4 of Cups : IS he wise to reject it ??!!

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 30 Dec 2002, and now archived in the Forum Library.

samantha	30 Dec 2002
Ok , I'm going around in circles about this one . The 4 of cups. I just can't decide whether the man is stupid or justified to reject (RW) the 4 of cups ? On the one hand I usually feel that Cups have that feel good factor (bar the 5 , elements of 7 , and perhaps self deception of the knight ..........but I digress.) BUT ! On the other hand the man on the ground has NO idea what he is being offered ?? There is a definate feeling that something has yet to be unravelled , and if he's not in full possesion of all the facts then who's to say he's not justified to hesitate ?? What do other people think about this ?

tarotbear	30 Dec 2002
Do you think he's rejecting the 4th cup being offered to him? I always feel , IMHO, that he's not even aware it is there. It is a card about being disconsolate. He is so introspective that he can only see the empty or full cups in front of him- he does not know the 4th exists. He is being told to take a 'heads-up' and see beyond the situation before him.

allibee	30 Dec 2002
in short, everything tarotbear said :) Also the 4 Cups is a card of boredom. You're stuck in a rut and can't see the woods for the trees - or the fourth cup for the three - often times something that was once so passionate becomes mundane, humdrum, routine. And you can't figure out why. You feel like you're just going through the motions. allibee

samantha	30 Dec 2002
Tarotbear: Yes.....I can see your interpretation being "correct"(in so far as anything in the Tarot can ever be "correct") in some situations ....perhaps alot of situations ! But not in that of my own reading !! Unless I am being particularly dense , I just cannot see that I am unaware of what is around me / on offer ! (infact if anything I am too aware !!)This is why I cannot get an angle on what the card is saying to me ! (Last card of the CC) Its a mystery.

sagitarian	30 Dec 2002
first off, to me it would depend on what deck I was using...What deck is that your using, and what do YOU interprate the last card of the CC meaning? Final outcome? Cards advice? Please let me know, and I would be glad to put in my two cents worth.

warabi	30 Dec 2002
Sometimes Tarot doesn't give you an answer that you are conciously aware of right away. Sometimes, the best way to understand what your intuition (cards) is telling you is to put them away for a while, relax, and enjoy the ride. If that sounds confusing, what I mean to say is sometimes things are revealed later. Our concious half of our minds sometimes do not grasp what our sub-councious are telling it until it comes at you. Of course, this is only the modest opinion of a "newbie" (to this board anyway).

samantha	30 Dec 2002
Hello Sagitarian ! So , I was using the RW deck , and I take the last card to mean the "Final outcome" , I had asked (which unfortunately is becoming habitual these days.....) about the direction of my career, which is really at cross-roads time . Because I cannot , or willnot, make a decision about it ............Sorry I don't want to bore you with my life story ! Anyway , any input is greatly appreciated ........this is a card which keeps coming up in my CC spread , so obviously significant..........but I can't work out why !! Over to you ........

samantha	30 Dec 2002
Hello Warabi ! Yes , I know that I could just call it a day , and give my cards a well deserved rest........I sometimes feel that they are SICK of being pestered with what amounts to the same question ! Well , so would I be ! And since I try to treat others as I would like to be treated .....! Thanks for the advice !

wavebreaker	30 Dec 2002
Hi samantha, Have you thought about posting your complete reading, including the spread, in the Your Readings forum? That way, people can see the whole spread and probably help you better interpreting the last card.

samantha	30 Dec 2002
Hello Tarotlady ! Thankyou for your gracious welcome and suggestion : I'm on to it now !

tarotbear	30 Dec 2002
I will add this comment: This card did pop up at the end of a reading I was doing, but based on the surrounding cards, I told the young man that what was being offered was only an illusion, and he would be better off sticking to the concrete.

Trogon	31 Dec 2002
Quote: Originally posted by samantha So , I was using the RW deck , and I take the last card to mean the "Final outcome" , I had asked (which unfortunately is becoming habitual these days.....) about the direction of my career, which is really at cross-roads time . Because I cannot , or willnot, make a decision about it .... and Quote: Originally posted by samantha I sometimes feel that they are SICK of being pestered with what amounts to the same question ! Well , so would I be! Hi samantha and welcome to Aeclectic Tarot. Very interesting discussion you started here. In general, my take on the 4 of Cups is pretty much similar to Tarotbear's, allibee's and others'. But your statements (quoted above) may be the key to the question you asked. Perhaps this card is simply pointing out that you're verging on obscession with this same question. Maybe it's not so much that you need to give the cards a rest, as maybe you need to give yourself a rest from the worry over the question itself? This card being an "outcome" card, might just be along the lines of a caution... that focusing too much on the one aspect, you may be missing something else - some other facet that you should be seeing? Just a thought.

