Paul's "Tiered" Minor Arcana System

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 10 Oct 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Paul	10 Oct 2004
Hello all. So, some have asked to hear about my system, especially the Minor Arcana. So, I humbly offer my multi-layered system of Minor Arcana interpretation, for what it’s worth. It’s kind of like a wedding cake, multiple tiers. But, like the tiers on a wedding cake, they match, there’s symmetry, congruency. So, I guess I’ll just offer up a tier-at-a-time. Each tier will offer more layers (astrology, etc) and more possibilities for specificity in your interpretations. Don’t worry, the layers will match, and hopefully taste good. When people see the whole cake, they say, that’s a lot of cake to eat! I know. But, when the card hits the table, it’s only one layer of many that actually pops into your head as inspirational. Just eat this elephant...oh, I mean cake...one bite at a time. It'll have to evolve in a series of posts on this thread, however. It's a tall "wedding cake". The Major Arcana work-in here, as well. 1. I believe in what Gareth Knight said in Treasure House of Images, the tarot is ideoplastic, it conforms to and confirms our ideological system that we use for interpretation. The secret is in your confidence in your system. If you get that confidence by following the GD or Kabala or Pythagorean numerology, or Etteilla or whatever, then fantastic. So, this system provides me with my confidence, but others will naturally not find it so inspiring. Those who like to follow the "correct" system will be frustrated with my occasional irreverence for the GD or other gurus. Oh, by the way, I truly once tried to incorporate the Kabalah, the letters, which ones go where (aaargh!)...ummmm, just didn't float my boat. So, no Kabalah in my system. 2. This system is very personal to me. I’ve spent many years developing it. So, I’m goin’ out on a limb here. I’m offering it for consumption, not canonization. So, you'll never hear me say anyone is wrong here for not toeing my party line. Critiques are fine, but since I never claimed the system as Truth, critiques are more for you than for me. 3. This is a synthetic system, at times obedient to tarot authorities, at times irreverent; but, I believe always symmetrical. I wanted a system with a good dose of “science," some traditions, and heritage behind it, not just made up. For Tier 1: Take a look at Papus’ system of Commencement/Opposition/Equilibrium. Just keep in mind that I don’t characterize Swords as naturally malefic “hatred and misfortune”. This’ll make a difference in interpretation. See websites: http://www.supertarot.co.uk/meaning/papus.htm or http://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/tob/tob52.htm. I’ll go into Tier 1 later, in another post. Tier 2 : We can look at a Hindu overlay. The numbers are grouped into Triptychs (groups of three): 1 Brahma 2 Siva 3 Vishnu 4 Brahma 5 Siva 6 Vishnu 7 Brahma 8 Siva 9 Vishnu 10 TRIMURTI – The Trinity combined. Each triptych goes through a cycle of Creation, Destruction, Consummation. Anabolism, Catabolism, Metabolism. Thesis, Antithesis, Synthesis. Got it? Each triptych is ruled by either Brahma, Siva, or Vishnu. Vishnu’s got the toughest job because “he” has to amalgamate the opposing energies of Brahma and Siva. Vishnu’s synthesis is always a preservation of Brahma’s “creation,” but mitigated by Siva’s “destruction”. So, for example, whatever Brahma creates is preserved in Vishnu, but humbled (modified/alterered) by Siva. If that whole paragraph threw you, fear not little grasshopper, I imagine subsequent chats will clarify. In this system, when the cards are upright, the even-numbers are problematic (this will become clearer as we go on). Odd-numbers are naturally positive. I view the odd numbers as having (spiritual) symmetry; the even numbers represent the attempts to fixate energies in Samsara, which causes resistance, friction, problems. Thus, in my system, the 4’s are NOT “stability,” but very unstable, requiring the help of the 5 to rebalance. All of the even numbers, in fact, are unstable. If you really analyze this system in depth, Brahma, Siva, and Vishnu are ultimately value-neutral, each participating in both “positive” and “negative” phenomena. Look at the 4-6s: there, Brahma(4) and Vishnu(6) participate in creating and preserving SIVA's negative, destructive energy and yet Siva(5) participates in nobly fighting the problem. Of course, the secret they all hold is hinted at in the 10’s (the Trimurti): which is to say that true liberation (XX Le Jugement) is knowing that there is nothing truly positive or negative in Leela, the Divine Play of ups and downs (X Le Roue de Fortune). Indeed, and are . Real liberation (white in the tarot) is in calling off the vain search for when we attempt to overcome with . Those familiar with Advaita Vedanta will appreciate this. But, I digress. As an example of this system, let’s take the Two’s (Siva in BRAHMA): So, BRAHMA rules the 1-3s, young numbers. Thus, anything in the 1-3s will be new, small and relatively minor. The Two is Siva conflicting with BRAHMA’s newly-birthed phenomenon in the Ace. This “phenomenon” will correspond in some way to the suit of the card. So, 2's are mild conflict, vacillation, etc in the suit. 2’s are ruled by the Moon in Vedic astrology, suggesting problems (XII Le Pendu) brewing more subtly (II La Papesse). Suggested meanings… 2 of Wands: Mild conflict at work. Project conflicts? 2 of Cups: Subtle conflict in relationship. Irritation, Resentment? with partner or child? 2 of Swords: Mild conflict with trying to plan something; Minor squabbles over the wording in a contract? 2 of Coins: Mild financial discomforts; bounced check due to purchase of luxury item? Keep in mind these two auxiliary points: 1. Surrounding cards give you more data. Any one card becomes only a word or phrase nestled within a sentence of cards in a given layout. So, none of the cards are meant to be read as a one-shot deal. They work in sentence format, like a telegraph message. 2. Moreover, the card doesn’t HAVE TO directly pertain to the area signified by the suit; it could be indirect. I part company with Papus here. He said for example that the Cups always pertain directly to areas of “Love,” like love-relationships and Coins to areas of Money, etc. Papus instructed the reader to use ONLY the suit corresponding to the matter at hand. So, if the reading were about Love, only use the Cups, he says. I don’t really get much out of that, however, because life blends suits. In my experience the suits can speak to a nuance outside their direct subject matter. Huh? I know that's abstruse. Here’s an example: Normally, Papus would say, use the Wands and lay down some cards to see the evolution of the Workplace matter. Not for me. Below, watch how any non-Wands suit of the 2’s may provide subtle (and specific) nuances to her Workplace-question even though the suit does not directly correspond: 2 of Cups: A personal conflict with a coworker with whom she is close. 2 of Swords: Conflict with the boss. 2 of Coins: Conflict with payroll over fair compensation. So, Cups, Swords, and Coins are not directly related to “Enterprise/Work,” such as Papus suggests, but they do indirectly show more specific information. Ok – Whew! Let’s stop there for now. Maybe some questions about Tier 2? Let me know if I need to be clearer or slow down or if this is at all useful. As you can see, my system is designed to answer specific questions about the ups and downs of this world. In my work reading for the public at fairs, few were the querents who wanted to know about their spiritual growth, aura evolution, or other such woovy groovy matters. This system is earthy and pragmatic, but you will see that it does address psychological stuff in the Cups.

Lee	10 Oct 2004
Thanks so much, Paul, not only for undertaking to present your system in a digestible fashion, but also for all the work you did to develop the system to begin with. I do have a few questions, but please feel free to not address them directly if doing so would interrupt your flow. Quote: Originally posted by Paul In this system, when the cards are upright, the even-numbers are problematic (this will become clearer as we go on). I'm afraid this sentence only prompts me to ask what reversed cards indicate. :) Also I would imagine this would necessitate using a deck where you can distinguish between uprights and reversals (like the Fournier), or else marking the cards. Quote: [...] the even numbers represent the attempts to fixate energies in Samsara , which causes resistance, friction, problems. This one went over my head a bit... are you saying here that with the even numbers, the concious mind is attempting to find a superficial stability by grasping at security and avoiding change in Samsara (i.e. the shifting, illusory material world), and that doing so will actually result in ultimate instability? Quote: After reading this and the post in your other thread, I'm still a little bit vague on what the Minor 10's mean. Would it be simply a transitional card, i.e. the situation is about to change to something else? Quote: Would I be correct then that in each succeeding triptych (i.e. 4-5-6 and 7-8-9), the meanings become more important and weightier, so to speak, and more advanced in time? For instance, the Ace of Wands would indicate the small beginnings of a project, whereas the 7 of Wands would indicate the beginning of a new phase of the project, the same project but now grown in stature and complexity? Quote: Does the correlation with the Majors continue throughout the Minors? In other words, the 4's would contain elements of IV Emperor and XIV Temperance? Quote: This sentence makes me curious about what layouts you use (assuming you use layouts). I would imagine that for this method, layouts that use series of cards (such as three cards in each position, or simply a row of cards without specific position meanings) would work better than the standard single-card-per-position method used in, for example, the Celtic Cross. Quote: As far as I'm concerned, you're doing great! I wonder if you would mind providing short (I mean real short, like one or two words) key phrases for each of the numbers 1-10, just so we can get a more precise idea of your general viewpoint on how the patterns of number and triptych coalesce in a single number. And I don't mean broken out in suits; I mean just the numbers 1-10. Here's a little narrative I made up to try to figure out the numbers -- perhaps you could let me know if I'm on the right track (I realize, of course, as you say, that there is no right track, but I mean in terms of your understanding of it, because I'd like to try to understand where you're coming from first before I make any deliberate modifications): In the Ace, I climb onto a bicycle for the very first time and start pedaling. In the 2, I realize how difficult it is to maintain balance, and the bike swerves crazily. In the 3, I manage to keep the bike under me and move forward at the same time. In the 4, the terrain becomes rocky and filled with terrifying obstructions like curbs. In the 5, I begin to improvise solutions to each new problem. In the 6, the obstructions are starting to come too fast, and my confidence in my ability to handle them is waning rapidly. In the 7, my skills are increasing with experience and I feel relief and a little more confidence that I will survive my first bike ride. In the 8, a huge tractor trailer roars up from behind me and I must swerve out of the way quickly to avoid becoming roadkill. In the 9, having survived my brush with death, I am the very picture of confidence and accomplishment. In the 10, I start wondering if I should buy a car instead. Thanks again, Paul, for giving me something to sink my teeth into! -- Lee

Paul	10 Oct 2004
Oh my, Lee. I’m in love. Ahem...I mean that in a most studious sense. Your enthusiasm is breathtaking. I was a bit insecure posting my system. It’s been a very private thing for me. Thus, your interest (and perhaps others’) is truly invigorating and encouraging. . Ok – I am pleased to answer your questions, but not as in-depth, in this first round. Plus, always keep in mind, yours and others’ personal understanding to this system, even if parting from my own, are meritorious. Let’s say for now, yes, I use reversed cards. For now, just take the whole system and reverse all of the cards: have BRAHMA create something "problematic" in the Ace: it’s abortive, shaky, a misfire. Then, follow that logic through the whole system. You will find it becomes like a photo-negative: light becomes dark, dark becomes light. As regards TdM reversals, haven’t met a TdM yet that I couldn’t figure out the top/bottom thing. Thanks to this Forum, when I recently acquired my Hadar, all of you helped enormously. Yes, philosophically, that fits nicely. It’s kind of Taoist. If you force something, you actually cause conflict. If you flow with the Tao, you allow harmony. I think I read in The Da Vinci Code something about odd numbers being feminine and "demonized" by the even-numbered masculine patriarchy, but could be wrong. But, don't want to be male-bashing here; afterall, I do have a pen**. I have the tens ruled by Pluto. He is the "last of the Mohicans," so to speak. The final planet. Pluto is the god of wealth and death. I assign him to Le Jugement, more specifically Pluto in Virgo. Thus, the tens signify the polarities (just like all of the numbers upright or reversed signify polarities) of climax and decline. Whether the cards are climaxing in the 10s or declining in the 10s, it’s all the turn of the Wheel of Samsara, i.e. temporary. Like La Roue, the 10’s are absolutely transitionary. This means that when the 10 of Cups signifies sublime emotional happiness, perhaps with family and friends, Pluto reminds us that all things must die. Yes, as long as you line them up like that. I found out that jmd lines them up the same. Right, no layouts. Get ready to break up some images, i.e. iconoclasm. No more precious Celtic Cross. Just strings of cards. Just 5 to 7 cards does well (both odd numbers). It’s absolutely liberating. But, it's really the only way you get to lay out the cards ad hoc and just let the natural idiosyncracies arise. I have experimented as well with the GD Opening of the Key Spread. I have students start with 3 cards for practice. I also use the classic European way of reading, detailed by Hadar, in the 4 card spread. BUt, this is Majors-only and then the Minor are spread for detail. More on that later. Later on, we’ll talk about how I use Elemental Dignities to form a grammar of the sentence; but, that’s waaaaay to involved for now. Here’s the dialectic, depending on whether upright or reversed: 1: Impulse vs. Impotence. {SUN} 2: Conflict vs. Confluence {MOON} 3: Progress vs. Chaos {JUPITER} 4: Disruption vs. Awakening {RAHU or Western Astrology: URANUS} 5: Intelligence vs. Complication {MERCURY} 6: Inertia vs. Cultivation {VENUS} 7: Creativity vs. Confusion {KETU or Western Astrology NEPTUNE} 8: Obstruction vs. Discipline {SATURN} 9: Assertion vs. Weakness {MARS} 10: Apex vs. Decline {Western Astrology PLUTO} Beautiful, gorgeous, sublime. I am sooooo impressed. Just keep in mind that in the 10, when speaking of the “light side of the force” might sound something like “I graduate to a Harley Motorcycle (but know that I have to go back to work on Monday)”. By the way, I do have to go back to work on Monday. So, I'll attend to the Forum as much as possible, with due enthusiasm.

Paul	10 Oct 2004
Oops, I forgot this one… Yup. Although, I wouldn’t say “the same project," because I don't follow Papus' stage system. But, I would interpret a 7-beginning as much more weightier than an Ace-beginning. For example, Ace of Cups may signify a new, budding romance or an infusion of romantic outings. The 7 of Cups is going to signify renewing marriage vows or going to partner-counseling and renewing a relationship.

Lee	10 Oct 2004
Quote: Originally posted by Paul Here’s the dialectic , depending on whether upright or reversed: 1: Impulse vs. Impotence. {SUN} 2: Conflict vs. Confluence {MOON} 3: Progress vs. Chaos {JUPITER} 4: Disruption vs. Innovation {RAHU or Western Astrology: URANUS} 5: Intelligence vs. Complication {MERCURY} 6: Inertia vs. Cultivation {VENUS} 7: Creativity vs. Confusion {KETU or Western Astrology NEPTUNE} 8: Obstruction vs. Discipline {SATURN} 9: Assertion vs. Weakness {MARS} 10: Apex vs. Decline {Western Astrology PLUTO} Perfect! Thank you. I see that adding in the planets gives a nice clarification to the general principles. Using these keywords I can actually try to read the cards this way, keeping in mind for each card the planet and the triptych stage as an overlay, and thus begin to get a feel for it. I imagine it will be somewhat slow going to begin with. Meanwhile, I look forward to the next installment. -- Lee

fyreflye	15 Oct 2004
Quote: Meanwhile, I look forward to the next installment. So do I.

Lee	16 Oct 2004
It's occurred to me that one could use the planets which Paul has listed to add some concrete objects and situations to the more general numerological meanings, by using astrological correlations for the planets and the signs and houses they rule. For example: Ace - Sun - children, theatricality 2 - Moon - the home 3 - Jupiter - growth, increase, religion, education 4 - Uranus - innovation, scientific breakthroughs 5 - Mercury - communication (i.e. radio, tv, internet, the media) 6 - Venus - art, pleasure 7 - Neptune - spirituality, addictions, confinement 8 - Saturn - career, social standing 9 - Mars - the self, face, head 10 - Pluto - death and taxes :) -- Lee

Paul	16 Oct 2004
Thanks for all of the interest, posted and non-posted. Hmmmm, why don’t I talk a bit about the suits? Once again, this system is inspired from a plethora of source material. I use a Medieval system of understanding the suits and, yeah you guessed it, a parallel with the Hindu caste system. Really, all of these layers of this wedding-cake I’m describing are like mnemonic aids that become a backdrop from which to draw interpretations—kind of the skeleton upon which the fleshy-interpretation hangs. So, here are the Medieval and Hindu Castes, not in order of “elevation”: Wands : Peasant class, laborers commoners. SUDRAS or Laborers and Servants. Cups : Clergy class, often dictating how people structured their emotional lives. BRAHMINS or Priests & Teachers. Swords : Authority Class, Warriors, Rulers, etc. KSATRIYAS or Warriors and Chieftains, Administrators. Coins : Merchant class. VAISYAS or Traders and Merchants. Then, translated into the modern milieu: Wands : The 3 C’s: Career, Community, Culture Cups : The 3 R’s: Relationships, R&R, Religion Swords : The 3? P’s: Politics, Power, (and the final ones expand past the three) Plans, Paperwork, Pain (like the burn of riding a bike up a hill, i.e. purposeful effort). Coins : The 3 H’s: Holdings, Home, Health Of course, there are times when none of these suit-attributions seem inspirational in a particular card; rather, simple elemental ideas arise: Wands : Fire, creativity, passion. Cups : Water, Emotions, psychology, spirituality Swords : Air, mind, focus, problem-solving Coins : Earth, physicality. Now, Sergius Golowin in The World of the Tarot quite evidently follows a Papus-like system of numerological interpretation, coupled with the suit. He likens the suits to aspects of each Hindu Caste. So, his Minor cards meanings have a look and feel of being derived from Papus’ Thesis/Antithesis/Synthesis system. But, I can’t find a particularly overt statement of this from him in his book. However, just knowing Papus’ system, when I analyzed his card meanings for the minors, it was quickly apparent that he was following this system, with one caveat: He (unlike Papus) was not interpreting the Swords as a naturally malefic suit. Neither do I. Alright, so, here’s an example of how it comes together: Let’s take the :CL. I’ll include some layers that we have not gone over yet, just so you can see the cake-layers in toto. Notice how all the layers basically match in tone: PAPUS : Commencement of the OPPOSITION (This card may signify a heretofore unanticipated oppositional phenomenon). HINDU TRIMURTI : Brahma in SIVA. Brahma commences the oppositional phenomenon of SIVA. This is SIVA’s first appearance as a Lord of a series of numbers, once again reinforcing the idea that this phenomenon will have an unanticipated feel to it. HINDU GUNAS : Rajas in TAMAS. We’ll go into these on another post. Fyreflye kindly remarked on the inclusion of this layer as a parallel to the TRIMURTI, in a PM. NUMBER : Vedic numerology, like astrology, provides every number with a dignified or ill-dignified attitude. The Four is (upright) ill-dignified because of Papus’ placement of the number in the Triptych as the problematic “Commencement of the OPPOSITION”. The Four challenges convention and creates reality through radical approaches. Thus, in summary the Four ill-dignified vs. dignifiied = Disruption vs. Innovation ASTRO/NUMBER : 4 in Vedic Numerology in ruled by Rahu (I associate it with the Western Uranus , although I am aware that this is not a technically-correct parallel because Rahu is the “north node of the Moon”). However, off the record so to speak, Uranus sure fits unofficially for me as a Western astrological parallel as far as the parallel-meanings of Rahu & Uranus are concerned. So, if you won't tell on me, this'll be our little secret. ;) Although, our more expert astrologers out there may provide more insight on the Moon's nodes. Anyway, the 4 = active and disruptive force, mainly on mental level. So, the 4 disruption will not be as much of a corporeal obstacle as the 8 (ruled by Saturn), but disrupts the natural symmetry of the 3 by trying to affix a new phenomenon, which is troublemaking. MAJOR ARCANA : Corresponds to IIII L’Empereur (MARS exalted in Capricorn- my assignment only) and XIV Temperance (Mercury ruling VIRGO- once again, my assignment). MARS is an exaltation, emphasizing the PLANET. VIRGO is a planetary rulership, thus emphasizing the SIGN. We might say that both are concerned with fixation and fluctuation in matter, or building and dissolution. Moreover, because the 4 is ruled by Rahu(Uranus), and I assign Le Diable as NEPTUNE exalted in Cancer (it’s exaltation, thus emphasizing the PLANET), Le Diable is related to the Fours on some level and therefore brings another novel, mysterious, dissolving layer or flavor to the 4 of Cups card. DECANATES : This part will require more expansion in the future. For now, just know that I use the Modern Decan system that includes the transpersonal planets, and my Decanates start at the Ace, not the Two like the GD. 4 of Cups = Pluto in Scorpio . Scorpio rules the 8th House. So, just pair that planet and sign/house together in your mind, give it a “negative”-bent, once again due to Papus’ classification of the 4’s as problematic/even-numbered and Voila , you’ll see a parallel meaning. Here’s some possible derived meanings of the 4 of :CL(upright), based on the above: Rows, Plots, Malice, Enmity, Arguments, Discontent , Jealousy, Affliction, Sexual Problems, Isolation, Neurasthenia, Disappointment, Criminality., Domestic Troubles, Jealousy, Setback, Misfortune, Death, Funerals, Church problems Ok, let’s stop there. Whew! :confused: Is your head swimming? Are you asking, how will I ever memorize such a complex 4 of Cups meaning? Actually, the deep learning is not on the 4 of Cups, per se, but on the layers from which it is comprised. If you learn the skeletal structure (the underlying system and its components), the “flesh” or the meaning of any particular card will naturally arise. So, who knows what meaning you will ultimately derive in the moment of a reading? But, all this layering aside, would you believe that I may not even use it in a particular interpretive encounter? Indeed, there’s been much discussion on this forum regarding just the simple inspiration that the TdM geomantic designs, flora, colors, etc. can provide in-the-moment of looking at the card. Thanks again all for this opportunity to share. It's quite fun.

