King of Cups...

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 18 Apr 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.

XLCR	18 Apr 2003
In a number of readings I have either done for myself or gotten form others the King of cups shows up in regards to future relationships or furture husband...it's strange I actually have an emotional reaction just looking at the card...I really don't know alot aobut the king of cups except that he is emotional...anyone care to give their take on the King of Cups?

celeste	18 Apr 2003
He is supposed to be a loving husband and family man.

Mimers	18 Apr 2003
The King of Cups always makes me think of my Father. When I think of this King's personality, I think of a kind loving family man. Rather sensitive. Would rather play with the children than sip cocktails with the adults. This king loves the water, and if it weren't for his responsabilities to his family, that is where he would spend most of his time. His tendancy is to shuck responsabilities, and often times has to force himself to do things like sit down and pay the bills. He does it because he knows he has to. I see the king of cups being in the healing professions. Nurse, therapist, school teacher, and any type of profession that helps others. My father was a fourth grade school teacher. He spends every second he can canoeing on the river or the lakes in our area. My mother usually has to force him to complete tasks around the house. He does them, but grudgingly. He is creative too. Will take 'garbage', driftwood, and whatever else he finds along the river and build 'sculptures' along the shores. If you go up the Hudson River you will see trees with empty plastic containers hanging from the branches and smily faces drawn on them. You will see a 'teepee' that he built with his grandchildren out of driftwood. Many more too. This is how I picture a King of Cups man. Mimers

Marion	18 Apr 2003
In addition to the comments above, the King of Cups is a thoughtful man who sees into hearts and minds. He is a good counsellor, a doctor who really 'sees' his patients. This is a person you can trust with your deepest secrets.

NeXoRiouS	18 Apr 2003
Is it possible to say that he is romantic man who is masculine and almost the perfect man for a wonderful romance?

XLCR	18 Apr 2003
Hmmmm...sounds like my kinda guy :D

Major Tom	18 Apr 2003
When the King of Cups isn't about a person, it can be about keeping your head above water. ;)

NeXoRiouS	18 Apr 2003
Well, the cups are about emotions. As the King of Emotions, shouldn't he be able to express his emotions especially love as though he was born to do so. He should be a full of charisma and charming of course. As a King, who is mostly likely to have a harem and nonetheless, a love saint who is able to handle all of them. It sounds as though I am refering to the Knight of Cups but a King is also a man. :)

XLCR	18 Apr 2003
Quote: " As a King, who is most likely to have a harem and nonetheless, a love saint who is able to handle all of them." That sounds like someone I know now...has more than one woman "a harem" and feels something for all of them but makes no real commitment to any...funny I kinda like the guy, just not the "harem" type of woman lol...Get the knight of cups for him so that fits...however can't see him (my friend) becoming the "family man" King of Cups...

Mimers	18 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Major Tom When the King of Cups isn't about a person, it can be about keeping your head above water. ;) Thank you for that Major Tom. I have to say that having an image of my Pa pop in my head every time I see this card limits my interpretations sometimes. This is something I will keep in mind. Mimers

jema	18 Apr 2003
he is fire of water and thus will have some problems to function. i see him as the ill-suited knight/king (depending on deck) he can be emotional-aggressive yet very unsure and a bit "flakey" as if he thought he had to choose between being a king (fire) or showing emotions (water) i see him as charming and flirty and someone that will sweep you off your feet and then never return your calls. it is like he wants so much! yet at his core he is passive and vain and a bit lazy. he will woo you and make your heart and your head spin but there is that fear there too - will you live up to his requirements? will you ever be as perfect as the dream he is chasing? (disclaimer - yet again these are my personal views and Your opinions are just as valid as mine) by the way - my biological father - King of Cups in a nutshell:) and that is both good and bad.

