Kings and Queens

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 01 Sep 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Shadyb	01 Sep 2004
Hello, I'm new here so allow me to introduce myself, I am Ben. Anyway, I was reading about kings and queens on the 'learn tarot' section of this site. The author said that court cards mostly represent people. I noticed that they made it seem like a queen can only represent a female and a king represents only a male. This maybe silly quesiton, because I know the cards are all about interpitaiton, however is this true? Does the sex of the character on the card have to represent the gender of the person it could represent?

Fulgour	01 Sep 2004
Court Cards tend to define themselves, as energies, individuals, or events. As a general rule I've found that if you're reading for yourself, you'll know, and if you're doing a reading for someone else, they'll know.

Lee	01 Sep 2004
Welcome to Aeclectic, Ben! Tarot authors differ regarding assigning genders to the Courts. Many contemporary authors feel that a Court card can apply to any gender, regardless of the gender shown on the card. -- Lee

Kiama	01 Sep 2004
Following on from what Lee said… I think that to say only Queens and Pages can be female and only Knights and Kings can be male is fairly outdated and also illogical. Because think about it: For example, the Page of Coins can represent a scholar or somebody in pursuit of wisdom. The traditional idea that Pages and Queens are women therefore discounts the possibility of men being scholars and people in pursuit of wisdom, just as it discounts the possibility of women being strategists like the King of Swords, or crusaders like the Knight of Swords. One reason I think that Queens and Pages tend to be women in the Tarot and Knights and Kings tend to be men is because each one represents an element: Queens and Pages being the traditionally feminine elements (Water and Earth) and Knights and Kings being the traditionally masculine elements (Air and Fire.) But this does not translate into real life- it is simply symbolism. So, the alternative is to view the Court Cards as representing people, regardless of gender (e.g. the Queen of Cups representing a person of any gender and age, who is very passive, very reflective, and compassionate, emotional, and a caring person.) Or, they could represent facets of a person’s personality (e.g. the Knight of Swords being that part of a person that will ride into battle to defend something they strongly believe in.) Or they could even represent events (e.g. the Page of Cups representing artistic inspiration, or the nurturing of artistic ideas.) We must be careful these days not to allow socially-constructed gender stereotypes to govern our use of the Court Cards. Just because you're male doesn't mean you'll definitely have certain traits and not others, and the same goes for women. So, that's my view on this. I'm eager to hear other's views. Blessings, Kiama

Umbrae	01 Sep 2004
Another excellent question! For me, I read courts different than most. Knights are always always always people (male or female) (except the Knight of Coins/Pentacles – and he’s a regular court). Kings, Queens, and Pages, are sometimes people – but more specifically, the aspects of each. I’d like to expand Kiama’s earlier points. Swords = Air Wands = Fire Cups = Water Coins = Earth King = Fire Queen = Water Knight = Air Page = Earth Now when you start mixing the suits with the courts, you will find that each suit has a court that is pure…For instance the Knight of Swords is pure Air. It’s a lovely way to begin looking at courts…mix the elements…how do they act? Do you have trouble with the Queen of Swords? Mix Water and Air…that’s her! The froth of a wave! The boiling of a class IV rapid (whitewater). Remember...gender is important before you step into a locker room - but not tarot...

Thirteen	01 Sep 2004
Quote: Originally posted by Shadyb Hello, I'm new here so allow me to introduce myself, I am Ben. Anyway, I was reading about kings and queens on the 'learn tarot' section of this site. The author said that court cards mostly represent people. I noticed that they made it seem like a queen can only represent a female and a king represents only a male. I'll answer this as it's likely you were reading my Tarot Basics. I did not state this because I'm out-of-date or being illogical, but because the Tarot Basics are just that. Basics. For this reason, I didn't go into the complications and depth that King/Queens can have (especially not on one page with one paragraph per queen). In my mind, I saw some poor beginner, biting his lip, trying to remember what each card means. Now imagine that beginner mumbling to themselves: "Queen of cups...can be man or woman....or not a person at all...energy is reflective....in spread position of obstacles....Okay. I've no idea what this means!" I thought it better to keep things simple, especially as the cards tend to provide answers that you can understand given your level (basics for beginners). So a beginner will usually get a King for a man they know, a Queen for a woman they know, and a Knight for a youth of either gender they know, a page for child of either gender they know. So now our beginner can say, "Queen of cups...a woman, reflective type....in the obstacle position of my spread.... Oh, wow. I bet my aunt's going to try and stand in my way again." Now, of course, if you're asking questions like this one, then you're probably ready to move up from those simple answers--and your deck knows it, so it's going to demand more of you ;) You get the myriad of layered answers you've just gotten, you move up a from the basics. I'll add my own answer just for completion--No, the King doesn't have to be male, the Queen doesn't have to be female. As mentioned in the Queen section of the "Learn Tarot," Kings are the Cardinal energy, they create and start things. Anyone who does that, who inspires others and takes the lead, is a King; he/she's the one who has the idea for the song, who writes it and inspires others who see it. Anyone who impliments the King's ideas, makes them real, coordinates the whole thing, is the Queen. He/she's the one who creates the band, arranges for the song to be recorded. He/She's the manager, if you will. Anyone who spreads the word is the Knight, the singer who sings the song, defends it, fights for it to be heard. And anyone helping at the bottom is the Page. Those working behind the scene or those in the audience, inspired by the song. Does that help?

The Kings and Queens thread was originally posted on 01 Sep 2004 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.