It isn't what it is....it is...what it isn't.

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 24 Aug 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.

pandora	24 Aug 2004
An “AHHHHH” newbie moment. It may seem obvious to most, but it was such a sit up, eye opening, of course why didn’t I see that before moment for me, I just had to share. Perhaps it may help others if you are like me...stuggling! Studying this summer found me at a site that dealt with Elemental Dignities. I found it amazingly informative but after a few lessons it went well over my head. Walking away with the theories of elemental importance in my head I came here and started the suggestions of journaling, studying each cards art work, and meditating. The first 5 Majors were my project and as I meditated on the High Priestess it came to me. It isn’t what it is........it is.........what it isn’t. When I realize all that a card wasn’t....I knew what it must truely be. Bare with me here please, I hope I am making sense. She has nothing to do with active Air and “specific ideas that are manifested in the Earth Element.” Nothing to do with solid, passive Earths “concrete manifestation of events that started in the Fire element.” And nothing of active Fire “the initiator of actions, the beginning of the matter.” The High Priestess is all Water, a passive element, “the powers of the unconscious mind. Attunements with life.” So I’ve put each Major to the test and now I am seeing their meanings for the first time as they stand alone without any modifiers. Try The Lovers, Air..........and I always thought of every thing but Air... (to help if anyone is interested my new easy to remeber yardstick from supertarot.com) Air Specific ideas that are manifested in the Earth Element. Theory, logic, abstract thoughts, expression of art, studies, writing, publishing, travel, sickness, death, problems, dissension, arguments. Water Powers of the unconscious mind. Attunements with life. The water may be calm on the surface, but below there may be undercurrents. The emotions in relationships, love, healing, protection. Spiritual groups, psychic phenomena. Earth The concrete manifestation of events that started in the Fire element. Earth is passive and persistent, so it represents matters concerning building structures, the land, agriculture, the physical body, material matters. Also reproduction, stability, recreation, possessions, wealth, poverty and greed. Fire Fire is the initiator of actions, the beginning of the matter. Fire gives heat and energy - anything that requires action, sports, war, arguments, sex, self-motivation, enthusiasm, inspiration. Fire shows power struggles, strength, expression of freedom, meeting challenges. Fire is related to Atziluth, a high spiritual level. Pandora

Imagemaker	24 Aug 2004
This is wonderful, Pandora! I tend to go to elemental dignities when other meanings aren't coming through, so this adds another helpful angle to interpretations. Thanks!

Anna	24 Aug 2004
Wow! Thanks so much Pandora, that was wonderful. I think I have finally clicked about elemental dignities :D

Eco74	24 Aug 2004
I thank you for that reminder Pandora. Still learning myself I sometimes think I spend far too much time trying to remind myself of "what that IS" and forgetting to rule things out. In order to clarify things you need to weed out the "spawn" first and what better way than acknowledge it and say "well, that it was not so now that's out of the way, now let's see what's left".

pandora	25 Aug 2004
I am so glad I made sense to some! I came here because I thought I needed to know more about each card and realize now ..uggg...I will forever be on the cusp of understanding. Because the High Priestess has always been a favorite of mine and an easier card for me to “feel”, I think it just made sense when I “got it”. I have so far to go but I am finding this “what it is not” revelation(?) so helpful in getting a feel for each card in it’s basic sense. I read Thirteen’s Tarot basics but then when I go through my cards flash style method I keep going back to automatic visual triggers. (RW deck) I see a card like the Lovers.....automatic is .....typically male/female/phycical/love/marriage/family/stability/ect.......the action of fire, the fulfillment of earth, the emotions of water.......but now i think .....no....slow down...this is not about Earth, Fire, or Water, it is an Air Element....O.K.... all Air can be, your mind, trusting logic and instinct, abstract thoughts, a choice, and it can be a choice of many things, think the many faces it can be positve or negative, other than that automatic jump. Making sense? Mostly for me it is teaching me to unlearn in order to learn. Pandora

Fulgour	28 Aug 2004
Quote: Originally posted by pandora Try The Lovers, Air..........and I always thought of every thing but Air... Since most attributes are based on correspondences to the old Hebrew alphabet (older still is the original Phoenician), if you begin with A ('aleph) as 1 (one) I.The Magician, then VI.The Lovers signifies Taurus ~ with the watery Moon of II.The High Priestess in its fully manifest Exaltation!

pandora	28 Aug 2004
I’m sorry Fulgour, I know you are pointing me in a more knowledgeable direction but being a “newbie” that went way over my head. I realize there are so many roads on this journey and I will not doubt change many times on my way. I look for wisdom from many and when I find something that clarifies the confusion, to me a beginner, I grab on. I think you may be telling me the Lovers do not belong as an air element (guesses Earth?) but for most of the descriptions of this card (RWS are my cards) I have found they put Air as the element and it has helped me focus/remember what the meaning of this card is. Remind me of this a few years down the road and I may laugh. For now I only meant my post as a “ahhh” newbie moment and a place to move from for us fumblers. Is the High Priestess not a Water element either....ohhhh Fulgour.....how far is my road? Confusion reins .... thanks for all help. Pandora