NeXoRiouS	18 Apr 2003
I agree with jema especially when the word "flirty" has been used.

biddy9	19 Apr 2003
I often interpret the King of Cups as a potential romantic partner - someone who is mature, strong, emotionally balanced and very charming. I like the interpretation of a father-figure as well - reminds me of my dad - balanced and emotive. Outside of actual people, King of Cups can suggest keeping on top of your emotions and feelings and keeping things under control. Also keeping a calm head and not letting things get to you. Biddy http://www.biddytarot.com

Kitty	19 Apr 2003
I smilied when I read this thread, let me share with you a description of a King of Cups (He is a Cancerian on the cusp of Leo)I know.... The King of Cups, fire and water, he is a hard mixture - he finds it hard to balance the two. He is romantic, flirty, family man with women on the side but loves them all in his own way. Women love his tenderside, able to charm all. Very intense loyalty to his family and children, nothing and no one will ever harm them while he is around, they are untouchable. He keeps them very separate from the rest of his life. Infact I have never met them, and I don't even know where they live, but he is one of my closest friends. He can be overly romantic and intense them disappear suddenly. He can be prone to depressive bouts, feels everything on a deep level. Sometimes can be found in his office of his club - saturday night, the place is packed wall to wall, music blaring, people drinking - but he is sitting at his desk in the quiet of his office with a scotch, listening to soft music and looking at pictures of his last holiday in europe... Saves homeless kitten, nurses it back to health and gives it to his boys as a gift to teach them the responsiblity. He takes his boys shopping and buys them a remote control helicopter that has to assembled first - patiently works with them to build the helicopter. The King of Cups can be a very beautiful man - but he is often in the midst of emotional turmoil - and can be very good at hiding his true feelings or intentions. I know my description is a personal one but I hope you get the picture :)

celeste	22 Apr 2003
I know a King of Cups type who is charming as all get out. He is funny and serious at the same time.He's a devoted father and gifted healer. He is a divorced man who still has an emotional attachment to his ex,but flirts with and uses other women for sex.He is a walking dichotomy. I fell in love with this person,but was able to detach when I found out the truth and was able to walk away(with difficulty). The King of Cups is not all he appears to be.

biddy9	22 Apr 2003
Celeste, perhaps this man is the resemblance of the reversed King of Cups??

Alex	22 Apr 2003
someone who values relationships very much be who can't achieve true intimacy. The King of Cups is a good catalyst to relationships and emotional expression in other people but he is insecure in the real of emotions and ultimately unable to trust. Alex.

XLCR	22 Apr 2003
sounds pretty much like the guy I know now...flirtatious ladies man who uses women for sex but tries not to hurt feelings at the same time...doesn't sound like marriage material...perhaps friendship is a better option

celeste	22 Apr 2003
Biddy; When other people read for me he always showed up as an upright King of Cups(it took me along time to get him out of my system),but when I read for him the reversed magician showed up so that made alot of sense (to me). Incidentally his birthday is June 22, a Cancer on the cusp of Gemini.

Hedera	23 Apr 2003
Especially in the light of this thread: http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13369 I think this is and interesting discussion, because everybody mentions a *man* as an example of the King of Cups. Most sources I've read agree that court cards can apply to women as well as men, independant of the gender of the person in the picture. I never have any trouble applying a king or knight or prince or whatever to myself when it seems appropriate, but I do get stuck in looking amongst my male aquaintances when the card applies to someone else. Is there anyone who can think of a *woman* who personifies the King of Cups? Who has all the qualities one would think of with this card?

jema	23 Apr 2003
well, writing "him" about the king was really not because i thought the king was a card for only male querents. i see all courts as aspects of a personality and of course both men and women can be reflected in them. i guess i just assumed everyone else thought so too, it never even occured to me that someone might see the king of cups as a card only describing a man. that would be as strange as saying that the empress is a card only applicable for women.