Paul	16 Oct 2004
Just read your last post, Lee, after I composed Novella #2. :rolleyes: Yes - another layer, indeed. And, the concreteness of the meanings provides the specificity you and others appreciate. This is another example of how knowledge of the underlying systems of interpretation may provide spontaneous, intuitive inspiration when the card is turned over.

Lee	16 Oct 2004
Quote: Originally posted by Paul Now, Sergius Golowin in The World of the Tarot quite evidently follows a Papus-like system of numerological interpretation, coupled with the suit. He likens the suits to aspects of each Hindu Caste. So, his Minor cards meanings have a look and feel of being derived from Papus’ Thesis/Antithesis/Synthesis system. But, I can’t find a particularly overt statement of this from him in his book. [/b] Hi Paul, thanks so much for the next installment! I have yet to read it in depth, but I just wanted to comment on this one thing. I've received the Golowin book, and it turns out he does actually credit Papus with his numerological meanings. In his discussion of the Ace of Wands, he says: "The interpretation of the numbered cards in the tarot closely follows the science of numerology as it has been taught for over a century by occultists in the West. The science stems in a large part from the gypsy-researcher Vaillant and is mentioned extensively in the works of Gerard Encausse," i.e. Papus. Now I'll sink delightedly into your post... -- Lee EDITED to change "delightfully" to "delightedly" :)

Paul	16 Oct 2004
Ahhhh. So, I wasn't hallucinating (about Papus). ;)

Lee	16 Oct 2004
Quote: Originally posted by Paul Then, translated into the modern milieu: Wands : The 3 C’s: Career, Community, Culture Cups : The 3 R’s: Relationships, R&R, Religion Swords : The 3? P’s: Politics, Power, (and the final ones expand past the three) Plans, Paperwork, Pain (like the burn of riding a bike up a hill, i.e. purposeful effort). Coins : The 3 H’s: Holdings, Home, Health Paul, I really like your "modern" suit meanings. I'm having trouble following how you derive some of them, however. Could you perhaps say a word about how you derive community and culture for Wands (peasant class, servants, commoners), and also R&R for Cups (clergy)? Are you perhaps adding in some elements from modern elemental meanings (creativity and enterprise for Wands, pleasurable activities for Cups)? Thanks -- Lee

Paul	16 Oct 2004
Thank you. I worked both forwards and backwards. Forwards: I asked myself, what would be the contemporary, experiential equivalent of each of the Medieval social classes? That is, what would experiences then look like today? Backwards: Then, given all of the various and sundry contemporary subject matters that querents ask about in readings (i.e. what are people concerned about), I asked myself what would be the appropriate corresponding Medieval Class? That being said, many may disagree with my attributions; but, of course, it’s all about gaining your own personal divinatory confidence. So, I’ll do a little stream of consciousness on how I morph from one to another… Wand ~ Peasants…Commoners…Living & Working Together…In communities…”neighborhoods”…Servants...Work…Employment…Most populous Medieval Estate which comprised the dominant culture of the times…so, Career, Community, Culture. Of course, culture here is used in the American sense, because so much of our culture is tied with employment. Others may link culture with, say cups. I also add in education to Wands, but many put it with Cups. This is because, once again, in America, so much of education is tied up with employment, rather than education for edification. Cups ~Clergy…Essentially, controlling the Sabbath (day of recreation and rest)…thus, how people spent their leisure time…how people loved (who you could marry, gender and class, was reinforced by the church)...thus, relationships…so, Religion, R&R, and Relationships. I know this expands from a strict Clergy/Religious idea, but I just thought about Medieval times and how the church was sooooo inextricably bound with leisure. I would think that the Church was the ONLY provision for leisure. Swords Ruling class…Warriors…Knights…rules…regulations…policies & procedures…problems that could not be solved by labor (Wands) or money (Coins) had to be solved by political articulation, struggle, effort (Swords). I think of paperwork, contracts, any type of authority figure: police officer, judge, boss, etc. Thus the Swords are the politics in our lives and the concomitant inner power, paperwork, planning, and pain that is required. Coins I understand that the mercantile class came later (fourteenth century?). At any rate, this area is self-explanatory; however, where to put Health & Body matters? Some might put it with the Cups, since the clergy had obvious associations with hospitals. But, I took the traditional ideas of Earth associated with the body and placed it here. I think of the Body as a resource; we are unable to engage in Wands, Cups, or Swords activities without MOney or adequate Health. Anyway, perhaps that helps to see where my (winding) mind was going?

Lee	16 Oct 2004
Yes, thank you very much! That clears it up for me wonderfully. Another question (and thank you for being so extraordinarily responsive)... do you find that the planet-assigned-to-number function interferes with the planet-as-part-of-decan function, since for each card they'll be different planets? Or do you give the planet-assigned-to-number function less weight than the decan? -- Lee

Paul	19 Oct 2004
Hmmmm. The Decans are the most subtle, I would say, and have the least weight. The Planet/Number is grosser. In fact, I would say in practice that what has more often been relevant to me when it comes to the Decans is the SIGN of the Decan. For example, I know that the 1,2,3's of Cups are all under the auspice of Cardinal Cancer. (4,5,6 Fixed Scorpio & 7,8,9's Mutable Pisces). The sign of the Decan is the aspect that comes to mind more often when looking at a cups-card than the precise Decan, per se. Although, certainly, it's happened that the planet of the decan or the decan combo-platter itself has popped into my head. Probably, this de-emphasis on the Decanates is in part because I played with various Decan Systems, and astrologers are not in agreement on which system is more "true". Thus, the Decan (planet/sign) combo platter never made a super duper big impression, but I did incorporate the system, nonetheless. Perhaps, it's a hold over from the GD. Maybe I need to have a little GD-purging ritual and release the Decans. However, Papus did use Decans (not exactly in the GD way nor in my way), so I thought "hec...let's add it in." When I wrote all this down awhile back, I went through and examined how the Decan would be effected by the ruling planet of the number. How do they harmonize, or otherwise? What astrological rules of dignification/exaltation/detriment/fall would come into play with the decanate? Indeed, as you intimate Lee, there were moments of the planets being strengthened or weakened by their relationship. I just took this as another piece of data that may (or may not) pop into my intuitive "head" when doing a reading.

Lee	20 Oct 2004
I see... perhaps then, for now, I'll consider the signs of the decans as more precise calibrations of the tryptich number system, and leave aside the decan planets for now (not difficult to do, since you haven't listed them yet :)). So, it looks like the decan signs are based on Cardinal, Fixed and Mutable signs of the suit elements. -- Lee

Paul	29 Oct 2004
I thought I would go back to Papus to reiterate the foundation of the system, while layering in some parallel ideas. The planets are assigned to the numbers by Vedic Astrology. Cards Upright COMMENCEMENT: Brahma. Ruled by the Knights. They ride as pioneers on their quest, but without the staying power of the Kings or the sophisticated worldview of the Queens. The Cardinal signs for each suit, for the decans. YOD Aces: Commencement of the commencement - SUN = Impulse - LE BATELEUR & LA FORCE Two’s: Opposition of the commencement - MOON = Conflict - LE PAPESSE & LE PENDU Three’s: Preservation of the commencement - JUPITER = Progress - L’IMPERATRICE & LA MORT OPPPOSITION: Siva Ruled by the Kings The Fixed signs for each suit, for the decans. HE Four’s: Commencement of the opposition - URANUS = Disruption - LEMPEREUR & TEMPERANCE Five’s: Opposition of the opposition - MERCURY = Intelligence - LE PAPE & LE DIABLE Sixes: Preservation of the opposition - VENUS = Inertia - LAMOREAUX & LE MAISON PRESERVATION: Vishnu Ruled by the Queens The Mutable signs for each suit, for the decans. VAU/HE Seven’s: Commencement of the preservation (a more sophisticated beginning) - NEPTUNE = Creativity - LE CHARIOT & L’ETOILE Eight’s: Opposition of the preservation (a more obstructive obstruction) - SATURN = Obstruction - JUSTICE & LA LUNE Nine’s: Preservation of the preservation (a more powerful preservation). - MARS = Assertion - L’ERMITE & LE SOLEIL Ten’s - Dénouement. Apex or Decline. Up or Down. High or Low. - PLUTO - LA ROUE & LE JUGEMENT Here’s a few auxiliary remarks: 1. The Knights as the Cardinal signs may be new to a lot of people. Indeed, most tarot readers place the Knights as the Mutable signs. However, in the last few years, I was intuitively led to re-assign the Queens and Knights, that the Queens were actually the mutable signs. So, of course, if you do not like this arrangement, just switch the Queens as the starting point for the minor arcana. 2. If you follow the numerological system, the even numbers are problematic and the odd numbers contain solutions or the potentiality thereof. There are a bunch of key words that I associated with each NUMBER, which I can list in another post. These key words correspond to Vedic numerology as well as Papus’ structure. 3. When it comes to the planets, as we know there is a “light side to the force” of a planet, or a “dark side of the force” to borrow from pop culture Star Wars. So, the even numbers (upright) reflect the dark side of the planet, or its more “afflicted” qualities (what’s the astrological term?). 4. As you will see this works well (each planet has a dark side) until to get to the 6’s. What?! Venus? A dark side? Well, of course it does. Moreover, I did some research on Venus and was intrigued to find that Venus was not always associated with sugar & spice & everything nice. In fact, Venus has had a dark side, indeed, as her major attributes in certain cultural milieus. 5. The system simply reverses itself when the cards are reversed: Cards Reversed COMMENCEMENT: Brahma. Aces: Commencement of a problematic phenomenon - SUN: Sun’s afflicted qualities…Impotence Two’s: Opposition of the problem - MOON = Confluence Three’s: Preservation of a problem - JUPITER = Chaos OPPPOSITION: Siva Four’s: Commencement of a solution - URANUS = Innovation Five’s: Opposition of a solution - MERCURY = Confusion Sixes: Preservation of a solution - VENUS = Cultivation… Venus’ “good” qualities. PRESERVATION: Vishnu Seven’s: Commencement of the problem (a more sophisticated problem) - NEPTUNE = Confusion Eight’s: Opposition of the problem (a stronger solution) - SATURN = Discipline Nine’s: Preservation of the problem (a more powerful problem) - MARS = Weakness Of course, the key words for the planets are very basic to coincide with the numerological flavor of the number. In another post, I’ll show how the layers inform a reading (and list out the decans – Lee – as well as the astro-system I use for the decans so that you can see it is a logically constructed system). But, just as a preview, let’s take the 7 of Coins: Upright: It will reflect… - “Commencement of the Preservation” (or, commencement of something sophisticatedly positive). - Creativity, from Neptune, in the earthy suit of coins. - Vigor, Progress, Inspiration, and Hope from Le Chariot and L’Etoile in the earthy suit of coins. - The “positive” key words of the number 7: (from http://www.sanatansociety.org/vedic_astrology_and_numerology.htm): o “Vast, spacious, expansion, spiritual, contemplative” in the earthy suit of Coins. - Decan = Mercury in Virgo So, when the card is examined, my mind does not actually contemplate each layer in a linear way. Instead, one or two aspects of these layers becomes instantly cogent. This informs the meaning. I suppose in slow motion, there is more analysis. But, in practice, this all seems to happen in a nanosecond. Why? Because I studied the underlying system of the card, not the actual meanings of the card. In the case of a recent reading I did for a friend, the 7 of Coins was the first in a line of 5 cards. The layer-aspect that was “instantly cogent” was “spiritual…mercury…coins”. Moreover, the number 7 made me think of “’7 heavens’…death…mortality.” What I said was: “You are reaching a time in your life when you are more in touch with your mortality and wondering if you have prepared your retirement resources wisely (intelligently)." Then, the reading went on… I truly hope my sharing all of this material is satisfying. Please let me know if you'd like me to (re)focus or more simply address an area.

fyreflye	29 Oct 2004
You've got it organized pretty well already. Just keep going as best you see fit. When you finish you'll have completed an outline for the book you should write :)

Paul	30 Oct 2004
Let’s talk Decans, so as to get this layer delineated… I use the modern system that goes by triplicities, which provides an opportunity for the modern planets (Pluto, Uranus, Neptune) to be included. However, one could use the classic Ptolemaic system, if desired. Experiment with both and see what matches for you. Here’s a nice table to show the (modern) decanates http://www.panplanet.com/library/decs.html Here’s a clear explanation of its logic: http://www.arlenekramer.com/astrology40.asp There are plenty of websites that provide information on classic faces by Ptolemy. If you’d like to see 2 tables showing how the GD and Papus did their decanates (both using the Traditional assignments, but differing in the placement of each decan) you can try here: http://www.tarot.org.il/English/, then find to the right-side of the page “Images,” under which you will see “Golden Dawn’s astrological attributions…” and “Papus’ attributions…” Here’s a summary of the development of the decanates for my system: Papus inspired my placement of the decans to start at the Aces . I liked that the decans started at the Aces and ended at the Nine’s, because this fit the numerological overlay as well (divided into Triptychs, starting at 1 and ending at 9, with 10 as an outside transitional number). Moreover, you will see that the numbers follow the Triplicity pattern of Cardinal (1-3’s), Fixed (4-6’s), and Mutable (7-9’s). However, Papus placed all of the suits together , wrapping around the decanates. As a result, Wands end up in fire, earth, and air signs, and so on with the rest of the suits. I did not like this—it seemed illogical. Well, evidently the GD didn’t either, which is why they have the suits wrapping around the decanate system according to element (wands with fire signs, cups with water signs, etc.) Yet, the GD system starts with the Two’s and ends at the tens, so this wouldn’t fit my numerological system. So, I essentially merged the GD and Papus system. The decans start at the Ace’s, but each suit is matched with it’s appropriate sign. Of course, Papus uses the traditional decanate assignments, and I use modern for reasons cited above. Here are my assignments, of course in the order of the decanates, which elucidates the Cardinal/Fixed/Mutable pattern: Ace Wands: Mars in Aries (Cardinal Sign) 2 Wands: Sun in Aries 3 Wands: Jupiter in Aries 4 Coins: Venus in Taurus (Fixed Sign) 5 Coins: Mercury in Taurus 6 Coins: Saturn in Taurus 7 Swords: Mercury in Gemini (Mutable) 8 Swords: Venus in Gemini 9 Swords: Uranus in Gemini Ace Cups: Moon in Cancer (Cardinal Sign, again…restarting the pattern) 2 Cups: Pluto in Cancer 3 Cups: Neptune in Cancer 4 Wands: Sun in Leo (Fixed Sign) 5 Wands: Jupiter in Leo 6 Wands: Mars in Leo 7 Coins: Mercury in Virgo (Mutable Sign) 8 Coins: Saturn in Virgo 9 Coins: Venus in Virgo Ace Swords: Venus in Libra (Cardinal Sign) 2 Swords: Uranus in Libra 3 Swords: Mercury in Libra 4 Cups: Pluto in Scorpio (Fixed) 5 Cups: Neptune in Scorpio 6 Cups: Moon in Scorpio 7 Wands: Jupiter in Sag. (Mutable) 8 Wands: Mars in Sag. 9 Wands: Sun in Sag. Ace Coins: Saturn in Cap. 2 Coins: Venus in Cap. 3 Coins: Mercury in Cap. 4 Coins: Uranus in Aquarius 5 Coins: Mercury in Aquarius 6 Coins: Venus in Aquarius 7 Cups: Neptune in Pisces 8 Cups: Moon in Pisces 9 Cups: Pluto in Pisces Now, once you understand the logic behind the modern decanate system, you will actually be able to "figure out" the decan for a card without memorization of every decan. I would suggest reading the link I cited above carefully. Once again, I should emphasize that I don’t see the Minor Arcana as simply cardboard cut outs of the Astrological Decan System—in my experience, the decans may subtly inform the meaning of the card, but more layers of meaning go into the equation than this. If one were to look up ideas of what each decan means, say on the Web, variations would be evident, although a certain flavor or tone would be evident. Moreover, each decan may show a dark side or light side, according to whether the planet is well-aspected or ill-dignified. This is necessary in order for the Decanate system to fit with Papus' numerological system, which requires even numbers/upright to be problematic and odd numbers/upright to be solvent. It's kind of Taoist, every number contains a problem and a solution. For example, we know that---upright—the 8’s are problematic. This means that I would interpret the planet within a decan for the 8’s in its more “ill-dignfied” nature. While—reversed—the 8’s are solvent, I would interpret the planet in its beneficent nature. Moon in Pisces: indolence, self-pity, vacillation and faintheartedness, sorrow and self-undoing, irresolute, inert, persecution, downhearted and easily discouraged. In love, possibly infidelity. Or, If well aspected, fruitful imagination, kind, benevolent, charity, quiet, retiring, private, sympathetic, fond of luxury, comfort, beauty, harmony, fluent, eloquent. By the way, I find that there are interesting interpretive possibilities when you use Houses that correspond to the signs. For example, the 8 of Cups would be Moon in Pisces or the Moon in the Twelfth House. Thanks to the Web, you can do a Google search for this combo and come up with interesting divinatory meaning possibilities. Moon in Twelfth House: (from http://members.lycos.nl/Shades/horoscopes2/moonin12houses.htm ) well-aspected gives success in such work as is performed in seclusion away from the public gaze, in prisons, hospitals or charitable institutions. There is also a liability to become involved in clandestine love-affairs but if the Moon is well-aspected the person will be able to keep this a secret. If the Moon is afflicted there is a danger of secret enemies, trouble and persecution. So, what professional astrologers say about the combinations of Planet & Sign might inform your meaning, if indeed it is the decan that seems most cogent to you when you examine the card. But, I would say why not trust your own intuition? Indeed, if you knew the meanings for the House/Sign already, and the meanings for the Planet, why not trust your own gut and speculate on its meanings in the moment of the reading.

Paul	30 Oct 2004
Layouts & Tarot Grammar: I appear to have found my posting Mojo again...so, one more post. :D Well, I don’t use layouts, per se, in the sense of laying down a card in a prescribed position that means something like “past…present…future…obstacle”. But, I certainly don’t disparage this form. I prefer to throw 3 or 5 or 7 cards (odd numbers) in a line, and interpret it as a sentence. Hadar said that the question or subject of the reading was paramount, because it would shade the direction or tone of the card. Indeed, without the subject of the reading, there could be no specificity. Thus, the question or subject of the reading is makes the “Tarot-Sentence” a position in and of itself, as it were. Thus, if the client says, “I have a questions about the resolution of a problem at work,” then the Tarot-Sentence becomes an entire position about "resolution of the problem at work". Now, for years I just interpreted the line of cards in sentence format, which was adequate. But, after awhile, I realized that the Grammar of the Tarot-Sentence was very important. Was a card active or passive? Was a card representing a noun or a verb or an adjective? Was the querent the Court Card or was the Court Card another person? Especially when I read for myself or friends or family, I wanted to ensure that I was not biasing the interpretation by bending the grammar to suit my preferred interpretation. Here’s an example of how unclear grammar can alter the meaning. Take this line of 5 cards. Let’s say the subject of the reading is a political problem at work and that this sentence is the resolution of the matter (which was an actual reading): LE DIABLE (r) + QUEEN COINS + 5 SWORDS + TOWER + LE PAPE I read this as follows: “The course of events would naturally transpire in such a way that there would be backbiting and gossip from a Woman, either dark-colored or in charge of money, which would lead you to oppose this Woman, but more intelligently—not stooping to her level—in order to avoid a major conflagration. But, it will come to a head—indeed, you must avoid direct confrontation, which may result in both of you getting hurt. Those in charge of the organization will find a fair and ethical solution.” This interpretation was accurate as it stood; however, notice how it assumes that the querent is passive to Le Diable and the Queen of Coins – i.e. the querent is not actively gossiping about the Queen of Coins, and the Queen of Coins must struggle with the querent’s ill-will. Indeed, it is the other way around. How did I know this? Well, it just felt right. But, could this Tarot-Grammar be better established? So, I did a lot of work with ideas about elemental dignities and developed a system of tarot grammar that helps the reader decide if the energy of any given card is active (coming from the querent) or passive (coming to the querent) or neutral (around the querent or atmospheric). Is the energy waxing (rising) or waning (falling) or inert (going round and round or still)? In another post, I’ll delineate this grammar system. It’s quite fun to use, and is filled with intriguing possibilities when discerning a Tarot Sentence. If I were to identify the grammar of the aforementioned Tarot Sentence, here’s how it would look (bear in mind that in order to discern the grammar there would be more rows of cards, but more on that later): Top row: the cards Bottom row: the corresponding grammar for each card, in order... LE DIABLE (r) + QUEEN COINS + 5 SWORDS + TOWER + LE PAPE Passive / Waxing + Passive / Inert + Active / Waxing + Neutral / Inert + Passive / Inert In other words, the gossip and backbiting of The Devil is happening to the querent and is rising in energy, coming from the Queen who is always around, to which the querent must actively respond in increasingly energetic ways (5 Swords). But, be careful! The Tower sits on the outskirts as a reminder of what is likely to happen if a direct confrontation is allowed. The querent will ultimately (passively) receive help from The Pope, who’s energy will set up some kind of intervention that will have staying power. Well, that’s 3 long posts. I’ll go into more detail on HOW to discern the grammar in a future post. Thanks for this opportunity to articulate this quirky system of mine. Happy reading and Happy Hallowe’en.

Lee	30 Oct 2004
Holy cow! What a huge amount of great material you've given us. It's past the point where I can study this on the screen, I'm going to be printing this all out and taking it to bed with me. The "grammar" ideas are particularly fascinating. I agree with fyreflye that you should write a book! Please feel free to give us more whenever the mojo strikes. :) -- Lee

Rusty Neon	30 Oct 2004
Quote: Originally posted by Lee The "grammar" ideas are particularly fascinating. More on tarot grammar: http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&postid=338385 http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&postid=234143

Lee	30 Oct 2004
Thanks Rusty, very interesting. -- Lee

Paul	30 Oct 2004
...a new home, "Using Tarot Cards". :cool: Remember... 1.Most of my system is designed for unillustrated pips, and 2. My Minor Arcana system in most of its layers won't likely work with Rider-Waite's or Crowley's or their offspring, because the meanings of the Waite/Golden Dawn decks are circumscribed by the scenes on the minors.

