Something strange in IJJ Swiss deck-- am I seeing things?

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 02 Aug 2003, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Myrrha	02 Aug 2003
Someone at work brought in her deck that she has had for ever and didn't know the name of, it was the IJJ Swiss. I used to have this deck but got rid of it because I thought I didn't like it. Anyway I was looking closely at the Death card, and there is a tiny face inside the hip bones, down at the base of the spine where the root chakra would be! It is an impish face with horns. Does anyone else see this? To me it says a lot about the connections between sex and death, peoples perception that reproduction confers a kind of immortality, and the everlastingness of the life force. Myrrha

Le_Corsair	02 Aug 2003
I never notice that before, but checked my 1JJ after you mentioned it, and there it is! (It looks like a boxer to me, but I wasn't using a magnifier.) The connection between sex and death, indeed! Especially in those pre-antibiotic times, when to contract syphilis was tantamount to a death sentence. And since that was the Victorian era, the connection between sex and damnation probably played a role in how the card was drawn, as well. Now I have to check the rest of the cards for hidden pictures! Bob :THERM

lawguy51	02 Aug 2003
I just inspected it with a loop (photographer's magnifying glass) and honestly, I'm not convinced. It's sort of like looking at a cloud and seeing a horse. I do see what you're seeing but I'm thinking it's not intentional imho. But what the heck, if you see it and can use it, go for it. Lawguy51 edit: Look at the left knee joint. Kind of looks like an angry beaver!! :D

Astraea	02 Aug 2003
While it can be interpreted as a face (which is probably the most important issue, anyway), it seems to me that what is depicted is simply the sacrum, a bone connected on two sides with the pelvis, and featuring several bilateral openings. From the standpoint of interpretation and esoteric anatomy, though, the suggestion of a face in the sacrum could be significant.

Ruby Red Slippers	03 Aug 2003
I don't have this deck, but a couple of things came to mind about the "base of the spine"...... 1. Are you aware that the Herpes virus lies dormat in the spine forever? Since Herpes is a sexually transmitted dis-ease, I found this interesting. 2. Sex representing "confirmation of life" - often people engage in sex following a loss, death, catastrophic events, etc. Having a sexually transmitted dis-ease can effect your participation in this activity. [perhaps it can effect your ability to change the past.] 3. The base of the spine - Base Chakra - Root chakra - the place of fundamental change. Death representing transformation - body, mind spirit, a change necessary to embrace the temperance card which follows. Musings by.... Ruby Red Slippers

Trogon	04 Aug 2003
Can someone scan and post this card, or perhaps post a link to a web site showing the card? Puhleeeze?

Myrrha	04 Aug 2003
Hmmm, well it made sense to me, and the astrological sign for the Death card is Scorpio, which rules the loins, and if we didn't have death we wouldn't need sexual reproduction, and then there is the "little death". Maybe it is just my imagination but I do feel it adds something to the card that speaks of immortality and the life force in a card that has little else of that symbolism, except for maybe the pyramid. Trogon, I don't own this deck or I would try to post it for you. The face might be too small to show up in a scan unless it was a scan of just that area on the card. Myrrha

RainbowFire	04 Aug 2003
well.... without sex (or reproduction) the human race would die. and remember, the death card means change ;)... I doubt that helps

Astraea	05 Aug 2003
In the Hudes deck, the pelvis and sacrum are represented by a butterfly -- another lovely depiction of the theme discussed in this thread.

samreid26	15 Aug 2003
Wow!! Amazing eye site! I've never seen that deck before, so I can't really be of any help. But, that sounds really interesting. So, I immediately had to check my own Death card. There was no face or anything of that sort on the skeleton. But, there is a question. Lying on the ground in front of the skeleton there is an arm, and two hands. I don't understand what that means, or why it's there. Any help? By the way, there is no real name of this deck, but it's illustrated by Jacqui Mair (or something like that). Thanks!! :OL

The Something strange in IJJ Swiss deck-- am I seeing things? thread was originally posted on 02 Aug 2003 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.