Hedera	23 Apr 2003
:) Hi Jema, I wasn;t referring to your post, specifically, more to all the ones that talked about fathers, male friends and/or (ex)boyfriends. Quote: that would be as strange as saying that the empress is a card only applicable for women. I agree completely! Still, I do find myself more often comparing the court cards to people of the same gender. Which is weird, because I tend to believe that most (perhaps even all) of the so-called 'gender characteristics' are more a matter of nurture (not nature), culture, and perception. For example, I think that men have the same capacity as women to be nurturing caretakers, or women to be powerhungry dictators. The reason you don't see a lot (although I know some) of those, is that most of us are trained differently from birth. Ok, this is drifting off-topic, so I'll get off my soap-box now :D I was just curious if people had any examples from real life of women they know that embody the King of Cups.

XLCR	23 Apr 2003
In my limited experiance it seems my tarot shows cards that are easy (somewhat) for me to understand. So if the deck wants to let me know that another female is involved in a certain situation then I will get a "female" card...just wondering why the King of cups energy in female form can't be the Queen of Cups? Why confuse things by presenting a high energy take charge women as the King of Wands...when there is a Queen of Wands?

jema	23 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by XLCR In my limited experiance it seems my tarot shows cards that are easy (somewhat) for me to understand. So if the deck wants to let me know that another female is involved in a certain situation then I will get a "female" card...just wondering why the King of cups energy in female form can't be the Queen of Cups? Why confuse things by presenting a high energy take charge women as the King of Wands...when there is a Queen of Wands? good question, however i think i might have misunderstood the whole thing:) i hardly ever see the court-cards as other people in a reading. i almost always see them as aspects of a personality of the querent and if the querent is a woman the king of cups can still refer to her and it doesn't have to mean a man will come into the picture. it can, of course. but then i think my reading "style" may be a bit different then many others.

Hedera	23 Apr 2003
Ok, I feel as if I have to respond to every post by Jema, firemaiden, azuremariposa and aerin now, just to prove that *they* are not the infamous Thread Killers....;) I do tend to look at court cards (any card, for that matter) as aspects of my own (or the person i'm reading for) personality, but sometimes, depending on the spread / position of the card, any card might relate to another person, as well. It's just that, in trying to remember the meaning of a card, especially the cards I have trouble with (court cards, amongst others), it can help to try and think of a situation / person that sums up my idea of the card. It bothers me that I have a tendency to be 'gendered' when I do that. I might just make more of a conscious effort to change that.

XLCR	23 Apr 2003
THIRTEEN...HELP US!!! LOL

NeXoRiouS	24 Apr 2003
I have found a clause in Thirteen's website. http://www.aeclectic.net/basics/highpriestess.html At the section Thirteen's Observation, look at the first line. "If there is a card that symbolizes the tarot reader is it the High Priestess. A woman (or man!) of psychic powers, intuition and secret knowledge." This goes to show there are no discrimination of sex here. As long as they possess the same skills, talents or ideas they fit in to the situation. As I've said King of Cups is a master of flirt, my friend is one of them, being able to captivate their "preys" heart and make them obey like a dog. When she is back home, she will take care of almost everything that a home needs. That goes to show not only males have these capabilities and talent. This applies to all the cards. I derive my opinions upon looking at the clause above, hence if anyone finds anything out of point or not true, please give me some advice. Thank you. These are mere opinions.

Alex	24 Apr 2003
I don't think that reccognizing gender differences is a discrimination. There is something like "male" energy and something like "female" energy. Even though any card can apply to any aspect of one's life or personality here and now, expanding the cards meanings too much in order to fit any meanging is a disservice the reader does to herself. As it is a disservice society does to itself by giving men and women the same set of expectations. Because men and women have different anatomies, physiologies, brain chemestry, anatomy and physiology. The tarot comes from a tradition where "man" is "man" and "woman" is "woman". Wasn't for that, there would be no "king of cups" and "Queen of Cups" but just a "person of cups", no Emperor and Emperess, but "go about business person" and "stay home parent" person and so on. Should we make a Tarot deck specially for our presumptiously genderless society? Alex. Quote: Originally posted by NeXoRiouS "If there is a card that symbolizes the tarot reader is it the High Priestess. A woman (or man!) of psychic powers, intuition and secret knowledge."