Paul	25 Nov 2004
Been away for awhile. Shall we continue? I made a diagram to summarize a lot of this information, thus far. The diagram will be clearly recognized as enhanced from Papus’ system. The diagram is just too big to post. I'll try to shrink it, but that might ridiculously compromise the legibility. Please PM me, and I'll be happy to email it to you. To review, the Minor Arcana (and Major) are divided into Triptychs, groups of 3, with the 10 serving as a transitional card, but also the seed for the next series. Here are the layers of theoretical constructs for each number: I’m tossing in the classic YOD HE VAU HE (Tetragrammaton) with which many will be familiar: 1 Yod 2 He 3 Vau 4 Yod 5 He 6 Vau 7 Yod 8 He 9 Vau 10 He final (I am aware for the purists out there that the 4 and 7 are really He final coupled with Yod of the next series. That is to say, the 4, for example, ends the series of 1-3 and begins its own series of 4-6. I left it off of the above list for visual simplicity.) I suppose a separate thread could be started on the whole YOD/HE/VAU/He concept; I would certainly be very interested in what all have to share on this. For now, think of… Yod as Active, thrusting force (1,4,7) He as Passive, reactive force (2, 5, 8) Vau as Neutral, integrating force – inertia (3, 6, 9) We can now integrate the Hindu concept of Sattwa, Tamas, Rajas: Rajas= Brahma, the soul, the unmanifest but intentional force Tamas = Shiva, the body, the unbuilding force, inertia, opposition Sattwa= Vishnu, the mind, the preserving force, equilibrium In sentence form: Parambrahma (the One, unmanifested) longs to manifest, thus couples with Shiva (the Destroyer) to unbuild the structure of the One outward into the Many—the manifested universe. Vishnu circumscribes this unbuilding through preserving, by balancing the force of Brahma and Shiva. (Adapted from Destiny in the Palm of Your Hand by Ghanshyam Singh Birla) I like the concept of Shiva “unbuilding” the unmanifest. It seems to couple the paradoxical concepts of Shiva being a creator and destroyer well. It helps us understand the energy of the even numbers in this system (which are all reflexive to the odd numbers). Rather than being “sugar n’ spice n’ everything nice” numbers that we find in some systems that associate even numbers with peace, stability, calm, we find the even numbers contain this dialectic of Shiva's "friction". In fact, from my observation only, when I line up the Tarot de Marseille minors, the even numbers always look “crowded…stressful…working,” while the odd numbers (because a pip icon ends up eliminating flora and fauna) appear cleaner, more ordered. So, to integrate a lot of these ideas... {1-3} = YOD, BRAHMA, RAJAS, COMMENCEMENT ONE= Yod, Brahma, Rajas, Commencement (Beginning of the beginning). The Ones are ruled by the Sun in Vedic & Chaldean numerology. TWO = He, Shiva, Tamas, Opposition (Opposition to the beginning). The Twos are ruled by the Moon in Vedic & Chaldean numerology. THREE’S = Vau, Vishnu, Sattwa, Preservation (Preservation of the beginning – but mitigated, thus working energy, but not fully established). The Three’s are ruled by Jupiter in Vedic & Chaldean numerology. {4-6} = HE, SHIVA, TAMAS, OPPOSITION FOURS= Yod, but also the He (final) from the 1-3, Brahma, Rajas, Commencement of the Opposition (Beginning of an oppositional force). The Three’s are ruled by North Node Rahu in Vedic & Uranus in Chaldean numerology, both with similar energies. FIVE’S = He, Shiva, Tamas, Opposition (Opposition to the Opposition – this is good, the Shiva energy is constructive here, solution oriented). The Five’s are ruled by Mercury in Vedic & Chaldean numerology. SIXES = Vau, Vishnu, Sattwa, Preservation (Preservation of the opposition – but mitigated, I generally interpret the sixes as having a slowing, lethargic effect on the energy of the card). The Sixes are ruled by Venus in Vedic & Chaldean numerology. {7-9} = VAU, VISHNU, SATTWA, EQUILIBRIUM SEVENS = Yod, but also the He (final) from the 4-6, Brahma, Rajas, Commencement of the Equilibrium (Beginning of a more sophisticated new force). The Sevens are ruled by South Node Ketu in Vedic & Neptune in Chaldean numerology, both with similar energies. EIGHTS = He, Shiva, Tamas, Opposition (Opposition to the Equilibrium – this force is pretty obstructive. The Eights are ruled by Saturn in Vedic & Chaldean numerology. NINES = Vau, Vishnu, Sattwa, Preservation (Preservation of the equilibrium – I interpret the nines as the preservation of a strong, victorious force to overcome Saturn). The Nines are ruled by Mars in Vedic & Chaldean numerology. {10’S} = HE (FINAL), TRIMURTI (Brahma, Shiva, Vishnu combined) TENS = He (final), Apex or decline. Transitional number. I give this number to Pluto. Haven’t looked for other scholarship on this. The Diagram that you can PM me for graphically illustrates a lot of these concepts. You can study this diagram ad nauseum and find relationships. (BRAHMA/Brahma)Aces = Le Bateleur + La Roue (Here’s Brahma w/ creative intention, yet some randomness on actual manifestation, the roulette wheel, such are the energies of the Aces by tradition) (BRAHMA/Shiva)Two’s = La Papesse + La Force (BRAHMA/Vishnu)Three’s = L’Imperatrice + Le Pendu (SHIVA/Brahma)Fours = L’Empereur + La Mort (Notice Shiva as Creator and Destroyer) (SHIVA/Shiva)Fives = La Pape + Temperance (SHIVA/Vishnu)Sixes = Lamoreux + Le Diable (VISHNU/Brahma)Sevens = Chariot + Le Maison (VISHNU/Shiva)Eights = Justice + L’Etoile (VISHNU/Vishnu)Nines = L’Ermite + La Lune (TRIMURTI)Tens = Le Soleil + Le Jugement + Le Monde (pictured in Medieval form as Brahma , Shiva , and Vishnu ) Sooooo, I know some of this is repetitious, but I hope it says the same thing differently, so to speak, to teach more effectively, as well as add new information. I would welcome questions, contradictions, pride, and prejudice. :D In the next installments, I’ll provide some specific reading examples. Then, tarot grammar.

Paul	26 Nov 2004
Along with my general layered-system for Tarot de Marseille, which specifically offers a way to interpret non-illustrated pips (or more accurately, non-Rider Waite or Thoth pips without “scenes”), I developed a grammar system for how to more subtly read the energies within a Tarot “sentence.” Keep in mind that I read the Tarot in a sentence format, meaning the cards are layed out in a string (3 or 5 or 7 cards) and read just like a sentence. It ends up being like a telegram of sorts. The book Tarot Card Combinations by Dorothy Kelly does this with the Rider-Waite deck, but does not offer grammar, per se. Readers may find how she makes “sentences” out of the cards very interesting. First, I think an understanding of the Aristotlian Elemental system is important (hot…cold…wet (moist)…dry) and the corresponding Tarot elements. See the attachment I've included with a diagram I composed. John Opsopaus offers a wonderful internet article of: Rotation of the Elements I’ll quote from it shortly. But, here’s my elemental associations: WATER = Wet & Cold AIR = Wet & Hot FIRE = Dry & Hot EARTH = Dry & Cold What does this have to do with anything grammatical? Well, in my readings, I came to appreciate that it was important to understand the grammatical nature of the energies of the cards. Given any card, the question is always whether the energy is… Active or Passive? i.e. coming from the querent or happening to the querent? Waxing or Waning? i.e. increasing or decreasing in force?One could also say, strong or weak? Then, there was the combination of Active/Passive or Waxing/Waning… Active + Passive = Neutral, i.e. happening AROUND the querent, environmental. Waxing * Waning = Inert, i.e. just constant. Before we look at the HOW of reading grammar, let’s take an example. This will be just one card of many in a string of cards making up a “sentence”. But, let’s say the question is about the workplace. XVI: LE MAISON DIEU/ The Tower: Let’s pick a key word “disruption” to use. Depending on the grammatical interpretation, The Tower may articulate the following possible meanings… Active (from the querent): The querent is disrupting the workplace. Passive (to the querent): The querent’s worklife is being disrupted Neutral (around): There is disruption in the workplace around the querent. _______ Waxing (increasing): The disruption is very strong(strengthening). Waning (decreasing): The disruption is weak(ening). Inert (ho hum): There is a constant sense of distruptive energy, unstable. Let’s combine Active/Passive with Waxing/Waning: Active & Waxing: The querent is highly disrupting the workplace. Passive & Waxing: The querent is being highly disrupted in the workplace. Neutral & Waxing: Around the querent, in the workplace, there is a high disruptive energy. …an so on. Of course, WHEN this energy is happening is simply a matter of whether the string of cards you are reading represent past/present/future. Next, we couple Active/Passive & Waxing & Waning with Pythagorean elemental attributes: Hot = Active Cold = Passive ___ Wet = Waxing Dry = Waning …applied to the Tarot elements: WATER = Cold & Wet, thus Passive and Waxing AIR = Hot and Wet, thus Active and Waxing FIRE = Hot & Dry, thus Active and Waning EARTH = Cold & Dry, thus Passive and Waning. See my attached Aristotle Elemental wheel. How does one get the qualities of “Neutral” (Combination of Passive & Active) or “Inert” (Combination of Waxing & Waning)??? It’s coming right up. First, you may have guessed that you would need more cards in your tableau in addition to the main card, for which an elemental association/combination could be made. Here’s how you lay out the cards in the tableau: ELEMENT #1: String of cards. SENTENCE: String of cards. ELEMENT #2: String of cards. Or, ELEMENT #1: {} {} {} {} {} SENTENCE::: {} {} {} {} {} ELEMENT #2: {} {} {} {} {} The “SENTENCE” cards are what you are actually reading, per se. The Elemental Strings are combined to form a grammatical tone. Let’s take the Tower card again. Within the sentence sequence would fall the Tower. Above and below The Tower would be one card each, obviously with a particular element, that can subsequently be combined together to form a grammatical tone. Fire + Fire = Active + Waning Water + Water = Passive + Waxing Air + Air = Active + Waxing Earth + Earth = Passive + Waning So you might see this… Above = 3 of Batons Middle = Tower Below = King of Batons The wands energy combines to make the Tower “Active & Waning”. This is nice, but we don't always see elements matching like this. Of course not, but here is where we get concepts of “Neutral” and “Inert”: Active + Passive = Neutral Waxing + Waning = Inert (could mean still, or could mean like a spinning wheel, constant). Thus, these opposites cancel each other out, so to speak. You can make a table of all of the combinations. (See the diagram attached). Here’s some examples: Fire + Water = Neutral + Inert Air + Earth = Neutral + Inert Fire + Air = Active + Inert Water + Earth = Passive + Inert Water + Air = Neutral + Waxing …and so on. Therefore, it is imperative that we have 2 cards (above and below) to combine in order to give us the grammatical tone. This may seem like an incredible feat to memorize the combos. But, I found that with practice and a foundational knowledge of the elemental attributions, combining them becomes facile. You don't actually have to memorize all of the combos (although, over time you will automatically recall them), but just know the attributions of each element and then combine them in your mind. Now, those familiar with the GD Opening of the Key spread may wish to just use the 2 cards snuggled up to the middle card in order to get their combination. This will be somewhat different from the concept of Elemental Dignities, but certainly following the same principles. So, from John Opsopaus’ Web Article , I quote the following: “The turning wheel is an elemental rotation driven by the qualities, Moist on the rising side, Hot on the top, Dry on the descending side, and Cold on the bottom. The young upstart is powerless (Cold), but by adapting to circumstances and playing the game, that is, by becoming more flexible (Moist), he is able to increase his power and success (Heat). However, as he reaches the pinnacle of his success, he becomes more rigid and inflexible, which sows the seeds of his decline. Rigidity undermines his power, and he falls back to a powerless state. Thus the ``laws of motion'' of the Wheel of Fortune are: Flexibility enhances power, but power discourages flexibility. The first quarter of the king's ascent corresponds to Water, for he must adapt passively. In the second quarter, governed by Air, he becomes actively flexible, seeking new opportunities. The third quarter belongs to Fire, and here he has the greatest power to set the terms to which others must conform, but this Fire must burn itself out. Therefore the final quarter corresponds to Earth, the deposed king, inflexible and powerless in bitter old age. I have a diagram with this system overlayed with La ROue de Fortune (The Wheel). I’ll post it soon. So, this matches my system in principle: Water = the passive ascent, i.e. Passive & Waxing. Air = “actively flexible seeking new opportunities,” i.e. Active & Waxing Fire = “greatest power…but this fire must burn out,” i.e. Active & Waning Earth = “inflexible…powerless,” i.e. Passive & Waning. Well, let’s stop there. I can show how it works in a longer sentence with more cards. I suppose this could become a separate Thread, but I view this as all part of my layered reading system, because the actual Tableau for reading does have layers. I welcome input and feedback.

Paul	27 Nov 2004
Here's a little diagram I composed, overlaying the elemental attributions for the tarot grammar over the tarot card X La Roue de Fortune (The Wheel of Fortune). I think this visual is not only eye-catching, but it is utilitarian as well. You can print the diagram and use it as a visual tool to quickly determine grammatical tone. Play with various combinations and practice determining the final grammatical interpretation. You'll notice that the Aristotle square is "flipped" in direction in order to correspond with the direction of the Wheel. However, the attributions are all the same. The card is from Tarocco di Besancon by Il Meneghello. As always, Alida store carries it.

Paul	27 Nov 2004
How about some sample readings to see how the system comes together? See the attachment for a image of the tableau. You’ll notice that I place the Aristotle Elemental Rows (Rows 1 & 3) down first, then the Sentence Row (Row 2) goes on top. This saves room; as well, for the elemental rows, you only need a quick glance to note the element, so the whole card does not have to be visible. I'm using the Dusserre Tarot de Marseille, a photoreproduction of Marteau's TdM. The meanings of the minor correspond with my personal TdM system; however, you could use this reading concept with any tarot deck. For those without attachment-viewing powers, here’s the tableau: S= Swords Cu = Cups Co = Coins B = Batons Here’s a random group of cards I drew. Let’s make the reading about a Male Querent who is asking about the future with a potential new beau…These are a teeny amount of cards (just 3 for the sentence); I’d probably do 7 in practice. But for the sake of illustration… ROW 1 (Element):: {S}…….{Co}……{Co} ROW 2 (Sentence): {QB}…..{ACu}….{8Co} ROW 3 (Element):: {Cu}…..{Cu}…….{S} So, The Queen of Batons is influenced elementally by the Sword card (above) and the Cups card (below). The Ace of Cups is influenced elementally by the Coin card (above) and the Cups card (below). The 8 of Coins is influenced elementally by the Coin card (above) and the Swords card (below). STEP ONE: Look at the cards “through the eyes of a child”. That is to say, let go of all knowledge of tarot and pretend you are just reacting to the cards as if you’ve never seen tarot before but are being asked to find some salient impressions. This might involve happenstances of: colors, shapes, flora & fauna, geometric layouts, people, eyes, postures, etc. Paul’s Step One: The Queen looks at the Cup, but seems to want to “beat it” with her wand, perhaps to get the cup’s attention? I notice her red-colored chest; is her heart on fire? Her arms seem akimbo, like she’s emphatic. The Ace of Cups, while positioned in the center, seems divisive, like it’s creating a barrier between the Queen and the 8 of Coins card. In fact, the symmetry of the Cup card in the center seems to naturally depict a woman on the left and the man (as the 8 of coins) on the right. I wonder why a court card didn’t appear for him? Is he not fully invested? Just an 8-guy, not a King? My eye goes to the leaves on the 8 of Coins and notices-most the downward-turned leaves. This visual seems to say “dampening” or “flaccid”. Queen of Batons, surrounded by Swords + Cups/ Air + Water = (Active/Waning) + (Passive/Waxing). This equals Neutral & Inert . Thus, the Queen of Batons is AROUND the querent and her energy is static, constant. Ace of Cups, surrounded by Coins + Cups/ Earth + Water = (Passive/Waning) + (Passive/Waxing). This equals Passive/Inert . Thus, the Ace of Cups energy is directed TOWARD the querent (obviously from the Queen, as she prefaces the Ace). Moreover, the Ace energy is constant. 8 of Coins, surrounded by Coin + Sword/ Earth + Air = (Passive/Waning) + (Active/Waning). This equals Neutral/Inert . Thus, the energy of the 8 of Coins is happening AROUND the querent and is static. Paul, Step Two: Thus, just by looking at the elemental grammar only, we could surmise that the Queen is around the querent and will continue to notice him with Ace of Cups energy; however, whatever the 8 of Coins signifies will play a part as well, but around the querent, as well. Notice the profound INERTIA in the grammar. This may indicate this relationship is Ho Hum. There is an absence of ACTIVE verbs for the querent; this may indicate he’s awfully passive in this relationship. The Queen seems to be floating around; the querent doesn’t appear to be doing anything. - Certainly, the final placing of a coins card in what seems to be a sentence about relationships is intriguing. How does the coins energy relate? Moreover, the 8 of Coins simply ends the sentence. Whichever concept pops into your intuitive head first is the right one. This is where the layers of meaning play-out.I’ll just list a stream of consciousness on the card meanings. I’ll put the key word I might choose in light blue: Queen of Batons = Woman…fiery …or at the workplace Ace of Cups = Beginnings…Yod…Brahma creating something new in the emotional realm… Decan = Moon in Cancer…Moon…mystery. Aces are ruled by the Sun…illumination… exposure . Cups = the 3 R’s: relationships , R&R, religion. 8 of Coins = Obstacles …Shiva opposing something sophisticated in the 7…8’s ruled by Saturn…Decan = Saturn in Virgo (give a negative flavor, due the 8’s being a problematic number, upright)…Saturn is very strong here because the 8’s are ruled by Saturn…Virgo = service/employment …Coins = the 3 H’s: home, holdings, health. So, I have the following key words: Fiery woman @ workplace…budding relationship w/ air of mystery, wanting to see the light of day…obstacle with employment. I would probably say “A fiery woman is at the workplace will continue to be interested in a relationship with the querent, but it will continue to have a lunar quality of the unknown. Why? the FACT of the employment of the querent at the Queen’s workplace will continue to preclude a relationship blossoming and seeing the light of day.” Paul’s Step Four: In short, a woman at work, possible the boss, will continue to be romantically interested in the querent. In fact, the energy is so static that this would indicate this has been a longstanding attraction. The cards indicate that he is quite passive about this relationship, more so than her. In fact, she seems to want to beat him over the head to get his attention. Although he is aware of the attraction, it must remain Moon-like due to the work situation. This may also indicate that they have a type of superior/subordinate relationship and cannot date for boundary reasons. In any case, the very fact of employment (8 of Coins) creates a Saturn-like obstacle to the relationship and dampens the prospects of the relationship seeing the light of day. The cards say that, given no further significant intervention on the querent’s part, the relationship is likely to continue status-quo, which is to say…lackluster. Whew! Now, that probably seems farrrrrrrrrrrrr too intellectualized. In practice, though, once you know all of the layers of meanings for the cards and coupled with a basic understanding of the grammar, all of this happens in intuition-time (i.e. very quickly). The key words of the cards pop into your head, usually one or two come center-stage amongst many possible key words for any given card. Then, the sentence comes together grammatically and just “feels right”. I recommend practicing this technique by making up clients, making up questions, and then randomly drawing a tableau. It is fun to see the myriad of possibilities of how the sentence will tell a story. Start with 3 cards, then move to 5, then onto 7. It will be excrutiatingly slow at first, but you will get notably faster with practice. You will get so fast that you will not even have to “think” about the grammar, etc. It will just occur in a nanosecond. Ok - I need a nap now.

Lee	27 Nov 2004
Hi Paul, just a real quick question -- how do you determine the elements of the Majors? Do you use the GD attributions? Or do you use your own astrological attributions of the Majors to determine their elements? If so, I don't think we've had those yet, unless I've lost track... Thanks, Lee

Paul	27 Nov 2004
I use my own. I thoroughly investigated the Continental & Golden Dawn attributions and was simply never satisfied. I toyed with such Kabbalistic overlays on the tarot, because it seemed all the rage for awhile and seemed the proper thing to do, like not wearing white after Labor Day. In the end: Kabbalah babbalah. From a strictly utilitarian point of view, it was never practical to my reading style. It didn't offer me anything from the divinatory p.o.v. *No offense intended for those who find it enriching. Besides, no one could agree on anything: Is 0 really 1? Is the Fool Aleph or Shin? Didn't Crowley monkey with The Emperor and The Star? Then, even if you got the letters lined up nicely where you wanted them, different astrological attributions were offered for the letters according to what authority was being cited. One major website I know of says the Marseille numbering is all amuck anyway, which then sends you back to the drawing board. Just shoot me. Sooo, I use my own. I'll post 'em soon. Again, I am aware of passion for the Kabbalistic p.o.v. on the tarot on this site, and I respect it. I just don't have a taste for it.

