*cringe* a question on reversals

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 08 Apr 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Dragons_Wing	08 Apr 2003
i know some of you are sick of these questions. after reading a run down you gave another newbie i was scared to ask my question, but i did a search and didn't find it anywhere else. i could has skipped over it if its there but i doubt it. anyway for my question :) i've use reversals. but if i get a deck where reversals arn't spose to be read, how do i take into account the other meanings that card could have? wont the meanings on each card be to broad and make the reading not nearly as accurate?

azuremariposa	08 Apr 2003
Welcome, Dragons_Wing... almost all of the people here are very friendly, so don't be shy w/your questions...yes, some people get tired of repeating themselves, but then, they really shouldn't be responding if they're tired of it, no? ;) just my opinion... Quote: Originally posted by Dragons_Wing i've use reversals. but if i get a deck where reversals arn't spose to be read, how do i take into account the other meanings that card could have? wont the meanings on each card be to broad and make the reading not nearly as accurate? ok, you will have to pardon my ignorance, but what do you mean by "where reversals aren't supposed to be read" ??? do you mean according to the creator of the deck? if it is a Tarot deck, i believe you can read reversals or not depending on your knowledge of the cards... that said, i believe that it is not necessary to use reversals, but you will find much diversity of thought on this point here...so, remember, that's just my thought... as far as the meanings being broad, i think an examination of what the cards mean to you would be helpful... and as far as the reading being not accurate, from my own experience i can say that using or not using reversals has never affected the outcome of a reading for me... out of curiosity which deck are you referring to? and again, take what i've mentioned w/a grain of salt, since i really have no experience w/a deck that specifies no reversals... many blessings to you, Dragons_Wing!

Umbrae	08 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Dragons_Wing … after reading a run down you gave another newbie i was scared to ask my question… Most ‘run downs’ are meant in a good spirit. After all, we all began somewhere – we were all newbies – and if you don’t ask… If reversals are not used, then you may ignore them. Or you may read it as a ‘weaker’ quality of the card. Some folks get carried away with the old reversal non-reversal argument. The more you read, the more you may find that a reversed card in itself means nothing – but where it appears in the spread, and its relationship to surrounding cards means everything. Now for me (and this is just for me mind you – and definitely not a ‘run down’…but then again…) if I’m looking at a three-card spread (there’s a hint there), and one card comes up reversed…the other two cards (and the spaces between them) will dictate how that card is read. …and if you listen – really carefully – you may find that the card tells you something that no book will ever discuss…because it’s your deck, and your reading…

Red Emma	08 Apr 2003
I'm glad you asked that question, I've been wondering about it myself. AS I learned early in my tarot attempts to work with reversals, I usually feel that I've lost a good half of the meaning of my spread if I don't use them. For instance, at the moment my life is in some turmoil. When it began the tower appeared in a couple of readings, then about half-way through the stress of the situation, the tower was reversed. I read this as saying the major change was over, but I now had to pick up the pieces. Which is pretty much what's happening. I have two decks, Shape Shifter and, Celtic Circle I think, which don't use reversals. As not using reversals leaves me feeling incomplete, I generally do it anyhow. However, as much as I love the Shape Shifter deck, I've not had much luck with it. Have pretty much left it alone for a very long time. It just might be the deck doesn't like my attitude. (I know, Mojo. Decks don't have attitudes. But this one does.) Happy Trails