Major Tom	24 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Alex I don't think that reccognizing gender differences is a discrimination. The tarot comes from a tradition where "man" is "man" and "woman" is "woman". Long live the difference! ;) And yes, women can exhibit masculine traits and men can exhibit feminine traits but do we really need to belabour the point? Most of the time, when a King shows up in one of my readings as a person, it's a man. The same with a Queen usually being a woman. This is not to say there aren't exceptions! It's just to say you have to apply some common sense, which I'm beginning to realise isn't all that common. :laugh: Personally, I like to think everyone is different. But then I also think everyone is God. })

allibee	24 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by Kitty I smilied when I read this thread, let me share with you a description of a King of Cups (He is a Cancerian on the cusp of Leo)I know.... The King of Cups, fire and water, he is a hard mixture - he finds it hard to balance the two. He is romantic, flirty, family man with women on the side but loves them all in his own way. Women love his tenderside, able to charm all. Very intense loyalty to his family and children, nothing and no one will ever harm them while he is around, they are untouchable. He keeps them very separate from the rest of his life. Infact I have never met them, and I don't even know where they live, but he is one of my closest friends. He can be overly romantic and intense them disappear suddenly. He can be prone to depressive bouts, feels everything on a deep level. Sometimes can be found in his office of his club - saturday night, the place is packed wall to wall, music blaring, people drinking - but he is sitting at his desk in the quiet of his office with a scotch, listening to soft music and looking at pictures of his last holiday in europe... Saves homeless kitten, nurses it back to health and gives it to his boys as a gift to teach them the responsiblity. He takes his boys shopping and buys them a remote control helicopter that has to assembled first - patiently works with them to build the helicopter. The King of Cups can be a very beautiful man - but he is often in the midst of emotional turmoil - and can be very good at hiding his true feelings or intentions. I know my description is a personal one but I hope you get the picture :) You saved me a lot of typing Kitty as I had EXACTLY one of those too, LOL, always ascribed him as King Cups, even though he was an Aries. This is where it is useful to bear in mind that our sun sign only makes up a part of who we are ... our moon sign and our ascendant signs are just as powerful in our shape and outlook. If someone is looking for marriagable material, I would just tread carefully if I saw the King Cups and the Fool together, as he/she may be rather more fickle than our hearts desire. Allison

firemaiden	24 Apr 2003
Dare I say it? The great Firemaiden say: don't confuse tarot cards with people you know. They are just cards. I hear you all going into detail like you can determine the character of this man down to the mole on his left cheek. Yes, in a specific reading, if these images come to you, the card has been a conduit for your intuition, and perhaps you have had the psychic vision of a man with a mole on his left cheek. But to say the King of Cups is a flirt, or a this or a that getting so specific as if you have known the guy for 30 years, gives me to suspect it is not the card you are talking about, but who the card makes you think of in real life. Careful, because the card is more flexible than that, it is just an empty vessel, a conduit for your imagination; outside of specific readings, it needs to remain rather neutral and simple to retain its evocative power. The next time you read this card, there might not be a mole on his left cheek. He might not be a flirt. He might just be a scuba diver, a surfer-dude, a person who owns a yacht, or a reknowned oceanographer... He might be a the incarnation of romance, or the romantic within you. He might be a guy who belongs to the Society for Creative Anachronism and jousts for a living at Renaissance Fairs, he might just be a guy with a water sign, or... if your deck doesn't ascribe to the Kings=Fire, Cups=Water associations, you can forget going scuba diving with him.

Alex	24 Apr 2003
I have thought about that but coming from a slightly different perspective. In my oppinion, sometimes people readily associate a court card to a particular person based on one simple trait_ let's say, "being a flirt"_ and then derive all other characteristics for that person from a general description of the King of Cups. I still recall someone who pulled the Knight of Swords for me in a spread, and redily associated it with my boyfriend. My question was regarding my relationship with him at the time. So I received this complete "profile" of my boyfriend that didn't really match other than in one detail or two. Now I look back and I see what that card was refering too, but the approach sometimes can get us to a very wrong understanding of things. I'm not saying that doing it is always wrong, but it may be safer to come from a more general idea, or "energy" conveyed by these cards. Alex. Quote: Originally posted by firemaiden But to say the King of Cups is a flirt, or a this or a that getting so specific as if you have known the guy for 30 years, gives me to suspect it is not the card you are talking about, but who the card makes you think of in real life.