Lee	27 Nov 2004
No problem! :) Personally I'm not attached to the GD system either. I'll look forward to seeing what you've come up with. -- Lee

Lee	04 Dec 2004
I haven't had much time to post here, due to my creative pursuits. However, I made good progress on my book today, so I thought I'd reward myself by spending some time in my favorite thread. I re-read my printout of the thread (all 30 pages!), and decided to try a three-card layout. I feel like the RWS Fool, stepping off the edge of the cliff... :) So, here goes. As in Paul's example, I'm using only Minor cards, and all upright (my poor brain has enough to deal with without worrying about reversals at present). The question is: How will my book be received? Here's the three rows of cards: Row 1: (Wands)..............(Wands)..............(Cups) Row 2: Knight Coins..........2 Cups...............8 Coins Row 3: (Coins)................(Cups)................(Cups) STEP ONE: Look at the cards through the eyes of a child: The Knight of Coins looks like he's following a coin which is floating through the air ahead of him, at the same rate of speed so that he'll never catch it. It looks like he's planning to use his stick to try to catch the coin, which seems like a rather unrealistic plan, a butterfly net would have served him better. Perhaps my writing methods are taking me in the right direction, but I won't quite succeed in capturing the elusive goal (which is, in my case, to state my viewpoints with clarity) because I'm using the wrong tools. The 2 of Cups has the two sea creatures growing out of a single plant stem, facing each other. The result of the publication of my book (the single stalk) will be a conflict between two camps, who are more or less evenly matched. The 8 of Coins continues the "evenly matched" theme, since the card is so visually balanced with the two rows of four coins each. The flora on the card are all offshoots of the center flower, suggesting that in the future, the project will eventually establish itself in the public's mind and will inspire others to their own projects. Wow, that was fun! Maybe I should stop here, and not press my luck! But no, I'll Foolishly press on. STEP TWO: Note the grammar: Knight of Coins, surounded by Wands + Coins/Fire + Earth = (Active/Waning) + (Passive/Waning) = (Neutral/Waning). Thus the Knight of Coins is AROUND the querent and his energy is weak[ening]. 2 of Cups, surrounded by Wands + Cups/Fire + Water = (Active/Waning) + (Passive/Waxing) = (Neutral/Inert). Thus the 2 of Cups energy is AROUND the querent and is static. 8 of Coins, surrounded by Cups + Cups/Water + Water = (Passive/Waxing) + (Passive/Waxing) = (Passive/Waxing). Thus the 8 of Cups energy is directed TOWARD the querent and is strong or strengthening. First I notice the predominance of Neutral, Passive and Inert, which is probably appropriate, given the fact that once the book is out in the public, I really don't have any control over how people react to it or whether it's generally considered successful or not. All I can do is basically wait and watch what happens. The 8 of Coins seems to be the most dynamic card, indicating something that will happen to me in the future or whose effect will grow. STEP THREE: Note the meanings of the cards: Now I'm really going off the deep end. With the foreknowledge that I'll probably make a total Fool of myself, here goes: A practical, home-and-health-oriented man (Knight of Coins/Earth) is taking action (Knights = Cardinal) which will lead to mild relationship conflict centering around the home (2 of Cups = Pluto in Cancer). This somehow leads me to be feeling restricted (8 of Coins - 8's = obstruction) because it forces me to be more aware of financial matters, but at the same time this restriction is in some ways favorable because I really *should* pay more attention to financial matters (8's = Saturn i.e. structure and discipline, even though the card isn't reversed, which would suggest discipline even more). STEP FOUR: Let it all flow together: The home-and-health-oriented man (my lover) is concerned about whether the financial aspects of the project will work out. He communicates this to me in a less-than-delicate/tactful manner (i.e. chasing the elusive coin with the stick). This leads to mild relationship conflict, because I tend to be entirely creative and entirely *not* practical, thus the two sea creatures on the 2 of Cups symbolize the creative vs. practical battle, rather than an opposition between two different camps of readers. As time goes on and the project is published, the need will increase for me to pay attention to the practical aspects of the project such as sales and future printings. Well, there it is. As you can see, I had two problems... (a) I ended up answering a different question than I originally asked, and (b) after Step One, the reading seemed to go in an entirely different direction. Perhaps (b) isn't so much of a problem, though, since, as Paul has said, we should use whichever layers pop into our minds, and the reading process, I suspect, eventually doesn't happen so sequentially (i.e. Step One, then Step Two, etc.), but rather all the steps happen at once, so I think it's okay that I didn't end up using all the things I noticed in Step One (noticing details of the pictures, flora, fauna, etc.). But this is only my first attempt. I'm sure future attempts will go more smoothly. -- Lee

Lee	04 Dec 2004
Hi Paul, I just wanted to let you know my thoughts about the pre-10 and post-10 Major matchups. In a prior post you say: Quote: You may notice from the diagram that the numerological relationships created between the Major Arcana will have changed from my original posts. Examples from earlier post: * LE BATELEUR paired with STRENGTH (1 paired with 11) * LA PAPESSE paired with LE PENDU (2 paired with 12) ...and so on. But, as an alternative, if you want to use Papus’ logic as pictured in my diagram, the pairings change to a “theosophical” number-reduction: * LE BATELEUR paired w/ LA ROUE (10 = 1 + 0 = 1) * LA PAPESSE paired w/ LA FORCE (11 = 1 +1 = 2) I like both arrangements. Each seems to have an interesting polarity. But, to be faithful to this entire system as a whole, the second arrangement would retain the internal consistency of logic through number-reduction. It seems to me, and this is just my personal preference, that the first method (1 paired with 11, 2 paired with 12, etc.) is preferable. First of all, from a very simplistic standpoint, it's a lot easier to remember because of the congruence of numbers (1/11, 2/12, 3/13, etc.). Secondly, I think this method has internal logic, because in this method the tenth and 20th Majors (Wheel of Fortune & Judgement) are laid aside, just as in the Minor numbers, we have 3 sets of 3, with the 10th card laid aside as the transitional card. It seems to me this gives your whole system more internal consistency than the number-reduction method, unless (as is likely) I'm missing how the number-reduction method relates to other parts of the system. Also, just in terms of being able to draw a correlation between the two cards of each pair (Le Bateleur with La Force, La Papesse with Le Pendu, etc.), it seems to me -- and I admit this is a purely subjective judgment -- that the first method results in more apropos pairings than the second method. Although, I admit that when you match the Majors to the Minor number system, Death and the Devil do go very well in the second triad (Shiva, the destroyer), which only happens in the second method of pairings. But it's hard, for example, to correlate the Star with obstruction/discipline (Saturn), which also happens in the second method. Arrghh, what a tangle. This will probably all clear itself up if and when Paul discusses his views of the Majors in more detail. Going back to the Minors, though, Paul, would you mind saying a few words about the Court cards specifically? We've seen from your examples what your general approach to them is, and that Knights=Cardinal, Queens=Mutable, and Kings=Fixed, but is there anything else we should know about how you go about interpreting them? Finally, I'd like to say that I hope some more people will decide to actively participate in this thread. I for one am having a great time. Come on in, the water's fine! :) -- Lee

Paul	05 Dec 2004
Lee wrote: As you can see, I had two problems... (a) I ended up answering a different question than I originally asked, and (b) after Step One, the reading seemed to go in an entirely different direction. Perhaps (b) isn't so much of a problem, though, since, as Paul has said, we should use whichever layers pop into our minds, and the reading process, I suspect, eventually doesn't happen so sequentially (i.e. Step One, then Step Two, etc.), but rather all the steps happen at once, so I think it's okay that I didn't end up using all the things I noticed in Step One (noticing details of the pictures, flora, fauna, etc.). But this is only my first attempt. I'm sure future attempts will go more smoothly. -- Lee Thanks for diving in like this, Lee. Absolutely beautiful reading. Now, there are three ways to look at the question posed by your comment: The tarot answered your most important question, which was not articulated (i.e. what is most important is not about the public's reception to your book, but the sequelae of your partner's involvement in the matter) The tarot answered your question as worded : "How will my book be received?" By whom? By the most salient entity involved, you and your partner as a collective. The tarot answered your question as intended and was, in fact, speaking about how your book will be received by the public. This would, of course, require a different spin on the cards. It all depends on the school of thought with which we approach the reading. If we are context-strict: we will strictly stick to the (intended) context of the reading as the backdrop; therefore, we must corral our interpretations into this boundary. That is to say, the Tarot answered what we asked it to answer, plain and simple. It did not veer. It did not waver. It did not answer something else, if not asked. As long as the question was clear, of course. The value in this approach is that it keeps you excrutiatingly honest. On the other hand, if we believe that the Tarot intuitively directs us to other more salient subtleties, then we may follow. We are then open to the idea that the question we intended to ask, consciously, is not the question we most needed answered, subconsciosly. This allows the Tarot to become a more powerful tool of subconscious communication. Or, conversely, we risk making the readings so fluid that we are at risk for biased interpretations. Personally, I think our intention in the reading, coupled with a well-worded question is the key. So, when you asked, "How will my book received?" what was your intention? Did you intend to ask about fiscal matters? "Received" in the sense of sales? Reviews? Contributions to tarot exegesis? Did you have your partner's ideas and concerns on the brain? I believe that this gives us the bona fide contextual backdrop for the interpretations. Of course, the cards you threw were designed for you. So, I cannot truly look over your shoulder and suggest anything, except to say just how IMPRESSED I am by your facility with these new concepts! It is truly a delight to see someone else play with these ideas. From a p.o.v. of whether the theoretical constructs were applied in a technically correct manner? You betcha!!!! You processed that tarot grammar liked you owned the place. YOu made a wonderfully fluid sentence out of all of the Steps and multiple layers of meaning. Woweeee. Well, that's why you're a prolific tarot writer. For practice, try the interpretation of those same cards, but in a context-strict manner. Pretend those cards DID answer your articulated question. It'll show you the fluidity of the interpretation and how context-strictness will change the reading. Now, Ill throw a wrench into it. Yup, I've experienced when the cards answer something I didn't intend (consciously) to ask. Hmmmmm. Now what? :eek: More posts are coming to answer your other comments. Oh - finally! You are absolutely right. The Steps start merging together and are less sequential. However, even the sequential pace is just fine. When I'm tired, I just take it one step at a time. In these cases, you do find yourself modifying prior impressions. I keep that to a bare mininum, because I don't want to sterilize a reading with intellectualization. (I have a habit of that, ya' know).

Paul	05 Dec 2004
Quote: Going back to the Minors, though, Paul, would you mind saying a few words about the Court cards specifically? We've seen from your examples what your general approach to them is, and that Knights=Cardinal, Queens=Mutable, and Kings=Fixed, but is there anything else we should know about how you go about interpreting them? Sure! Here's a few words: ;) The courts were my nemesis when I first started Tarot Reading. It seemed that the possibilities for meanings were so broad that I had a kind of “reader’s block” when they appeared in a tableau. I’ve made friends with the Courts since. To make sense of the Courts, I took into consideration what the Tarot cards variously may have meant when the tarot was constructed: Major Arcana: Virtues, Vices, Archetypes, Estates of Man Minor Arcana: Daily matters Courts: People mainly; maybe some events So, I decided to stay fairly traditional. Despite a lot of modern scholarship on the Tarot, which construxts post-modernized meanings, so to speak, and gave the Courts (and the cards) very psycho-emotional-spiritual meanings, I wondered what the cards may have meant from a more primitive interpretation. For example, if I were a child looking at the courts, I would simply interpret them as people, maybe doing something, but still quite simply people. If I knew something about Medieval social roles, I would probably infiltrate my impressions of the courts with “functions,” as well. I also had a healthy admiration for traditional meanings and appreciated those “cartomancers” that came before us. So, a Court card may represent the following layers: People w/ suit attributes or roles An action (or series of actions) according to Court functions Tradition Astrological significations To tie them into the Minor Arcana (this system varies from Papus in assignations): 1,2,3’s: Cardinal Signs. The Knights. 4,5,6’s: Fixed Signs: The Kings 7,8,9’s: Mutable Signs: The Queens 10’s: Transitional number: The Pages [*] Regarding Knights as Cardinal and Queens as Mutable, these could be switched (and often are in Tarot textbooks). Follow your nose on this matter. So, to elaborate: The Knights can start something, but do not have staying power. Just like the 1-3’s, the Knights’ resulting phenomena are not fully matured. (BRAHMA or Yod). The Kings have great staying power, but may resort to masculine fixation and control. Therefore, they often have to deal with the friction from this fixating approach, which is embodied in the oppositional energy of 4-6. (SHIVA or He). The Queens are the most sophisticated, coupling masculine power with feminine modulation, yielding completion. (VISHNU or Vau). The Pages are the He-final , which is the most corporeal formation of Yod/He/Vau and most probably concerned with the practical manifestation of the matter. Pages are thus concerned with the nuts and bolts of matters: the small details, errands, to do lists, etc. As the 10, not embodied in the 1-9 series (3 series of 3), the Page is concerned with the auxiliary details and accouterments around the drama of the Court. For example, if we were to bake a cake: The Knight will definitely be initiating the project and be on the front lines monitoring it; the King will dictate the recipe (a carefully prescribed Court recipe, that is) and will be interested in monitoring the project to ensure it goes as planned; the Queen will have suggested clever and special modifications to the ingredients; and the Page will be running around gathering the ingredients, cleaning up after the Knight, and thinking about whether there will be enough cake to serve the Court, whether this special oven is hot enough or too hot, how to get the cake from the kitchen to the table, and how to best aesthetically serve the cake, etc. Here’s a summary of (hopefully) simple ideas for the courts (pardon my possibly poor use of the French terms): Most often the Roy’s & Reyne’s are adult people, but may represent Decisions or Reflective Periods, respectively. Most often, Cavaliers are proceedings (series of purposeful actions). Occasionally, a Cavalier appears in order to represent a young adult (21 +). Most often, Valets are errands and necessities, minor/supportive actions (that are nonetheless necessary enough to the plotline to bring up), but once in awhile, they are young people 20 yrs and younger (roughly the age when Page/Valet/Squires would graduate into Knighthood). [indent] If a person, Valet’s are those whose welfare depended upon a certain servitude or submission to an older, more experienced social echelon. At least in America, young people attending school through college (usually up to 20) are indentured, so to speak, to authority figures until graduation, always serving someone. Even those who do not pursue secondary education are often extra-dependent due to lack of further education or job skills. [/indent] The Court “functions” I see as the following: Valets : Servants, service, employment, help, errands, lists, the little daily matters, an episode in a larger matter, and by tradition: information (letters, emails, newspapers, phone, internet, etc). A subordinate by conditions of age. Cavaliers : Purposeful action that is time limited (quest-like) but longer than the Valet (the Valet performs those smaller actions to support the Knight’s longer actions). The CARDINAL sign. A subordinate by role. The Knight was associated more with a role (what he DOES than who he IS). The actual personage of importance was the KING or QUEEN for whom the action of the Knight is performed. So, there is a sense of egolessness with the Knight; therefore, the Knights do not primarily signify people. Roy’s : Decisive action. Control, deals, decisions, fixation, offensive (as in game terms) acton, and of course an authority figure. The FIXED sign. Reyne’s : Reflection. Medieval Queenship perhaps was a relativized role (to that of the patriarchical mandates). Thus, Queens signify roles & actions which are ongoing, oscillating, yielding, modulating, defensive action, moderating, tolerating, reflecting. The Medieval Queens were imbued conversely with “Daughters of Eve” and “Sisters of (Virgin) Mary” status. The MUTABLE sign. Still an authority figure. Here’s some modern applications (by no means exhaustive): Valet de Coupe: Sweetness, kindness. Or, those little, nice, subtle gestures of emotional kindness. A note, some flowers, a phone call to an old friend. A box of chocolates. Young, sensitive person. Tradition: Idealism, kindnessness. Cavalier de Coupe: New romance and its accouterments (dating, phone calls, smooches, etc). Or, the gathering of family and friends for special occasions. Tradition: Arrival, seduction. Roy de Coupe: A family man. Or, making a decision that will have great psychological impact. By occupation, perhaps a therapist or metaphysician. Tradition: A virtuous/chivalric man. Reyne de Coupe: A mother or mother-figure. Or, the ongoing virtuous nurturance of something. By occupation nursing or nurturing professions. Tradition: A virtuous/wise woman. I understand that these definitions are gender stereotyped, but I wanted a system that drew from Medieval traditions and could still be applied to modern-day situations. Thus, the courts become archetypes of sorts, yet still valid to represent modern-day contingencies. Well, I suppose that describes the whole tarot. Of course, the big question is HOW do you know what is what? Which is which? Well, of course intuition is the first indicator (you’ll feel whether the card is flesh or spirit, so to speak). A primitive, childlike view helps: for example, two court cards next to each other, looking at each other, might immediately inspire a view that these are flesh & blood people. As well, the tarot grammar that I set up assists: Active: The court card is the querent; probably more role/function/action related. Passive: The court card is NOT the querent; likely a real person. Neutral (Around): The court card is AROUND the querent; could be a real person, could be a phenomenon. Here’s my bottom line with the courts: Even if you have layers of meaning going into any given Court card, the actual meaning when it hits the table will be QUITE SIMPLE; ridiculously simple. In fact, just one of the many possible attributes of the Court card will pop into your head and be correct (usually the first one). Once again, USUALLY (in my system) Kings & Queens are simply people. Otherwise, Kings represent Decisions/Decisiveness and Queens represent mutable Reflections/Contemplations/Considerations. Pages and Knights are usually phenomena/actions/functions/roles. If the person (or yourself) has younger people involved in the context of the question, then the Pages and/or Knights could move into a "person" identity. When the Kings and Queens represent people, the MOST SALIENT aspect of the person according to the context of the reading will represent itself, whether this is by suit attribution, role, or even hair coloring. Most important, be IRREVERENT to any of these expectations and toss out the whole lot of meanings if something spontaneously unique pops into your head regarding why a court card is appearing. For example, one time the King of Swords (R) made me think of his astrological attribute Aquarius, which made me think of “organizations…society”. In this reading, The King of Swords represented an impersonal Organization with which the client was dealing. Although this was not a common meaning, I ran with it. Let me close by saying something about hair & coloring being salient. Although, I have found that the classic attributions by Papus and even Eden Gray on the coloring of people to be rarely salient in readings, it has come up. For example, I have rarely seen the Reyne de Baston to be a "red-headed” female. Yet, in one reading, the work organization had 2 leaders, one with red hair and one with black hair. Lo and behold, the spread contained the Reyne de Baston and the Reyne Depee. Truly, hair-coloring was used to differentiate these two women, because hair color was the most salient aspect (of differentiation) when the two were paired together, not roles. By the way, their personalities were not significantly different.

Paul	05 Dec 2004
Quote: By Lee: Finally, I'd like to say that I hope some more people will decide to actively participate in this thread. I for one am having a great time. Come on in, the water's fine! Thanks, Lee. Of course, I understand that those who like the Rider-Waite decks may not find a fit for the Minor Arcana system detailed herein. Yet, perhaps the Tarot Grammar may find some interest. Anyway, I do welcome any input and am not in any way a fundamentalist with my personal system. (Meaning, I won't bite; in fact, I'm probably more afraid of being bitten by someone who doesn't like the system.) So, Come one, come all!

Paul	05 Dec 2004
Lee wrote: This will probably all clear itself up if and when Paul discusses his views of the Majors in more detail. -- Lee Took me long enough... Here’s my astrological attributions. I guess they can go here in this thread, since we’re starting to tie the Major Arcana with the Minor Arcana in my synthesized system. Basically, I understand the astrological overlay on the Major Arcana to be composed of the planetary rulerships and exaltations. Conversely, because we know the TdM beautifully symbolizes the juxtaposition of opposites, one could also say that every Rulership contains its own Detriment, and every Exaltation contains its own Fall. So, if a Major Arcana card indicates an Exaltation, for example, implied in the card is its Fall, as well. So, there’s two choices in this system I designed: Classical astrology via Ptolemy’s assignations Modern overlay with the planets Neptune, Uranus, and Pluto. Below, I will list the planet-in-sign assignations and capitalize the predominant energy (either planet or sign depending on exaltation or rulership). I should say that I sometimes see astrological glyphs hidden in the TdM pictures. I have absolutely no scholarship for this, but I am working on some scanned images to share with everyone, just for fun. I’ll provide both classical and modern versions; as always, take what you like and leave the rest, if you wanna take anything, that is: #1: PTOLEMAIC: Le Bateleur: GEMINI ruled by Mercury . La Papesse: MOON exalted in Taurus L’Imperatrice: MERCURY exalted in Virgo L’Empereur: MARS exalted in Capricorn Le Pape: JUPITER exalted in Cancer. Lamoureux: VENUS exalted in Pisces. Le Chariot: ARIES ruled by Mars Justice: LIBRA ruled by Venus L’Hermite: SATURN exalted in Libra La Roue: Part of Fortune (Or the Arabic Parts as a whole – Ptolemy kept Part of Fortune). La Force: LEO ruled by Sun Le Pendu: PISCES ruled by Jupiter La Mort: SCORPIO ruled by Mars Temperance: VIRGO ruled by Mercury Le Diable: South Node of Moon exalted in Sagittarius. Cauda Draconis, Dragon's Tail Le Maison: CAPRICORN ruled by Saturn L’Etoile: AQUARIUS ruled by Saturn La Lune: CANCER ruled by the Moon Le Soleil: SUN exalted in Aries Le Jugement: North Node of Moon exalted in Gemini. Caput Draconis, Dragon's Head Le Monde: TAURUS ruled by Venus Le Mat: SAGITARRIUS ruled by Jupiter. Comments: I gathered by my ideas from an iconographic analysis of the card, rather than any Hebrew letter, Kabbalistic associations, etc. I considered the traditional meanings of the cards with typical astrological meanings of planets and signs. As we all know, some matches were obvious, which were taken care of first, others fell into place by process of elimination. Then, further associations with these set-matches were found. L’Imperatrice as Mercury exalted in Virgo : I take a more classical European interpretation of the Empress (more in terms of eloquence, mind, communication, etc) than a Venusian view. The fact that male Mercury is in a female card still fits for me with Mercury’s associations with androgyny, and with the female Virgo iconography. See Anima Mercury . Also, compare TdM iconography for MERCURY exalted in Virgo (L'Imperatrice, suggestion of wings) and Mercury ruling VIRGO (Le Temperance, full wings). Perhaps, these two should be reversed? L'imperatrice should be ruling (VIRGO)? La Roue as Part of Fortune : This can be just the Part of Fortune, or inasmuch as there were close to 100 Arabic Parts, one can just add more spokes to the wheel). In any case, the glyph for Part of Fortune is a circle with an X inside. Compare with La Roue. The Moon’s Nodes: One could conceivably swap these two nodes, depending on how one interprets the cards and the nodes. #2: MODERN: Le Bateleur: GEMINI ruled by Mercury La Papesse: MOON exalted in Taurus L’Imperatrice: MERCURY exalted in Virgo. L’Empereur: MARS exalted in Capricorn Le Pape: JUPITER exalted in Cancer. Lamoureux: VENUS exalted in Pisces. Le Chariot: ARIES ruled by Mars Justice: LIBRA ruled by Venus L’Hermite: SATURN exalted in Libra La Roue: PLUTO exalted (in Leo) La Force: LEO ruled by Sun Le Pendu: PISCES ruled by Jupiter La Mort: SCORPIO ruled by Mars Temperance: VIRGO ruled by Mercury Le Diable: NEPTUNE exalted (in Cancer) Le Maison: CAPRICORN ruled by Saturn L’Etoile: AQUARIUS ruled by Saturn La Lune: CANCER ruled by the Moon Le Soleil: SUN exalted in Aries Le Jugement: URANUS exalted (in Scorpio) Le Monde: TAURUS ruled by Venus Le Mat: SAGITARRIUS ruled by Jupiter. Comments: The Moon’s nodes switch to the modern planets of Neptune and Uranus. By studying Neptune’s iconographic symbolism and various associations, one can arrive at the spirit of Le Diable. The Sky God Ouranos fits with Le Jugement. Pluto is associated with La Roue. Pluto/Hades was associated with Wealth and Riches. I like Pluto’s dual associations here with powerfully exalting or felling a person. He ruled the potential for wealth and riches and, of course, the Underworld. Well, these assignments could be debated forever. Once again, I recommend these only to myself. These provide me with divinatory information. Others, who have based their systems on other constructs are, in my view, just as respectable. After many years of trying to follow someone’s else’s construct, I threw my hands in the air and said “What makes sense to me?”