Alissa	08 Apr 2003
I've gone back and forth with reversals for years now. At first, I never used them. I didn't understand them, so for clarity's sake I laid and read everything upright. Then, I read somewhere in Gail Fairfield's book "Choice Centered Tarot" about approaching reversals differently. The card, when upright, applies to one's exterior world (that of the every day, jobs, relationships, family, their external world). When reversed, it applies to their internal world (that of the thoughts, feelings, emotions and spirituality). This worked for me for a long while and eventually I started incorporating reversals into my spread, altogether and in a more "conventional" way. But, even that too is new to me and doesn't always feel right. And, to confuse matters, I also have a Shapeshifter deck which claims it "doesn't use reversals." At first, I felt that it didn't either. Then, I started to use them ... it just happened that way. When reading reversals with that deck now, it can mean a whole ton of things : * it's not intended to be read reversed, or * applied to the internal realm, or *conventional reversed meanings, or, *diminished effects of the Card's message. Needless to say, reversals on that deck can throw me for a loop since I really REALLY have to investigate precisely what it's trying to say. (But, since ideally we do that all the time anyways, perhaps that's nothing new ;) ). So, finding out how reversals work for yourself in your own readings, as Umbrae stresses above, can be very tricky and worthy of questions, in my opinion. Hope this helps, if only by showing you how confused I still am myself about the matter at times!!!

Dragons_Wing	08 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Amaya Hi! The Celtic Dragon was my first deck.. a little hard to work with for my first but I guard it with my life now :). I don't really use it as often as some of my others, more less for 'special' times :). After learning more about tarot I found the deck rather easy to work with. I've heard people comment on the fact that they wished more dragons were portrayed instead of humans. Of course those same people never owned the deck and never used it. (at least thost that I talked to) I have never found this aspect of the cards to be a bother to me. Conway didn't make the deck to be used with reversals. I'm sure they can be, I don't use reversals hardly so I never found this a problem. I'm sure that you will enjoy them when you receive them as much as some of us have. :) Blessings, Amaya she wrote this in responce to me asking about the deck because i really want to get it.

Dragons_Wing	09 Apr 2003
i've read through all the posts and i find them v. insightful about whether or not to use reversals, how you interperet reversals, and other such things :). however i was wondering how to not use reversals and have it not just be the wide ranges of meanings behind it. original question: but if i get a deck where reversals arn't spose to be read, how do i take into account the other meanings that card could have? the deck i have in question is the celtic dragon i've read posts that i can use reversals w/ every deck whether or not they are "ment" to or not. maybe i'm trying to jump to far in my studies for being new but i would like to learn to do readings with out reversals also if the deck is "ment" to not have reversals.

azuremariposa	09 Apr 2003
Quote: originally posted by Dragons_Wing maybe i'm trying to jump to far in my studies for being new but i would like to learn to do readings with out reversals also if the deck is "ment" to not have reversals. i don't think you are trying to jump too far ahead...you just need practice w/your deck... if the deck is not meant to be read w/reversals and you don't want to read it with reversals, b/c this is what the deck's author specifies, than don't read it w/reversals... simply take into account the position the card is in and whether it should be favourable or not... for instance...i did a reading today where the Sun was the obstacle to this man's path...the Sun is generally a really positive card right? how could that be an obstacle...so, my interpretation was that this man feared his life being too good...that whenever things became really good, he would automatically start anticipating it all going to sh*t (and yes, i used that word in my reading! lol)...now, that is a very big obstacle to have...b/c that kind of thinking will cause a person to walk out the door thinking "i better get out before she dumps me", even though there are NO major problems in the relationship... my spreads are almost always "reversal-free"...even though the deck i uses says reversals are ok...there are many meanings to the cards, which is why i initially advised you to become more comfortable with what the cards mean to you...b/c that is one way you will be able to read w/o reversals...they are not always necessary for an accurate reading... let me know if this helped you or not and if i addressed your question or if you have more questions...i'm sure i'm not the only one willing to help! ;) many blessings to all!

Dragons_Wing	09 Apr 2003
it both helped and answered my question. :D thanks a bunch.

Umbrae	09 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Dragons_Wing Maybe I'm trying to jump to far in my studies for being new but I would like to learn to do readings with out reversals also if the deck is "meant" to not have reversals. Let me see…78 x 2 = 156. Hmmm. In my opinion, you need to learn to read the cards…78 of them. Not little memorized rote meanings…I’m discussing learning to read the cards. Reversals come later…once the foundation is built. Build on a poor foundation…house falls down…everytime. But then…that’s my opinion…

Butterfly	09 Apr 2003
I use reversals, with some decks, but others decks just don't feel right to be upside down. I like to read 'between the cards' (thanks Umbrae for that fabulous phrase). One card means very little to me, beyond a snappy weak lwb style definintion. Put two together and pure alchemy begins. That's just me though. In terms of your question, what I'm getting to is that I determine whether it should be read "reversed" by the cards around it. I play with it, read between the cards. look for a theme, a story. It will make more sense to me to read it one way or the other. It's not terrible scientific, but I guarentee it works for me.