Mimers	24 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by firemaiden Dare I say it? The great Firemaiden say: don't confuse tarot cards with people you know. Oh Great Firemaiden, I know you are right, but I can't help it. Every time the card comes up (isn't often) I think of my Father. Boom There he is. I try not to, because I know I am limiting my reading, but I can't help it. Please forgive me,your humble follower. Mimers :)

paradoxx	25 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by firemaiden Dare I say it? The great Firemaiden say: don't confuse tarot cards with people you know. They are just cards. I hear you all going into detail like you can determine the character of this man down to the mole on his left cheek. Yes, in a specific reading, if these images come to you, the card has been a conduit for your intuition, and perhaps you have had the psychic vision of a man with a mole on his left cheek. But to say the King of Cups is a flirt, or a this or a that getting so specific as if you have known the guy for 30 years, gives me to suspect it is not the card you are talking about, but who the card makes you think of in real life. Careful, because the card is more flexible than that, it is just an empty vessel, a conduit for your imagination; outside of specific readings, it needs to remain rather neutral and simple to retain its evocative power. The next time you read this card, there might not be a mole on his left cheek. He might not be a flirt. He might just be a scuba diver, a surfer-dude, a person who owns a yacht, or a reknowned oceanographer... He might be a the incarnation of romance, or the romantic within you. He might be a guy who belongs to the Society for Creative Anachronism and jousts for a living at Renaissance Fairs, he might just be a guy with a water sign, or... if your deck doesn't ascribe to the Kings=Fire, Cups=Water associations, you can forget going scuba diving with him. While I don't disagree with what you are saying, exceptions do apply. The Cosmic Tarot figures are based on real people who share inclinations and physical appearences with people you and I may know in our private lives. I look like several of the figures in this paticualar deck and has given me a chance to expand the interpreatations to a new level. see http://tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13155 blessed be

NeXoRiouS	25 Apr 2003
I beg to differ. Life is ever-changing. We are changing everyday. Daily experiences changes how we are. For example, today you get grossy and highly irratable and tommorow you become gentle and demure. I doubt you can predict your attitudes to daily life as the same as you did for today. Today I could have black long hair and tommorow with a snip of the fingers, I could have gold short hair. Anything is possible. Need not even to be a daily change. Even a few hours or even seconds, your moods can change all of a sudden. For example, during office hours, I paid full concentration in my work. The moment the clock ticks, I get wild and pop up in front of the dance stage. Furthermore, not even talking about character, we are influenced by our surroundings every day. Especially when we have interactions with the society. Even television and movies could make a change in our lives. Moreover, I've seen people oftenly relating the King of Cups with their dad's or whatsoever, Are you sure they don't have any secrets hiding from you? A dad has to be a role model afterall. What if in the day, your loving father, thoughtful and caring, absolutely the greatest man on earth. Once nightfalls, he gets wild with your mum and even played with sex toys or even bondage and wax? I am a living experiment. When I'm out with my friends, I don't tell them much. Not even whom I'm dating with has been known by them. Guess life's like that. Take the Moon as an example, highly creative but there is a tendency to get cranky and even wild. Nevertheless, court cards are well used when a particular person has these traits in him/her which is highly related to the crucial point of the question or situation. Any similar cases are merely coincidence and fictional. You can assume how a person is like, but you can never deduce that he will never change.