Paul	11 Dec 2004
I've composed 2 Diagrams derived from Papus' star system. If anyone is interested, please PM and I'll email you the large diagrams. Still toying with ways to post them here @ 300 x400. Diagram 1: Matches 1/10, 2/11, 2/12 etc (Theosophical reduction) Diagram 2: Matches 1/11, 2/12, 3/13 Both retain the Papus system of Yod/He/Vau/he. Diagram #2 matches with my original posts about how to match up the Major Arcana with the numerological system in the Minor Arcana.

Paul	11 Dec 2004
Oh, what the hec. I'll post them and see if you think they are readable.

Lee	12 Dec 2004
I've been practicing... I'm just going to set down some thoughts, observations and questions, in case they might be helpful to anyone else who wants to learn this system or who might in the future. Please note that these are my own opinions and may differ from Paul's. First, I think it's important to keep in mind that Paul has referred to this system in the thread's title as "tiered." It's a series of components, and if it all seems overwhelming at first, the best way to approach it is as just that, a bunch of components, any of which can be used exclusive of the others. I think even if one wants to learn the whole thing, the best way is to approach it one component at a time. Personally, I've determined to learn the whole thing, but in the end I may not end up using it all -- or I may. But I want to learn it all so I can try it out and determine for myself which parts are the most valuable for me. I think it's also important to understand the relationships between the components. The way I see it, each component stands basically alone, but has connections to the other components. Even when these connections are strong, though, I still think they're basically standalone components with connections rather than a grand unified scheme where everything fits together snuggly. For example, each pip card has its own decan (planet in sign). Each number of the pip cards also connects to two majors (i.e., 3's connect to the Empress and Death). In other words, when you get a 3 of Wands, the decan can inform the meaning, and the two majors can inform the meaning. But the connections only go so far. If you get the Empress, you can't look to the keyword (Progress) and planet (Jupiter) of the pip number 3, and you can't look to the decans for the 3's either. You can, however, look at the Empress in its place in the Papus system of three sets of three, i.e. Preservation of Commencement. This isn't a criticism of the system at all. I believe the structure of the deck prevents any kind of grand simplified theory where every part can connect directly to every other part. Such a system would mean shoehorning the cards into preconceived meanings to such an extent that the tarot would become meaningless. Rather, I admire Paul tremendously for creating a system which hangs together, with valid connections, as much as it does. The first component is the meanings of the numbers Ace through 10, along with the planets which Paul has assigned to the numbers. These can be used either with one's own suit meanings, or Paul's suit meanings. One could stop right there and have a perfectly sufficient method of reading the pip cards. I found it easy to memorize the keywords and planets in sequence, but learning them individually (i.e., "what's the 7 of Cups mean?" without mentally counting up from the Ace) was a bit harder. I took my deck, removed all but the pip cards, and just used them like flash cards until I had fully internalized that 7's are Creativity and Neptune, etc. I'm a little leery of the reversals. I haven't tried it yet, because I suspect it will take a bit of mental gymnastics, having recently learned the numbers, to reverse them all. But I do intend to learn them. I see it as necessary, because, as Paul has pointed out, they allow you to see both sides of the planets in question. The second component is the decans for the pip cards. I ran into a bit of trouble with this at first, because I had learned the planets assigned to the numbers, and suddenly we had a whole other set of planets. So, strictly speaking, the 4 of Cups will have two planets assigned to it: Uranus for all the 4's, and then Pluto (in Scorpio) for the 4 of Cups' decan. I see this as another example of what I mentioned above: two different systems which connect but still remain separate. So if you're looking at the 4 of Cups, you don't just shove Uranus and Pluto together, so to speak. Instead, you use Uranus to give you a fuller picture, after the keyword (Disruption in Relationships, R&R or Religion), of the number in the suit. Then, you can (if you desire or if it seems apropos in that reading) go further and consider the decan (Pluto in Scorpio). Paul has said he puts more emphasis on the sign than the planet anyway, so perhaps you wouldn't even reach the planet part of the decan. It's kind of like sinking through levels, and you stop at whatever level satisfies you at the moment. First level: keyword (number and suit). Second level: number planet. Third level: decan. Fourth level: connections with major cards. (Totally discounting for the moment, of course, visual cues from the images of the pip cards, which may actually be the primary influence.) As far as learning the decans, it's true, as Paul says, you don't have to memorize them. You can figure them out. But to do that, you need to have a good understanding with the zodiac wheel and the elements and modes (i.e. cardinal, fixed, mutable), and have practice in counting around the wheel (for instance, being able to name all the cardinal signs in order around the wheel, or all the fire signs in order, etc.). Fortunately, I've spent the last few years trying to force some beginning astrology into my little brain, so this isn't too much of a problem for me. But beginners to this system should know that for this particular component, they will either have to become proficient in the zodiac wheel or memorize the decans. For the Majors, we have Paul's original astrological attributions. I find these fascinating. I've looked at different sets of attributions, and I've even tried to make my own, but I think Paul has done a great job, and I like this set of attributions better than the GD's. Some of them are absolutely brilliant, like Sagittarius for the Fool and Virgo for Temperance. Paul, I know you're not into modern decks, but you may be interested to know that in the Mythic Tarot, the authors illustrate the Hermit as Chronos/Saturn. Also, regarding Mercury for a female card, in the Alchemical Tarot, artist Robert Place illustrated the World card as a female Hermes. When I first saw Paul's attributions I was a bit lost, what with all the rulerships and exaltations. However, if one were to simply delete the lower-case attributions and only keep the ones in capitals, one will end up with 12 signs and 10 planets, just like the GD system (but assigned to different cards). This may be a good way to approach it at first. I'm assuming that the rulerships and exaltations (the lower-case signs and planets) add influences that are more subtle than the upper-case ones. The "tarot grammar" method of laying out the cards is a completely separate component which could be used exclusively of the rest, and I think it would be a fun system to experiment with, especially for those who have played around with elemental dignities. For someone just starting to learn the entire system, I would recommend either learning the grammar part first, or learning the other stuff first and the grammar last. While you're learning the astrological attributions, it's hard to practice it while also practicing the grammar part at the same time. I'd really encourage folks to try this reading method out, even if you don't feel compelled to learn the rest of the system. It's really neat. For the Courts, I like what Paul has done. Regarding the gender stereotypes, which Paul has already noted, my personal approach would be to do everything as Paul has written, except that when the Kings and Queens refer to other people, I wouldn't take them to refer to actual gender. So a King could refer to a decisive authority figure who could just as likely be a woman as a man. For me, this solves the gender problem nicely without sacrificing the gist of Paul's approach. Paul, here's some questions for you, with the understanding as always that if any of these questions is awkward to address at this stage, please feel free to ignore it or leave it for later. For the Courts, the inevitable question... what do you do for reversed Courts? :) For the Majors, when you say you sometimes see astrological glyphs in the images, do you mean you actually see them in some of the cards to which they're assigned in your system? How intriguing. I've tried to look for them myself, and sometimes I can see suggestions of the shapes but nothing concrete. And by astrological glyphs, do you mean the general symbol (lion for Leo), or do you mean the actual glyph (for Leo, the curving upside-down-U shape)? Also for the Majors, and this is kind of a hard question to phrase, but to what extent does the astrological attribution determine the meaning of the Majors? Do you have your own personalized meanings for the Majors separate from their signs and planets, and then the signs and planets modify the meanings (like the decans subtly modify the more prominent pip card meanings), or do you look to the astrology to provide the basis for the card's meaning? I've asked a lot of questions over the course of this thread, and I don't want Paul to think that I feel he's in any way obligated to answer them or to keep posting new material on his system. All we can do is be grateful for what he's posted so far, and hope he continues. :) -- Lee

Paul	12 Dec 2004
Coming soon to a theatre near you -- the Alchemy layer. Lee - I'm preparing responses to your questions...

Lee	12 Dec 2004
Alchemy?!?!? Yikes! :eek: -- Lee :D

Paul	12 Dec 2004
Tell me about it. Could those alchemists be any more obscure?!!!!! Notwithstanding, yup...it's a comin'. But, not to worry, I worked it all in.

Paul	12 Dec 2004
lee wrote: I think it's also important to understand the relationships between the components. The way I see it, each component stands basically alone, but has connections to the other components. Even when these connections are strong, though, I still think they're basically standalone components with connections rather than a grand unified scheme where everything fits together snuggly. Right. In fact, when one reads with this system one's brain is not flooded with multiple layers which then requires having to spit out some meaning that amalgamates those layers. Too much of an intellectual feat! Too solar for this lunar divination activity. In practice, one layer tends to stick out as most cogent—that’s where your intuitive/psychic brain goes. Yet, as you have said, there is enough connection between the layers as to make them relatable in a grand scheme. Without philosophical acrobatics (I hope) the scheme stands together comprehensively. lee wrote: the connections only go so far. If you get the Empress, you can't look to the keyword (Progress) and planet (Jupiter) of the pip number 3, and you can't look to the decans for the 3's either. You can, however, look at the Empress in its place in the Papus system of three sets of three, i.e. Preservation of Commencement. If I understand you correctly, I would say, I agree. Indeed, the Major Arcana TRUMP the Minors; so, indeed, it does not work in reverse. The Empress stands on her own without being informed by the minors, because she trumps the minors. However, the Empress informs the minors. Of course, as we’ve discussed, the actual vibration will depend on how one lines up the Majors: (1/10, 2/11…or 1/11, 2/12). To each his or her own. lee wrote: The second component is the decans for the pip cards. I ran into a bit of trouble with this at first, because I had learned the planets assigned to the numbers, and suddenly we had a whole other set of planets. So, strictly speaking, the 4 of Cups will have two planets assigned to it: Uranus for all the 4's, and then Pluto (in Scorpio) for the 4 of Cups' decan. Here again, the idea that these are tiers or layers complement each other, but are not exactly the same. Indeed, this is not one big mixed cake, but a layered-cake. So, each cake-layer is indeed separate, but joins the whole as a complete “wedding cake”. It’s ok that one layer is chocolate and one is white-cake, as long as the flavors don’t clash. So, instead of thinking (on the 4 of cups): “Oh, I have to combine Uranus (4’s) with Pluto and Scorpio (decan) to generate an amalgamated meaning.” Too much intellectualization. Actually, just one of the possibilities floats to the surface as most salient. Psychically, or intuitively, (I don't mind the word psychic), it's as if one flavor amongst many becomes more favorFULL. Also, I fully encourage anyone to use whatever Decan system to which they aspire: Ptolemy (Picatrix) or Modern. Or, perhaps, one would substitute (classic) Mars for being ruler of Scorpio to form a Mars-in-Scorpio decan. I've experimented with all. As long as you allow yourself the liberal privilege of interpreting the decan combination (rather than following some strict scripture of Astrology), the decan meaning will harmonize with the other aspects of the cards. Fundamentally (oops, avoid that word), Basically, I see the combination of layers, not as if they are the same flavors, but as complementary flavors. It’s like an Italian Ice-cream with complementary flavors (each with differences) that combine into a delicious whole. Ok, that was corny. Lee wrote: I think Paul has done a great job, and I like this set of attributions better than the GD's….when I first saw Paul's attributions I was a bit lost, what with all the rulerships and exaltations. However, if one were to simply delete the lower-case attributions and only keep the ones in capitals, one will end up with 12 signs and 10 planets, just like the GD system (but assigned to different cards). This may be a good way to approach it at first. I'm assuming that the rulerships and exaltations (the lower-case signs and planets) add influences that are more subtle than the upper-case ones. Thanks, Lee. Many, many hours spent on those attributions over the years. Yes – the exaltation/rulership scheme is at first blurring. But, you get the hang of it: PLANET energy for exaltation, and SIGN energy for rulerships. I agree, combining both Planet/Sign energies (while still identifying a primary energy) add a nice element of sophistication to the card. Lee wrote: The "tarot grammar" method of laying out the cards is a completely separate component which could be used exclusively of the rest, and I think it would be a fun system to experiment with, especially for those who have played around with elemental dignities. Thank you. You know, necessity is the mother of invention. I stopped reading professionally and read for myself, friends, and family. Thus, the bias-factor was a clear & present danger. The grammar method really helped in corralling me into a particular interpretation, rather than me risking projecting into the cards. I swear by this method. What’s odd is, I believe I made it up. I mean to say, I haven’t found other scholarship for it, per se, but only scholarship that informs it, such as Paul Hughes-Barlow’s elemental dignities or the Aristolean elemental wheel. But, neither of these systems precisely reflects my Tarot Grammar system. And, yet, I’ve subjected it to scientific test and, it works! There’s the plasticity of Tarot. But, I'm sure some will find the fact that it is an almalgamation of ideas to be intolerable; some want antiquity behind these systems, with an authority (which I am not) espousing the system. Lee wrote: For the Courts, the inevitable question... what do you do for reversed Courts? Reversed courts are a “red flag,” so to speak. I immediately go to the dark side of the Force, as it were, and something problematic/negative pops into my head. As a general rule, I do not afford a prescribed interpretation to the Reversals. Instead, they indicate a “disruption in The Force” of the card. Most often, this tends to result in the simple preface of the upright meaning… “Good” meaning, reversed = “Problem with…” So, for example… Queen of Cups, reversed = “ Problem with home-making,” which came up for a friend who was pissed-off about being taken for granted around the house. One can extrapolate from this system that any “bad” card, reversed, could indicate… “Bad” meaning, reversed = “Resolution of…” So, for example… 8 of Cups, reversed = “ Resolution of obstacles in relationships,” which would suggest the Saturnian qualities of discipline and focus as applied to relationships. This would have the Saturnian "good" angle of harvesting, discriminating, separating, giving the card the sense of separating the wheat from the chaff and being more consciously loving, for example. The 8 of Cups Decan = Moon in Pisces. This could indicate a willingness to address the subterranean aspects of a relationship, or to enchant a relationship that is fluctuating. Papus’ system (reversed) would indicate 7’s as Commencement of the consummate problem , and 8’s as Opposition to that problem . Thus, Papus’ system (reversed) would support this idea of the 8 of Cups indicating working through the problem. The image of VIII Justice might come to mind and inspire ideas of weighing what’s important in the relationship. Or, perhaps XVIII The Moon, indicating again the idea of home and family and subterranean aspects. In the case of the reading for my friend, the Moon additionally signalled me to the hidden and suppressed resentments. If you did the Theosophical Reduction method it would be VIII with XVII Star, which might indicate the healing properties of water, and the ideas of Aquarius (looking outside oneself, unselfishly. In the case of this reading, the mother wanted the husband to appreciate how she poured out her own urns of attention and devotion on the family. Indeed, in any reading, your mind will dart around a bit within nanoseconds to provide information. Ok – where did I go there? Oh, yeah, the courts. Yes, just interpret the original Court meaning either as “problematic”. lee wrote: For the Majors, when you say you sometimes see astrological glyphs in the images, do you mean you actually see them in some of the cards to which they're assigned in your system? Yes. Like I say, I have no scholarship for this, and would have to check the glyphs that were in use when the Tarot was presumably invented to be sure, but I enjoy seeing the shapes of glyphs in the cards. For example, look at Temperance’s shoulder/wing/right-arm shape, as it wraps down to the hip. I see the classic shape of Virgo’s glyph. Look at the Hermit’s hump-back. I see Saturn’s glyph. Look at the collar on the imps on The Devil, can you see the South Node of the Moon? I’ll post them sometime. For some of the cards, I think the iconography substitutes for the glyph. lee wrote: Also for the Majors, and this is kind of a hard question to phrase, but to what extent does the astrological attribution determine the meaning of the Majors? Do you have your own personalized meanings for the Majors separate from their signs and planets, and then the signs and planets modify the meanings (like the decans subtly modify the more prominent pip card meanings), or do you look to the astrology to provide the basis for the card's meaning? Great question. I think I’ve said elsewhere that I don’t think of the Tarot as an astrological oracular machine; so, the astrology informs the meaning but does not dictate it. Generally, the Major Arcana are informed by their planet in sign combination; either the PLANET or the SIGN is emphasized, depending on whether it is an exaltation or a rulership. But, the Majors are informed from a plethora of iconographical associations, not astrological. As for the minors, the planet/sign combos tend to speak to “planet in astrological house” idea, rather than planet-in-sign, as the Majors. I see the minors as more mundane, thus they will portend more practical matters, as indicated by the house. In my own mini-book I have on this system at home, I indicate the house-meanings for the minor-astrological signs. For example, 1-3 Cups = 4th house Cancer, pertaining to house, family, relationships. 4-6 Cups = 9th house Scorpio, pertaining to joint possessions, sex, death, taxes, alimony, etc. 7-9 Cups = 12th house Pisces, pertaining to hidden matters, gut feelings, sorrow, confinements, fears, secrets, drugs. Sometimes, it is as simple as applying BRAHMA/SIVA/VISHNU to these Triptychs. For example, Ace of Cups = Brahma in the house of Cancer; Two Cups = Siva in the house of Cancer; Three Cups= Vishnu in the house of Cancer Hey, if this is what happens to pop into your head, amongst all other layer-possibilities, than that is what you are supposed to "see". ….So, once again, as you have noted Lee, although the layers seem overwhelmingly complicated at first, usually only one aspect of the layers will be significant. The point is not to censor the psychic impulse that comes through, even if it is a strange combination platter of layers. lee wrote: I've asked a lot of questions over the course of this thread, and I don't want Paul to think that I feel he's in any way obligated to answer them or to keep posting new material on his system. All we can do is be grateful for what he's posted so far, and hope he continues. Happy to oblige. :D Truly. If I forgot an inquiry, please reiterate.

Lee	13 Dec 2004
That's very helpful, Paul, the stuff about the houses with the pip cards. I know you mentioned them before but it hadn't really sunk in. What you wrote about reversals is helpful too. Food for thought. -- Lee

Lee	16 Dec 2004
Hi Paul, a little question about the Majors -- how do you determine the element of each Major? Is it through the sign? In other words, the Empress is MERCURY in Virgo, so the element would be Earth because of Virgo? -- Lee

Paul	18 Dec 2004
Sure... If we are talking rulership, then the SIGN is paramount, and simply use the element of the sign. If we are talking exaltation, then the PLANET is paramount, and I use I have tended to use standard associations of the planets: Sun = Fire Pluto = Fire Mars = Fire Jupiter = Fire Moon = Water Neptune (Moon South Node) = Water Mercury = Air Uranus (Moon North Node) = Air Venus = Earth Saturn = Earth However, one could borrow from the classical astrological attributes of HOT/COLD; MOIST/DRY and match these with Aristotlean elements: Fire = Hot & Dry ~ SUN & MARS are Hot and Dry Water = Cold & Moist ~ VENUS & MOON are Cold and Moist Air= Hot & Moist ~ JUPITER is Hot and Moist Earth= Cold & Dry ~ SATURN & MERCURY are Cold & Dry The Head of the Dragon is Masculine, thus Air fits, in tandem with Uranus. The "Tayle" of the Dragon is Feminine, thus Water fits, in tandem with Neptune. Here's a kind of table: PLANET............STANDARD............ARISTOTLE-TYPES ______________________________________________ Sun.................Fire...........................Fire Moon...............Water........................Water Saturn.............Earth.........................Earth Jupiter.............Fire...........................Air Mars................Fire...........................Fire Venus..............Earth.........................Water Mercury...........Air.............................Earth So, you can see that everything matches, except for Jupiter, Venus, and Mercury. So, to answer your example of The Empress as MERCURY in Virgo (which is to say MERCURY exalted in Virgo, so the planet is emphasized). Thus, Mercury is according to standard associations Airy, but if you use the Aristotle program it would be Earthy. What do you think?