Aerin	09 Apr 2003
Butterfly describes pretty much what I do. The meaning of the card is influenced by its position in the spread, its full spectrum of possible meanings, and the cards it appears with. I kind of get a click inside when I tumble to an appropriate interpretation. You've probably seen it mentioned somewhere already, but I can highly recommend Mary Greer's book on reversals: it gives several different ways of reading them and really added to my understanding of the cards as someone who reads without using reversals for the most part. Aerin

DesertHowler	02 Oct 2003
I began using tarot about 3 years ago with the OSHO ZEN deck. There are no reversals listed in the book that came with the deck but I found that I use them by using meanings that feel right to me. Each card has a different rule for me...but I use that rule consistently. In any form of divination-selfanalysis, and I use several including looking at patterns on rocks, the only thing I have found is to have some basic rules and don't change them in the middle of a divination. DH

MSPSYCHOMAGNET	02 Oct 2003
Reversals are a wonderful tool to use once you have familiarized yourself with tarot. But, before that you should probably concentrate on understanding the meanings of the cards upright themselves. I am not sure who said this, but 156 cards are a lot for a beginner. By understanding the cards, I mean not only referring to a book if that is what you like, but to really look at the pictures, and take the time to go back and see what the cards told you and how the events or situations actually played themselves out over time. Once this has been mastered, apply the same to reversed cards. However, you should note that just as cards read upright have no intepretations written in stone, nor do cards read reversed. Same goes for tarot decks and tarot deck authors. Think of it this way, you read a cookbook and try a recipe, but you always have the opportunity to add something different to the recipe or prepare it a bit differently and that doesn't make it right/wrong/better/worse and I doubt that the cookbook author will strike you dead for changing their recipe. I think Tarot reading is similar to this.

nexyjo	02 Oct 2003
i use the robin wood deck. while reversals are listed in the lwb, in the seminars she's given that i've attended, she specifically says she never meant that her deck be used with reversals, and she only wrote them for the lwb because llewellyn told her she had to. indeed, in her book on the deck (which was not published by llewellyn) she doesn't list reversals. that said, i normally don't use reversals. in fact, normally, i never get reversals. when i got the deck 5 years ago, all the cards were upright. i shuffle them and shuffle them, and none of the cards ever get reversed. ok, yeah, i'm a careful shuffler, but with "normal" use (or the way i normally use them), the cards never get reversed. on a rare occasion, i will get a reversed card. that might happen if i drop a card or two during shuffling, and inadvertently put it back in the deck upside down. i certainly take into account that the card is reversed, but i always seem to be able to intuit what that might mean, in the context of the particular spread or use. of course, when i put the card back, i make sure it's upright :)

Gaidheal	05 Oct 2003
Personally, I decide whether or not to use reversals (and which meaning to use) separately for each reading. It's not even so much a process of deciding, per se, but just a feeling I get. I know that's very vague, and I apologize, but that's just how it works for me. Sometimes reversals can mean delays, or something to a lesser degree, or sometimes the complete opposite of what the upright meaning is. It just depends on the reading. If you do not wish to use reversed meanings, I would say just consistantly read the cards upright. You have to do that all the time, though. There are always cards which, upright, mean the same or at least mostly the same as another card reversed. If you know ahead of time how you're going to read the cards, the right cards will come up. However, what I would suggest is to decide on a particular card's meaning based on the cards surrounding it, regardless of whether it's reversed or upright. If the negative (or reversed) meaning fits with the reading better, use it. Anyway, just my take on things.

The *cringe* a question on reversals thread was originally posted on 08 Apr 2003 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.