Musings on the four of cups.

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 28 Feb 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Eissej	28 Feb 2003
Hello all! I just did a little reading and had a bit of a revelation about the meaning of the four of cups. I couldn't find a similar thread anywhere, so I hope no one minds but I would like to share this thought, maybe get a little bit of feedback. I guess I should start by describing the card and the inspirtation for its image. I was sitting at dinner in the cafeteria one night (college cafeteria "food"... ick) off in my own little world, worrying about the image for this card. Up 'til this point, most of the images had come to me fairly easily. But for some reason, the more traditional images I'd found for "stagnintation and overindulgence" did not appeal to me at all. I understood what it meant and how it connected, just not what it would look like. Then I looked up and realized that there were three other people at the table with me and the four of us had exchanged maybe half a dozen words in the half hour I'd been there. However it was not a friendly silence, it was an awkward, brittle, stagnent silence. But if anyone had really wanted to leave their daydreams they could have easily started a conversation, getting things flowing again, un-stagninting the table. There was an "ah-HA!" moment and I dived for a sketchbook. So my four of cups shows four people with their backs to each other, arms clutched around empty cups, staring into the bottom as if they were trying to restablish the curly blue and green strands of water that twirl across the other cup cards. They apparently don't realize that all they have to do is look up and talk to the others to bring back the flow. Emotions do that, they thrive when you don't strangle them. So I had overindulgence in the empty, unfufilling world of their bare cups and the stagnentation and lack of creativity/interaction it causes in the same image. However, tonight it came up reversed in a little mind-clearing spread I did. I had more-or-less just asked them what advice they had for me. "Motion," I thought when I saw what it was. But not interaction with other people. The story that popped into my head started with the image of an actual stagnent pool, cut off from the flowing stream. Then someone looking at a something pretty reflected in it. It was probably her own face, you know how fairy-tale heros are, beautiful without ever having realized it. Well then she was stuck. She couldn't reach into the pool for the pretty thing, it is just a reflection, when she touches the water it makes ripples and ruins it. Same goes for draining the pool to get to the bottom. And you can't see your face in running water so letting the water into a stream would ruin it. And it was pretty enough that she wouldn't leave it, continue with the spirit quest she was on. What she needed to do was get up and leave. Perhaps drain the pool perhaps not. Just getting up and moving would work. It seems to me that this is stagnentation again, with the same feeling of overindulgence. Only, this time (quick switch back to talking about the image on the actual card) the answer is not "look up, see what is around you, interact and be happy" it's to throw down the cup and smash it. The person has the strength not to need others to make their life flow. The people are the overindulgence, or the thought that they are needed for creativity. Thoughts or comments anyone? Am I totally blind for not seeing this before? How do you see your four of cups? Does anyone else come up with funny little stories for their cards?

GreaterSecrets	01 Mar 2003
Quote: Thoughts or comments anyone? Am I totally blind for not seeing this before? How do you see your four of cups? Does anyone else come up with funny little stories for their cards? I always have "stories" for my cards and your story was wonderful, perfect! Bravo! Exactly the sort of thing you might see when you do meditate on a card particularly when you make the step through. No you are not blind for not seeing this previously. In fact I'd bet my last dollar it can happen again, with the same card, and you'll have an entirely new story. Circumstances, position, spread, set and setting can change everything. It might even be a subtle change, especially as you become more receptive to the cards. Your insight is the key. My interpretation of the four does not matter in this instance. I think the process you have unlocked is more important. And you wrote it down. __________________ Gilabno: Greater Secrets

Mimers	01 Mar 2003
Eissej, That was a great story! There are so many ways to see the same card and I think your way is great. The fact that you are making your own deck is a great way to get to know them better too. Thank you for sharing it with all of us. I see the 4 of cups as being so wrapped up in one thing that you fail to see other things in your life. Keep sharing with us! Mimers

Trogon	02 Mar 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Eissej However, tonight it came up reversed in a little mind-clearing spread I did. I had more-or-less just asked them what advice they had for me. "Motion," I thought when I saw what it was. But not interaction with other people. The story that popped into my head started with the image of an actual stagnent pool, cut off from the flowing stream. Then someone looking at a something pretty reflected in it. It was probably her own face, you know how fairy-tale heros are, beautiful without ever having realized it. Well then she was stuck. She couldn't reach into the pool for the pretty thing, it is just a reflection, when she touches the water it makes ripples and ruins it. Same goes for draining the pool to get to the bottom. And you can't see your face in running water so letting the water into a stream would ruin it. And it was pretty enough that she wouldn't leave it, continue with the spirit quest she was on. What she needed to do was get up and leave. Perhaps drain the pool perhaps not. Just getting up and moving would work. I found this very interesting as it is a theme which has also occured to me with this card as well as one or two others. It is very much like the story of Narcissus and (I believe) has occured in other mythologies. You can read a very good article on it at: http://www.mythology.com/echonarcissus.html. This story has several aspects which make me think of the 4 of Cups, including the idea of pining away at the reflective pool, as well as turning your back on one who is attracted to you because you want something you imagine to be better.

Karenwhe	03 Mar 2003
I never really understood the 4 of Cups. To me it means nothing but boredom or dislike of a situation. Thank you for sharing your story.

Alex	04 Mar 2003
jealousy is often attached to this card, unfortunately missing in the H-W clones, which seem to portray someone who's had too much whine and can't take the next round. Some people, like me, can never get really drunk. When I start getting high, my body can't take anymore. So may be it also speaks for boring people who can't really get a high, or for people whose bodies are weak for drug abuse. The good side os that these folks aren't in real danger of seriously abusing substances. Alex. Quote: Originally posted by Karenwhe I never really understood the 4 of Cups. To me it means nothing but boredom or dislike of a situation. Thank you for sharing your story.

bighairymonster	07 Mar 2003
Can the 4 cups also mean that things haven't been concluded yet? As in...a "wild card", where things have still to take shape?

Rusty Neon	13 Mar 2003
Quote: Originally posted by bighairymonster Can the 4 cups also mean that things haven't been concluded yet? As in...a "wild card", where things have still to take shape? Yes, certainly ! I've never thought about it before, but yes. I can see it in the RWS 4 of Cups. The person in the card is bored or satiated. Maybe he just hasn't had enough experiences and doesn't yet know what he wants or what's meaningful to him. He doesn't appear interested in taking the 4th cup. He thinks it'll be like the other three. Yet, he should take it ... and drink thereof. It's a wild card: Perhaps it'll be different and open new vistas, or NOT. In any event, it's worth the risk. C'est un beau risque, as they say in French.

Alex	14 Mar 2003
I thought this was the 8 of cups. I like the one below for the four of cups: ... "Somehow eternity almost seems possible as you embrace. And yet when you've got past the fear in that first exchange of glances the mooning at the window and that first walk together in the garden one time: lovers, are you the same? When you lift each other to your lips mouth to mouth drink to drink - oh how oddly the drinker seems to withdraw from the act of drinking." ... Rilke. Translated by... well, I forgott. Alex. Quote: Originally posted by Trogon This story has several aspects which make me think of the 4 of Cups, including the idea of pining away at the reflective pool, as well as turning your back on one who is attracted to you because you want something you imagine to be better.

The Musings on the four of cups. thread was originally posted on 28 Feb 2003 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.