Paul	17 Jan 2005
It’s been awhile. Before I launch into the Alchemical layer, why don’t I review my Tarot Grammar system and enhance it more with information about how a sentence is constructed “naturally” by means of how the cards fall in sequence. That is, how do you determine the natural nomenclature and linkages of the sentence? Here’s a refresher on the preliminary rules, based on extrapolating from the Rotation of the Elements, with this helpful article: Cups/Water = Cold + Wet Swords/Air = Hot + Wet Wands/Fire = Hot + Dry Coins/Earth = Cold + Dry Grammatically, I am first interested in whether a card’s “meaning” is in the Active or Passive tense. I am also interested in whether it is Strong or Weak, you could also say Increasing or Decreasing. Of course, there is a third option (this system always seems to come in 3’s), which is the combination of the two: Active + Passive = Neutral Strong + Weak = Static or Inert, this would equate with Ongoing. Back to the Elemental properties and grammar… *First, equate Active/Passive with Hot/Cold. *Then, equate Strong/Weak with Wet/Dry *How do you get Neutral or Static? You’ll see that they are the combination of Hot/Cold or Wet/Dry Here are the grammatical equivalencies: *Active = Action coming from the querent. *Passive = Action happening to the querent *Neutral = a.k.a. Atmospheric, around the querent. *Static = a.k.a. Inert, regular energy level, or Ongoing. To arrive at the grammatical “tense” of a card, you need 2 Modifiers, which you will combine together to form the grammar. See previous posts, but in short, you would lay out 3,5, or 7 cards (7 is not recommended for beginners!) with modifiers. Those familiar with the Opening of the Key Spread, which Paul Hughes Barlow and others have made popular could conceivably use the 2 modifiers nestling around each card in the spread. I use a simple sentence string of 3 rows… GRAMMAR ROW #1: ************** SENTENCE ROW:……************** GRAMMAR ROW #2: ************** As you’ll see in the attached example, I tend to lay down the Grammar Rows first, then lay ON TOP the sentence row. This naturally brings the sentence row to the foreground. Since you only need the suits (e.g. Coins) for the Grammar Rows (not the particular card, per se, e.g. 6 of Coins), it’s ok that they are hidden. This also helped when reading at Faires, and I did not have such a huge space. - Thus, each Card in the Sentence Row has two Modifiers: One Above; One Below. I’ll re-attach my Legend of combinations. But, honestly, after you memorize the principles of this Grammar system, you don’t need a key—you’ll combine them very quickly (nanoseconds!) in your head. The next level of understanding is to appreciate how these Grammar structures merge together to form a viable sentence. While I think that INTUITION is the most powerful indicator here, there are some strong grammatical indicators that will dictate how you read a sentence—that is, how you put it together in a sensible story. SEE THE ATTACHMENT FOR THE SAMPLE READING… Here’s a typed version for those without access to the attachments. Let’s say this reading is about a question regarding a woman who wants a change in venue . This is the PAST : GRAMMAR ROW 1:…AS……...5S.…….6CU…..9S…..2W SENTENCE ROW:…10CU.…...5CU..….KCO…7W….5CO GRAMMAR ROW 2:….9W……6S..…….8CO….ACO...4W So, as an example, the 10 of Cups (Card 1) is modified by the Ace of Swords and the 9 of Wands. Remember, for the GRAMMAR rows, all you need is the element. I don’t read the actual GRAMMAR cards’ meanings, only the element. 10 of Cups—The Home, the City one resides, Family. Modified by: Ace of Swords/ Swords/ Air = Cold and Wet, or Passive and Strong + 9 of Wands/ Wands/ Fire = Hot and Dry, or Active and Weak = Neutral and Static * Thus, the grammar for the 10 of Cups will be Neutral and Static. * It would read something like, “For a long while (Static), your family has been an ever present fixture in your life around you, but not something that you feel you are actively participating in, nor withdrawing from (Neutral). Perhaps, your children are older?” But, how do you go on to keep the sentence going? The next card is the 5 of Cups, but how does this card fit with the sentence? First, just note the grammar, as usual: - The 5 of Cups is modified by two sword-cards: Thus, combined = Hot and Wet, thus Active and Strong. * So, it makes sense that the first card (in the Neutral & Static) tense, followed by an Active and Strong card , would mean that the card speaks of the querent’s response to the prior card. * So, if I take the 5 of Cups to mean something like Intelligence in Emotions, or trying to Work an Emotional Matter through , I would say that the 5 of Cups (Active/Strong) would be responsive to the 10 of Cups (Neutral & Static) would sound like this… At any rate, you responded to this with a sure psychological vigor. ” The CUPS suggest a relationship. How so? Hmmm. How about the next card… King of Coins. Now, the King of Coins in this spread is Passive (Cups + Coins, both passive); moreover, it is an Inert energy (ongoing) (Cups/Strong + Coins/Weak, cancel each other out to make Inert). * Thus, the querent is now ACCEPTING SOMETHING that has been there all along from the King of Coins. In this reading, the King of Coins is the woman’s husband and money-maker. He distributes income—for what? Well, he’s looking at the card to his right. So, we’ll see…At any rate, here’s what I might say… * “In response to your static home life, you decided to become receptive to something, likely financial or physical, from the King of Coins. Your husband? His offer has been longstanding…he’s always been generous.” * Now, just a note on the King of Coins. If the grammar tense had been ACTIVE, the King of Coins would take on other possibilities… - Perhaps he is the Querent making a financial decision. - Perhaps the Querent is approaching the King of Coins (which is to say, he’s not naturally offering). One could probably come up with other ideas. Intuition plays a big part here, but I hope you can see, the combination or SEQUENCE of grammar, often strongly suggests a certain interpretation angle. The next card is the 7 of Wands, modified by Sword + Coin (which yields: Neutral and Inert). This card therefore is something around the Querent, probably static or there for some time. * I take one TIER of the 7 of Wands to mean Neptune in Wands, so this brings an idea of imagination, dreams, and vision to the realm of Career, say. It would fit, then that the 7 of Wands speaks of the querent’s Career Potential (which has been there for some time, but not something she has actively engaged within). The King of Coins is looking at the 7 of Wands; consequently, he seems to approve. * ”…The King of Coins seems to approve of you delving into the community more, perhaps a career; these would be career visions you’ve had for some time. Suggested here is that you put them on hold while your children were younger.” Finally! The last card is the 5 of Coins, modified by two wand-cards, thus decidedly Hot (Active), but also Dry (Weak). * I take one TIER of the 5 of Coins to be Mercury in the suit of Coins. Thus, this could be the opening salvo of the ACTIVE investment of resources in this business venture. However, cerebral Mercury suggests more planning, actually. In any event, the Coins here, in an active tense, suggest then that the Career idea of the querent is self-employment. * If the card was 5 of Wands , I would think more in terms of a standard employment. But, what do you think the Dry or Weak element here means? I took it to mean that the Querent was not strongly confident about this investment. Here’s the GRAMMAR sequence only, with my notes underneath: Neutral/Static…..Active/Strong…..Passive/Static…..Neutral/Static…..Active/Strong SITUATION…..RESPONSE…….WITH ACTION FROM….INVOLVING…FINAL ACT Ok, so here’s the reading in its totality: * “{Neutral & Static 10 Cups}For a long while, your family has been an ever present fixture in your life around you, but not something that you feel you are actively participating in, nor withdrawing from. Perhaps, your children are older? *{Active & Strong 5 of Cups} At any rate, you responded to this with a sure psychological vigor, to find something creatively stimulating. *{Passive & Static King of Coins} It seems there was an opportunity there all along. A man with money (your husband, the current provider) was willing to offer you help. It would seem that this offer has been longstanding. Perhaps, now you are able to consider it. *{Neutral & Static 7 of Wands} It would have to do with creative ideas regarding a career plan. Once again, not so much a new idea, as the cards indicate this has been an idea for awhile. *{Active & Strong 5 of Coins} In response, you invested (or made a business plan to invest) your own money in this venture (or the King's money, depending on how your marriage sets up financial arrangements), which would suggest something more entrepreneurial.” Perhaps I can provide more example, but I imagine that this was tedious to get through. However, I should say that this is only tedious in the beginning. After you learn the rules, I guarantee that this will become fluid and fast. You simply won't have to think it through so much; it will have a quicksilver-like flow to it. So, for those who think -- Whoah! Too intellectualized system for me! I would only say that it doesn't feel that way once you learn it. Here’s some basic grammatical ideas. You don’t really have to memorize them, they just make intuitive sense: * An Active card followed by a Passive card, likely indicates something happening to the querent in response to the querent's actions. * A Passive card followed by an Active card, likely indicates the querent’s response to the prior passive event. * Neutral cards should never be interpreted as coming from or happening to the querent, they are environmental or atmospheric. * Two or more Active Cards in a row tend to indicate a compound sentence structure: ACTION1 and ACTION2 and ACTION3… * Likewise, Two or more Passive Cards in a row tend to indicate a compound sentence EVENT1 and EVENT2… * The only exception here is that the sequence of cards can indicate ADJECTIVES or ADVERBS. I'll go into this in another post. - EVENT1 + ADJECTIVE, or - ACTION1 + ADVERB * In fact, whenever a grammar tense repeats itself, this is usually an indicator that the conjunction “and” should be used to connect the cards. * Whenever a Neutral card is followed by an Active card, this usually indicates the querent’s response to the environmental situation. * Whenever a Card of an opposite type of meaning is followed by a Card of another type of meaning, it may indicate that the word “but” should be used… For example, 3 CUPS (Active) + 8 COINS (Passive) = The querent wants to go on holiday, but heavy work obligations await. These two cards have opposite meanings -- i.e. leisure and heavy work. You’ll come up with your own insights, from seeing the countless combinations and sequences of grammar tenses. What will be interesting is to see how the Grammar Modifiers make such a difference in how one interprets, not only ONE card, but a SEQUENCE of cards. It truly keeps you honest.

Paul	06 Feb 2005
Let’s review the Hindu Gunas and match them up with the Trimurti. Then, to provide a gender-balance to the system, we’ll look at the female CONSORTS of Brahma, Siva, and Vishnu for added richness. In regards to the Gunas – Rajas, Tamas, and Sattva, I have encountered confusing works on the internet in regards to whether Rajas or Sattva serve the function of the balancing force. After much ado, I ultimately kept the sequence as follows, but follow your bliss: Rajas – Active, Beginning Tamas – Passive, Opposition Sattva – Balanced, Equilibrium So, back to Papus’ Triptych system: RAJAS/ BRAHMA/ Commencement of…/ The CARDINAL signs. Aces: Rajas/ Brahma of BRAHMA/ Commencement of the commencement 2’s: Tamas/ Siva of BRAHMA/ Opposition to the commencement 3’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of BRAHMA/ Equilibrium (Preservation) of the commencement TAMAS/ SIVA/ Opposition to…/ The FIXED Signs 4’s: Rajas/ Brahma of SIVA/ Commencement of the Opposition 5’s: Tamas/ Siva of SIVA/ Opposition to the Opposition 6’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of SIVA/ Preservation of the Opposition SATTVA/ VISHNU/ Preservation of…/ The MUTABLE signs 7’s: Rajas/ Brahma of VISHNU/ Commencement of the Preservation 8’s: Tamas/ Siva of VISHNU/ Opposition to the Preservation 9’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of VISHNU/ Preservation of the Preservation So, how can one apply this methodology to practical numerological analysis? I find interesting insights all of the time. But, here’s some basics: The RAJASIC numbers (with a gross quality of RAJAS) will have an active, quickening quality about them, for better or for worse: 1,4,7 The TAMASIC numbers have a passive, slowing quality about them, for better or for worse: 2,5,8 The SATTVIC numbers have a balancing, retaining quality about them, for better or for worse: 3,6,9 Then, you can compare and contrast numbers, within the specific GUNA: RAJASIC NUMBERS 1 = SUN: Rajas of RAJAS. Active Action. Very active number with much potential, but like all ACES, it is action without form, yet. 4 = URANUS or NORTH NODE: Rajas of TAMAS. Active Oppositional Force. This number has a disrupting, interrupting tone. 7 = NEPTUNE: Rajas of SATTVA. Active Balancing Force. Force that balances, harmonizes, it is well crafted. Thus, when a 1,4 or 7 appears in any suit, the reader knows this card speaks of clear and present pro-action. Here, the 4 embodies Uranus’ negative qualities, in contrast to the Solar potency of the 1 and the Neptunian sophistication of the 7. TAMASIC NUMBERS: 2 = MOON: Tamas to RAJAS. Opposition to Action – slowing, tempering forces. 5 = MERCURY: Tamas to TAMAS. Opposition that is opposed. Very mercurial number because of the friction of tamas opposing tamas here. Imagine a debate with two gifted orators, two sticks rubbed together. 8 = SATURN: Tamas to SATTVA. Opposition to Balance. Sophisticated, synthesizing oppositional forces. Very oppositional number, because it must oppose sattvic (sophisticated) action. Thus, when a 2,5, or 8 appears, the readers knows this card speaks of clear and present re-action (or reaction). Here, the 5 embodies Mercury’s positive qualities, in contrast to the Lunar passivity of the 2 and the Saturnian obstacles of the 8. SATTVIC NUMBERS: 3 = JUPITER: Sattva of RAJAS. Balance of Action. An organizing, forming, coagulating, inert quality to this number. 6 = VENUS: Sattva of TAMAS. Balance of opposition. Inert, static opposing force. A complex tamasic quality, i.e. complications, lethargy, overdetail. Venus here has a “maze-like” feeling, trapped. Think of a garden...overgrown. 9 = MARS: Sattva of SATTVA – Synthesizing of all forces to produce the most strong, balancing phenomena. Thus, when a 3, 6, or 9 appears, the reader knows this card speaks of a flow or undulation of forces. Here, the 6 embodies Venus’ negative qualities, in contrast to the Jupiterian organization of the 3 and the Martian strength of the 9. Let’s see how this works, pragmatically. Take the :CL suit in its RAJASIC form. I use the mnemonic “Relationships/Religion/R&R” for Cups. For the sake of simplicity, let’s choose “Relationships”: Ace :CL – Much potential in the area of relationship. It could be the investment within a new relationship, or the revivification of an ongoing relationship. 4 :CL – Disruption in relationship. Dissatisfaction, rows. 7 :CL – Expansion and sublimation of relationship. Finding newfound peace, spiritualization of the relationship. Finding the best in each other. You can see Papus’ THESIS—ANTITHESIS—SYNTHESIS in this Triptych: Ace :CL – Thesis, the relationship begins. 4 :CL – Antithesis, the honeymoon’s over! 7 :CL – Synthesis, the parties in the relationship integrate the shadow and light side of the relationship via conscious, mystical loving. Now, let’s try the :OL suit in its TAMASIC form. I use the mnemonic “Home/Holdings/Health” for Coins. For the sake of simplicity, let’s choose “Holdings” or money and assets: 2 :OL –Challenges to tracking and adapting to income limits. Frittering it away on nebulous purchases with credit cards. The MOON rules the 2’s—thus, there’s a feeling here of, Where did the money go? The Lunar silvery glistening Platinum credit card. ;) 5 :OL – Getting a Microsoft Money program, reading Internet advice on investment and mentally committing to a new regime of money management. 8 :OL –Accumulated credit card bills impinging upon the querent. You can see Papus’ THESIS—ANTITHESIS—SYNTHESIS in this Triptych: 2 :OL – Thesis, the resources are mismanaged. 5 :OL – Antithesis, enough is enough, let’s get organized. 8 :OL – Synthesis, well…too little too late. Now, due to frivolous spending, some inevitable bills must be paid off. So, now there’s a synthesis of mismanagement and organization. The querent is organizing the mismanagement (paying off credit cards). Finally, let’s try the :SL suit in its SATTVIC form. I use the mnemonic “Power/Plans/Politics” for Swords. For the sake of simplicity, let’s choose “Plans”. Let’s say the plans are in regards to completing the application work to work overseas: 3 :SL – Harmonized, balanced plans. The countries of intention are identified and information has been gathered. Optimism rules. 6 :SL – Oh my goodness, the forms are complex, the bureaucracy is suffocating, what a maze of confusion! 9 :SL –Pushing through it, narrowing of the list to the most realistic, and completion of the paperwork (Note: A 10 of swords would indicate that the efforts paid off in victory.) I’ll let you do the Thesis/Antithesis/Synthesis yourself. _____________________________________________________________________ Of course, you may have already figured out that the triad of numbers that are considered Rajasic, Tamasic, and Sattvic have a higher layer to them. Consider this diagram again… RAJAS Aces: Rajas 2’s: Tamas 3’s: Sattva TAMAS 4’s: Rajas 5’s: Tamas 6’s: Sattva SATTVA 7’s: Rajas 8’s: Tamas 9’s: Sattva So, as you can surmise, the 1-3’s have a subtle RAJASIC quality to them. The 4-6’s have a subtle TAMASIC quality to them. The 7-9’s have a subtle SATTVIC quality to them. Consquently, I tend to think of the number series in this subtle way: 1-3’s = describe young, simpler phenomena 4-6’s = describe working through problems 7-9’s = describe finding solutions This adds another subtler element to the system. Ok – finally, I thought I would add in the female CONSORTS to the Hindu Trimurti. As you know, Hinduism loves the balancing of polar opposites. Brahma with SARASWATI (knowledge, creative arts, endeavors) Siva with PARVATI (aka Durga, Kali—both have destructive aspects, opposing) Vishnu with LAKSHMI (beauty, grace, eloquence, harmony, balance) The Siva/Parvati/Durga/Kali match is complicated. I’ll let interested parties explore on the Web at will. In another post, we'll compare the subtleties of matching numbers with the same Guna combinations, but in different amounts: 2 and 4 3 and 7 6 and 8 Then, there are other numbers: 1 Rajasic double 5 Tamasic double 9 Sattvic double

Paul	06 Feb 2005
Hi all - some of you have PM'd me that you are enjoying the posts, albeit a somewhat lonely post...:(, with encouragement to keep posting. Indeed, I know that Lee is busier than [fill in blank]...so he can't post at present. But, please feel free to post in the thread, whether it's good, bad, or ugly. ;) Love to hear your input, rather than the echo of my own voice...my own voice...my own voice...my...

pandora	07 Feb 2005
I think Lee expressed all our questions so eloquently we just left him and you to it. We may not be there in posts but are here in spirit! Thank you so much for all the work you are doing, the printer is fired up again for the next installment of “Paul’s Book.” I am really excited with the grammar lay out and have been practicing like Lee with 3 cards. Wow does it keep you honest! No more ……. “Yep, there he is causing all our problems!” With two air cards sitting underneath I had to take ownership. (Not something I do willingly on a regular basis!) Verbalizing what I see in my cards has also been a major stumbling block and to now have a system that helps form a sentence is wonderful. You have put enthusiasm and direction back into this mammoth learning curve of tarot I am on. I am using my RWS for now because I know(?) them and it is working beautifully. I understand that....... Quote “1.Most of my system is designed for unillustrated pips, and 2. My Minor Arcana system in most of its layers won't likely work with Rider-Waite's or Crowley's or their offspring, because the meanings of the Waite/Golden Dawn decks are circumscribed by the scenes on the minors.” ......but using my RWS hasn’t caused any problems yet, everything seems to be coming together for me. I hear the gasps!!!!! Yes blasphemy to some, but I am having an extremely hard time finding and then grasping Waite’s intended meanings and I am comfortable using P.C.S’s art with Paul’s system. My Astrology knowledge is nil but with a copy of The Astrology Encyclopedia, by James R. Lewis, beside me I have managed to place all of Paul’s Minor Arcana system onto a wheel diagram and it is amazing how much easier it is to understand all these new concepts and really “see” how they come together. Just an idea that may help someone on this journey too. My one problem was with the tens so I stuck them all together in a circle at the center with the Pluto/Virgo glyphs. Paul, looking at your diagram from Papus, the 1, 2, 3, & 10, 11, & 12 are YOD, Brahma, commencement. I have found that the 1-11, 2-12, 3-13 pairings are more to my liking. I am making a diagram to better understand and remember this concept but I am unsure about what to place in the final HE, TRIMURTI. Would it be 10 20 21 and would that mean 10 = Brahma/Trimurti, 20 = Siva/Trimurti, 21 = Vishnu/Trimurti? Or are they all just Trimurti/Trimurti, a combination of all three. (Lee where are you to explain my question?) And the Fool, 0, does he just drift in and out of all? I am off to study your new post. Hope Lee has the time to ask all my questions coherently! Thanks again Paul Pandora