allibee	25 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by firemaiden ....... But to say the King of Cups is a flirt, or a this or a that getting so specific as if you have known the guy for 30 years, gives me to suspect it is not the card you are talking about, but who the card makes you think of in real life. IMHO tarot works like a mirror in that it brings to the surface what we need to know, but have hidden or lost in our subconscious for whatever reason, using the trigger of Archetypes. You know those - the strong, silent type, the opportunist, the control freak, the carer, the tree huggin' hippy, the King Midas type, et al. (www.tarotpeople.com/main.htm ... my site, nearly finished :O)) You can do it your way, I can do it mine, and yet someone else can do it their way because the cards in themselves are not important, it's whatever way works for you as the 'narrator', reader or navigator ... call it what you will... to arrive at an informed response. Personally I ascribe to archetypal triggers as a base to jump from within a reading, not a definitive ending, (although I don't use significators) perhaps this was not clear, but it works for me, because when you are looking for a needle in a haystack, it helps to have a metal detector. Allison

XLCR	25 Apr 2003
I think we all have opinions or storys to tell about what particular cards have ment to us (personally or in readings for others). But I think we would all agree that there are certain "qualities" or "energies" associated with each card. Otherwise tarot cards would all be similar blank slates and we'd just put there what we choose. There are 70 some cards in a deck so when I pull a particular card "spirit" is trying to tell me something...sometimes it is clear as day, othertimes it isn't. So when I pull the King of Cups there is a REASON why that card is placed in that particular position instead of say the King of Wands. Most times I can tell whether the card represents a person or an "energy" associated with the situation. I guess what I'm trying to say is I don't see anything wrong with the King of Cups representing a particular personality type...of course different individuals will display different aspects of the King of Cups which only the querant and reader can discern. In my case I looked at the King and saw a strong, silent, sensitive type, older gentleman and was wondering what others have seen in the King of Cups. My book actually said something to the effect of "emotional undercurrents" which I felt didn't fit this particular reading...I "felt" the King represented a person. Quote NeXoRiouS: "We are changing everyday. Daily experiences changes how we are. For example, today you get grossy and highly irratable and tommorow you become gentle and demure. " I may be in a bad mood go in to work and chew everyone out like the Queen of Wands reversed - but my momentary mood does not change my queen of disc nature - I believe in my reading for the day I would still be represented as the queen of discs- but with the queen of wands (energy) showing up in an appropriate position.

Alex	25 Apr 2003
Allibee What is the load time due to in your site? I've tried to access it many times but it keeps loanding... then it crashes my IE. Alex. Quote: Originally posted by allibee ( www.tarotpeople.com/main.htm ... my site, nearly finished :O))

NeXoRiouS	25 Apr 2003
I have no problems entering it. It's an online reading url. No interest. hehe

allibee	26 Apr 2003
Quote: Originally posted by NeXoRiouS I have no problems entering it. It's an online reading url. No interest. hehe hehehe ... MY online reading site, though actually it is an email reading site:O) (Alex, I have a dial up connection and the whole site is under 500kb, should load quick, however if you go to the home page, you then enter the flash zone :O) which is under 10 seconds on 28.8k pm) allison

Moongold	06 Jul 2003
The Emperor is THE BIGGIE and when he shows up in my readings I always feel a bit uneasy because there is something I have to learn. I see the Emperor has being really archetypal in an out there kind of way. The image still seems hopelessly authoritarian and patriarchal to me. I laways feel a bit sick when I see this card But KING CUPS is another matter. King Cups can represent that part of a male who is comfortable with the feminine side of life both within himself and within the female members of his family and his social and professional networks. A man who is not comfortable with the feminine archetype can subtlely and no so subtlely denigrate the instinctual and emotional psyches of women and men in his family which can cause long term relationship and orientation problems for those people. King Cups doesn't have to be a poet or an intellectual, or someone who always brings roses on a date. He can be present in both but he can be the ordinary guy in the street, the garbage collector, the teacher, the municipal clerk. He is just a guy who has a real, instinctive understanding and joy about femininity in himself and in others. PS Why does not Aeclectic have a spell check??? :D

The King of Cups... thread was originally posted on 18 Apr 2003 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.