reason. If the deck doesn't want to talk to you. Something along that line. A 'work' situation could be anything that takes time and effort, and is a source of pride (or frustration, depending on the situation). This could be anything from being the CEO of a major corporation to the effort it takes an invalid to feed him/herself. There are three things I've found to be effective in a situation where an 'irrelevant' card comes up: either ask about what the card could be referring to, use the surrounding cards to figure out what it might be, or draw another card or two to specify. There's absolutely nothing wrong with doing any of these things. Most importantly, be honest with the client. Let them know that X card usually means ___ (insert meaning here), but you're not sure what it has to do with ____ (insert subject here). If people aren't sceptics and are serious about the reading, they will usually understand and be willing to work with you to find out the relevance to the reading.

Kazz	12 Jun 2002
Thankyou to all of you, all these replies have given me alot to go on in regards to the overall "work" situation, and i do read mostly like that, but occasionally i find it hard to read that one card in that house that seems out of place (for some reason or another) like Riannon said the reading may be off. Oh Cricket you really made alot of sense about the client willing to help out, thankyou for all your input, i will work on it a little differently than i have been. Cheers Kazz

HudsonGray	14 Jun 2002
Ya know, I completely forgot about something. It might not be the card's meaning, but the picture on the card that's more relevant. Even in the 'work' position--take a close look at the picture itself & see if that triggers anything. I had the chariot come up for an allergy question once & it made no sense whatsoever till I looked at the top of the card. It was the Haindl deck & there's a gray boar on the top, but it looks more like a hugely shedding cat with fur flying everywhere. Now THAT fit the reading! Every so often you get something like that showing up. Got to keep an open mind on interpretation every so often, with things like that.

jade	14 Jun 2002
i have found that their "work" area always corresponds to something in that area of their life. for example: if they are retired and loving it, it will show happiness and lots of pleasure in that area. if they are unemployed and just lazying around, it will show that in the card. i've never found a card to be irrelevant in a reading........i've had cards i wanted to be irrelevant LOL but none that ever were. in light, jade

The When a card and it's position is irrelevant to client thread was originally posted on 11 Jun 2002 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.