Paul	07 Feb 2005
pandora wrote: I think Lee expressed all our questions so eloquently we just left him and you to it. We may not be there in posts but are here in spirit! Lee is sure eloquent. But, rest assured, your questions are clear as crystal.;) pandora wrote: ...the grammar lay out and have been practicing like Lee with 3 cards. Wow does it keep you honest! Yes, indeed. In fact, I synthesized such a format, because my personal Tarot reading-- i.e. for myself and loved ones-- was sooooo suspect to bias. I'd do readings (before the grammar system) and record them. Then, later check the accuracy and think...Whew! Was I ever self-serving in that one. Once you learn the grammar (and stick to it, even when it hurts) you become painfully aware of all of the plethora of ways we can tweak sentence structure to serve what we want the reading to say! Quote: Verbalizing what I see in my cards has also been a major stumbling block and to now have a system that helps form a sentence is wonderful. You have put enthusiasm and direction back into this mammoth learning curve of tarot I am on. Thank you so much! Yes, I find that figuring out the grammatical structure is fun (and easy) once you learn the rules. The way a sentence is most likely to be read becomes readily apparent. Quote: I am using my RWS for now because I know(?) them and it is working beautifully...using my RWS hasn’t caused any problems yet, everything seems to be coming together for me. I hear the gasps!!!!! Yes blasphemy to some, but I am having an extremely hard time finding and then grasping Waite’s intended meanings and I am comfortable using P.C.S’s art with Paul’s system. Oooooh. Intriguing. I'm happy to hear more as you go along. I've got a RWS around here. I should give it a check-er-rooni. Quote: Paul, looking at your diagram from Papus, the 1, 2, 3, & 10, 11, & 12 are YOD, Brahma, commencement. I have found that the 1-11, 2-12, 3-13 pairings are more to my liking. Yes. As you know, I don't worship Papus. In fact, I veer from him in several ways. Using the 1-11, 2-12 combination sequence is one deviation. Does that make me a deviant? }) I find sensible typical "opposites" pairings with the 1-11, 2-12 way. As I have said, the Tarot operates on the tension and resolution of polarities (Yod/He/Vau...). I think the key to appreciating the pairings (e.g. 4/14. 5/15. 6/16) is to think in terms of opposites. But, not exactly polar opposites like antonyms, more like the opposite of the negative of a photograph-- same image, looked at a different way. If you play with this idea, the Majors-pairings each contain a basic similarity and then a polarity thrown in for tension. Quote: I am making a diagram to better understand and remember this concept but I am unsure about what to place in the final HE, TRIMURTI. Would it be 10 20 21 and would that mean 10 = Brahma/Trimurti, 20 = Siva/Trimurti, 21 = Vishnu/Trimurti? What do you think? (That's not a tricky, sneaky question, like Come now little grasshopper and find the inner answer that I want you to find sort of thing. I am sincerely interested in what you think.) I've attached some sample iconography of Brahma, Siva, and Vishnu and the diagram I made, originally.It's really a matter of how you position the cards. Look at the bottom of the diagram. We have WHEEL (LEFT), WORLD (CENTER) and JUDGMENT (RIGHT). Or, WHEEL (Underneath the first triangle string), WORLD (in the center), and JUDGMENT (Underneath the right triangle string). So, you could go from left to right: Wheel = BRAHMA World = SIVA (Think of Siva in his dancing form in a fiery wheel, Nataraj -- attached) Judgment = VISHNU (Vishnu is well known for his preservation qualities, sending Avatars to earth to preserve it. Perhaps the Angel is coming to Preserve-- rather than destroy as in fundamentalist Christian theology.) But, maybe there's a triangle shape. See the diagram attached, with Yod at the top, He to the left, and Vau to the right, just like all of the triangles: World = BRAHMA (notice the heads in four directions) Wheel = SIVA (creating and destroying...I will reign...I reign...I have reigned...) Judgment = VISHNU (still the Angel). Hmmmmm. Quote: Or are they all just Trimurti/Trimurti, a combination of all three. I must say, I don't look at them as collectively the Trimurti. Even in Hindu iconography of the Trimurti, the Brahma/Siva/Vishnu entities are not merged together into some unified, monistic glob. You can discern each member of the Trinity. Quote: And the Fool, 0, does he just drift in and out of all? Right...He's off-kilter in my diagram. He is the soul incarnated and "foolish in two major ways: The veil initially prevents him from realization that he is Consciousness/God itself. To pull asunder the veil, he must become a fool as to the things of the world -- that is, nonidentification with the Ego and materialism. So, he weaves in and out of this Maya -- Leela -- the drama of Samsara. Depending on how you look at him, he is the fool, fully veiled; or, the fool, fully unveiled. The fool either see's nothing as it really is, or see's everything as it really is.

pandora	11 Feb 2005
Hello Paul, The 1’s to 9’s I am becoming comfortable with but I really need you to explain the 10’s in more detail because I am confused with HE (final) & Trimurti and what that really mean. Where do the BRAHMA/ SIVA/ VISHNU fit in and how. I know you’ve spoken of it before but I do seem to have made a monistic glob of every thing and can’t move away from it. Confusion! Anyway, here is my take on the three final Major’s triptych I was trying to make and only because you asked how I got there: The Wheel for me has to be BRAHMA. I see the constant movement and action, apex/decline, Rajas/Brahma commencement of the commencement/for better of worse / etc. here. Because it falls in the middle of the Majors I also see this card as a pivotal point where one is moving from the practical to the abstract, the mundane to a more spiritual outlook. I can’t put it in Vishnu or Siva because this Wheel doesn’t stop turning. Until it stops can it be considered balanced? Unless a force pushes from the other direction to slow it down or oppose the motion can there be Siva? So for me, THESIS/BRAHMA Judgment, I tried to place in Vishnu but find only ANTITHESIS / SIVA works here for me. I have never thought of this Angle coming to destroy, and as to preserving .... pehaps preservation of some things but I am sure he would not "Judge" most in a totaly possitive light and worthy of "Preservation" as a whole, so opposition must be part of Judgment. Whenever I see this card I always think of the angle as the Universal “Angle of Arbitration” who is coming down and saying “So…… Let’s talk.” Judgment seems (for me) to be an Oppositional/Siva force, a time of trying to find balance as you move from say life to death, the mundane to spiritual, ignorance to knowledge, wants to needs, resistance to acceptance, unbalanced to balance, practical to abstract, etc. I see Siva’s unbuilding and a clear reaction to the process. And the World as my SYNTHESIS, Sattva, Vishnu. For me the iconography seems to show the ultimate balancing between all the elements and the mundane and the spiritual. I feel that if you could reach this perfect point of equilibrium, or more importantly hold it, then the journey has ended, all questions are answered, and the “Void” / “Heaven” / or what you spoke of before as “true LIBERATION” has been reached. So still The Wheel = Brahma, Judgment = Siva, The World = Vishnu, I can “see’ this better than I can describe it! What do you think? Pandora

Paul	12 Feb 2005
pandora wrote: The 1’s to 9’s I am becoming comfortable with but I really need you to explain the 10’s in more detail because I am confused with HE (final) & Trimurti and what that really mean. Sure – As we have seen, Vedic Numerology recognizes 9 numbers total. Essentially, the 10 is outside of the sequence of evolution. It is ethereal. What this means to me is that the 10 is transitional, not essential. So, in the evolution of the 1-9, the 9 ruled by Mars, represents the climactic effort. The 10 is a kind of apex. But, because the 10 is transitional, not essential, this apex is a type of success that cannot be maintained forever, no matter how comprehensive. Of course, according to much Hindu philosophy, this is indeed the nature of non-identification with corporeal bliss. UPRIGHT 10’S: Think, for example, when a matter is perfectly settled (10). You completed the effort of the 9 and now your project is complete (10). Yet, there is a sense of impermanence, n’est pas? You have a sense that what goes up, must come down (Wheel of Fortune). Thus, while the 10’s (upright) mean that the energy of the 9 is corporealized, concretized, etc. they hold within them the inevitable energy of decay, ending (10’s REVERSED). Since you mentioned the RWS: This imagery seems apropos. Since you mentioned that the RWS imagery can match up with this Triptych system, I can briefly depart from the TdM to illustrate this concept for you with RWS. Look at the 9 of Cups with the 10 of Cups. In the 9, the man is sitting in front of his feast-table with 9 cups. This is a type of 9/Mars energy in Cups. It seems complete – Satiety? Yes...but, the 9 is not quite settled in all its fullness. The 9’s sense of completeness is not comprehensive. Thus, the man is satisfied in his belly, at his party, at this psychological moment. Then look at the 10 of Cups. Here, the sequence of the 1-9 is more comprehensively realized, concretized, corporealized. Yet, that sunny rainbow day is temporary. The family knows this. That moment of comprehensive joy will pass, it must pass. Thus, the 10 reversed. I haven’t looked at other RWS imagery for the other suits, but thought this would give you an idea. Thus, I give the final planet PLUTO to the 10’s. And, it seems to fit nicely, in that it is the final planet not taken up by the other numbers. PLUTO is the God of Wealth and the Underworld. Thus, once again, the idea of comprehensive success in the tarot-suit, or comprehensive endings. 10's REVERSED: Conversely, PLUTO as the God of death and elimination, comes along to say the 9-energy cannot stand, it cannot culminate in all of its fullness. It's over. Start again at the Ace. The 10's reversed are truly a type of abortion. I love the (upright) 10s in a reading. They say: "Now you've settled the matter. All is well." Except that I know that all is temporary (and what isn't?). It is a message to live-in-the-moment and enjoy the 10 (upright). Even the (reversed) 10 can be welcome, depending on if you can perceive the energies of the Tarot as value-neutral, in the big picture. The 10's reversed can be painful, disappointing, or fearful, but they are the necessary transition to make way for the next Ace. So, they can be embraced. So, to relate this to the YOD, HE, VAU, He sequence: YOD = shaped like a comma or a dot, represents the principle or origin of all things, the Unity is regarded as the whole, of which all created beings are only the constituent parts; just as the Unity-human is formed of an agglomeration of molecules, which compose its being. HE = But the Self cannot be realized except through its opposition to the Non-self, by a kind of division of the Unity. This is the origin of duality, of opposition, of the Binary. VAU = But the opposition of the Self and the Non-Self gives rise to another factor; this is the Affinity existing between. This is realization. This is what mystics seek: to live in the world, but not be of the world. He = Indeed, there's the rub. Realization is meaningless without the ability to live in the world of Maya. After all, we can’t just sit 24/7 in a trance or go live on the mountain. Tomes have been written on YOD,HE,VAU,He. And, I cannot claim to be a mystical authority on this matter. Papus and others said that the final He was transitional to take you to the next YOD. Thus, the number sequence places the 4th and 7th numbers as both the final He and the next YOD: 1 = YOD 2 = HE 3 = VAU 4 = He/ YOD 5 = HE 6 = VAU 7 = He/ YOD 8 = HE 9 = VAU 10 = He Thus, you can see that the 10 is the final final He. It is the amalgamation of 3 sequences of YOD, HE, VAU. 3 Sequences of 3 Letters. For divination purposes, I have never found it very practical to think of the 4 and 7 as “He/YOD”. Instead, they are mainly YOD energy to me. It is the 10 that has the He energy to me. That being said, this concept does remind us that the final sequence ending in 3 (VAU) or the final sequence ending in 6 (VAU) or the final sequence ending in 9 (VAU) are not completely complete. 3 = VAU (4 is He, thus “you thought you were done with the Vau-formation of the 3, but keep going!” and YOD, thereby continuing the sequence) 6 = VAU (7 is He, thus “you thought it was stuck with the Vau-paralysis of the 6, but not yet!” and YOD, thereby continuing the sequence) 9 = VAU (10 is final He, thus “you thought it was complete with the Vau-climax of the 9, but at the 10...aahh, there you’re done"). Pandora wrote: Where do the BRAHMA/ SIVA/ VISHNU fit in and how. In kind, the Trimurti will also form 3 sequences of 3 entities. The 10 will represent the final amalgamation of the 3 of 3. 1 = BRAHMA 2 = SIVA 3 = VISHNU 4 = BRAHMA 5 = SIVA 6 = VISHNU 7 = BRAHMA 8 = SIVA 9 = VISHNU 10 = The TRIMURTI, united, concretized into 1 unified being. Pandora wrote: So still The Wheel = Brahma, Judgment = Siva, The World = Vishnu. I can “see’ this better than I can describe it! What do you think? I love your rationale! Indeed, when you look at the modified Papus diagram, the LEFT-side column of triangles could be the Pillar of YOD, the RIGHT-side would be the Pillar of HE. The MIDDLE-space would reconcile the two into the Pillar of VAU. It so happens that the Wheel, World, and Judgment fall under these “Pillars” as follows… YOD Pillar = Wheel - Brahma HE Pillar = Judgment - Siva VAU Pillar = World - Vishnu Soooo, not only does your iconographical analysis work, Pandora, but it also fits with the symmetry of the (modified) Papus diagram!!!!! Neat!

Paul	12 Feb 2005
It occurred to me that this system (REVERSED) should be more fleshed-out. Here’s the UPRIGHT System, one more time… RAJAS/ BRAHMA/ Commencement of…/ The CARDINAL signs. Aces: Rajas/ Brahma of BRAHMA/ Commencement of the commencement 2’s: Tamas/ Siva of BRAHMA/ Opposition to the commencement 3’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of BRAHMA/ Equilibrium (Preservation) of the commencement TAMAS/ SIVA/ Opposition to…/ The FIXED Signs 4’s: Rajas/ Brahma of SIVA/ Commencement of the Opposition 5’s: Tamas/ Siva of SIVA/ Opposition to the Opposition 6’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of SIVA/ Preservation of the Opposition SATTVA/ VISHNU/ Preservation of…/ The MUTABLE signs 7’s: Rajas/ Brahma of VISHNU/ Commencement of the Preservation 8’s: Tamas/ Siva of VISHNU/ Opposition to the Preservation 9’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of VISHNU/ Preservation of the Preservation 10’s: Trimurti. Comprehensive settlement or ending, with a POSITIVE tone. The REVERSED System simply flips the polarity of +/-, but of course, keeps the Triptych structure: RAJAS/ BRAHMA/ Commencement of…/ The CARDINAL signs. Aces: Rajas/ Brahma of BRAHMA/ Commencement of the Problem 2’s: Tamas/ Siva of BRAHMA/ Opposition to the Problem 3’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of BRAHMA/ Equilibrium (Preservation) of the Problem TAMAS/ SIVA/ Opposition to…/ The FIXED Signs 4’s: Rajas/ Brahma of SIVA/ Commencement of the Solution 5’s: Tamas/ Siva of SIVA/ Opposition to the Solution 6’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of SIVA/ Preservation of the Solution SATTVA/ VISHNU/ Preservation of…/ The MUTABLE signs 7’s: Rajas/ Brahma of VISHNU/ Commencement of the Instability 8’s: Tamas/ Siva of VISHNU/ Opposition to the Instability 9’s: Sattva/ Vishnu of VISHNU/ Preservation of the Instability 10’s: Trimurti. Comprehensive settlement or ending, with a NEGATIVE tone. - Thus, you can see that each number now embodies the potential to have a positive or negative spin, depending on whether it is Upright or Reversed. - You can also see that positive is not necessarily associated with Upright and negative with Reversed. Indeed, such is really the function of the Triptych sequence. Remember that each number is ruled by a planet. Compare the UPRIGHT System… Aces: SUN + 2’s: MOON - 3’s: JUPITER + 4’s: URANUS (or NORTH NODE) - 5’s: MERCURY + 6’s: VENUS - 7’s: NEPTUNE (or SOUTH NODE) + 8’s: SATURN - 9’s: MARS + 10s: PLUTO + ...with the Reversed system, wherein you simply switch the polarities of the PLANETS for each number: Aces: SUN - 2’s: MOON + 3’s: JUPITER - 4’s: URANUS (or NORTH NODE) + 5’s: MERCURY - 6’s: VENUS + 7’s: NEPTUNE (or SOUTH NODE) - 8’s: SATURN + 9’s: MARS - 10s: PLUTO - Thus, I appreciate the incredible balance of this system…By using the Triptych structure and then allowing for reversals, every element enjoys a natural Yin/Yang Tao-like symmetry. Every number, planet, Hindu deity, etc enjoys a positive side and a negative side. Thus, the entire system is ultimately value-neutral and will display in divination the totality of life’s ups and downs. - It would seem difficult to now have to learn TWO Systems (Upright and Reversed); however, in practice, it’s much more simple: If the card is reversed, you simply give it the OPPOSITE POLARITY of meaning. Opposite to what? Opposite to it's natural polarity. What is its natural polarity? Whatever the polarity is (+ or -) UPRIGHT. For example, take the 6 of :SL... First, just note the general TIERS of meaning… 6 = -VAU, -Vishnu of SIVA, -Preservation of the Opposition OR Preservation of the Solution, -VENUS, -Fixed Signs Triptych, thus AQUARIUS -Decan = Venus in AQUARIUS (Cardinal sign ruler, in AQUARIUS) -Compare with LOVERS (VI) and TOWER (XVI) -According the Papus’ basic Triptych numbering system, the 6’s are naturally (in upright position) taken with a negative polarity. So, of Upright, take the (natural) negative spin for the 6s, on whatever layer seems most cogent. If Reversed, take the (opposite) positive spin for the 6s. As usual, merge these with the meaning of the :SL: "Plans...Power...Politics" Here’s a sample meaning set: - Upright (naturally negative) = Troubled Waters, Tough Road, Stuck W/ Problems, Slowing, Stymied, Abortion, Hard choices, Doubt, Caution! Unsure , Troubling associates or organizations, Submission or Victimization by others or organizations. - Reversed (positive) = Path, Passage, Walk, Route, Driving, Journey by Water (Long), A Way, Authorization, Approval, Reassurance, Choicefulness, Law, Order, Certificate, Publication by organization (Some of these meanings I gather from consulting Etteilla’s and other’s traditional meanings, like English or Spanish Cartomancy, and just matching up those meanings that fit the polarity.) So, the point is that any layer is either given a positive or negative spin, depending on: The natural polarity of the number, Whether the card is upright or reversed. In the example above, the 6’s are ruled by Venus, and the 6’s have a natural negative polarity… 6’s = Preservation of the Opposition, lethargy, paralysis, stuckness. Almost the quality of such hyper-harmony that there is inertia. …Thus, the 6’s upright will embody Venus’ negative qualities. If reversed, one takes the positive qualities of Venus, because (reversed)… 6’s reversed = Preservation of the Solution, balance, harmony, relief, release. That’s why, if you learn the UPRIGHT system well, the REVERSED system is simply a matter of reversing the polarity of the card. You don’t necessarily have to learn 2 separate systems. Hope this helps with reversals.

Paul	12 Feb 2005
Paul wrote: In kind, the Trimurti will also form 3 sequences of 3 entities. The 10 will represent the final amalgamation of the 3 of 3. 1 = BRAHMA 2 = SIVA 3 = VISHNU 4 = BRAHMA 5 = SIVA 6 = VISHNU 7 = BRAHMA 8 = SIVA 9 = VISHNU 10 = The TRIMURTI, united, concretized into 1 unified being. Just thought of another way to explain it: 1 Yod = BRAHMA 2 He = SIVA 3 Vau/he = VISHNU (Commencement of the formation of TRIMURTI) 4 Yod = BRAHMA 5 He = SIVA 6 Vau/he = VISHNU (Opposition to formation of TRIMURTI) 7 Yod = BRAHMA 8 He = SIVA 9 Vau/he = VISHNU (Preservation of Commencement of TRIMURTI) 10 = The TRIMURTI, united, concretized into 1 unified being. Thus, the 3,7, and 9 form a natural sequence of... - YOD - HE - VAU or - BRAHMA - SIVA - VISHNU or - Commencment - Opposition - Equilibrium That's why I appreciate this system...once you learn the Rules of Three, and of Thesis-Antithesis-Synthesis, you this SYMMETRY everywhere on multiple layers.

pandora	12 Feb 2005
Thanks Paul for that explanation of the 10’s. I know you have talked about these different aspects though out the lessons but I wasn’t connecting everything together. Now…… I wont be floundering when we hit ALCHEMY! Glad you found your old RWS deck … do you see what I mean when I say there isn’t much difficulty working with the iconography of the pips? I have bought a very cheap and cheerful pack of TdM ‘s that I am putting above “my” cards to try and get use to none illustrated pips. Falling in love with them will definitely take some time and it is not just because of the terrible printing job on these! Thank you again for all your work. Can’t wait for the next step! Pandora

Nevada	12 Feb 2005
Paul, I've gone through this thread with great interest. Still need to study further, but I am curious: What deck or decks do you typically use with this system? Do you think it matters? I can see Pandora's point about the RWS, but also even the Thoth (for instance I would have trouble looking at the Thoth 2 of Cups and thinking this 2 was opposition to, well, anything. So I'm curious which deck(s) you use. EDITED TO ADD: Ah, I just found the post where you talked about your decks. Yes, I think this will help me a lot with my TdM studies. Lots to think about! Thank you so much for sharing. I can see how much work it was just to put all this before our eyes. :) And it is definitely food for thought. I will no doubt absorb some or all of it into my library of Tarot knowledge (which has grown in leaps and bounds here at AT). Nevada

Paul	13 Feb 2005
Thanks for the compliments, Nevada. Yes, as you found out, I don't believe this system would work for RWS and its derivatives (which eliminates a lot of decks sold in America, at least, because RWS iconography tends to be regarded as the Prototypical tarot). In fact, any Golden Dawn derivative is not going to match up comprehensively, in my evaluation. I know that Pandora has found a fit. However, I cannot discover a perfect relationship 1:1. Thus, I would say that any deck with a Minor Arcana with non-scenic pips (abstract pips might work as well) could absorb this system. One could say that the Thoth deck is abstract; however, the abstract designs certainly suggest a tone of meaning which might contradict the Triptych flow, and then there are those annoying titles on the Minors. I for one use the Tarot de Marseille, which enjoys an antiquity and simple profundity that rocks my world. ;) Papus (Gerard Encausse), of course, generated the Triptych system (which he said was inherited by himself, not invented). And, in Papus' time, there was no Rider Waite and no Thoth decks as the ubiquitous tarot. Instead, it was the TdM or other playing card varieties that were everywhere seen, I think. So, I believe that Papus offered the Triptych system formula for the reasons of: There were an awful lot of Minor Arcana cards to memorize. The Minor Arcana iconography did not offer imagery from which to remember the meaning of the card, such as in the Major Arcana. (Of course, this point is somewhat controversial here on AT, as some proffer that the Minor Arcana pips are rife with interpretative imagery. BUt, I have no desire to reproduce that debate in this thread.) For this reason, I think TdM-type decks are ideal for the Triptych System. I have said earlier in this thread that the following 3 Books feature this Triptych System in some form or another: The World of the Tarot: The Gypsy Method of Reading the Tarot , by Sergius Golowin Defintely shows the Ace-Nine (Commencement/Opposition/Equilibrium) interpretation of the Minor cards; however, the meanings are rather abstract. Overall, I love this book. It essentially produces this system I am explaining, even with my personal modifications (such as declining to interpret the Swords as naturally malefic). - The Book of Tarot , by Fred Gettings Features the C/O/E formula for the Minors with its own angle on the derivations of meaning. I believe that the Swords are interpreted Papus-style, i.e. as naturally malefic. So, Commencement is "Commencement of the Struggle". I personally rejected the swords as naturally malefic. Gettings' Minors' meanings don't seem to match the symmetrical rhythm and flow of the version of the system I'm presenting, but are close. - Tarot Mirrors, by Mary K. Greer. Offers a nice overview of the Triptych system for the Majors.