Fulgour	29 Aug 2004
Dear Pandora, Newbie status is eternal in the realm of Tarot, and if anything, the more you learn about, the more there is to learn more about. Interpreting the cards is a matter of personal choice, and this is why we talk of 'using' the cards for three main reasons: Research-Study, Meditation, and Divination. "Elemental Dignities" work at all three levels, but begin with the basics, and that requires working out what is what, right from the start. Paul Hughes-Barlow and Elayne Doue of Super Tarot are my friends, we've corresponded frequently over the last few years, and I respect and honour their theories and beliefs. Elayne has been so helpful to me that we are even now discussing co-authoring a brief presentation contrasting my views (she calls them my Fulgour-isms) and her more widely accepted approach ~ the time honoured Golden Dawn 'method' of attributions. Writing an essay contrasting our differing views was my idea, because I feel such a debt of gratitude to Elayne, and really, nobody understands mine (for some odd reason), so I thought maybe they'd make more sense by at least being compared to the much more standard versions. And yet there is only one main difference. I do not use The Golden Dawn system, which was created by magicians as an astrological-numerological correspondence, based upon the Kabbalah, a form of Jewish mysticism. I simply begin with the first letter and the first card, and work from there. And yet when I wrote to you of "the watery Moon of The High Priestess" ~ you responded by asking, "is the High Priestess not a water element...?" Oh, Pandora. If you feel overwhelmed, imagine my complete isolation! Sincerely, Fulgour

Fulgour	29 Aug 2004
Judaism 101: Kabbalah and Jewish Mysticism Lest anyone misconstrue my reference to Kabbalah as a form of Jewish mysticism to be in some way disrespectful, please: http://www.jewfaq.org/kabbalah.htm Thank You, Fulgour

pandora	29 Aug 2004
Oh Fulgour, I am sorry, I thought you were telling me something like Father Christmas didn’t exist ..... I am so new, the information is coming from so many areas, information over load maybe, and I acknowledge I haven’t taken the time to sift through much to feel what is real to me. What I do know is ...... my “It isn’t what it is ... it is ...... what it is not” is working for me if only for getting a feel for each card. Perhaps your friends may shudder to think I got this from their web site but it works for me “the Newbie!” I know .... that the High Priestess, to me, will always be a Water Element .... some of the other Majors I have firmly placed (to me). But I do not really know how I feel about “The Lovers”, “The Chariot”, “Temperance”, or “Judgment”. I waffle on these but have listened to what I thought was the majority. But what if, like you suggest, I do not know the “real” what? Fulour, I have plunked myself down on my adventure and need to ask you before I get on my way again ...... are there many different roads I can travel to get to where I hope to go ........ how many .... can you show me where to get information about your path ..... do they all lead to the same place ... is it really the journey that matters or the destination. Why am I here, study and enlightenment I think, I honestly don’t know other than I feel I should be. I thank you for all your help Pandora

Fulgour	30 Aug 2004
What I did, or really, what happened (because it was an event), was that I allowed the Major Arcana to develop slowly from within, and my focus for thinking about card meanings was the Minors. The Pages became like my adopted friends, because they seemed to have no home ~ every other book had a different place for them. There are 16 Court Cards, but only 12 signs of the Zodiac, so where did The Pages belong? Finally one day, in a very "ahhh" moment of delight, I could suddenly see them as the phases of the Moon ~ Waxing ~ Full ~ Waning ~ New ~ and their special guardian was none other than The High Priestess herself! Autumn's Waning Moon, The Page of Swords, loosening, giving, ebbing. Winter's New Moon, The Page of Pentacles, original, fresh and unbounded. Spring's Waxing Moon, The Page of Wands, awakening, gathering, becoming. Summer's Full Moon, The Page of Cups, generous, strong, and fulfilled. The High Priestess is within each one of them, and among them always. It may be as simple as finding one card, maybe one that speaks to you in a special way, and then building on your own true experience of it. Enjoy each discovery you bring home to you, for it will be yours always!

pandora	31 Aug 2004
Thank you for that Fulgour, I love the 7 of cups....turns up for me all the time and I see more positive than neg. with this card. For years I have tried to get deeper into my cards and looking at all my books I find each one saying something different. Finally find the internet tarot community and (oH NO!) everyone has their own ideas on where this path leads and the rules to follow. My training and teaching methods have forever been "Always learn your tools and the rules before you try to become creative, and then what you create has a truth and form in reality." I supose I was looking for that in my cards, but I guess some things have a "real is what you make them" attitude. I will take your thoughts and the time to find my "truth?" and go from there. It might not be yours and perhaps.......who knows? See you in a few years.... will read your book when it comes out .....thanks all....I am on the road and my journey.

The It isn't what it is....it is...what it isn't. thread was originally posted on 24 Aug 2004 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.