Rhiannon	31 Dec 2002
Have to agree with Trogon on this one. Perhaps what this card is saying to you is that you are asking the wrong question! I was just discussing this last night with someone else (I know she'll forgive me for mentioning it!). If you ask "What is the basis of this matter?" over and over again, you will get nowhere! What you really need to do is figure out exactly what you want to know. If it's a relationship question then ask "Why am I reacting to this in this manner?" or "What is the root problem here that I'm missing?" or "What am I doing that is causing this situation?" or "What can I do to change this situation for the better?" That's when it almost takes only one card to sum up your problem. But you can base an entire reading on those types of questions. Asking generalized things gets you generalized answers and they often hide the real issue. Mostly because you are hiding from that issue yourself. Definitely post your problem readings. And when you have enough posts, if you still can't figure it out, reply to an offer in the reading exchange and have someone else read for you. But I also agree that sometimes we can just work a problem to death when we really need to just let it go. But aside from all that... LOL I usually interpret the card the way tarotbear and allibee do. Hope I helped with all my rambling... R :)

Umbrae	31 Dec 2002
The traditional interpretation is that he is refusing. That assumes he has a choice. On the other hand – who says he is refusing…perhaps he is waiting until he can use the next cup (one can only drink so much beer at one sitting). My take has always been a bit skewed… Often, too much is too much – too many facts can obscure the truth, too much knowledge does not allow for easy decisions – over intellectualizing dampens the spirit… But that does harken back to a more traditional interpretation…Stuck on a point. Sometimes we can think a thing to death…and spin our tyres, getting nowhere… Now if it is a cup of chocoloate…

samantha	31 Dec 2002
Hello one and all ! I feel as though I am slowly , slowly edging towards an answer !! Its like one of those Russian dolls.... Trogon : You are quite possibly right about this ! I must stop the obsessive questioning ....I acquiese with bowed head. BUT! (glint in the eye....) I still have this gut feeling that there is something extra about this card. You know the way R.P (78 degrees..) talks of "gate" cards ?(Is there such a thing as an undiscovered gate card ??!! Like an undiscovered master ?!I'd like to think so !) well , I just get this tingling at the back of my scull that there is something else going on with this card. It may not be rocket science but .....hence the dolls. Rhiannon: Yes. I appreciate what you say about generalised questions giving generalised readings. That said , I am still confused about how to get the cards to focus on what you want them to look at , rather than on what they decide merits contemplation !! Perhaps this is impossible ?! I have done as was suggested and posted my complete reading. It is giving me food for thought , but there is still abig question mark in my mind. Do you think it is possible to ever interpret a spread 100% correctly ? (Here I mean make no mistakes , rather than get the entire picture , which HAS to be impossible ??!!) Umbrae: Hey !! A fellow chocoholic !! YES! absolutely .......I think what you said about "too much knowledge" not allowing for easy decisions may be getting near the mark !! If you are interested take a look at my reading posting . Thanks

Trogon	01 Jan 2003
Quote: Originally posted by samantha You know the way R.P (78 degrees..) talks of "gate" cards ?(Is there such a thing as an undiscovered gate card ??!! Like an undiscovered master ?!I'd like to think so !) well , I just get this tingling at the back of my scull that there is something else going on with this card. Hmm... well... maybe there's and then there's gate cards... Perhaps this particular card (the 4 of Cups) is going to be something like a personal gate card for you. It may be there is some important personal epiphany waiting for you when you figure it out. Maybe there is some other significance to it and the reason for it's repetative appearance in your self-readings. When you finally figure it out though... I'm sure there will be some personal importance in it for you. I hope you share it with us when it is finally cleared up.

samantha	01 Jan 2003
Yes! A personal gate card ! Thats probably it . The same way you feel drawn to some cards more than others: as though their are friends , and then merely aquaintances ! Which gives me an idea.........

Alex	01 Jan 2003
of the Mythic deck. It portrays Psyche's sisters instigating her to go find out what her husband, Eros, is *trully* about. The image itself suggests these moments of "paranoia" when we begin to wonder about something that so far seemed perfectly OK. Associating further, when we get past the first enchantement in a relationship and start seing the other person for what he/she really is. It is not a matter of wisdom but necessity. It invariably happens when we take on a new project, job, relationship. At some point it becomes work, marriage or *just name it*. It's about having to face our own illusions, the 4 of cups. OK, I've had it, I don't wanna take this one more (illusion). Now I'm gonna look at ya and see ya and decide if I still love ya. Oh well, life is great. Alex.

samantha	02 Jan 2003
Thanks. Another very interesting spin on this card. I can see very well where "paranoia " might fit in , that and the sense of something which has yet to manifest. This card has a feeling of emotional evolving to me , and would tie in exactly with your Psyche story. You mentioned the "Mythic" Tarot , is this a well known deck ?

The 4 of Cups : IS he wise to reject it ??!! thread was originally posted on 30 Dec 2002 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.