Paul	26 Feb 2005
Let’s look at how numbers relate to each other according to Rajasic, Tamasic, or Sattvic properties in their related compositions. Here’s the table – again! I’ve colored it up to make the relationships more evident: Brahma = Blue Siva = Red Vishnu = Yellow …Then, I combine the colors to form compound colors, to help you see the related numbers. Brahma (Blue) + Siva (Red) = Purple Brahma (Blue) + Vishnu (Yellow) = Green Siva (Red) + Vishnu (Yellow) = Orange Aces: Rajas / Rajas of RAJAS / Brahma of BRAHMA 2’s: Tamas / Tamas of RAJAS / Siva of BRAHMA 3’s: Sattva / Sattva of RAJAS / Vishnu of BRAHMA 4’s: Rajas / Rajas of TAMAS / Brahma of SIVA 5’s: Tamas / Tamas of TAMAS / Siva of SIVA 6’s: Sattva / Sattva of TAMAS / Vishnu of SIVA 7’s: Rajas / Raja of SATTVA / Brahma of VISHNU 8’s: Tamas / Tamas of SATTVA / Siva of VISHNU 9’s: S Sattva / Sattva of SATTVA / Vishnu of VISHNU 10’s: Trimurti. Comprehensive settlement or ending, with a POSITIVE tone. Okay – So you can now see which numbers are related by virtue of their common combinations of Rajas/Tamas/Sattva. Yet, even though they are shown in the diagram as the same color, we’ll see that they have subtle differences. : Both conjoin Rajasic (Blue) and Tamasic (Red) qualities, but the combination of Gross and SUBTLE are different: The 2 is Tamas (Gross) of RAJAS (Subtle): Thus, this is primarily Tamasic, an obstacle, to something already RAJASIC or newly in place. Thus, Papus called this “Opposition to the Beginning”. I see the 2 vibration as being mostly an obstacle to something already in its infancy. Thus, not a huge obstacle. The focus is on the obstacle to something small. The 4 is Rajas (Gross) of TAMAS (Subtle): Thus, this is primarily Rajasic, something new, that will serve a TAMASIC or obstacle function. Thus, Papus called this “Beginning of the Opposition”. I see the 4 vibration as being mostly something new functioning as an obstacle. Thus, this presents a more novel obstacle. The focus is on the newness. : Both conjoin Rajasic (Blue) and Sattvic (Yellow) qualities, but the combination of Gross and SUBTLE are different: The 3 is Sattva (Gross) of RAJAS (Subtle): Thus, this is primarily Sattvic, preservative and having balance, to something already RAJASIC or newly in place. Thus, Papus called this “Preservation to the Beginning”. I see the 3 vibration as being mostly something balanced regarding something already beginning. Thus, not a huge balanced vibration, lite, so to speak. The focus in on the Balance. This is not a huge balanced situation. The 7 is Rajas (Gross) of SATTVA (Subtle): Thus, this is primarily Rajasic, something new, that will serve a SATTVIC or preservative/balancing function. Thus, Papus called this “Beginning of the Preservation”. I see the 7 vibration as being mostly something new serving a function of bringing in balance and preservation. Thus, this presents a more novel balancing phenomenon. The focus in on the newness. : Both conjoin Tamasic (Red) and Sattvic (Yellow) qualities, but the combination of Gross and SUBTLE are different: The 6 is Sattva (Gross) of TAMAS (Subtle): Thus, this is primarily Sattvic, preservative and having balance, to something TAMASIC or already forming an obstacle. Thus, Papus called this “Preservation to the Opposition”. I see the 6 vibration as being mostly something preservative of something that is an obstacle. The focus in on the preservation. The 8 is Tamas (Gross) of SATTVA (Subtle): Thus, this is primarily Tamsic, something that is an obstacle, that will have to oppose something lasting (preserved quality), so it's got to be a big obstacle. Thus, Papus called this “Opposition to the Preservation”. I see the 8 vibration as being mostly an obstacle that is strong enough to oppose the (sattvic). Thus, this presents a larger obstacle. __________________________________________________________ This is all quite abstract. Here's some more ideas…with PLANETS 2 & 4: 2: MOON -- Opposition to Beginning. Internal oppositional force. 4: URANUS -- Beginning of Opposition. External oppositional force. 3 & 7: 3: JUPTER -- Preservation of Beginning. Minor harmonic force. 7: NEPTUNE -- Beginning of Preservation. Major harmonic force. 6 & 8: 6: VENUS -- Preservation of Opposition. Stalemate. 8: SATURN -- Opposition of Preservation. Checkmate. __________________________________________________________ So, it’s really a matter of noting the combination of Gross & SUBTLE energies of the numbers to determine their relatedness and differentness. You'll find your own conclusions. What about the 1, 5, 9 ? As you can see, these numbers are purer forms of the qualities of Rajas/Tamas/Sattva. Now, let’s look at the similarities in Triads. Notice the subtle differences: All numbers with SUBTLE Rajasic qualities: 1 – Minor Beginning/Potentiality (SUN) 2 – Minor Obstacle/Conflict (MOON) 3 – Minor Solution, Balanced/Harmonious (JUPITER) All numbers with SUBTLE Tamasic qualities: 4 – Moderate New Obstacle/Problem (URANUS) 5 – Moderate Solution/ Progress (MECURY) 6 – Moderate Failure of the Solution/ Stymied (VENUS) All numbers with SUBTLE Sattvic qualities: 7 – Sophisticated New Beginning/Potentiality (NEPTUNE) 8 – Sophisticated Obstacle/Barrier (SATURN) 9 – Sophisticated Solution/Synchronization (MARS) 10 = Apex or Decline (PLUTO) Now… All numbers with Gross Rajasic qualities, all something new: 1 – Minor Beginning/Potentiality (SUN) 4 – Moderate New Obstacle/Problem (URANUS) 7— Sophisticated New Beginning/Potentiality (NEPTUNE) All numbers with Gross Tamasic qualities, all oppositional: 2 – Minor Obstacle/Conflict (MOON) 5 – Moderate Solution/ Progress (MECURY) 8 - Sophisticated Obstacle/Barrier (SATURN) All numbers with Gross Sattvic qualities, all seeking preservation: 3 – Minor Solution, Balanced/Harmonious (JUPITER) 6 – Moderate Failure of the Solution/ Stymied (VENUS) 9 – Sophisticated Solution/Synchronization (MARS) – The 5 is wonderful in that the opposition opposes itself, thus forms a solution. - The 6 is problematic in that the problem is preserved. I’ve said it before regarding VENUS for this number as seeming strange. Think of it this way: Think of VENUS’ garden as overgrown, full of brambles, the plants are choking themselves off, lethargy, slowing, stymied, annoyances—sort of like walking through one of those gardens that attract TOO many insects. Remember that the 6 – reversed- brings out VENUS’ positive qualities of harmonization and balance. So, we do get to see VENUS’ lighter side when the card is reversed. I recommend just sitting down at your table in a meditative mood and combining the cards as above. Meditate upon their qualities of Rajas, Tamas, and Sattva. Place cards with the same qualities in combination (but in different proportions). Meditate upon how this energy combines with the Suit to provide a card meaning. If anyone wants to try this and post that would be cool. :)

Paul	27 Feb 2005
This number comparison may also be fun to plug-in the Zodiac: Here's the standard table, with Zodiacal associations: Aces: Cardinal / Cardinal of CARDINAL 2’s: Fixed / Fixed of CARDINAL 3’s: Mutable / Mutable of CARDINAL 4’s: Cardinal / Cardinal of FIXED 5’s: Fixed / Fixed of FIXED 6’s: Mutable / Mutable of FIXED 7’s: Cardinal / Cardinal of MUTABLE 8’s: Fixed / Fixed of MUTABLE 9’s: Mutable / Mutable of MUTABLE 10’s: All combined. All numbers with SUBTLE Cardinal qualities: 1 – Aries, Cancer, Libra, Capricorn 2 – Aries, Cancer, Libra, Capricorn 3 – Aries, Cancer, Libra, Capricorn All numbers with SUBTLE Fixed qualities: 4 – Leo, Scorpio, Aquarius, Taurus 5 – Leo, Scorpio, Aquarius, Taurus 6 – Leo, Scorpio, Aquarius, Taurus All numbers with SUBTLE Mutable qualities: 7 – Sagitarrius, Pisces, Gemini, Virgo 8 – Sagitarrius, Pisces, Gemini, Virgo 9 – Sagitarrius, Pisces, Gemini, Virgo 10 = Cardinal, Fixed, Mutable combined Now… All numbers with Gross Cardinal qualities: 1 – THESIS: Aries, Cancer, Libra, Capricorn 4 – ANTITHESIS: Leo, Scorpio, Aquarius, Taurus 7— SYNTHESIS: Sagitarrius, Pisces, Gemini, Virgo So, the 1,4,7 all vibrate to show something New (Cardinal) within the respective signs (Cardinal/Fixed/Mutable). All numbers with Gross Fixed qualities: 2 – THESIS: Aries, Cancer, Libra, Capricorn 5 – ANTITHESIS: Leo, Scorpio, Aquarius, Taurus 8 - SYNTHESIS: Sagitarrius, Pisces, Gemini, Virgo So, the 2,5,8 all vibrate to show something Oppositional(Fixed) within the respective signs (Cardinal/Fixed/Mutable). All numbers with Gross Mutable qualities: 3 – THESIS: Aries, Cancer, Libra, Capricorn 6 – ANTITHESIS: Leo, Scorpio, Aquarius, Taurus 9 – SYNTHESIS: Sagitarrius, Pisces, Gemini, Virgo So, the 3,6,9 all vibrate to show something Balancing(Mutable) within the respective signs (Cardinal/Fixed/Mutable). * Remember the interesting 5 and 6: 5 vibrates as something Oppositional, but it is opposing a problem, and is therefore a SOLUTION. 5's are solution oriented, but it is not settled yet-- it is more the process of solving. The 9 settles the matter. 6 vibrates as something Balancing, but it is balancing out the tension between the problem (4) and solution (5). It is preservative of the problem. Thus the 6 is problematic, but since the 5 mitigated the problem of the 4, the 6 retains the problem at a mitigated level-- The 6 is stuckness, slowing, lethargy, complications, etc. It does not have the severe obstacle-nature of the 8. Let's do one example of the TIERED SYSTEM. Let's take the 5 of Coins and look at a few layers: On its highest (SUBTLE) level, the 5 is FIXED. A "stick". ______________________________________________________________ On its more focused (Gross) level, the 5 is Fixed of FIXED. "Two sticks rubbing together". ______________________________________________________________ Coins are:Hearth, Holdings, Health (Home, Money, Body) ______________________________________________________________ Coins in the 5 number are the fixed Earth Sign of Taurus . So, all of these layers provide any number of interpretive possibilities. It all depends on which layer intuitively or psychically feels most salient to you. Thus, this is a combination of LEFT & RIGHT brain, INTUITION and KNOWLEDGE. There's a thread going on in AT about this matter (reading Tarot by Intellect or Intuition, or both). I say both. Here are some intepretive possibilities, depending on the layer most salient: On its highest (SUBTLE) level, the 5 is FIXED. A "stick". Focusing on earthy matters. ______________________________________________________________ On its more focused (Gross) level, the 5 is Fixed of FIXED. "Two sticks rubbing together". Rolling up your sleeves and attending to solving a earthy matter. ______________________________________________________________ Coins are: Hearth, Holdings, Health (Home, Money, Body). Focusing on (let's say) Health with a solution-oriented attitude. A Workout routine, a new diet, yoga. ______________________________________________________________ Coins in the 5 number are the fixed Earth Sign of Taurus . Focsuing on Taurus-area matters with solution-oriented attitude: Re-investing, renegotiating the mortgage, etc. Once again, when reading with the LAYERS, usually only 1 or 2 tiers of the whole actually become salient. You know you've got the right layer if you are familiar with how psychic/intuitive information "comes in": Quick, but sure. It is that instantaneous "knowing" that quickly dances across the stage. Then, the mind takes over and tries to analyze the performance. So, you resist the analysis and stick with the original fleeting image of the dancer. But, now I'm off topic. Ok - maybe all of these postings will generate some responses. ;) In any case, next weekend, I'll finally start with the ALCHEMY piece. We'll be plugging in the Tria Prima (Three Supernal) Elements of Alchemy into the Triptych system: Sulphur Salt Mercury Or, is it...Sulphur, Mercury, Salt??? Or, is it Mercury, Sulphur, Salt??? We'll see.

Paul	03 Apr 2005
Let’s inter-layer another TIER…Alchemy ( dark, gothic, organ music here ). I know. Alchemy is mind-boggling. But, I found some parallels with my Tiered System, so I incorporated it. I am not an expert on Alchemy, but have synthesized what I think I understand. ;) Dennis William Hauck’s works have been invaluable (but, also confusing, if you get both his books). First, some basic background. Let’s start with 2 basic concepts: The Tria Prima : Paracelsus’ SULFUR, SALT, and MERCURY The Seven Operations : - CALCINATIO - Calcination - SOLUTIO - Dissolution - SEPARATIO - Separation - CONJUNCTIO – Conjunction - MORTIFCATIO – Fermentation/Putrefaction - SUBLIMATIO – Distillation - COAGULATIO – Coagulation Hauck talks about The Three Magisteriums, wherein the alchemists believed the Stone was produced by THREE passes through the SEVEN operations. So, I place the Operations in the Major Arcana (3x7 = 21). This could be discussed later, but it’s not a part of my Minor Arcana Tiered System, per se, so perhaps another thread. However, I believe that it essentially involves finding 3 cards each to correspond to each of the 7 Operations. The Fool would make a decent candidate for a card that does NOT have a correspondence to an Operation, but is in fact the First Matter going through the operations. The Minor Arcana Tiered System pertains to the Tria Prima . These are the fundamental elements going through stages, interestingly, THREE stages. So, THREE essentials going through THREE stages. Hmmm. It seemed to fit. Here’s the Three Essentials, examined. Please note, I’ll present 3 alternate orderings of the essentials downward in the post… Basic Progression of the Essentials... SULFUR, (Cardinal) progresses as follows… Combustible Sulfur (Cardinal) Fixed Sulfur (Fixed) Volatile or Ethereal Sulfur (Mutable) SALT (Fixed)… Elementary Salt (Cardinal) Salt of the Earth (Fixed) Central Salt (Mutable) MERCURY (Mutable)… Common Mercury (Cardinal) Bodily Mercury (Fixed) Philosophical Mercury (Mutable) You can see a parallel construct here—the Zodiac signs of Cardinal/Fixed/Mutable. SULFUR (Cardinal) SALT (Fixed) MERCURY (Mutable) Or SULFUR (Rajas) SALT (Tamas) MERCURY (Sattva) Or SULFUR (Brahma) SALT (Siva) MERCURY (Vishnu) Thus, a complete table that incorporates the Thesis/Antithesis/Synthesis, would look like this…This is only one possible ordering… SULFUR (Commencement) 1. Sulfur - Combustible Sulfur (Cardinal) 2. Salt- Elementary Salt (Cardinal) 3. Mercury - Common Mercury (Cardinal) SALT (Opposition) 4. Sulfur - Fixed Sulfur (Fixed) 5. Salt - Salt of the Earth (Fixed) 6. Mercury - Bodily Mercury (Fixed) MERCURY (Equilibrium) 7. Sulfur - Volatile or Ethereal Sulfur (Mutable) 8. Salt - Central Salt (Mutable) 9. Mercury - Philosophical Mercury (Mutable) 10 Final Product. _____________________________________ Now, those who are familiar with the Three Essentials, may protest about this aforementioned sequence. This is because, specifically, SULFUR is thought of as Masculine, MERCURY as feminine (in relation to SULFUR only, in this context), and SALT is considered the remainder. This may suggest a different order. Three alternative orders would be... Alternate Ordering #1 SULFUR (Thesis) MERCURY (Antithesis) SALT (Synthesis) Or, if you wanted to start with Feminine… Alternate Ordering #2 MERCURY (Thesis) SULFUR (Antithesis) SALT (Synthesis) Or, begin with Salt… Alternate Ordering #3 SALT (Thesis) SULFUR (Antithesis) MERCURY (Synthesis) ________________________________________ I have no issue, really, with these alternate sequences. I pained over all of them. In my travels researching the incorporation of the Tria Prima, I found the following information that would suggest multiple possible sequences: Sulfur/Salt/Mercury are commonly associated with Cardinal/Fixed/Mutable and Rajas/Tamas/Sattva. This suggested a certain order for the Three Essentials in order to fit into the Tiered System, which already uses the Zodiac and Gunas sequences. Sulfur is Rajasic and Cardinal, Salt is Tamasic and Fixed, Mercury is Sattvic and Mutable… In my readings of Hauck and others, I found that the Three Essentials were presented as a marriage between Solar King Sulfur and Lunar Queen Mercury to yield Androgynous Son Salt. Thus would suggest Alternate Ordering #1. But, otherwise, I found that the Three Essentials it may be presented as… - Sulfur is the fuel of the fire (oil, fat, wood, coal) = Soul - Salt exhibits a fixed nature and resists the fire = Body - Mercury is what goes unchanged or is released from the fire, the smoke, moisture, light = Spirit So, in Basic Ordering Table, the Solar Sulfur and Lunar Mercury cradle in between the Salt. Finally, I’ve also seen, Sulfur, Mercury, and Salt presented as all mediating between each other. Here’s three alternate tables for those who want to examine a different sequence of the Three Essentials. Take whichever one feels right to you, based on your research… __________________________________________ Alternate #1 SULFUR – King 1. Sulfur - Combustible Sulfur 2. Mercury - Common Mercury 3. Salt- Elementary Salt MERCURY - Queen 4. Sulfur - Fixed Sulfur 5. Mercury - Bodily Mercury 6. Salt - Salt of the Earth SALT - Child 7. Sulfur - Volatile or Ethereal Sulfur 8. Mercury - Philosophical Mercury 9. Salt - Central Salt ____________________________________________ Alternate #2 MERCURY - Queen 1. Mercury - Common Mercury 2. Sulfur - Combustible Sulfur 3. Salt- Elementary Salt SULFUR - King 4. Mercury - Bodily Mercury 5. Sulfur - Fixed Sulfur 6. Salt - Salt of the Earth SALT - Child 7. Mercury - Philosophical Mercury 8. Sulfur - Volatile or Ethereal Sulfur 9. Salt - Central Salt _________________________________________ Alternate #3: SALT – Seed & Child 1. Salt- Elementary Salt 2. Sulfur - Combustible Sulfur 3. Mercury - Common Mercury SULFUR - King 4. Salt - Salt of the Earth 5. Sulfur - Fixed Sulfur 6. Mercury - Bodily Mercury MERCURY - Queen 7. Salt - Central Salt 8. Sulfur - Volatile or Ethereal Sulfur 9. Mercury - Philosophical Mercury _________________________________ So, after you analyze which sequence you want, you can play with the energies of the cards. I know that’s a lot!!! I’ll take a break there and let you analyze the possible orderings. If you’re like me with Alchemy…that should take awhile.

Paul	01 May 2005
It has been a pleasure to gather my thoughts into a system that I hope was coherent and inspirational. Many PM'd me to say they enjoyed the posts. Unfortunately, other projects require priority, thus I cannot devote any more significant posts to this thread. I'll be requesting the thread be closed as soon as I figure out how to do that. ;) Any final questions are welcome.

pandora	03 May 2005
Ohhh Paul, I do understand ............. But what I really want to say is .... “Please don’t go. I need you still. Let me come to your house, I cook well and could turn your garden into a heaven” But, you have given so much already, so instead I will just say “Thank you so very much for all the time and effort you have put in to this thread, I have loved it and have learned so much.” Each time you have posted it has sent me on a different quest. My last “Oh, here we go in a different direction.” was to a book at the library about Jung on dreams and alchemy......fabulous read...think I may have to look for it on the book lists. (Along with many others that you made me want!) I have “my” deck and my new Marseilles. I have my new “grammar” and together and apart it is working so well! I have my new “ look to/at astrology” (hard, so hard and confusing.....(I read and think I understand ……. then there is exalted ……. but what does exalted really mean.... I don’t get it, and why is exalted in something it has no reason to be interested in...... and how does this correlate......?) such a lot to put into context but will get there eventually) .......now, I am not sure about the Majors, do I deal with them just like the minors/pips? Do I start them in Brahma of Brahma for the Magician etc.....and everything for the pips = Majors but in a bigger way? I wish I had more.......... but perhaps I have enough........ and like you will work for the rest. Love and blessings Pandora Ps... I love the colours and if people knew the the colour wheel it would be so much more meaningful..........ty you spoke in my language there.P.

Alta	08 May 2005
Thread closed at Paul's request.

The Paul's "Tiered" Minor Arcana System thread was originally posted on 10 Oct 2004 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.